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Ranking the Star Wars films — Page 164

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Anakin Starkiller said:

openly mocking fans (“Your Snoke theory sucks”) for simply theorising on events and questions setup by TFA

Tbf, all the Snoke and Rey theories did suck. There were a couple for Rey that were decent (memory wiped student of Luke and new Chosen One), but I wasn’t actively rooting for them to come true. Everything else it was blatantly clear wasn’t gonna happen if you have any basic understanding of storytelling and the direction of these movies. Seriously, why did so many people think Snoke would be revealed as that guy Palpatine mentions once a film that these new ones are clearly ignoring? I got both what I hoped for and expected with these two mystery boxes, and no plausible alternatives were presented within the films themselves.

I’m not saying that many of them weren’t either ridiculous, wishful thinking or illogical and inconsistent with Star Wars itself. It was the fact that he openly mocked fans and in retrospect it’s more inline with directly insult since in the end his own explanation was: nothing.

It’s akin to a group of co-workers coming up with different plans to resolve an issue (some of them legitimately good and interesting) but the boss turns around and says all their ideas and plans suck. When they ask him what his grand plan is then - “oh sorry, I don’t have a plan either…but yours sucks regardless”.

Personally I had no theory myself or cared about any particular one other people came up with. I just had a lot of questions from TFA and was genuinely interested to learn more about this character. That interest was actually massively stoked by how powerful and threateningly imposing he is shown to be in TLJ (it finally felt like there was a credible and real threat behind the First Order since the rest of them are bumbling fools), right up to the point he is killed off without so much as a tidbit of background info that would not only tell me about him but why the fuck was the universe in the situation it was in after the previous 6 movies and the ultimate triumph over the Empire and the Emperor!

Val

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  1. Empire Strikes Back (great)
  2. Return of the Jedi (great)
  3. Revenge of the Sith (great)
  4. A New Hope (great)
  5. Rogue One (great)
  6. The Force Awakens (pretty good)
  7. Solo (mediocre)
  8. Attack of the Clones (has it’s highlights)
  9. Phanthom Menace (has it’s highlights)
  10. The Last Jedi (why…)
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Don’t think I’ve ever seen anything like that order before G&G-Fan, quite an interesting one to say the least though I definitely agree on your placement and summation of TLJ 😃

Val

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MalàStrana said:

  1. Star Wars

  2. The Empire Strikes Back

  3. Return of the Jedi

  4. Revenge of the Sith

5-6. The Phantom Menace / The Last Jedi

  1. Attack of the Clones

  2. The Force Awakens

9-10. Rogue One / Solo

Slight changes :

  1. A New Hope
  2. The Empire Strikes Back
  3. Return of the Jedi
  4. Revenge of the Sith
  5. The Last Jedi
  6. The Phantom Menace
  7. Attack of the Clones
  8. Rogue One
    9-10. The Force Awakens / Solo

Ep4/5 are stellar. Ep3/6/8 are solid. Ep1/2 are mediocre but keep the SW spirits somehow. R1 is dull but the last part is OK for some reasons. Ep7 and Solo are very embarrassing (I watched Hal’s v3 yesterday, the movie is better in his cut but so many things are so wrong and phony in every scene - and Ford and Ridley are so bad - that I’m not sure it can really be saved with fanediting anymore). Solo is just the same kind.

“I have to say that I felt George’s group of six films had more innovative visual imagination, and this film was more of a retrenchment to things you had seen before and characters you had seen before, and it took a few baby steps forward with new characters.” - James Cameron about Episode VII.

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MalàStrana said:

MalàStrana said:

  1. Star Wars

Slight changes :

  1. A New Hope

Nooooo.

And in the time of greatest despair, there shall come a savior, and he shall be known as the Son of the Suns.

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1981 A NEW HOPE is better than 1977 STAR WARS (the sound mixing was better 😃 )

“I have to say that I felt George’s group of six films had more innovative visual imagination, and this film was more of a retrenchment to things you had seen before and characters you had seen before, and it took a few baby steps forward with new characters.” - James Cameron about Episode VII.

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Was the movie actually remixed for the '81 reissue? There were old prints where Fox simply spliced the A New Hope crawl into them.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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Lucas was remixing the movie while it was already released in 1977 so I guess 1981 might be different. Was the mix redone in 1985 ? (with the C3PO line added on the DS ?)

“I have to say that I felt George’s group of six films had more innovative visual imagination, and this film was more of a retrenchment to things you had seen before and characters you had seen before, and it took a few baby steps forward with new characters.” - James Cameron about Episode VII.

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There were some sound mix tweaks done for home video around that time.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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MalàStrana said:

Lucas was remixing the movie while it was already released in 1977 so I guess 1981 might be different. Was the mix redone in 1985 ? (with the C3PO line added on the DS ?)

There were three mixes in 1977 (35mm mono, 35mm stereo, and 70mm six-track). These were the only mixes used until the 1985 stereo remix. The 1981 ANH theatrical reissues all used the 1977 stereo mix (I think; it’s possible some used the mono mix, but as no 35mm mono was prepared for ESB, I doubt it).

The mix you’re thinking of is the 1985 remix.

Almost all of the 1981 ANH reissue prints were just 1977 prints with the opening logos, crawl, and flyover chopped off and replaced with the 1981 version.

a trolling bantha

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  1. ANH
  2. ESB
  3. ROTJ
  4. TLJ
  5. ROTS
  6. TFA
  7. TPM
  8. AOTC
  9. Rogue One
  10. Solo

I’m sorry I just think TLJ has so much more depth than any of the prequels or sequels.

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Mine changes all the time but currently it’s:

1.Star Wars (1977)
2.The Empire Strikes Back
3.Return of the Jedi
4.The Force Awakens
5.Solo
6.The Last Jedi (though I prefer the Fallen Knight fan edit)
7.Rogue One
8.The Phantom Menace
9.Revenge of the Sith
10.Attack of the Clones
11.The Clone Wars

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Budu1ux09Rs

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OK guys, just finished watching Solo, so here’s my updated ranking which includes a mini-review for Solo:

  1. The Last Jedi

  2. The Empire strikes Back

  3. Star Wars

  4. Return of the Jedi

  5. Revenge of the Sith

  6. Rogue One

  7. Solo - This movie is just plain average and totally unnecessary, but I won’t deny it has its moments. Some of the jokes did make me chuckle, and there are some sequences and visuals that are pretty neat. Lando’s droid companion L3 is perhaps the most WTF character in SW history, and Maul’s cameo was nice but it does raise a lot of questions.

  8. Attack of the Clones

  9. The Phantom Menace

  10. The Force Awakens - seriously, fuck this movie.

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NeverarGreat said:

I don’t think I’ve ever seen TLJ and TFA on opposite sides of a ranking before. I assume it comes down to director, but apart from that are there any reasons for the divide?

Because TFA was such a letdown.

Never before has a SW movie, or any movie for that matter, disappointed me as much as TFA has. It was such a carbon copy of the first one, and to make matters worse everybody else heaped all kinds of praise on it.

After that fiasco I fully expected TLJ to a rehash of TESB and had no expectations whatsoever in regards to the movie, however once a friend saw it on its opening day and texted me that it wasn’t like TESB I was suddenly pumped, and went in to the cinema and enjoyed every second of it and once the credits started rolling I left the cinema with a sense of euphoria.

Of course the excitement has died down a bit and there are some things I would change like Rose’s line about not fighting what we hate, saving what we love, which I find way too corny and remove Poe’s jests at the beginning of the movie, but while I’m not a studio executive I would have started the ST with TLJ or at least make Episode VII very similar to it. I know it’s petty, but I also felt satisfaction at seeing all those who loved TFA being let down by TLJ, and the fact that all those stupid fan theories were totally dismissed.

Basically TLJ was the SW movie I didn’t know I wanted and arrived when I least expected, and for that I feel grateful towards Brian Johnson.

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If you didn’t like TFA that much as a carbon copy of ANH then I don’t understand how you can put TLJ at the top. It’s not a carbon copy in the sense of TFA but it reuses and repurposed so much from TESB and ROTJ in a mixed up fashion that IMO it is magnitudes worse than TFA.

I get the issues with TFA which I also took issue with but it wasn’t as big a deal for me as I overall enjoyed it as a love letter to the OT and trying to feel like the Star Wars that everyone loves while setting up new story and character arcs that started leading away from the rehashery and borrowing of ANH, that setup a lot of expectation and promise for TLJ which ended up taking a left turn at the intersection onto a road from another world instead of the expected right turn…

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TFA didn’t feel like a love letter to the OT at all to me, rather like the most expensive fan film ever made.

TLJ is weighed down by the ST’s poor set up (the FO being inexplicably all-conquering and powerful), but still succeeded despite all the things it had going against it.

That’s another problem I have with TFA. Abrams approached the movie like a fan, whereas Johnson approached it like a filmmaker first and foremost.

Since the movie’s release all online discussions feel like an exercise in who can hate the movie more, which why I’m not particularly fond of expressing my love for it as it makes me feel like some sort of extraterrestrial being with a mindset drastically different from others.

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fmalover said:

NeverarGreat said:

I don’t think I’ve ever seen TLJ and TFA on opposite sides of a ranking before. I assume it comes down to director, but apart from that are there any reasons for the divide?

Because TFA was such a letdown.

Never before has a SW movie, or any movie for that matter, disappointed me as much as TFA has. It was such a carbon copy of the first one, and to make matters worse everybody else heaped all kinds of praise on it.

After that fiasco I fully expected TLJ to a rehash of TESB and had no expectations whatsoever in regards to the movie, however once a friend saw it on its opening day and texted me that it wasn’t like TESB I was suddenly pumped, and went in to the cinema and enjoyed every second of it and once the credits started rolling I left the cinema with a sense of euphoria.

Of course the excitement has died down a bit and there are some things I would change like Rose’s line about not fighting what we hate, saving what we love, which I find way too corny and remove Poe’s jests at the beginning of the movie, but while I’m not a studio executive I would have started the ST with TLJ or at least make Episode VII very similar to it. I know it’s petty, but I also felt satisfaction at seeing all those who loved TFA being let down by TLJ, and the fact that all those stupid fan theories were totally dismissed.

Basically TLJ was the SW movie I didn’t know I wanted and arrived when I least expected, and for that I feel grateful towards Brian Johnson.

You feel grateful towards the former lead vocalist of AC/DC for a starwars movie? 😉

In all seriousness; while I like TFA more than TLJ, it’s interesting to see someone feel the opposite way, and have valid reasons for it. Your perspective is a breath of fresh air!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Budu1ux09Rs

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rocknroll41 said:

fmalover said:

NeverarGreat said:

I don’t think I’ve ever seen TLJ and TFA on opposite sides of a ranking before. I assume it comes down to director, but apart from that are there any reasons for the divide?

Because TFA was such a letdown.

Never before has a SW movie, or any movie for that matter, disappointed me as much as TFA has. It was such a carbon copy of the first one, and to make matters worse everybody else heaped all kinds of praise on it.

After that fiasco I fully expected TLJ to a rehash of TESB and had no expectations whatsoever in regards to the movie, however once a friend saw it on its opening day and texted me that it wasn’t like TESB I was suddenly pumped, and went in to the cinema and enjoyed every second of it and once the credits started rolling I left the cinema with a sense of euphoria.

Of course the excitement has died down a bit and there are some things I would change like Rose’s line about not fighting what we hate, saving what we love, which I find way too corny and remove Poe’s jests at the beginning of the movie, but while I’m not a studio executive I would have started the ST with TLJ or at least make Episode VII very similar to it. I know it’s petty, but I also felt satisfaction at seeing all those who loved TFA being let down by TLJ, and the fact that all those stupid fan theories were totally dismissed.

Basically TLJ was the SW movie I didn’t know I wanted and arrived when I least expected, and for that I feel grateful towards Brian Johnson.

You feel grateful towards the former lead vocalist of AC/DC for a starwars movie? 😉

In all seriousness; while I like TFA more than TLJ, it’s interesting to see someone feel the opposite way, and have valid reasons for it. Your perspective is a breath of fresh air!

Goddamned autocorrect.

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fmalover said:

OK guys, just finished watching Solo, so here’s my updated ranking which includes a mini-review for Solo:

&

fmalover said:

NeverarGreat said:

I don’t think I’ve ever seen TLJ and TFA on opposite sides of a ranking before. I assume it comes down to director, but apart from that are there any reasons for the divide?

Because TFA was such a letdown.

I love this about the community here - everyone having their own preferences and favourites, of course… and on occasion something (or a couple of posts) that just comes along and makes you think about how other fans views the films in a way we may not often appreciate or maybe not considered much before.

With additional respect for AC/DC too 😉

Nice one, man.
 

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here?
And say something righteous and hopeful for a change?

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fmalover said:

TFA didn’t feel like a love letter to the OT at all to me, rather like the most expensive fan film ever made.

TLJ is weighed down by the ST’s poor set up (the FO being inexplicably all-conquering and powerful), but still succeeded despite all the things it had going against it.

That’s another problem I have with TFA. Abrams approached the movie like a fan, whereas Johnson approached it like a filmmaker first and foremost.

Since the movie’s release all online discussions feel like an exercise in who can hate the movie more, which why I’m not particularly fond of expressing my love for it as it makes me feel like some sort of extraterrestrial being with a mindset drastically different from others.

That’s funny as I have the exact same thoughts about TLJ (being essentially an officialised fan film due to all the quirky and left field elements that are inconsistent with the Star Wars I know, making it feel like someone’s personal take on Star Wars rather than a direct continuation of the previous film and preceding saga’s style, themes and tone that make it feel like Star Wars).

See, I have the same issues with TFA now as you do but that’s because TLJ failed to provide sufficient or compelling (or any at all) explanations for all the unexplained things occurring in TFA. Additionally due to the disappointment that TLJ was to me and how drastically it departed from what was setup in TFA, TFA as a direct result is now a mediocre to poor movie for me where prior to TLJ it was good to excellent.

But yeah, you shouldn’t feel restricted from discussing the movie and what you like about it. There are many here that enjoy and even love TLJ, you certainly aren’t alone nor in the presence of a majority here that hate the movie. In fact I’m certain I’m part of the minority here on OT.com that actively hate TLJ.

I think the only oddity with your ranking is just how the two ST movies are at polar opposites from each other and that’s what pique’s people’s interest to wonder aloud why 😉

Val

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Valheru_84 said:

fmalover said:

TFA didn’t feel like a love letter to the OT at all to me, rather like the most expensive fan film ever made.

TLJ is weighed down by the ST’s poor set up (the FO being inexplicably all-conquering and powerful), but still succeeded despite all the things it had going against it.

That’s another problem I have with TFA. Abrams approached the movie like a fan, whereas Johnson approached it like a filmmaker first and foremost.

Since the movie’s release all online discussions feel like an exercise in who can hate the movie more, which why I’m not particularly fond of expressing my love for it as it makes me feel like some sort of extraterrestrial being with a mindset drastically different from others.

See, I have the same issues with TFA now as you do but that’s because TLJ failed to provide sufficient or compelling (or any at all) explanations for all the unexplained things occurring in TFA. Additionally due to the disappointment that TLJ was to me and how drastically it departed from what was setup in TFA, TFA as a direct result is now a mediocre to poor movie for me where prior to TLJ it was good to excellent.

Actually, the fact that TLJ disregards TFA worked in the film’s favour in my view.

I’ve also posted previously that with TLJ, Johnson has earned my full trust and now I’m eagerly anticipating Johnson’s SW trilogy, even more than Episode IX, the best part being that it will be a brand new story that is wholly disconnected from the main saga.