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Rogue One * Spoilers * Thread — Page 165

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NeverarGreat said:

I’d say that she still isn’t convinced to fight for the Rebellion in the Hologram scene. She is actually more interested in finding and rescuing her father. It is only after his death (strangely, at the hands of the Rebellion) that she decides to get the plans. I don’t think she ever really aligns with the Rebellion, more accurate to say that they both have the same objective in the end.

pretty much this. she seemed very antagonistic towards the rebellion during her time in yavin. she was always a lone fighter - but in the scenes where she discovered the truth about her father, she stopped fighting for herself and started fighting for somethng bigger, even if still as a lone wolf. at no point during the film she’s a rebel (as in a member of the rebellion) imo.

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NeverarGreat said:

I’d say that she still isn’t convinced to fight for the Rebellion in the Hologram scene. She is actually more interested in finding and rescuing her father. It is only after his death (strangely, at the hands of the Rebellion) that she decides to get the plans. I don’t think she ever really aligns with the Rebellion, more accurate to say that they both have the same objective in the end.

That sounds more like what I remember.

See, I was right without knowing why.

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The Autistic Asexual said:
There’s characters in Rogue One. You might not like them but they’re there.

Not true. To like or dislike them they have to exist. Instead it’s a bunch of stand ins that are not developed. Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying that SW77 or even the PT has deep characters. But you need either real characterisation, or just simply fun screen presence and charisma. But you have to have one or the other.

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Well sure there are people doing a bunch of things on the screen. Yes.

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The characters in Star Wars has never been deep. Deal with it. When you buy a Star Wars action figure 9 and 1/2 times out of 10 it’ll be a masked character or some kind of really cool creature, it won’t be a human character with a face. That should give any thinking person a clue as to what kind of film franchise Star Wars really is.

Reality sucks, watch movies.

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A character behind a mask can’t be deep?

Also, there’s a bunch of deep characters in Star Wars, namely Luke and Vader. Later there’s Kylo.

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i think jyn is a good character. far from the best, but a good one. so is cassian. a trillion times better than rey, for example.

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I wouldn’t put either in the same league as Rey. Both have big problems. Cassian is better realized in general though his arc is weaker.

The characters in RO are somewhat weak overall, but I think that fact is overstated. Prequels don’t hold a candle in that regard, for instance.

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rey is extremely charismatic and a very likeable character overall. she has some very interesting stuff that she has to figure out about herself that would make her an awesome character. unfortunately she suffers from overpoweredness, which makes me lose my interest in her and even find her annoying. (plus i don’t think she’s well written in tfa)

jyn is likeable even though she’s not an active protagonist and while she has somewhat of an arc it’s not a very well developed one (even though i quite liked it and thought it was very compelling) which ends up hurting RO a lot.

cassian imo is the most interesting character in RO: he had lost himself in the war and ends up finding his way back to the light with jyn, i think. i should rewatch the movie, but i remember cassian being a well developed character.

sure if you like rey she’s a much better character than the other two. objectively she’s miles ahead from any of them. but i dislike rey, so, to me, rogue one’s characters are far better.

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I agree with a lot of what you both said. Especially what Collipso’s thoughts on Cassian. He is the standout from Rogue One.

Rey is incredibly likable and charismatic but often times is uninteresting and just boring. I liked Rey a lot better in the Last Jedi though. She lacked any physical challenges but did have an identity struggle that proved to be really interesting.

Here’s a good way of showing what I mean…

When Rey lifts the rocks for the Resistance to escape, I feel nothing. She lifts them, oh well. I never saw her struggle with any force powers before hand so I was not surprised or elated in any way to see her succeed to lift the rocks.

Buutttttt, when her and Finn reunite, you see them hug, and then we get the close up of Rey smiling, I do feel something! It’s because it shows her finally learning where she belongs, and feeling at peace with being a “nobody”. She doesn’t have to feel like that anymore because she is somebody regardless of her parents.

Therein lies my stance on Rey. Any combat victories or feats of the force on her part feel empty and unearned. But the emotion of her trying to find where she belongs is compelling and relatable.

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The Autistic Asexual said:

When you buy a Star Wars action figure 9 and 1/2 times out of 10 it’ll be a masked character or some kind of really cool creature, it won’t be a human character with a face.

This is true for me, but it’s just because the human characters have awfully sculpted faces.

Not enough people read the EU.

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The Autistic Asexual said:

The characters in Star Wars has never been deep. Deal with it.

When you buy a Star Wars action figure 9 and 1/2 times out of 10 it’ll be a masked character or some kind of really cool creature, it won’t be a human character with a face. That should give any thinking person a clue as to what kind of film franchise Star Wars really is.

I already said they weren’t deep, and why it doesn’t always matter.

The rest of this is a non sequitur.

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 (Edited)

Why does Tarkin’s CGI in Rogue One look so plastic-y? Could they have made it look more realistic?

a reply from Hal Hickel, Animation Director at Industrial Light and Magic (1996-present)…

https://www.quora.com/Why-does-Tarkins-CGI-in-Rogue-One-look-so-plastic-y-Could-they-have-made-it-look-more-realistic/answer/Hal-Hickel-1?share=7ba8846a&srid=ziwh
 

Seems he’s answered a few other fan questions too - which is pretty cool and kind of him to do.
 

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darthrush said:

I agree with a lot of what you both said. Especially what Collipso’s thoughts on Cassian. He is the standout from Rogue One.

Rey is incredibly likable and charismatic but often times is uninteresting and just boring. I liked Rey a lot better in the Last Jedi though. She lacked any physical challenges but did have an identity struggle that proved to be really interesting.

Here’s a good way of showing what I mean…

When Rey lifts the rocks for the Resistance to escape, I feel nothing. She lifts them, oh well. I never saw her struggle with any force powers before hand so I was not surprised or elated in any way to see her succeed to lift the rocks.

Buutttttt, when her and Finn reunite, you see them hug, and then we get the close up of Rey smiling, I do feel something! It’s because it shows her finally learning where she belongs, and feeling at peace with being a “nobody”. She doesn’t have to feel like that anymore because she is somebody regardless of her parents.

Therein lies my stance on Rey. Any combat victories or feats of the force on her part feel empty and unearned. But the emotion of her trying to find where she belongs is compelling and relatable.

This is exactly how I feel as well. Well put.

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Finally got around to rewatching this last night; first time since theaters. I was pleasantly surprised to see that I still really like this movie, despite the intermediate time being full of reading people say the movie has Problems and isn’t so great. Nah, I think it’s great. I was even surprised to find that CG-Leia was fine! CG-Tarkin, however, is still not fine. It is bad. Oh, and incorporating Red & Gold Leader worked surprisingly well. I could still tell the footage wasn’t quite as crisp as the others - but it was close enough.

But yeah, I liked the characters! I even think Jyn had an arc: She went from not wanting to be a part of the Rebellion because of her traumatic childhood, to giving her life for the slim chance that someday someone might succeed (i.e. hope). I suspect the Cassian show will have a lot of stuff about him learning to kill.

Standout performance was definitely Riz Ahmed - but I thought all the rest were good too. Most compelling scene was the emotional debrief onboard the cargo shuttle after the botched Eadu mission, confronting Cassian about whether he was sent to assassinate Galen or not. Worst moment is, of course, when Vader makes a pun, and frankly that entire scene is pretty bad, even though I’m all for showing that Krennic is all about getting favorable job performance reviews instead of the glory of the Empire. If that guy had been born a hundred years earlier, he would have been obsessed with ensuring the Senate recognized his ability to manage grain shipments or some equally Republican job.

And, yes, I am a sucker for Exciting Times with X-Wings. I can not deny that that helps.

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Cassian Andor is great in Rogue One. He definitely shot first.

I like seeing the Rebellion isn’t all white knights and everyone gets dirty in war. Cassian is ready to do whatever he thinks is necessary to get the job done. His new series should be very interesting.

Chirrut Îmwe and Baze Malbus are great too. Baze lost his faith in the Force after the Empire raids the Guardians of the Whills temple while Chirrut remains steadfast in his belief, but their friendship still endures. I love how the Death Troopers, who had been able to easily pick off anyone who stepped out, were unable to shoot Chirrut as he walked to the control panel. He does get caught up in the blast as a Death Trooper shoots the panel itself and it explodes. Baze rushes to his side and in their final moments, Baze has his belief in the Force restored and proceeds to take out the Death Troopers before being killed by a grenade. Chills.

I’m a huge fan of Mads Mikkelsen and his presence elevates anything he is in. Forest Whitaker does a great job of bringing a character from the animated Clone Wars series to life. Ben Mendelsohn is great as Krennic. Very memorable as he looks out to the horizon to see the Death Star, all his ambition, about to destroy him.

Tarkin and Leia do not look perfect, but I applaud the effort and their appearance doesn’t take me out of the movie. I think it is amazing how far they’ve come and can only imagine what they will be able to do in a few years.

Don’t get me started on Vader. I’ll fill up this entire forum!

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Totally agree with you, Rodney. I absolutely love Rogue One for all the reasons you mention. Baze and Chirrut are awesome characters; easily my favorite characters from the new era of films. Easily. I’d almost rather have a B&C show than a Cassian show, but I’m still totally pumped about the show we are getting. I’ve like his character more each time I’ve rewatched R1 and the premise of the show sounds really cool.

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Gave this another spin last night. Just a wonderful, wonderful movie.

I’ll second everything Rodney said, except to say that I’ve come to the conclusion that Tarkin looks like crap. He looks a bit waxy, and his face moves way to much. Peter Cushing was more stone faced in his portrayal. Seems like something they literally could’ve just dialed down a little.

Still, far from enough to ruin the movie and it gets an A

TV’s Frink said:

I would put this in my sig if I weren’t so lazy.

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I think there may be a fear that if the face is too static, it’s not going to look real, so they over-animate a tad. On the flip side of the coin, I think Disney once got some critical flak for the human characters in Sleeping Beauty being too stiff, when the animators were trying to be more realistic.

Having seen R1 twice in 70mm IMAX, Tarkin looked good to me. Is there something about putting the images out onto film that makes it less digital looking, or am I simply perceiving it that way because I know I’m watching a print?

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I could see a layer of grain helping with the overall appearance of it, which, if that were resolved, might lead one to be more forgiving of the rest.

Edit: for all I know, this is all a relic of my shitty 32" Samsung LCD TV. I remember being shocked at the realism in the theater (DCP)

TV’s Frink said:

I would put this in my sig if I weren’t so lazy.

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CHEWBAKAspelledwrong said:

Gave this another spin last night. Just a wonderful, wonderful movie.

I’ll second everything Rodney said, except to say that I’ve come to the conclusion that Tarkin looks like crap. He looks a bit waxy, and his face moves way to much. Peter Cushing was more stone faced in his portrayal. Seems like something they literally could’ve just dialed down a little.

Still, far from enough to ruin the movie and it gets an A

I have a theory that the biggest issue with this weird CGI facial animation comes down to the smooth way a CGI movement is animated versus the twitchy way muscles really move. I think this is also one reason why an animatronic puppet can more easily appear lifelike than CGI - the mechanical servos that control the puppet are often a better approximation of muscles than smooth motion gradients.

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CHEWBAKAspelledwrong said:

I could see a layer of grain helping with the overall appearance of it, which, if that were resolved, might lead one to be more forgiving of the rest.

Edit: for all I know, this is all a relic of my shitty 32" Samsung LCD TV. I remember being shocked at the realism in the theater (DCP)

Do you know if the auto motion aka Soap Opera Effect is switched on or off? You’ll want it off.

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