negative1

frank678 said:

@negative1

thanks for the reply. its tricky to ask a question about this project whilst keeping in mind sensible privacy about it. i imagine for me if i was involved in this project i would hope to develop a real love of the organic qualities of film and love for keeping projection alive for the future. However I know this stuff can also be over romantised and might be in reality a pain in the ass in these digital times.

well, of course i'll be selling all the prints i have,

both star wars, and empire strikes back..

the digital versions were the point..

i'm sure others will enjoy the film though.

later

-1

jero32 said:

Well I thought maybe a dedicated thread would stil be easier for people to "wade" trough.

i don't want to deter you.

but i'd PREFER if people DID wade through those threads.

there's a lot of good information in there. we would be

duplicating a lot of it.. (in some ways, we already did

in the 35mm thread) but that couldn't be helped.

since i didn't really know where all of this was going.

hope you understand.

later

-1

frank678 said:

You have a very patient way of looking at this stuff and to patience to tackle this in the first place(!), I suppose you could thank Lucasfilm for inspiring you to learn more about 35mm film and film restoration, and to develop a new skill set. Can I ask if you were already into 35mm projection before this project (i.e. already have access to it etc.) and has it lead to interest in it further? I would be interested in (apologies if youve answered this before) if you have the means/chance to compare analog vs digitised projection of this source and if its perceptibly different?

good question:

-----------------------

i have 0 (zero) experience with film, restoration, preservation and

digitizing before jumping into this 4 years ago.

this whole thing has been an amazing experience. from dealing

with people (not always good, but mostly!), to coming across people

will amazing skills, talents, and time to explain things to me.. especially

cinch!

i'm not that smart, but i learn quickly, and have a huge appetite when

something interests me. this started of as a technical challenge, but

once we got rolling, it's been more of a project management, and

people skills effort on my part. which is weird, because i'm a software

developer, and looked at this like i would a software development

project....

the amount of information right here on the board is STAGGERING,

seriously, just pick any technical, video or audio thread, and you

will discover all kinds of information and detail.

the best thing about this board, is that there are many

people who will help, explain, and SHARE their information,

data, results, pictures, video, and everything else if you

just ASK... only the private stuff (which isn't much) stays

private.....

if people here hadn't thought of these things, or came

up with these ideas. we wouldn't be here..

i can't comment on how the digital version will compare

with the project one just yet.. but i do know there are

plans on my end to screen it in a movie theater later

this year with some friends..   also, in watching the

many raw versions of it digitally, it DOES feel like watching

film, due to the scratches, dirt and image warping/jumping.

most people would hate that, so the more normal version

that is cleaned up will be more like the version you will

watch. as i mentioned i have plans for my own grindhouse

versions after it comes out...

it's been an amazing trip, and i'm sure WE WILL have

a very cool behind the scenes documentary about all

the neat stuff that made this happen (this would come

out MUCH MUCH later, when we're done), and be

anonymous of course.

later

-1

looking further down the road..

the openEXR format may be the answer

to what we're looking at for the raw 

images:

=============================

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Project-release-formats-what-should-we-be-using-these-days/post/593146/#TopicPost593146

later

-1

jero32 said:

That seems awefully suggestive...not sure if I should get my hopes up or not. Guess I would be hoping regardless so ya.

there will always be a (new) hope!

later

-1

when we get around to messing with the raw files..

looks like we'll be using the professional openEXR
format for the image files..

====================================

http://www.openexr.com/ 

OpenEXR is a high dynamic-range (HDR) image file format developed by Industrial Light & Magic for use in computer imaging applications.

OpenEXR is used by ILM on all motion pictures currently in production. The first movies to employ OpenEXR were Harry Potter and the Sorcerers Stone, Men in Black II, Gangs of New York, and Signs. Since then, OpenEXR has become ILM's main image file format.

OpenEXR's features include:

• Higher dynamic range and color precision than existing 8- and 10-bit image file formats.
• Support for 16-bit floating-point, 32-bit floating-point, and 32-bit integer pixels. The 16-bit floating-point format, called "half", is compatible with the half data type in NVIDIA's Cg graphics language and is supported natively on their new GeForce FX and Quadro FX 3D graphics solutions.
• Multiple lossless image compression algorithms. Some of the included codecs can achieve 2:1 lossless compression ratios on images with film grain.
• Extensibility. New compression codecs and image types can easily be added by extending the C++ classes included in the OpenEXR software distribution. New image attributes (strings, vectors, integers, etc.) can be added to OpenEXR image headers without affecting backward compatibility with existing OpenEXR applications.

ILM has released OpenEXR as free software. 

this should easily be able to handle the data,

and possible reduce the overall size of the movie data.

we'll be doing some testing to get an idea of how well it is.

however, the overall file size will still be in the terabytes per

film.

later

-1

frank678 said:

dammit it STILL makes me mad why Lucas and Co. created a situation where you guys have had to do this project this way. fingers crossed you get the best results possible for all the hard work you've put in

i'm not mad. but that's because i got to play 

around with all this stuff for the last 2 years.

maybe if it never got released, then yeah,

but life's too short. so i probably would just

live with what we have.

later

-1

jero32 said:

-1 would you be ok with a screenshot thread if I made one? (where people compile the screenshots you have posted so far)

i'm pretty sure they're already in the links provided above.

right?

later

-1

lurker77 said:

negative1 said:

if you're new to all of this, and want

to see samples, and examples of

pics/videos, there won't be many

posted here..

Aw, that's the best part. And I've already seen most of what's already been made available... :(

i didn't say there won't be any.

just not that much. mostly reel change frames,

and maybe a few more in the cinematography thread.

later

-1

if you're new to all of this, and want

to see samples, and examples of

pics/videos, there won't be many

posted here..

================================

however,

there are quite a bit already in other

threads.

pics of credits/leaders:

----------------------------

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Credits-Leaders-Thread/topic/12960/

color timing and cinematography:

------------------------------------------

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Star-Wars-Colortiming-Cinematography-was-What-changes-was-done-to-STAR-WARS-in-93/topic/9805/page/12/

various glitched frames:

-----------------------------

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Star-Wars-Tantives-Orange-Items-Thread-other-unintended-objects/topic/13355/

videos/pictures of cleaning up frames

==========================

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/cleaning-up-dirty-frames-for-scenes/topic/14044/

audio

=======================

samples of english mono:

--------------------------------

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/The-Mono-Mix-Restoration-Project/topic/7222/page/7/

samples of spanish:

-------------------------

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/The-original-Latin-American-Spanish-dubbings/topic/11112/

later

-1

on another note:

============================

how /where will it be released?

-------------------------------------------------

after seeing the successful launch of

harmys v2, we would like to take a similar

approach..

1) newsgroups

2) torrents

3) file sharing sites

most likely, myspleen will be the choice.

we've got people lined up for:

--------------------------------------

newsgroups

myspleen

so we'll be on the lookout for those

that can handle the rest..

when the time comes, we'll let you know..

===============================

as far as distributing the bluray discs,

that will pretty much have to be on your own.

as we don't have the facilities for the numbers

we're looking at...

===============================

we'll make a note of the official downsamples

as there are those that would want a

SD single layer 5gig version also..

i haven't really thought about avchd or 720p

versions, but i'm sure those will be made

also...thoughts?

more details on what's involved:

=========================

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Making-our-own-35mm-preservation-my-crazy-proposal/post/591950/#TopicPost591950

image quality reference:

=================

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Making-our-own-35mm-preservation-my-crazy-proposal/post/591954/#TopicPost591954

how authentic will it be?

=================

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Making-our-own-35mm-preservation-my-crazy-proposal/post/591990/#TopicPost591990

how will it look?

===========

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Making-our-own-35mm-preservation-my-crazy-proposal/post/592043/#TopicPost592043

later

-1

welcome to the official thread for the discussion of the

star wars 1977 - 35mm theatrical version 1.0

=======================================

this has been a project long in the making, and with the help and ideas of many diverse people from this board.

this is the collective project that is not officially part of OT, or lucasfilm, 20th century fox, etc. but in the spirit of preservation, has been put together with the wish to relive the memory of the original 77 star wars.

=========================================

we have made a lot of progress, and in preparation for the release, we have some more steps to take, but will still be gearing up for the release.

this is the place to keep on top on the when/where/how/who/and why of it…

a lot of information is  sprinkled through the original discussion thread about - 35mm my crazy proposal… we’ll take just the details and emphasize them here.

if you want to discuss technical stuff, post it there, or speculate there… this is just to keep people informed on the status and updates…

if you’re new to OT.com, this should be a lot easier to follow

than the previous one.

what is it? - a conversion/preservation of the 35mm version

of star wars from 1) spanish lpp print (6 reels) 2) english

print (5 reels) + 1 partial reel

who are we? - a group of individuals working on it,

color restoration and technical advisory, support

why? - because we love star wars, and appreciate

george lucas

when will it be out? - we’re targetting this year,

but its done when its done

where can we find out more? - right here

technical details

===========================================

video - our goal is to have a preserved version that will be released in a high definition 1080p anamorphic MKV that is full frame for people with projectors (25gigs), and bluray disc (25gigs), and a dual layer dvd (9gigs) as the final product. there might be several other downsamples in avi/mp4 later on…

audio - we will have a partially restored mono track,

the 35mm theatrical mix, and a reconstructed 70mm version, along with the original 35mm spanish soundtrack for it.

also, there will be a trailer for it, along with the original 35mm 1976 teaser. that’s it for the extras.

there will be more bonus behind the scenes content provided with links for download later on.

sample artwork, readme, what it will include:

===================================

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Making-our-own-35mm-preservation-my-crazy-proposal/post/591842/#TopicPost591842

future releases:

===========

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Making-our-own-35mm-preservation-my-crazy-proposal/post/590499/#TopicPost590499

raw data calculations:

================

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Making-our-own-35mm-preservation-my-crazy-proposal/post/590570/#TopicPost590570

equipment used and methodology:

=========================

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Making-our-own-35mm-preservation-my-crazy-proposal/post/588979/#TopicPost588979

preliminary trailer in 720p:

===========================

https://vimeo.com/49889448

pw: OT

download 1080p WMV:

http://www.sendspace.com/file/0o7zd1

pw: ot

========================================

i’ll be taking pertinent posts from the other thread that

will apply to this… in the meantime, we look forward to

your participation.

========================================

thanks from our entire team!

later

-1

well we should be wrapping this up..

i'll check on this thread once in awhile..

feel free to continue talking about the

35mm versions and technical stuff,

queries, ideas and conjectures..

but once the new thread starts up,

it'll just be updates about star wars

over there..

interesting north carolina has technicolor sw,

70mm empire, and jedi!

------------------------------

http://forum.dvdtalk.com/movie-talk/604406-star-wars-restoration-hits-milestone-2.html

see you in a few years for

==================

empire strikes back

return of the jedi? maybe?

? ? ????

later

-1

AntcuFaalb said:

negative1 said:

AntcuFaalb said:

Here's the motion-compensated dirt removal function I was using for the now-defunct SWOLT project.

Warning: It cleans excellently while preserving detail, but don't use it for any shots containing stars.

Note 1: You may want to set clmodeY to 18. See the RemoveGrain manual for explanations of what the different modes do and what the ups/downs of each one are.

Note 2: It only works on clips in planar color-spaces; e.g., YV12. Furthermore, it won't clean frames at scene-changes.

cool, thanks will check it out..

do you have any video examples of this

that you used?

 

later

-1

Have you tried this out yet, -1? How's it going?

sorry, not yet.

do you have some examples?

later

-1

with the release of harmy's v2 in mkv, and

with our upcoming release for our project..

there always seems to be a lot of questions

and issues with burning to bluray or converting

to other formats..

list your issues or ideas and solutions here..

for me

================================

i'm downconverting the MKV to a lower bitrate avi,

with just one soundtrack (english stereo)..

i've used several programs but all have had problems,

and i'm using the latest versions..

FIRST : i have an uncorrupted, known good version of the

MKV from myspleen, you need to check that yours is good

also... then

=========================================

got MULTIavhcd from a suggestion...

computer number 1-> installed, but the program crashed

when loading the MKV (probably not enough memory?)

computer number 2 -> installed, everything loads, but the

program crashes when trying to do any kind of conversion

AVIDEMUX -> program crashes when trying to save to a video file

VIRTUAL DUB -> crashes

Total video converter -> crashes

TSmuxer -> program crashes

MKV toolnix -> able to split files, but the split files do not load

into any other program and give errors

Solveig multi media splitter -> crashes

All to AVI -> crashes

AUTOMKV -> doesn't do what i was looking for..

the only program that i sort of got to work was: Mediaencoder

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

attempt number 1 -> transcoding error at 50%, the thread locked

up, and crashed, however the file worked so i had half the movie

attempt 2-> tried setting a cutting point at 1 hour, but the program

ignored any set time points, and ALWAYS started at the beginning.

attempt 3 -> started from scratch, and now it seems to be working..

i went to DOOM9 forums, but couldn't find anything too helpful.

videohelp.com led me to a lot of tools, but most didn't work..

i saw a whole bunch of standalone MKV -> avi converters,

but all of them crashed..

at some point, i'll try to burn a bluray also,

we'll see how that goes.

later

-1 

Brahmmuel L Jackson said:

By the way, could you guys do something extra-nice and include instructions on how to properly burn the film to a DVD/Bluray? I don't do it often, and I keep forgetting how to do it every time I burn a new release. Besides I think I'm not alone in this matter.

not sure why that would be needed.

one of the formats will be the files

you need to burn straight to bluray.

i use nero, just add files to bluray folders-> burn . done.

there will also be a dual layer dvd image, same thing,

use nero (or whatever) -> dvd folders -> burn. done.

for the .mkv with the larger picture, it's not meant to

be burned to a disc, it will be for people who use

their projectors with a laptop or computer. i guess

you could burn it also. but why?

--------------------------------------------------------------------

anyways, all this technical talk, and all the talk

in harmy's thread should be moved over to here:

==================================

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/forum.cfm/How-Tos-and-Technical-Discussions/forum/12/

the how-to and technical forum.

USE IT!

=====

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/converting-mkv-to-bluray-and-other-formats-discussion-and-issues/topic/14589/

that way people won't keep asking, and having issues,

solving problems etc.

later

-1

more talk and more models

from other makers for 4k:

---------------------------------

http://www.extremetech.com/electronics/135327-ifa-move-over-3d-its-time-for-4k-uhdtv

discussion at slashdot:

----------------------------

http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/12/09/01/1325210/4k-uhdtv-hardware-on-display-in-berlin-and-on-sale-in-korea

later

-1

ok, hopefully we'll have some more

to talk about next week.

we'll wrap up notes from this thread.

although feel free to keep posting

here for general talk and

other 35mm related issues, technical or not..

we'll start a new 35mm thread dedicated

just for the star wars release. i'll try to make

it just about the main points ; who/what/where/when/why?

and that should get everybody up to speed and

ready when the time comes, so you don't have 

to keep digging through this one just to find something out.

major thanks to zombie84 and all the others that

started this 6 years ago, and came up with all the

major thoughts and ideas..

later

-1

none said:

negative1, (if you happen to read this) what was your process for the acquiring of frame counts?

good, old fashioned, opening up avi file in virtualdub,

marking down the beginning time of frame - frame number.

pressing the frame advance key,

watching for a scene change.

marking down the end of time and frame number.

double checking so i didn't miss anything.

entering the numbers into an exel spreadsheet.

repeat for every single scene in the VOB/reel/etc.

slow, but gets the job done.

later

-1

sorry to hear about your connection

problems, hopefully it will get worked out.

maybe you can tether your computer to your

phone?

ok, finally got it from myspleen. thanks to the

seeders there!

========================================

first of all, great job!

i'm very impressed with all the work you've put into it,

even from the last set of workprints, there's a lot of

details and subtle changes.

to anyone waiting on getting this, hurry up! get it now.

yes, the BD and other versions will come later, but if

you can, just get this one and you won't be dissapointed.

the colors look great! (did you somehow sneak our copy

from us? haha just kidding) .. i have to say the color

matching is very faithful to our lpp print also in many

places. we'll have to do a comparison at some point.

the clarity of course is amazing. ours might be 1080p,

but it still won't match the crispness of this transfer based

on the bluray.

the sound is exceptional from the few english ones i've

heard. with tons of choices from the mixes, and the 

subtitles.

it's going to be hard for any other release to match

this! (even ours, although it's really in a different

category)..

you've done an excellent job, and deserve a huge congratulations.

along with everyone that has worked with you and supported you

and the rest of your team.

take a nice break, and get ready for 3.0 when ours comes out!

haha just kidding? (maybe?)

looking forward to reading other peoples comments and

reviews. you have brought the whole star wars movement

much closer to the originals than ever before.

thanks from our whole team, including cinch and mr brown.

later

-1

Davnes007 said:

...Only 84" ?

;)

That would take up half of my apartment.........if I could still afford an apartment after I got it.

boy i was way off! this thing could be $30k!!!!

================================

http://news.cnet.com/8301-33692_3-57502890-305/ifa-2012-big-reveals-for-sony-samsung/

later

-1

here's the second reel.. more latin goodness!

==============================

http://soundcloud.com/negative1/sw-spanish-r2

excelente!

muchas gracias.

más tarde

-1

skyjedi2005 said:

You have access to something that has the mono mix in better quality than we already have, but its incomplete right?

the 35mm mono optical still has to be higher fidelity than nth generations of VHS tapes of the bootleg or itv uk broadcast, or even the 16mm puggo grande.

I have a movie on DVD with its original mono mix and no noise reduction and it sounds better than the stereoized pop and click removed version on the same disc.

yes, right now we only have the first two reels as previewed here.

they will sound 'better' of course.. we'll keep an eye out for the

rest, somebody might have them!

later

-1

here's a preview of reel 2 in nice

low-fidelity mono! ha ha

==============================

http://soundcloud.com/negative1/star-wars-mono-reel-2-raw

later

-1

pat man said:

This should be OT's theme song

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJlbPXZEpRE

Comparison of original song 

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rvx6ZGuskHc 

Lego version by a 10 year old 

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RUbkB9tPlX8

check previous postings:

---------------------------------

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/YouTube-Vimeo-etc-Star-Wars-finds/post/583421/#TopicPost583421

lego:

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/YouTube-Vimeo-etc-Star-Wars-finds/post/586224/#TopicPost586224

and discussion:

============

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/YouTube-Vimeo-etc-Star-Wars-finds/post/585917/#TopicPost585917

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/YouTube-Vimeo-etc-Star-Wars-finds/post/586132/#TopicPost586132

later

-1