logo Sign In

44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released) — Page 11

Author
Time
 (Edited)

It was an all day afair but I had time…

https://vimeo.com/495937271

Enjoy the restored music and footage and fixed chronological scene orders which was another bodge up because they kept fiddling about with it hopefully this takes it back to a nearly or close to perfect version all that is needed is Gil Galads death really…Of which is not available but hopefully will be next year.

Author
Time

44rh1n said:
WOW, you’re right! I just checked my iTunes copy, and it looks REALLY good! It’s still only HD for me (hopefully it upgrades to 4K for me eventually – iTunes usually does!), but it’s definitely the new master. It looks WAY better than the old green extended Blu-ray master!

So I’m curious about something. When you stream the new master from iTunes/Apple TV on an 1080p SDR monitor, what are you actually watching? I get that the 4K would just be downscaled to 1080p, but what about the HDR? Is there some kind of tone mapping being done, or does Apple already have a 1080p SDR version of the new master that automatically streams if they detect you’re using a non-HDR screen?

Author
Time

Nick66 said:

So I’m curious about something. When you stream the new master from iTunes/Apple TV on an 1080p SDR monitor, what are you actually watching? I get that the 4K would just be downscaled to 1080p, but what about the HDR? Is there some kind of tone mapping being done, or does Apple already have a 1080p SDR version of the new master that automatically streams if they detect you’re using a non-HDR screen?

I’d assume all streaming services have an HDR and SDR version of films, and just give you what your monitor supports. Tone mapping HDR to SDR is very resource intensive and not very accurate, while storage is cheap.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

stwd4nder2 said:

Nick66 said:

So I’m curious about something. When you stream the new master from iTunes/Apple TV on an 1080p SDR monitor, what are you actually watching? I get that the 4K would just be downscaled to 1080p, but what about the HDR? Is there some kind of tone mapping being done, or does Apple already have a 1080p SDR version of the new master that automatically streams if they detect you’re using a non-HDR screen?

I’d assume all streaming services have an HDR and SDR version of films, and just give you what your monitor supports.

That’s what I’d assume also. But the 1080p/SDR version of the new LOTR masters hasn’t officially been released yet (a release is scheduled for this summer), so if Apple does indeed have the SDR versions, we’re getting a preview of what those are going to look like.

stwd4nder2 said:
Tone mapping HDR to SDR is very resource intensive and not very accurate, while storage is cheap.

Perhaps. But my Nvidia Shield does HDR to SDR tone mapping on the fly, as does Plex, and the results are actually pretty impressive.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Nick66 said:

44rh1n said:
WOW, you’re right! I just checked my iTunes copy, and it looks REALLY good! It’s still only HD for me (hopefully it upgrades to 4K for me eventually – iTunes usually does!), but it’s definitely the new master. It looks WAY better than the old green extended Blu-ray master!

So I’m curious about something. When you stream the new master from iTunes/Apple TV on an 1080p SDR monitor, what are you actually watching? I get that the 4K would just be downscaled to 1080p, but what about the HDR? Is there some kind of tone mapping being done, or does Apple already have a 1080p SDR version of the new master that automatically streams if they detect you’re using a non-HDR screen?

The simple answer is that the 1080p version is an SDR master that’s been derived from the HDR master. It’s not HDR, but it comes from the same source.

The more complex answer is that this was mastered in Dolby Vision. A lot of people don’t quite understand what Dolby Vision actually is, so let me explain: Dolby Vision is when you take an HDR (Rec.2020/ST.2084) graded master, and use Dolby’s trim analysis tools to perform a shot-for-shot tonemapping of the entire film. Every single shot is analyzed and remapped to fit inside of a Rec.709/Gamma 2.4/100-nit SDR container. After the analysis, Dolby has additional custom trim tools that allow the colorist to fine-tune the SDR version of the film. They can tweak the exposure, the saturation, and the balance/tint. This way, they can make SDR version look as good as possible. Then the same analysis/trim pass is repeated a number of times to accommodate the capabilities of different screens. For example, a brand new analysis and trim pass will be performed for 600-nit TVs, 400-nit TVs, etc. This is why Dolby Vision HDR looks so much better on consumer screens than generic HDR, because its tonemapping is done by the colorist himself rather than just using a TV’s automatic tonemapping. Every version of the film, tailored to your specific screen, was done by the colorist.

So when you’re watching the SDR version, you’re not just watching something that’s been automatically tonemapped. You’re watching the Dolby Vision SDR version that the colorist has actually created, using Dolby’s toolkit, and derived from that original HDR master. That’s what Dolby Vision is – a toolset that allows filmmakers to create an HDR master and then interpolate the color grade all the way down to SDR while preserving the original intent of the grade.

And yes, I would imagine that the new 1080p Blu-rays are going to be from that same Dolby Vision SDR trim. So they will likely look the same as the iTunes 1080p versions, but with a much higher bitrate.

Hope that makes sense.

Author
Time

Thanks much for the detailed explanation! Still think your FOTR looks better. 😃

Author
Time

Hey! While I’ve been too ill and tired to look through all pages I just wanted to post again and say thank you! It’s really nice to have the extended version in higher resolution with its original colors.

It’s been a long time since I worked with restoring movies but if I have any constructive criticizm it would be - mind that it’s just my opinion - first of all: There is a bit too much grain in the highlights sometimes. Like when Arwen appears in light and speaks to Frodo. Maybe it was necessary to cover the DNR in the theatrical blu-ray shots but yeah, in the highlights it looks a bit too visible and sharp. And don’t get me wrong, I’d take this version over any other, any day!

(Dwalin’s version was fine too though it suffers from the downsides of the messed up contrast and colors of the extended blu-ray like the artifacts in the sky of the wide landscape shots after the Fellowship leaves Rivendell, or Aragorn’s skin being cyan-tinted when looking out the window from the Prancing Pony. Dwalin did a great job matching shots anyway though I’d always make sure the black level is always black which can be extra tough.)

And second: Some of the extended version’s shots are oversharpened already in the source. Example: https://i.imgur.com/K7EIZvE.png
Then the sharp grain on top of that makes it look even more oversharpened! I’d blur such scenes just a tiny bit before applying that grain.

Then I saw a difference in two shots of Galadriel that comes after each other. First one looks great and the second looks like a DVD upscale, has slightly different colors and no grain added on top of it. Not sure what happened there: https://imgur.com/a/nv3x9oS

Hope you’ll make a shot by shot correction based on the upcoming blu-ray release! (if it’s like the old extended blu-ray minus all the color changes they made and the awful green tint)

Again, thank you so much for this version!

Author
Time

Hey You_Too, it’s good to hear from you. And I think you undervalue your own blanket tint adjustment. While not as good as this, it was still worlds better than the EE Blu-ray, and the best alternative version available for quite some time. Just, you know, Merry’s vest went all orange, that’s all 😉

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Saying that the fellowship of the ring never had a digital grade before is nonsence the limited edition dvd with costa boates documentary had a digital grade for sure.

You will taste lambflesh! or so a kiwi told me…

Author
Time

Awesome project, I would also like to get my hands on the newer V2 - I only had V1, which was great.

Author
Time

Nick66 said:

I finally got a chance to watch this last night, and I have to say…absolutely stellar job by 44rh1n. One of the best, and most needed, fan restorations I’ve ever seen. Given how important, and beloved, this film is, and how egregious the green tint which plagues the EE BD, I’m frankly surprised this release has not gotten more attention here.

The colours, as near as I can tell, are a near perfect match for the EE DVD and TE BD. And anyone who’s familiar with the TE BD know its problems with edge enhancement, but 44rn1n has done an amazing job of ameliorating that…as least as I believe is possible with this release. In addition to the colours being what they should be be, the muddiness and lack of definition in the extended scenes has been greatly improved.

Really top notch all around, including the little details…including all the commentary tracks, removing any black screen between the disc transition, no cropping, etc. A job very well done and highly recommended.

44rh1n, just a couple questions…as you know, in addition to the significant additional scenes and alterations in the EE, there are many minor, almost unnoticeable changes from the TE…sometimes something a little as lingering for half a second at the end of a shot. How did you handle these?

Also, now that you have a cap of the Netflix TE (which I’ve watched as is an improvement I agree), any plans to upgrade this release anytime soon?

Again, much thanks for taking this on and giving it so much care and thought.

How do I get the movie?

Author
Time

Brthld said:

Awesome project, I would also like to get my hands on the newer V2 - I only had V1, which was great.

Did you get it?

Author
Time

It has been almost a month since you asked, no hope getting the link anymore I guess lol.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Imperium - posting four times in here about getting hold of this… in a matter of minutes. Really?

Please take the time to look around and see how things work on here - a little patience does go a long way… 👍
 

Welcome to the OriginalTrilogy.com; Introduce yourself in here + useful info within

I have found a Fan Edit / Preservation Project I am interested in - but don’t know how to get / acquire / download it?

‘How do I do this?’ on the OriginalTrilogy.com; some info & answers + member FAQs - in the General Assistance section.
 

A little patience goes a long way on this old-school Rebel base. If you are having issues finding what you are looking for, these will be of some help…

Welcome to the OriginalTrilogy.com | Introduce yourself in here | Useful info within : About : Help : Site Rules : Fan Project Rules : Announcements
How do I do this?’ on the OriginalTrilogy.com; some info & answers + FAQs - includes info on how to search for projects and threads on the OT•com

A Project Index for Star Wars Preservations (Harmy’s Despecialized & 4K77/80/83 etc) : A Project Index for Star Wars Fan Edits (adywan & Hal 9000 etc)

… and take your time to look around this site before posting - to get a feel for this place. Don’t just lazily make yet another thread asking for projects.

Author
Time

I am thinking about making a regrade of the new UHD Transfers of LOTR, so they look like the DVDs, in terms of sharpness and definition would it be worth it or should i stick to this version?

Author
Time

SHM said:

I am thinking about making a regrade of the new UHD Transfers of LOTR, so they look like the DVDs, in terms of sharpness and definition would it be worth it or should i stick to this version?

I would go with the UHD versions. They are definitely improvements.

Project creator and film enthusiast.

Author
Time

Can I have a link. My mom is really into this movie and I think she would love this.

Does anyone want fried chicken?

Author
Time
 (Edited)

CloakedDragon97 said:

SHM said:

I am thinking about making a regrade of the new UHD Transfers of LOTR, so they look like the DVDs, in terms of sharpness and definition would it be worth it or should i stick to this version?

I would go with the UHD versions. They are definitely improvements.

But it turns out that many Blu-Ray reviewers have found out that all six movies and the Extended Editions were very likely all the older master files (the sloppy color grading job on the HD version of FOTR Extended excluded) upscaled and regraded one more shot-for-shot with extra digital noise reduction and sharpening. Jackson even admits that the color grading in FOTR was analog compared to the sequels, while he said that the green tint was intentional alongside director of photography Andrew Lesnie to bring it in line with The Hobbit. Also, this video has proven a good point about the 4K UHD releases and the problems within the transfers.

https://youtu.be/I3Z58uiwcME

Author
Time

KokoNigel, a lot of that was actually covered (with some back and forth) in this very thread, pages ~7-10.

Here’s a quite damning comparison. The blu-ray literally has a lot more detail than the 4k, lots of detail turned to mush 😦

https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?d1=5240&d2=15006&s1=48928&s2=156526&x=665&y=172&i=16&a=2&go=1&l=1

And the more famous “detail death by DNR” compare that people were sharing

https://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/8656

LightWave = fun times with gfx for me 😃

Author
Time

WXM said:

KokoNigel, a lot of that was actually covered (with some back and forth) in this very thread, pages ~7-10.

Here’s a quite damning comparison. The blu-ray literally has a lot more detail than the 4k, lots of detail turned to mush 😦

https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?d1=5240&d2=15006&s1=48928&s2=156526&x=665&y=172&i=16&a=2&go=1&l=1

And the more famous “detail death by DNR” compare that people were sharing

https://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/8656

So, BD has poorer contrast but less DNR and sharpening. 4K on the other hand has better contrast but more DNR and sharpening.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Would love a link to the V1 version if anyone can provide. 😃

edit: also interested in the V3 version.
edit: got it, thanks!