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Episode VIII : The Last Jedi - Discussion * SPOILER THREAD * — Page 65

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TV’s Frink said:

LuckyGungan2001 said:

Lord Tobias said:

The biggest plot twist in last jedi

The force ghosts are not real…but are all a deception from snoke.

All this time, he had been using his great powers to manipulate yoda and obi wan to think that they would come back after death…falsely believing that they can contact luke.

They were deceived and they were only able to observe the events but not interfere(meaning they couldn’t warn luke about anything).

Snoke was there this whole time from the death star to Hoth to dagobah to even the emotional ghost scene at the end of return of the jedi. He was using his powers to deceive luke and the audience into thinking he was talking and looking at his dead loved ones.

That is why obi wanted luke to kill vader, to corrupt luke to turn into snoke’s high priest…a position he later gave to kylo ren. What is snoke that he is powerful enough to do this? Snoke is a WHILL…whills are mentioned several times in rogue one.

Whills are the star wars equivalent to angel (or even a minor god) immortal beings connected to the force and are essentially godlike. He was the best whill and the other Whills grew very jealous of him. He all his life yearned to leave his realm to explore and influence the larger galaxy.

One day the snoke was prideful and belittled his friends for their jealousy which would without a doubt have caused the other Whills to be angry and pissed. one day he was betrayed and thrown out of his home by jealous whills who wanted him gone. And snoke was emotionally devastated, but instead of forgiving his spiritual brothers he became enraged and went to the jedi.

Where he created the sith, leading to the rise of the sith empire. The immense destruction the sith wars cost gave snoke more and more power(using the dark side to regain his power). He was soon strong enough to return to his realm and singlehandily killed all the whills for betraying him. He was cast out again by the bendu(a elder entity who is a associate of the whills if not one of them).

Now what does this all have to do with luke? Because snoke was casted down at the time that the sith empire fell…leading to the rule of 2.

Slowly he wanted to turn the galaxy into a theocracy…the more people who worship his ideals the more powerful he became.

Of course we see star wars play out. As the sith were manipulating the republic, snoke was manipulating qui-gon, yoda and finally obi wan into his false doctrine of immortality after death. And that voice that we hear In new hope is not obi wan…but snoke’s. Who was guiding luke so that he can manipulate events to his liking. Luke was meant to be his crowning jewl. His high priest for a dark side religion that will make him powerful enough to “improve” the galaxy. He doesn’t want to rule the galaxy but turn it into a paradise. He wants to make sure no one suffers. But Snoke is like a god…he needs worship to get stronger. Kylo ren is not an apprentice but a high priest of a new religion meant to worship and empower him. This whole time, luke was deceived.

Force ghosts were never real and snoke is basically space satan…deceiving us all

That is why luke is angry and is saying that the jedi are bullshit…because he has no one to confide in. The jedi were just pawns to a game that snoke played.

Thoughts?

Come on man, if you’re gonna break the forum rule, at least use the gif.

Oh crap there is a rule against picture only posts. I apologise.

Not enough people read the EU.

Author
Time

LuckyGungan2001 said:

TV’s Frink said:

LuckyGungan2001 said:

Lord Tobias said:

The biggest plot twist in last jedi

The force ghosts are not real…but are all a deception from snoke.

All this time, he had been using his great powers to manipulate yoda and obi wan to think that they would come back after death…falsely believing that they can contact luke.

They were deceived and they were only able to observe the events but not interfere(meaning they couldn’t warn luke about anything).

Snoke was there this whole time from the death star to Hoth to dagobah to even the emotional ghost scene at the end of return of the jedi. He was using his powers to deceive luke and the audience into thinking he was talking and looking at his dead loved ones.

That is why obi wanted luke to kill vader, to corrupt luke to turn into snoke’s high priest…a position he later gave to kylo ren. What is snoke that he is powerful enough to do this? Snoke is a WHILL…whills are mentioned several times in rogue one.

Whills are the star wars equivalent to angel (or even a minor god) immortal beings connected to the force and are essentially godlike. He was the best whill and the other Whills grew very jealous of him. He all his life yearned to leave his realm to explore and influence the larger galaxy.

One day the snoke was prideful and belittled his friends for their jealousy which would without a doubt have caused the other Whills to be angry and pissed. one day he was betrayed and thrown out of his home by jealous whills who wanted him gone. And snoke was emotionally devastated, but instead of forgiving his spiritual brothers he became enraged and went to the jedi.

Where he created the sith, leading to the rise of the sith empire. The immense destruction the sith wars cost gave snoke more and more power(using the dark side to regain his power). He was soon strong enough to return to his realm and singlehandily killed all the whills for betraying him. He was cast out again by the bendu(a elder entity who is a associate of the whills if not one of them).

Now what does this all have to do with luke? Because snoke was casted down at the time that the sith empire fell…leading to the rule of 2.

Slowly he wanted to turn the galaxy into a theocracy…the more people who worship his ideals the more powerful he became.

Of course we see star wars play out. As the sith were manipulating the republic, snoke was manipulating qui-gon, yoda and finally obi wan into his false doctrine of immortality after death. And that voice that we hear In new hope is not obi wan…but snoke’s. Who was guiding luke so that he can manipulate events to his liking. Luke was meant to be his crowning jewl. His high priest for a dark side religion that will make him powerful enough to “improve” the galaxy. He doesn’t want to rule the galaxy but turn it into a paradise. He wants to make sure no one suffers. But Snoke is like a god…he needs worship to get stronger. Kylo ren is not an apprentice but a high priest of a new religion meant to worship and empower him. This whole time, luke was deceived.

Force ghosts were never real and snoke is basically space satan…deceiving us all

That is why luke is angry and is saying that the jedi are bullshit…because he has no one to confide in. The jedi were just pawns to a game that snoke played.

Thoughts?

Come on man, if you’re gonna break the forum rule, at least use the gif.

Oh crap there is a rule against picture only posts. I apologise.

😉

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I would prefer Snoke turn out to be Darth Plagueis the Wise to some convoluted saga rewrite.

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 (Edited)

Lord Tobias said:

TV’s Frink said:

Lord Tobias said:

Although the whills theory aspect should be a little fixed (maybe snoke was cast out and killed his buddies during the events of the Phantom menace…maybe he never created the sith but merely fed off their power to become better than the other Whills to kill them)

Either way force ghost not being real provides strong context for several loose ends of TFA

Why isn’t anakin doing anything to stop kylo

Because he is in the netherworld stuck watching if not in complete oblivion(unlikely)

If luke was powerful…why was he a coward?

Because he realized that his faith was a lie…and that he was simply a pawn. He has no one to confide in now in these dark times.

Why did kylo join the dark side

Because of 2 reasons…either he wanted immortality(or wants snoke to bring back someone he loved), or snoke used his fake force ghost powers on him. Maybe kylo ren sees a vision of paradise in the galaxy and wants snoke to bring it. Maybe snoke isn’t a true bad guy. Maybe he truly believes that with enough power he can bring a golden age. He can heal wounds, it is just a matter of using the force to manipulate cells. He can extend the life of life forms indefinitely as well as bring them to life if their body is in good enough condition.

Not my strongest plot…but certainly one with potential

End-of-paragraph punctuation percentage = 33%

How about you fuck off. How is that for a reply asshole?

How about you review the rules around here?
http://originaltrilogy.com/announcement/Updated-OTcom-Forum-Rules-and-Guidelines-Applies-to-all-forums-including-Off-Topic/id/52717

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 (Edited)

nice new pic (promo/photoshopped?) of Finn, Rey and Rose for Ep VIII - with Ties and X-Wings battling in the background sky…

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NeverarGreat said:

Definitely photoshopped. The shadows around Rey are a dead giveaway.

Also, TIE fighters don’t exist in real life. 😛

Everyone knows TIE fighter are real - we just have to make the ‘pew pew pew’ noises ourselves 😃

A little patience goes a long way on this old-school Rebel base. If you are having issues finding what you are looking for, these will be of some help…

Welcome to the OriginalTrilogy.com | Introduce yourself in here | Useful info within : About : Help : Site Rules : Fan Project Rules : Announcements
How do I do this?’ on the OriginalTrilogy.com; some info & answers + FAQs - includes info on how to search for projects and threads on the OT•com

A Project Index for Star Wars Preservations (Harmy’s Despecialized & 4K77/80/83 etc) : A Project Index for Star Wars Fan Edits (adywan & Hal 9000 etc)

… and take your time to look around this site before posting - to get a feel for this place. Don’t just lazily make yet another thread asking for projects.

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Is that Force ghost thing a plot leak or just a rumor? That doesn’t sound good at all.

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Rumor but with all the people that want to see Anakin talk to Kylo I can see it actually happening. Maybe Force Ghosts will be one if the mysteries explored in the film.

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I definitely hope this doesn’t go the route of all that Force ghost stuff that was discussed a little earlier. I’d rather have the R word forever and ever if the price of originality is retconning the OT beyond recognition.

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 (Edited)

it would be cool too see a force ghost that is torn between the light and the dark like in the concept art
anakin force ghost

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What’s the source of that artwork?

Forum Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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OldMateMatt said:

it would be cool too see a force ghost that is torn between the light and the dark like in the concept art
anakin force ghost

This would be cool for a story which takes place shortly after ROTJ, but not 30 years later. Anakin should be long gone and so should his conflict.

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 (Edited)

Besides, isn’t Anakin’s story finished with ROTJ ? I wouldn’t mind seeing “young Anakin ghost” in VIII, but only as a mean to “help” Ren to go back to the light.

(someone tried something about that with Qui Gon/Vader, an idea that would have happened if the movies had been shot from EpI to EpVI I guess: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=axlAcj5Lx08)

However, VIII seems to go on the path of giving a new “hindsight” about the events of Ep I to Ep VII, so… who knows about a conflicted Anakin ghost ?

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 (Edited)

Hal 9000 said:

I would loathe a conflicted postmortem Anakin. It would totally betray ROTJ, in a sharp and specific way, as opposed to the general way in which TFA’s plot did.

Vader was nearly fully cemented in the Dark Side for two decades. One good act isn’t going to wash all that darkness away.

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That is one of the things I hated about the prequels. I’m all up for redemption and everything, but when you slaughter a school full of kids, I don’t think you get to come back from that.

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 (Edited)

rodneyfaile said:

but when you slaughter a school full of kids, I don’t think you get to come back from that.

Yeah, I like Ep III (I know, not a very popular opinion around here…) but this scene is among those I truly dislike. Glad it’s been cut in my favorite Ep III fanedit.

SilverWook said:

What’s the source of that artwork?

I think it’s from GL Episode VII concepts.

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MalàStrana said:

rodneyfaile said:

but when you slaughter a school full of kids, I don’t think you get to come back from that.

Yeah, I like Ep III (I know, not a very popular opinion around here…) but this scene is among those I truly dislike.

Would you prefer they just alluded to Vader killing kids? I’m neither for nor against them showing Vader killing children but the reality that he has killed children in the past should be acknowledged somewhere…even if it’s in novelizations or comics.

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MalàStrana said:

rodneyfaile said:

but when you slaughter a school full of kids, I don’t think you get to come back from that.

Yeah, I like Ep III (I know, not a very popular opinion around here…)

We’re far from the only rational people about the prequels.

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Interesting revelations not many people talked about:

Daisy Ridley confirmed The Last Jedi will have at least some ‘Grey’ in the film and a part of it will have to do with DJ

Rian Johnson confirms the meaning of the title “The Last Jedi” changes throughout the movie and Daisy Ridley seemed to be under the impression that the title was plural.