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RocketJump's Video on Star Wars "being saved in the edit" is Literally a Lie (*no, it is not) — Page 3

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Marcia Lucas spoke about this in Jonathan Rinzler’s Howard Kazanjian book. She debunks the narrative that she is the sole reason for “saving” the film. It was all a collaborative process and George was very much involved in piecing it all together.

"Pleasure’s fun. It’s great, but you can’t keep it going forever; just accept the fact that it’s here and it’s gone, and maybe then again, it will come back, and you’ll get to do it again. Joy lasts forever. Pleasure is purely self-centered. It’s all about your pleasure: it’s about you. It’s a selfish, self-centered emotion, that is created by a self-centered motive of greed. Joy is compassion. Joy is giving yourself to somebody else, or something else. And it’s a kind of thing that is, in its subtlety and lowness, much more powerful than pleasure. You get hung up on pleasure; you’re doomed. If you pursue joy; you will find everlasting happiness.” - George Lucas

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Of course he wrote it and Luke is George. Like Terry the Toad in Graffiti and Milner, and Curt were all aspects of him. It was his imagination that was up there on screen in Star Wars.

But it is true the editors and Lucas himself was one of them, saved that film. And John Williams score and ILM finally bringing it all together.

There is a lot of trying to discredit him these days due to the prequels. Like he never was on top of the world and never was a great director, writer or producer. Like those original Star Wars films were accidental. And not everything he had learned about making movies since film school.

It didn’t hurt that he surrounded himself with the best people and creatives and had a lot of friends who also made movies or who he went to film school with.

But maybe there is a bit of truth to the yes men stuff and not being challenged on the prequels, but when you’ve been a genius and done everything right for so long, its hard to argue even when what you are doing isn’t working or is ill advised. He was Mr Star Wars and that meant he had the final say on every single detail. Nobody else was going to figure it out it was in George’s head. The story and characters sprang from his mind.

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Stardust1138 said:

Marcia Lucas spoke about this in Jonathan Rinzler’s Howard Kazanjian book. She debunks the narrative that she is the sole reason for “saving” the film.

Many of us on here are aware of the downplaying or ignoring of Marcia Lucas’ contributions to the films in the official Star Wars history - and applaud content which illustrates and highlights her input - along with the input and work of others too… yet there is now a narrative where she is the sole reason for ‘saving’ the film? And the above words debunked that narrative? Huh.
 

It was all a collaborative process and George was very much involved in piecing it all together.

Indeed, and yet it is such a shame that some of the content out there which attempts to highlight the contributions of others to the Original Trilogy is somehow labelled as ‘lying, biased nonsense with misdirection and misinformation across the board’ along with false inferences that the editors somehow created Star Wars, or that such content is viewed to be an affront or insult to George, or ‘literally a lie’.

Especially so when one of those people who had a significant input on the Original Trilogy has seemingly been omitted / erased from the official Star Wars history.

 

The following passage of words by Marcia Lucas didn’t get much attention on social media (unlike the quotes re the Prequels and Sequels has over the past day or so) - yet they are worth putting up on here… it is the foreword written by Marcia for the book ‘Howard Kazanjian: A Producer’s Life’, by the late JW Rinzler:-

 
Seems like it is a good intriguing book - I hope people do read it (and not just Marcia’s quotes on the Prequels & Sequels).

 

As well as looking up other rare content where Marcia talks about her work and contributions on the Original Trilogy films…
 

Star Wars 40th with Marcia Lucas and Duwayne Dunham’:-

https://vimeo.com/224132896 - a 10 minute video at the Athena Studios vimeo channel.
 

The blurb: ‘Academy Award-winning editor and George Lucas’ former wife Marcia Lucas discusses the creation of Star Wars with Emmy-winning editor Duwayne Dunham who worked on The Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi.

From the 40th Anniversary ILM reunion held at 32ten Studios on May 27th, 2017.’

 
 

Star Wars Visual Effects Pioneers Highlight The Academy’s “Galactic Innovations: Star Wars & Rogue One” Event’:-

www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOxfmq0nCEs - a 2 and a half hour video from the Alexis Alcázar youtube channel.
 

The blurb: 'Watch live as VFX pioneers behind “Star Wars” and “Rogue One” share the journey of creating the impossible with their breakthrough visual effects.

We’ll share rare images that compare the technology and visual results from both films. Guests include John Dykstra, Dennis Muren, John Knoll, Ben Burtt, Marcia Lucas, Bill George, Harrison Ellenshaw, Bruce Nicholson, Richard Edlund and Rachel Rose.’

^ Marcia appears on the video to talk about the editing aspects of Star Wars at 60 mins, alongside Ben Burtt - then later at 2h 07m.

 
 

 
Edit: Plus, this in-depth ‘In Tribute to Marcia Lucas’ article written by the author of The Secret History of Star Wars - Michael Kaminski (aka zombie84):-

http://fd.noneinc.com/secrethistoryofstarwarscom/secrethistoryofstarwars.com/marcialucas.html

 
 

Double Jedit: an article on Marcia Lucas - and Charles Lippincott’s contributions to the Marcia Lucas segment in ‘The Secret History of Star Wars’ book and article (above). It also touches upon the some of the people who contributed to / worked on the film - and were later written out of the official history of Star Wars - such as Lippincott himself, Gary Kurtz, and Marcia Lucas…

“The ‘secret weapon’ behind Star Wars” (from 2015, by Charles Lippincott)
 

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I tend to give George the majority of the credit whenever I pay my dues for whose most responsible for Star Wars because so often I see the narrative that he was never talented and the Prequels prove it. I just don’t see that at all. I see both his trilogies as collaborations and George as the leader who rallied everyone to fulfill his vision that he started and in some cases they expanded upon. I think he’s extremely talented. His creativity knows no bounds. It’s truly endless and filled with wonder. I see both the Prequels and Originals as flawed as I get older and can view things objectively but I still love them both completely, and in some cases I love them more than when I was a kid. I think often it’s when one grew up or what order one is exposed to the saga that determines what they consider to be Star Wars. We each have a generational tale and in some cases we fall in the middle. I think that’s some of why I can look at the first two trilogies as one of the same. They’re different from each other but they’re from one creator. I can see endless through lines and connections.

The same can be said for the kids who grew up with the Sequels. It’s what they know Star Wars to be. It may not feel like Star Wars to some of us older fans or even George and Marcia but it is to them as they haven’t been exposed to objective reasoning yet. They’re not restricted in their thinking yet of what something can and can’t be. I think that’s similar to how the older fans that do like them tend to view things. They tend to see the films as a pew pew adventure that have familiar elements to the three films they grew up with while others like me who love the Prequels and also the Originals view it as a collective whole of both trilogies that came before it. In turn I think we tend to be the most disappointed by the trilogy because it feels like everything we see Star Wars as was forgotten for familiarity on the surface level with the original three films while the other part of what we loved was ignored. To us they tend to forget the context and established rules that the Prequels expanded upon and added to the story the Originals told. In some cases it’s even things we feel the Sequels ignored in way of the Originals.

No one group is wrong and that’s a good thing but at the end of the day what George says is Star Wars to me is what the final word should aspire to continue and expand upon. At least I think with the Sequels. They should’ve given closure to his stories before moving onto different interpretations.

I loved that excerpt from Marcia. It’s great having her come out to tell her story and what matters to her. I really admire that like George she was concerned about raising her children. I can honestly see after today entirely why George was in love with her. She seems like such a warm hearted, fiery, and honest person. It really contrasts George who tends to be more reserved and a bigger picture thinker. They’re both warm hearted and because of that we got the makings of a beautiful story that continues to resonate with us and grow beyond us. It all started with one man though and she’s quick to point it out.

Thank you for including the videos. I was thinking about that first one today but wasn’t sure where I had first seen it. I look forward to revisiting it in a new light and viewing the second one. I’ve not seen it.

"Pleasure’s fun. It’s great, but you can’t keep it going forever; just accept the fact that it’s here and it’s gone, and maybe then again, it will come back, and you’ll get to do it again. Joy lasts forever. Pleasure is purely self-centered. It’s all about your pleasure: it’s about you. It’s a selfish, self-centered emotion, that is created by a self-centered motive of greed. Joy is compassion. Joy is giving yourself to somebody else, or something else. And it’s a kind of thing that is, in its subtlety and lowness, much more powerful than pleasure. You get hung up on pleasure; you’re doomed. If you pursue joy; you will find everlasting happiness.” - George Lucas

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It’s pretty dishonest to say that post-SE and post-PT there hasn’t been a narrative that George Lucas is a fraud and more of an “ideas man” that basically can’t do anything, and it’s often backed by people saying the Original Trilogy and the original movie would’ve failed and were saved by its editors, chiefly amongst them Marcia Lucas, or by Gary Kurtz, who “heroically left after George decided to turn Star Wars into teddy bears and stuff”. And George’s own contributions go to shambles.

If one is to look at it objectively, Marcia’s statements both disprove the narrative that she and the other editors “saved the film” and the narrative that Lucas is a mastermind who’s never made a mistake and needs no help.

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oojason said:

Stardust1138 said:

Marcia Lucas spoke about this in Jonathan Rinzler’s Howard Kazanjian book. She debunks the narrative that she is the sole reason for “saving” the film.

Many of us on here are aware of the downplaying or ignoring of Marcia Lucas’ contributions to the films in the official Star Wars history - and applaud content which illustrates and highlights her input - along with the input and work of others too… yet there is now a narrative where she is the sole reason for ‘saving’ the film? And the above words debunked that narrative? Huh.

Come on man, I know you’ve heard this before. This isn’t new to you.

Death of the Author

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As the late great Jonathan Rinzler said in his interview with Rick Worley, George was there in the edit room with the team and part of the crafting of what it became. Every final decision with the film came down to him. As well as sometimes even George was talked out of his good ideas as Marcia relates in the book that Brian De Palma thought George should take out references to “May the Force be with you” in the first film. It was Marcia who convinced George that he should include them. Just like on the Prequels it was Ron Howard who helped a certain moment in the podrace to create further tension. Star Wars has always been a collaborative venture but it all came down to George in the old days. He had final say and depending on your certain point of view that was for better or worse. I miss him greatly and after these latest developments I’m starting to find further acceptance in knowing I’m not alone in my feelings.

"Pleasure’s fun. It’s great, but you can’t keep it going forever; just accept the fact that it’s here and it’s gone, and maybe then again, it will come back, and you’ll get to do it again. Joy lasts forever. Pleasure is purely self-centered. It’s all about your pleasure: it’s about you. It’s a selfish, self-centered emotion, that is created by a self-centered motive of greed. Joy is compassion. Joy is giving yourself to somebody else, or something else. And it’s a kind of thing that is, in its subtlety and lowness, much more powerful than pleasure. You get hung up on pleasure; you’re doomed. If you pursue joy; you will find everlasting happiness.” - George Lucas

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It’s important to acknowledge and appreciate Marcia and everyone else who collaborated with George and took part in the creative process. They’re crucial to why Star Wars was so great. But there’s a big difference between saying “George was helped” (which is true) and saying “George was carried” (which isn’t true). In the years after the Plinkett reviews came out, I’ve heard a lot of people online parroting the latter statement, worded in different ways, but all implying the same thing: that George was just some helpless fool who needed to let the “real filmmakers” step in and salvage his incompetence. RedLetterMedia did say things to that effect in their reviews, and perhaps they meant it jokingly, but I encountered a lot of people who took it seriously and believed it.

As usual, the truth isn’t as simple as people make it out to be. George is not a helpless fool, nor is he infallible. He’s an intelligent filmmaker who makes mistakes sometimes, like anyone else, and who benefits from bouncing ideas off other people, like anyone else.

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SparkySywer said:

oojason said:

Stardust1138 said:

Marcia Lucas spoke about this in Jonathan Rinzler’s Howard Kazanjian book. She debunks the narrative that she is the sole reason for “saving” the film.

Many of us on here are aware of the downplaying or ignoring of Marcia Lucas’ contributions to the films in the official Star Wars history - and applaud content which illustrates and highlights her input - along with the input and work of others too… yet there is now a narrative where she is the sole reason for ‘saving’ the film? And the above words debunked that narrative? Huh.

Come on man, I know you’ve heard this before. This isn’t new to you.

Marcia, as part of the editing team that ‘saved the film’? Of course.

Marcia, among many other countless contributions (Kurtz, Laddie, Boone Jr, Lippincott, Huyck & Katz etc) to making the film what it was / ‘saving the film’? Of course.

Marcia, where there is now a narrative that she is the sole reason for ‘saving’ the film? No. Hence the question of ‘there is now a narrative where she is the sole reason for ‘saving’ the film?’
 

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