A statement from Warbler — Page 3

Moth3r has been absent over two months and nobody seems to notice. I’m worried about him!

Warbler said:

To the mods I want to say that I want to talk about this calmly. I don’t want to be perm banned. I thank you for not automatically closing this thread. Let us please continue to have a dialog.

(in reply to you post above, to continue from my post made in here late last night…)
 

Hi Warbler,

Unfortunately that didn’t come across at all in your emails to me (talking calmly), your PM to me seconds after I lifted you ban, or in your first unedited statement moments later - including the details of a private conversation between you and me, that was seemingly one-sided and somewhat economical in describing what had actually occurred.

That was not cool and also not a good idea - nor did it you seemingly mind much attention to my post asking for everyone that…
 
"For the quality, accuracy and help ensure the smooth running of this occasionally polarising thread, it is asked that posters please adopt a ‘read, think, breathe, and then reply’ policy to posts they may find strong disagreement with.

Posting inflammatory picture-only responses - or inflammatory pictures without explanation or context is not cool.

Everybody be cool - it may well help you get your point across and be better received. Thank you."
 
…and as indicated in your statement you ‘…will obey that order under protest.’ What?

I’m struggling here a little Warbler.

It seems a simple reasonable request to everyone to try and ensure a decent level of quality in posts by the members here, and to try an limit or remove the more inflammatory aspects of posting which can occur at times in posts where there are various, strong and differentiating viewpoints…
 

Part of a moderator’s concern is for the quality, accuracy and smooth-running of the site as a whole.

We’re not talking about an out-of-the-blue snappy post, a mis-read or misinterpreted post, a language barrier or cultural/regional misunderstanding, spambots, WUMs (wind-up merchants) etc - we’re talking about long serving and valued members of this community, who opinions carry weight, contributing to a decent level of debate with wide-ranging views doing so without inflammatory posts, and the other reasons as to why you given a couple of days off - of which you now know.

I am not going to debate these reasons in here - I have already done you the courtesy of replying in here.

If you have more questions or problems - or would like more info - then you can do so via PM - like every other poster on the site does if/when they have any issues.
 

It seems that you think as other posters may have treated you badly in the past, or other posters here in the past have gotten away with what you think is far worse, and that it is harsh on you to be given a cool-off for something you consider lesser ‘crime’ (for want of a better word), or that you have been wronged.

I can’t comment on those past things - I haven’t seen them, I wasn’t a mod at the time and am unaware of the history of it.

I will say that everyone else in that thread was told by me (in the very same post that I let you know you were being given a couple of days off) that the same cool-off temp-ban would apply to them if they did the same as what you did on Sunday night.
 

Obviously the cool-off temp-ban did not work as I had hoped it would, and you seemingly do not agree with the reasons as to why I decided to give you a couple of days off.

That is fine - we all have our differing opinions and beliefs, though we are expected to give .

What is not fine is ignoring a moderator, and posting details of personal conversation between them on an open post in quite a one-sided portrayal of events.

What is not fine is since the cool-off temp-ban is the snarky replies of ‘May you sleep better tonight than I did Sunday evening’, ‘Maybe, but if a new mod makes decisions contrary to way the forum is supposed to be run, the more experienced mods need to correct him.’, ‘I call out Jay(where is he? when was the last time anyone here anything from him?’, ‘…I don’t care what anyone thinks…’ ‘Second, I apologize to everyone involved in the debate in the politics thread on Sunday - except the moderators’, I ask all my non-moderator friends to help me. I need your support. I fear by standing up here and protesting that I could face a perm ban. I need you to tell the mods that you do not want that to happen’, ‘I have been having problems sleeping lately and so I was sleep deprived on Sunday. When I am sleep deprived I get irritated and depressed. This affected my posting. I apologize for being rude.’ followed by ‘That said, I do not accept that I did anything deserving of banning’ etc - as well as other posts in here I really don’t want to continue to copy and past to add to this.’

What is not fine after your snarky posts above is then the one quoted at the top of this one - ‘To the mods I want to say that I want to talk about this calmly. I don’t want to be perm banned. I thank you for not automatically closing this thread. Let us please continue to have a dialog.’
 

What is not also fine - and what you seemed to have failed to understand - is that you behaved like a stroppy teenager which led to the 2 day cool-off temp-ban, and you are behaving like on since.

If you were sleep deprived, and it affects your posting, I would suggest, as I did on Sunday night, that you step away from the computer, or adopt a ‘read, think, breathe, and then reply’ policy to posts they may find strong disagreement with, and be cool.
 

You need not fear that you will be perm-banned - and no-one (to my knowledge) has even mentioned this to you. However, if you continue to post like this, in this manner, with this attitude, don’t be surprised if one of the mods does so.

In the meantime - have a week off. A couple of days obviously wasn’t enough for you to cool down - hopefully a week will be.

Please take the time away from this site to have a think about your posts which led to your couple of days off, and also the posts and actions since which have earned you a week off.

You put the ball in mine, the other mods and Jay’s court - this is my reply and my decision. I can’t speak for the others.

Do NOT contact me via email.

Again, this cool-off was taken with a heavy heart - I am aware of how much this site means to you - and giving people cool-offs isn’t something I want to be doing at anytime (though it may not seem it right now).

Rest assured if you think I am being unfair or harsh on you - I would do the same if anyone else had the done the same as you.

I hope upon your return you will be back to being a valued member of this community, and this will continue for longer than the you have already been on here for.

Best wishes, Jason.

For the time being this post is locked. It may well be re-opened soon.

yhwx said:

Here is my statement/open letter defending Warbler here:

When in the course of forum events, it may sometimes become necessary for forum members to be banned, temporarily or not, by the moderation of the forum. It is my opinion that a miscarriage of justice was committed when Warbler was banned on Sunday.

While Warbler’s posts regarding the issue of the National Anthem may have been inflammatory, such is the nature of an argumentative discussion. A certain level of leeway must be allowed, as long as all people feel comfortable in the discussion. As I did not see any complaints of legitimate offense during the course of our previous discussion, I feel that it is safe to say that all people felt comfortable in that discussion. Angry, yes, but comfortable. If certain people did not feel at ease because of Warbler’s presence, my opinion may have been different.

Next, I feel that there is an amount of contradiction of actions by the entirety of the moderation on this board. While many other, more inflammatory members have continued to roam free on this forum for many months, and in some cases, even years, Warbler got punished simply, in my opinion, on a first offense. This also leaves open the door to the question of if this action has belied prevailing political opinions that some may have.

Interesting discussion requires a reasonable variety of viewpoints. Some viewpoints, such as white supremacism, are unacceptable, and I am not saying that those viewpoints are within that reasonable variety. However, I do believe that Warbler’s viewpoint, at this moment, was in that reasonable variety.

I do respect the right that the moderation have to discipline any member however they see fit, for any reason, or for no reason at all. I 100% believe in that right, and would fight for it. However, I do also believe in the right to voice grievances of the leadership of any organization. These are my grievances, and I hope they are considered by the leadership here.

I am in agreement with many of your well-made points - though a ‘miscarriage of justice’ may be laying it on a little thick somewhat.

Since making your post you have likely read the reasons as to why Warbler was given a couple of days off in the form of a cool-off temp-ban (I have got to come up with another way of stating this - as I think I’m wearing down these specific keys on the keyboard too much). The decision to do so taken after he had stated he stopped listening to everyone, and when asked to once again explain himself in a better fashion he stated it would be a waste of time - and continued to post inflammatory posts (and likely would have posted more).

I took the decision to put those posts to a halt - partly for the reasons given since, partly as he wasn’t engaging in any meaningful conversation with other posters, and as a moderator I have a duty to the site to try ensure some level of reasonable discourse; I certainly wasn’t comfortable with the was the thread was heading.

On your next paragraph re ‘amount of contradiction of actions by the entirety of the moderation on this board’… as said elsewhere I can’t comment on those past things - I haven’t seen them, I wasn’t a mod at the time and am unaware of the history thereof. Was this at a time when the ‘Off Topic’ section was unmoderated? I can’t speak for the other mods. Everyone else in that thread was told by me (in the very same post that I let Warbler know he was being given a couple of days off) that the same cool-off temp-ban would apply to them if they did the same as what he did on Sunday night. If Warbler had written his posts in a reasonable non inflammatory manner, he’d still be here - regardless of political opinion. Other posters on the ot.com may have received similar to Warbler, though it may not be publicly known to members in general.

Variety in viewpoint is indeed a requirement for interesting debate and should be encouraged. His viewpoint in the main was fine - the delivery was not, nor was his stance at being asked to explain himself better.

Re your final paragraph - I agree with the mods having the right to ‘discipline’ any poster they see fit - though I disagree with it if it were for no reason at all. I do completely agree with your assertation in the belief to the right to voice reasonable grievances of the leadership of any organisation too.
 

I hope I have answered your questions both adequately and satisfactorily - though accept you may not like or agree with (some of) the answers given. Please feel free to PM me if you have any further questions - thank you.