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The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant (Released) — Page 541

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Jar Jar Bricks said:

I remember having this same conversation a while back. The problem with making her parents bad people is that the Palpy/Rey scene at the end relies on the whole “she will take her revenge!” spiel. He’s trying to get her to hate him. But if Palpatine is responsible for the killing of her parents, and they were bad people, then really Rey should be thanking Palps for neutralizing those scum bags. Not exactly the greatest strategy. And don’t even get me started on the fact that it makes no sense that they wouldn’t reveal her location to Ochi if they were bad.

Don’t get me wrong, it would have been better for them to be bad, but unfortunately the movie we have been given relies on them being good. Doing the opposite would involve removing way too much content and make the Rey/Palpatine scene kinda confusing.

I see your point. But I do think the revenge she could be taking would be because she was alone for all those years because of Palpatine. Rey being “no one” and on her own and not having a family her whole life was because of Palpatine and her deadbeat parents. Palpatine wanted her to feel alone and resent him and strike him down in anger so he could take over her. He even taunts her about having the power to save her friends. He even tries to tempt her to go bad to “protect” her new family. I could see it working that way but it may be tough to make that easily apparent in the film.

The Skywalker Saga:
I · II · III · IV · V · VI · VII · VIII · IX
This is the way.

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Jar Jar Bricks said:

The problem with making her parents bad people is that the Palpy/Rey scene at the end relies on the whole “she will take her revenge!” spiel.

This revenge line could be excised from the edit, leaving only she will strike me down.

“They sold you to protect you” is a patently ridiculous retcon.

heil Palpatine!

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DZ-330 said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

I remember having this same conversation a while back. The problem with making her parents bad people is that the Palpy/Rey scene at the end relies on the whole “she will take her revenge!” spiel. He’s trying to get her to hate him. But if Palpatine is responsible for the killing of her parents, and they were bad people, then really Rey should be thanking Palps for neutralizing those scum bags. Not exactly the greatest strategy. And don’t even get me started on the fact that it makes no sense that they wouldn’t reveal her location to Ochi if they were bad.

Don’t get me wrong, it would have been better for them to be bad, but unfortunately the movie we have been given relies on them being good. Doing the opposite would involve removing way too much content and make the Rey/Palpatine scene kinda confusing.

But I do think the revenge she could be taking would be because she was alone for all those years because of Palpatine.

Well then somebody could easily make the argument that she probably had a better quality of life being alone than being with drunken parents who don’t give two shits about her (abuse).

I ran into this issue when writing my novelization and ultimately decided I had to go with good parents (but improved) because otherwise you’d have to change a lot. For example, Ochi would have to never encounter her parents and die while on the hunt for them. This then makes Rey unfamiliar with the dagger and his ship. Then that leaves the dyad fight in Kylo’s quarters devoid of content since there are no visions and not a whole lot to say except that she’s a Palpatine, which is supposed to happen in the hangar scene. Plus there would need to be a good enough reason for Rey to want to kill Palps with the dark side so the essence transfer works.

Ah, what a mess.

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I think the problem is the whole thing is tied together with stupid rationale/writing that makes it hard to make any perfectly clean/rational changes.

If her parents were always dead beats, then you have to scrub a lot of the Orchi subplot, especially her vision scene “remembering” what happened. If that is the case, then there isn’t a ship to remember. You can still have it where he was suppose to find her but stumbled into quick sand one day and died while looking around for her. So then what’s the “real” story Kylo explains? “Oh yeah, your parents were jerks, but not quite nobodies since Palps got it on Clone style … you’re his grand daughter.”

If her parents were noble, then really TLJ needs to be trimmed during the throne room dialogue. She repressed the noble part of her parents, to then repress the hope of them returning to them being dead beats that died on the desert? Also, then it all is just kinda shallow anyway since it’s been back and forth. “Well, remember when I said they were bad, yeah, they weren’t, I lied. They loved ya and got stabbed.”

Personally, I don’t have a real answer to make it make sense. It may just be choosing the lesser of two evils.

(I still vote adjusting TLJ for Rey not to admit it … then she is still suppressing stuff and just isn’t sure about her parents … until it’s all revealed in this movie. Plus it goes along with “People keep telling me who I am, and I don’t know” to include “People keep telling me about my parents, but I don’t know”)

“Because you are a PalpaWalker?”

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Jar Jar Bricks said:

DZ-330 said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

I remember having this same conversation a while back. The problem with making her parents bad people is that the Palpy/Rey scene at the end relies on the whole “she will take her revenge!” spiel. He’s trying to get her to hate him. But if Palpatine is responsible for the killing of her parents, and they were bad people, then really Rey should be thanking Palps for neutralizing those scum bags. Not exactly the greatest strategy. And don’t even get me started on the fact that it makes no sense that they wouldn’t reveal her location to Ochi if they were bad.

Don’t get me wrong, it would have been better for them to be bad, but unfortunately the movie we have been given relies on them being good. Doing the opposite would involve removing way too much content and make the Rey/Palpatine scene kinda confusing.

But I do think the revenge she could be taking would be because she was alone for all those years because of Palpatine.

Well then somebody could easily make the argument that she probably had a better quality of life being alone than being with drunken parents who don’t give two shits about her (abuse).

I ran into this issue when writing my novelization and ultimately decided I had to go with good parents (but improved) because otherwise you’d have to change a lot. For example, Ochi would have to never encounter her parents and die while on the hunt for them. This then makes Rey unfamiliar with the dagger and his ship. Then that leaves the dyad fight in Kylo’s quarters devoid of content since there are no visions and not a whole lot to say except that she’s a Palpatine, which is supposed to happen in the hangar scene. Plus there would need to be a good enough reason for Rey to want to kill Palps with the dark side so the essence transfer works.

Ah, what a mess.

Palpatine would be the reason Rey believes she’s worthless. Even after realizing that her actual heritage doesn’t define her value, if it weren’t for Palpatine then Rey wouldn’t believe she’s nothing.

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It’s really a tightly bound mess. You pluck one string and the whole thing comes undone even worse. I’ve found that to be the case with a lot of suggested changes in this film.

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When I get the chance I could see about making a mock up with both “I see them” and “you don’t need to say anything” - echo and all. I’d need to run it through audacity first but I’m sure it wouldn’t be too difficult.

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Hal 9000 said:

I think I’d prefer the default version of this project not to venture down the path of making her parents back into shitheads, but I see your point.

I mean, there’s another sticky point here that we’re all ignoring: If we want to go with a Rey Palpatine version, then the character arc/theme is “Your bloodline decides how good or evil you are,” which is not only weird as hell (why would morality be a genetic trait?), but it’s also tangentially explored by Kylo’s storyline. (Although I think that one works better because Kylo wants to embrace the Dark Side, unlike Rey.)

So the problem is, if you want to make Rey’s parents be good guys, that effectively negates the already ludicrous theme that Chris and J.J. are trying to explore. If your bloodline determines your morality, why is Rey’s dad a good guy when his dad is evil incarnate? And more importantly, if Rey comes from two good people, wouldn’t that mean she is genetically “good”? By the movie’s own logic, Rey’s parents being good means she doesn’t have to worry about being susceptible to the Dark Side at all.

So you can make a movie about how Rey is descended from a line of “shitheads,” and she has to break the cycle. Or, more powerfully imo, make a movie about how Rey is her own person, and she rises or falls on her own merits, not her gene pool. (Rey Nobody ftw!) What makes absolutely no thematic sense is to have Rey be descended from Palpatine, but also have her parents be good, kindly folks.

DZ-330 said:

Jar Jar Bricks said:

Ah, what a mess.

This should have been the main tagline for the film haha

Can we put this on the TROS poster? Please?

The Rise of Skywalker: Untold - A “Rey Nobody” edit of Ep. IX | Looking for voices and VFX - Please reach out if interested!

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I think Rey can still want revenge against Palpatine without her parents needing to be noble. Firstly, they were still her parents, and despite the level of abuse/neglect implied by literally selling her into slavery, she’d still probably be opposed to them being murdered, especially since she doesn’t remember them well enough to harbour any personal grudge. Secondly, he’s Palpatine: he’s responsible for a huge amount of death, for turning Ben and starting the First Order (and thus getting Han, Luke and Leia killed), and is actively trying to kill the rest of her friends. Difficult guy to not want some kind of revenge on.

My ideal Rey Palpatine version of this movie keeps her parents as bad people and tries to shift more of the plot onto her worrying about being evil because of using the Dark Side all the time and being tempted to join with Kylo Ren, rather than some kind of genetic determinism. But that’s a looooot of very fiddling dialogue reworking. There’s a lot of tough points, like “why would Rey’s parents not give up her location to Ochi if they were drunks who sold her and not lovely self-sacrificing heroes”, and what to do with Luke going on about “Because you’re a Palpatine!” on Ahch-To, etc.

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I’m gonna reign this in, if that’s all right, since it won’t really play into things until we get to Rey Nobody, and that thread will be better. That’s not a knock; I want it to happen, just there.

My stance on revising fan edits.

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sade1212 said:

I think Rey can still want revenge against Palpatine without her parents needing to be noble. Firstly, they were still her parents, and despite the level of abuse/neglect implied by literally selling her into slavery, she’d still probably be opposed to them being murdered, especially since she doesn’t remember them well enough to harbour any personal grudge. Secondly, he’s Palpatine: he’s responsible for a huge amount of death, for turning Ben and starting the First Order (and thus getting Han, Luke and Leia killed), and is actively trying to kill the rest of her friends. Difficult guy to not want some kind of revenge on.

Why? The point of TLJ is that she doesn’t care about her parents anymore and now has to stick with the Resistance for validation, because she wasted all those years for nothing caring about awful, drunken parents who neglected her. She’d want them to suffer for neglecting her and believing she was nothing.

Having her go back to caring about them regresses that.

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As Hal has requested this topic doesn’t continue in this thread for the time being, any further discussion of Rey Nobody should be done in the Rey Nobody thread.

“It’s like rhymetry. They poem.” - Leorge Gucas

TROS Novelisation: The Faraday Edit, TLJ: Stoic Edition, ROTS: The Faraday Nudge, ROTS Ultracut: Order 66, Kenobi: Faraday Cut, Godzilla Vs Megalon, Godzilla Vs Gigan, Godzilla: Final Wars, The Light Rises, Faraday Jr.'s Star Wars

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All is fair Hal. Better get this edition taken care of and then work on a nobody edit that can work on it.

This movie bro. (Or trilogy to be honest, for me personally.)

“Because you are a PalpaWalker?”

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I swear I’ll stop after this post but Testing is a master-level troll and I feel compelled to address this:

TestingOutTheTest said:
She’d want them to suffer

Does Rey at any point seem like the sort of person who’d want people who’ve wronged her to suffer and be murdered? She forgives, heals and sort-of-falls-in-love-with the guy who stabbed Han (a kind of short-lived surrogate parent figure) in front of her. Such a lust for revenge. /s There’s hating your neglectful parents and then there’s actively cheering on their deaths, you know.

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Don’t do it. Be strong.

heil Palpatine!

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TestingOutTheTest said:

sade1212 said:

I think Rey can still want revenge against Palpatine without her parents needing to be noble. Firstly, they were still her parents, and despite the level of abuse/neglect implied by literally selling her into slavery, she’d still probably be opposed to them being murdered, especially since she doesn’t remember them well enough to harbour any personal grudge. Secondly, he’s Palpatine: he’s responsible for a huge amount of death, for turning Ben and starting the First Order (and thus getting Han, Luke and Leia killed), and is actively trying to kill the rest of her friends. Difficult guy to not want some kind of revenge on.

Why? The point of TLJ is that she doesn’t care about her parents anymore and now has to stick with the Resistance for validation, because she wasted all those years for nothing caring about awful, drunken parents who neglected her. She’d want them to suffer for neglecting her and believing she was nothing.

Having her go back to caring about them regresses that.

 

CaptainFaraday said:

As Hal has requested this topic doesn’t continue in this thread for the time being, any further discussion of Rey Nobody should be done in the Rey Nobody thread.

TestingOutTheTest - I strongly suggest you follow Hal’s request, and CaptainFaraday’s reminder.

And stop continually taking this thread, and also other fan edit threads, off topic.

There won’t be any more requests or warnings.
 

A little patience goes a long way on this old-school Rebel base. If you are having issues finding what you are looking for, these will be of some help…

Welcome to the OriginalTrilogy.com | Introduce yourself in here | Useful info within : About : Help : Site Rules : Fan Project Rules : Announcements
How do I do this?’ on the OriginalTrilogy.com; some info & answers + FAQs - includes info on how to search for projects and threads on the OT•com

A Project Index for Star Wars Preservations (Harmy’s Despecialized & 4K77/80/83 etc) : A Project Index for Star Wars Fan Edits (adywan & Hal 9000 etc)

… and take your time to look around this site before posting - to get a feel for this place. Don’t just lazily make yet another thread asking for projects.

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jarbear said:

This movie bro. (Or trilogy to be honest, for me personally.)

Me too, however the work achieved by the OT.com community does improve every layer of the ST quite a bit, around the TLJ pivot point. I will never watch TROS theatrical cut again, but Ascendant v2 is an edit I will definitely watch and most probably enjoy.

So long 🙌

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MalaStrana#2 said:

jarbear said:

This movie bro. (Or trilogy to be honest, for me personally.)

Me too, however the work achieved by the OT.com community does improve every layer of the ST quite a bit, around the TLJ pivot point. I will never watch TROS theatrical cut again, but Ascendant v2 is an edit I will definitely watch and most probably enjoy.

I agree, it is impressive what’s being done and there is no way I can watch the non fan edits of these movies since they really help remove the gunk. Although I’ll still not fundamentally “accept/agree” the trilogy, I can at least enjoy them for what they are.

I’m curious for V2 and an eventual Nobody version. Work it skilled fan editors, you are our only hope!

“Because you are a PalpaWalker?”

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Well, since my and poppasketti’s edits of TLJ remove the detail that Rey’s parents are dead and buried, this sequence now carries the implication that Rey is learning about or uncovering knowledge that they were, in fact, dead.

My stance on revising fan edits.

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Poppa’s edit actually doesn’t remove it, I’m pretty sure. I had to go in and remove it myself. Was pretty easy to do it seamlessly, though.

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That’s a good thing, by removing that line in TLJ it does at least help with this narrative.

@JarJar, oh yeah, you are right. I remember doing the same thing, I did like a hybrid of Hal’s and Poppa and that was one of the things I made sure to not have in there.

“Because you are a PalpaWalker?”