I too see value in including the preservations but not if there is a risk of more C&D's.....
If you are looking at "Test Articles", feel free to take anything from GTF or even the Starkillers Guide to the Monomix which really needs updating and putting somewhere else. I only hosted it as a favour!!!
Moth3r said:
However, the site only lasted a few months, I think the fact that it included download links led to it receiving a C&D from Lucasfilm relating to daveytod's The Clones Revealed.
I only had a brief mention of The Clones Revealed on GTF and I got the same C&D!!!!
I think more of a knowledge bank is what is needed and maybe even omit the preservation/transfer work already done if that could be percieved as a problem.
If there was one place that had all the differences in all releases of all films in all formats and languages, that would be amazing. The nearest place to that is here but not too easily searchable.
A good example is how many threads are titled around ESB 70mm differences? At least three or four the last time I looked as well as all the other references in other threads. These are the sort of things I would like to see in a wiki.
Anything other than on your ISP free webspace with your real name plastered all over it!!!!!!!!!!!!
Good luck and I really hope you can pull something worthwhile together - if the interest is really there.
The idea behind the GTF site was a 2005 version of your Post 1 but 4 people with massive plans was soon became 1 with me left alone to try to make work.
Count me in.....if there is any interest.
My Galactic Trade Federation website was done years ago to try to make sense of all the preservations of the day. My more recent OT.com posts on audio dialogue differences and GOUT synced sources have attempted to do the same thing so I think something is needed.
A properly designed and regularly updated WIKI would be perfect but getting people to do it is another story......
I have been trying to give away the GTF site for years with no interest to date.
I see where you are coming from here and I agree there is certainly room to make Post 1 far simpler. Thanks
Harmy said:
The descriptive audio's already on the list :-)
Oh crap!! The dyslexia is getting worse!!
You wrote Audio descriptive commentary Stereo and I assumed you meant the 1993 Definitive Collection Commentary Track. DOH!!
In that case, I vote for the recently posted Schorman13: 1993 Commentary Track (Mono) Definitive Collection from the Star Wars Laser Disc Audio Archive thread.
I have taken your comments on board and will try to work out a way to simplify my GOUT synced list concerning the known duplicates....
Harmy said:
Yeah, I'm not criticizing your method, it's probably better this way if you want to make a comprehensive list of available GOUT synced audio tracks. I was just saying that I find it a little confusing for my own purposes.
It is confusing for me too and I wrote the list in the first place!! However, it is far less confusing than trying to remember all the options as I was trying to do before.
Other than one of the isolated scores, I vote for your "hearing impaired audio descriptive" track from your last release once again as that is truly unique.
Harmy said:
@russs15: That's cool but a bit confusing to be honest. Too many options and many of them overlap (eg. the stereo and mono mix in mine is the exact same audio file as moth3r's etc.)
I tried doing the list the other way but it looked like a dogs dinner ie a total and utter mess.
Besides, apart from the Monomix and a few assumptions about the hairy_hen mixes, most of the rest do not have enough information to prove exactly either way that (for example) one 1977 Theatrical Stereo mix is the same as another 1977 Theatrical Stereo mix.
If you are saying that you used the exact Moth3r release 1977 Theatrical Stereo mix, I can log that. However, is either of those the same as used on the DJ V3 or either of the Belbucus releases?? It is hard to know...
I have updated Post 1 with the latest from Project Threepio and hopefully the first of many listings from the latest work done by schorman13 with his Star Wars Laser Disc Audio Archive.....
Harmy said:
Rendering is in progress again and going very slowly (0.75fps), but as long as everything's fine in the encode, I don't really mind.
I'm still waiting for v2 of hairy_hen's 5.1 mix. If it's not ready before I have to start uploading to meet the 28 August release date (I'll have to start uploading on the 24th or 25th at the latest!) I'll use the older one and people will have to mux the new one in on their own.
On a related note, just wanted to report which audio tracks I have been able to collect so far and ask you guys if you knew about any other NTSC GOUT synced tracks I could use. So here goes; I have and will be using:
h_h's 70mm 5.1 (v1 for now)
1977 Stereo (probably will use the analogue capture)
1977 Mono (Belbucus VHS preservation)
1993 Stereo (LD capture)
Czech Stereo (the same VHS capture as v1.0 but with improved sync)
German Stereo (Improved version from Laserschwert with missing lines returned)
French Stereo (GOUT?)
Italian Stereo (GOUT)
Spanish Stereo (GOUT)
Japanese Stereo (GOUT?)
Hungarian Stereo (1993)
Audio descriptive commentary Stereo
I have put together a comprehensive list of what is generally known to be available as NTSC GOUT synced for all three Original Trilogy films.
http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/A-summary-of-GOUT-synced-Video-Audio-and-Subtitle-sources-WORK-IN-PROGRESS/topic/14360/
Apart from the official Japanese GOUT, all are available from official GOUT sources that people on OT.com have or from projects on OT.com......
Numerous transfers used the DC as the source. Go here... http://homepage.ntlworld.com/russdawson/gtf/
...and look at the various Original Trilogy releases.
I have not got a clue what any of that last post actually means but I am convinced that you are doing an amazing job. Keep it up!!!!
Erikstormtrooper said:
I believe PAL is the preferred source for most preservations.
In fact the opposite is the case.
All but one GOUT synced preservation that I know of is NTSC.........
Living in PAL land, I can no longer watch PAL releases of my favourite films as I find the 4% speedup annoying!!!!
The list of discs alone is incredible but then multiply that by 3, 4 or 5 sides per release and multiply again by the three for the number of times each disc was ripped and you begin to see how mind-bogglingly huge this actually is.
Wow just isn't enough.......
Any further work done with GOUT syncing any of the list is the only thing that could top the work done so far.
Moth3r said:
Treadwell said:
Let's not forget the "shelter built"/"shelter up" and "out of there"/"taste very good" differences. Surely a 70mm vs 35mm difference?
No, I believe these were '97 SE changes.
True for actual full retail film releases but the alternate lines were on The Story of The Empire Strikes Back LP so were actually heard way before the SE release in 1997.
QuickPar and the par files should do the trick....
I thought the Reivex had both French and English Dolby 2.0 on it.......
TK421138 said:
On a side note, having access to the Story Of albums is genius!
I can't wait!
You do so have so much to learn.
You think that is genius?
Genius is..... http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/RETURN-OF-THE-JEDI-story-LP-HELP-NEEDED/post/586837/#TopicPost586837
..... And the versions for the first two films done as DVD's by MoveAlong.
Once you do your homework, see what has been done around here and join in other threads, you will realise that there are things out there that you do not know about yet but once you do, you can not live without them.
Before you know it, your DVD shelf will be full to bursting point!!
TK421138 said:
What the heck is this "mux" talk?
Please correct my sledgehammer approach to this answer in my use of the terms demux and remux.
A DVD or AVCHD as discussed earlier is a collection of video, audio and subtitles in an agreed and approved format.
Either can be demuxed (split) into their component parts of video, audio and subtitles.
You can then remux (combine) the individual parts into a new DVD or AVCHD.
The fun part here is this. I have said before about the GOUT being a standard and many projects here follow that same standard. Therefore, the video and audio for ANY GOUT synced project can be split (demuxed) and re-combined (remuxed) with ANY other GOUT synced video or audio.
I refer you back to here http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/A-summary-of-GOUT-synced-Video-Audio-and-Subtitle-sources-WORK-IN-PROGRESS/post/583569/#TopicPost583569
If you fancy the audio from the DJ V3 with the Harmy Despecialized, guess what, you can do it. You want the opposite, you can do it.
If you fancy the latest hairy hen 70mm re-creation with your retail GOUT DVD's, you can do it.
If you had the Japanese GOUT DVD's, you could take the audio from there and add it to both the DJ V3 and the Harmy Despecialized.
If the sources are GOUT synced, the choice is yours.
OK, the above was not explaining what mux means but does give a practical example of what can be done. A big plus is that all the software is free!!!!
If you do say that you have the Japanese GOUT, you will be the new best friend of a few around here.........
EDIT. If there are any other permutations with any other formats that can be done, please let me know.
Once again, Thanks.
You even answered my next two or three questions!!!
I am "Old School" DVD and AVI but stopped using discs years ago. It is a fluke that I have Media Players that play everything I throw at them and now I know what it actually is that I am throwing at them.
In this respect, I am as much a "New Guy" as TK421138 was a few short days ago with things that we take for granted.
....and what does an mkv file do that an mp4, avi, wmv etc will not do??
Again, my players play them but I do not know what they are or why people use them so often now.
Great answer by the way. Thanks.
There is a menu which has 5 of the audio options. The sound only track is available by your audio button on your DVD remote only.
I grew up with a UK TV early 80s recording which became a huge part of the source for the Monomix restoration project. This is my favourite.
Second favourite is the other 1977 Theatrical Stereo mix as that was my first retail copy.
The link in Post 38 tells you the differences and as you will see, the Monomix has quite a few differences.
Back to the arguments post earlier, Threepio's tractor beam line, opening/closing blast doors and who was annoying Luke on the "Blast it" line have caused some fun and games around here in the dim and distant past...... Happy days!!
From what I remember the DJ V3 was good old fashioned DVD format only. In fact, if it has a VIDEO_TS folder, it is DVD only.
Some of the Harmy versions out there are in a different format which could be AVCHD but this 40-something has yet to learn what that is. My Asus O Player plays it fine but other than that I am screwed for a better answer.
Likewise any question on upscaling.
I am not sure if that last post was praise, an insult or good old-fashioned taking the piss...........
Either way, thank you very much.
I do believe over the last few days we have sucked you in to our ways. Whether you like it or not, you are now one of us and there is no turning back!!!!!!!!!!