RogueLeader

Cool mock up Anakin.
I also think you could do the same with Maul, and use him in most of Sidious’ scenes instead like you’ve done with Dooku. With both Maul and Dooku, you could possibly use lines from The Clone Wars where it might be appropriate, and cut those scenes liberally to the essentials.

Another thing I think would be a cool change to TPM would be to turn Qui-Gon and Maul’s first duel on Tatooine into a night/twilight scene. Seeing their lightsabers stand out in the dark would have a nice look, and maybe you could add a few of Tatooine’s moons and a few stars in the last shot of their ship flying away as Maul watches it.
You also might have to regrade some of the previous scenes to imply that dusk was approaching as well.

That’d be a lot of work but it has a nice look to it. You could even have it when Vader eventually tosses Palpatine down the reactor shaft, it is actually could have more lava at the bottom. When he falls in though, you could still have it where he explodes into that blue spirit energy or whatever.

If you were to expand on this, you could even have Luke and Vader’s conversation on the landing platform catwalk take place on Coruscant, and rotoscope that background as well. It would be cool to spend at least one scene on the planet surface that way. Maybe it is right before they take the elevator down to deep beneath the planet.

Cathy, you had a lot of excellent observations regarding Shmi’s death scene.

I didn’t think I would like it but for the most part I like your use of digital zooms, especially your motivation to zoom out on Anakin, then zoom back in. Also, literally cutting out all sound in the moments following her death, then it slowly returning. This really works for me. I think those are little things that could help give the moment a little extra impact. I would suggest possibly slowing down the zoom in on the tusken guard just slightly, but for the most part I think they work well. Nothing too extreme.

The one thing that doesn’t work for me at all, personally, is the piano rendition of the Imperial march. I just can immediately tell it isn’t really Williams, for one, and I also don’t think it is very appropriate for this moment.
Honestly, if I could make a suggestion, what about reusing Anakin’s theme, since we only hear it once in AOTC? I think the last 30 seconds of Anakin’s Theme track could fit in this moment, since it transitions into something a little darker at the very end, and it clearly reminds us this is just a boy watching his mother die.
Here is the track, starting around the last 30 seconds: https://youtu.be/WUC7MgkOgKA?t=141
You also could possibly slow down the track and pitch it down maybe, if you wanted to try to do something more ominous. Just think it might be a little more appropriate for this stage in Anakin’s life, since this is sort of the moment where Anakin loses his innocence, represented by Anakin’s Theme, in a way.

Also, excellent observation regarding the scene transition, where it appears it originally was meant to be a wipe to Yoda’s chamber. Wow, never really noticed that but I think you’re right. Honestly, I think the hard cut to black works sooo much better than what was there before. It’s a little more intense, to me.

I also wanted to make a note regarding the lightsaber changing colors. It seems like others find the idea interesting so you could totally go for it, you don’t necessarily have to be stuck with what is canon, but the the way lightsaber crystals change color doesn’t necessarily work as you described. It’s not really where the lightsaber will shift depending on one’s amount of hate or anger in the heat of a moment. Rather, bleeding a lightsaber crystal is like an intense ritual that bends a kyber crystal to the will of a Sith, which goes against its natural energy, and thus changes it into a red color. It is possible for a crystal to be purified as well, but that also is a process that takes time and concentration, so a lightsaber won’t just change color like a mood ring in the middle of a battle.

But, like I said, this is your edit and you do whatever you want to try! Overall my biggest suggestion for this would be to change the Imperial march piano rendition.

EDIT: The end of Anakin’s theme does have a hint of the Imperial march still, it’s just a lot more subtle.

DOUBLE EDIT: Listening to Anakin’s theme again, if you notice at the very end of the track, there is a long pause between the last and the second to last note, and the last note plays out for several seconds. It would be interesting if you had the song stop at the second to last note, leaving the motif unfinished, just like Shmi’s last sentence “I love…”
Just an idea though!

Hey Cathy, really enjoyed your edit video you previously posted where we got to hear you talk about the changes you made to a particular Anakin/Padme scene too.

Also, I would suggest instead of making a new thread for each update or request for assistance, you should just have a single thread where you can post about your edit. That way you can just make new posts in that thread, and it will be easy for other people to keep track of all of your updates as well.

EDIT: To give you some notes on your dream idea. I honestly would suggest trying to cut the initial shot of Anakin in bed, and just keep the final shot of him waking up, and see how that works.
I agree with the others that Vader, the Emperor and the Vader line need to be a lot more hidden and subtle, like as fans we will notice it, but I think there still be some ambiguity rather than just being totally obvious, especially if this was for someone hypothetically watching these movies for the first time in chronological order.

I would also suggest adding a vague/blurry shot or two of actual Tusken raiders, and maybe one of their distorted roars, and maybe those images/sounds could transform into a nightmarish Vader and his breathing. I feel like since this vision is about his mother, it definitely should be more focused on what has happened to her, but with some small hints towards Vader.
Also, while it doesn’t necessarily have to be the same, instead of just having the vignette around the edges, you could also try to replicate the dream effect from ROTS. Maybe if you can find some kind of smoky overlay effects, and then add a blur effect outside a circle of focus that is centerpunched on the screen. There also seems to be some sort of halo effect that distorts the colors, but I’m not sure what the best approach is to achieve that effect.

Well it mentions the New Republic in this description, so I wouldn’t be surprised if we did learn little things about it or even encountered them occasionally in the show.

Well it looks like you are making progress! Did you come up with any new ideas once you had to start over?

EDIT: I know Dooku with spurs was one, right?

Maybe I missed an update, but were you able to recover your material, or have you started back from scratch? Either way, I’m really happy for you! It looks real fun.

I wasn’t sure about adding spur sounds to Dooku but it works surprisingly well. Makes him feel more like a badass.

I see what you’re going for. Personally, though, I think the information that Poe delivers to Finn about BB-8 and his mission on the TIE fighter, which he then passes on to Rey, is more important for the audience to know than it is to address though issues, which are relatively minor to me.

Maybe I’m interpreting it wrong but it sounds like from this restructure the audience might learn that during Poe’s interrogation, but Finn and Rey don’t. But they need to know he is important in order to encourage Rey to go on this journey.

And I also think it might be just as unclear for the audience how he was rescued from the Star Destroyer so quick and immediately jumped into the battle, if not moreso than the explanation he gives in the movie.

You mean the part where Anakin and Obi-Wan are kicking each other on top of the table?

And thanks Collipso! I probably could have worded it better.

I just think if you combine this idea with a lot NFBism’s idea from his New Canon Cut where he adds little things to improve Anakin and Obi-Wan’s friendship and characterization could go a long way to help improve the movie.

These look great Nev! I like all of it, but the snow battle especially looks beautiful. Keep it up!

That’s very true. Though I think they said there were some things Rian requested that they didn’t change either, so even if he asked maybe they were satisfied with that moment as-is.

I think that first shot of Han pulling out the dice could be cropped and altered to match the existing footage.

For the shot of him putting them up there, you could create a plate of the Falcon that you could put Han in, since he isn’t blocked by anything for the most part in that shot. Though you would have to find/generate a background that would match.

Another option would be to create a new shot. You could use the TLJ insert as a plate and then have a hand-double hang up a pair of dice that you might could find online. That would require green screen, and actor and props so that could be more challenging than the first option.

Another issue might be continuity, because Han puts his hands on both chairs when he enters, and I’m pretty sure they rest there until he exits. You could possibly cut to the dice insert without the dice as if he looks up there to help with that issue.

Otherwise, if all of those options are too challenging, at the very least you could reuse the TLJ dice insert as if the dice are still there and Han is just looking up at them.

I agree! I’m just saying instead of just dying, Padmé could be given a choice between saving her own life or saving her children for actual medical reasons.

Haemorraging, placenta praevia, I don’t know exactly but I’m sure there have been moments where a mother would have to make such a decision in the delivery room.

For example, maybe what Anakin did to Padmé hurt her physically and induced the pregnancy prematurely. But because of Padmé’s condition, there’s a high risk giving birth now could kill her. They could either not risk Padmé’s life and let her miscarriage, or go through with it and try to save the babies.

“Having this operation now could kill her, but she wants to continue in order to save the babies.”

Does that make sense? We’re just addressing that there was a difficult decision that Padmé had to make.

Most edits cut out the “losing the will to live” line regardless. Her dying in childbirth for medical reasons is a given in most edits. I’m just saying that let the risky childbirth be presented as a clear choice between her children’s lives and her own in order to give Padmé a final moment of agency in a film where she barely has any.

EDIT: Padmé wasn’t in a stable condition, but if her babies don’t come out now, they’ll die. But if she goes through with the operation now, it could kill her. Just presenting a basic choice that gives Padmé one last decision to make that has a greater impact on the entire saga. She could have waited and lived, but by sacrificing her own life to save her children, she’s allowed hope for the future to survive.

In my suggested version, the “You’re sounding like a seperatist” scene would come before the deleted scene where Padmé suggests involving the Jedi. So since Padmé already tried to approach the subject with Anakin and he became defensive, I think it could lead the audience into thinking she was referring to someone else in the later scene, like Obi-Wan or Yoda.

So a brief order of scenes (skipping some):

1. Tells Anakin she’s Pregnant
2. Balcony scene
3. Discussing Anakin’s Nightmare
4. Anakin appointed Palpatine’s representative, doesn’t become Master. Anakin and Obi talk afterward.
5. Padmé and Petition of 2000 see Palpatine.
6. The next day or later, Padmé and other senators complain how Palpatine has ignored their wishes and continues to exert his power, then they suggest forming an “organization” to stop it (which is now more clearly implied to be the Alliance rather than the Petition of 2000). They agree not to talk about their plans with anyone, and Padmé hesistantly agrees.
7. Later that day, Padmé tries to approach the subject of politics with Anakin, but he becomes defensive and she drops the topic.
8. The senators meet again and Padmé asks if she can speak to a Jedi she trusts about it, and the senators seem open to the idea.
9. Later that day or the next day, Anakin senses that Obi-Wan been to Padmé’s apartment, and Padmé says he was just worried about him.

And the movie continues as normal.

(Grievous speaking to Sidious and Anakin’s Nightmare could also be placed later in the film, maybe after Yoda, Obi and Mace’s gunship conversation. Haven’t really decided on this.)

And like I’ve mentioned, I would trim the deleted scene to end where the other senators seem open to the idea rather than Bail telling Padmé to wait, as well as the mention of the Petition of 200 in that scene. I would also remove the mention of regional governors from the Palpatine scene since it now takes place before he does that, and then remove Padmé defending Palpatine with the other senators at Bail’s apartment, because at this point she has already recognized the problem.

This could add more reasoning as to why Bail goes to the Jedi temple during the attack, and why he goes looking for Yoda and Obi-Wan. There would be the implication that Padmé has spoken to Obi-Wan offscreen (Anakin: Obi-Wan’s been here?) and has established the crucial link between this Alliance and the Jedi.

And the benefit of it being offscreen is that it helps us see the situation from Anakin’s perspective. At this point Palpatine has already planted seeds of doubt in Anakin regarding the Jedi and Padmé. So Anakin’s suspicions would only build if he feels like something is going on behind his back. Yes, Padmé says he came by her apartment to talk about Anakin and how stressed he is, but is that all they talked about?

And hopefully this build up could help rationalize his erratic behavior on Mustafar. Anakin might have doubted Padmé’s loyalty at brief moments, but kept faith because he was doing all of this to save her. So when it appears that Padmé brought Obi-Wan with her, all of Anakin’s fears, that have now been better set up, seem to have come true. His best friend and wife have come to kill him. Anakin has sacrificed all of these lives and turned the galaxy upside down for her, and this is what she does in return?

Obviously Anakin goes too far but I’m hoping his paranoia would better explain his reaction in this version of events.

On another note, I also found this relevant video discussing Padmé’s character in ROTS.

https://youtu.be/5tScrwlQb0E

Basically, he suggests that rather than Padmé just losing the will to live, that due to complications, she has to make the choice between saving her own life or saving the twins.

It would be nice if she could make this choice using her own words, but probably the easiest way to do this would be the Hal-method, and create a new medical droid VO to deliver the necessary exposition, and state that the delivery process will be dangerous, and Padmé has chosen the lives of her children over her own.

I think it would be worth it, because it would give her character one final decision, and allow her the choice to make a sacrifice, not only for Luke and Leia but the future of the Rebellion.

And while realistically I do think it is rare for mother’s to have to make such a choice on the delivery table, it would at least be as equally, if not more believable, than “losing the will to live”. Yes, dying of a “broken heart” is possible, but I think this option would also better serve the narrative and do Padmé a little more justice. Although Padmé dying still falls into the trope of a female character’s death being used to drive the male character’s own narrative, at least it would allow Padmé to maintain some agency in the end.

Okay! Thanks for explaining it to me Frink! I’ll make sure to do that in the future. And thanks Z6PO! Quality is even better than the one I found. The cast really seemed to have liked Gary. I think Mark said when Gary left “Revenge of the Jedi”, it felt like “Mom and Dad getting a divorce.”

Okay, that’s weird. I’ll try to fix it or take it off then. And yeah, it’s the name of the guy’s blog, maybe it is blocking it because of that? Just a picture of Gary, Mark and Carrie on set.

EDIT: Changed it. Hopefully it works now.

In all of the BTS I’ve seen of Gary Kurtz, he seems to have been a very positive influence on set, which is something greatly treasured to those who work on them. Not only did he have a big impact on filmmaking, but he was a decent person. I know his family must be devastated, but I hope they can celebrate the time they had with him and the great impact he’s had on millions of people around the world.

I’m sure many of you have seen this but I wanted to share a video of what was probably one of Star Wars’ first appearances at a fan convention in 1976, with Mark Hamill and Gary Kurtz representing the film. A really great look at a moment in time before people even knew what Star Wars was.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmhjvkj8_aw

Thanks! And I totally understand what you’re saying. I don’t think it could work for every edit, but I think it might work for some. I’ll have to try to put it together sometime and see if it could work at all.

And you’re right, I didn’t realize just how many scenes there were in this part of the movie until now. Honestly I think it is sort of a side effect of George waiting to tell the bulk of the story until the third movie in the trilogy.

Ah, I see what you’re saying. That’s a good point. Though I don’t think it has to be before the Palpatine deleted scene, does it? Basically, once the Petition of 2000 fails to make a difference with Palpatine, that’s when the Senators take it a step further. They agree to keep it a secret, but Padmé does try to talk to Anakin about it but he deflects the topic. So, the next time we see Padmé she suggests talking to a Jedi she trusts, which makes us think she isn’t talking about Anakin. And then basically you would end that scene not with Bail saying no, and just leaving the possibility she will in the air.

I’ve laid out the scene orders for both the theatrical and Hal’s restructured version, and then I’ve laid out two optional structures with the Padmé scenes rearranged.

Theatrical
Pregnant
Grievous
Balcony
Nightmare
Yoda’s Advice
Briefing
Anakin’s Appointment
You’re on this council…
Spy on Chancellor
Gunship conversation
Sound like a sep
Opera
Kashyyyk/Utupau discovery
Goodbye old friend
Second dream, visiting Padmé
Obi-Wan arrives

Hal’s Edit
I’m Pregnant
Briefing
Palpatine Appoints Anakin
Jedi discuss
On this council
First Padmé scene
Spy on Chancellor
A prophecy misread
Sound like a sep
Grievous makes a call
Anakin’s nightmare (doesn’t tell padme)
Opera
Kashyyyk
Second Padmé scene
Goodbye old friend
Third Padmé scene
Obi-Wan on Utupau

Option #1
I’m Pregnant
Balcony
Grievous
Nightmare
Briefing
Palpatine appoints Anakin
Yoda, Mace & Obi meeting
Not a Master
Spy on Chancellor
Third Padmé deleted scene
Gunship conversation
First Padmé deleted scene
(Possibly “Sounding like a sep”)
Opera
Second Padmé deleted scene
Kashyyyk
Goodbye old friend
Anakin visits Padme “Obi-Wan’s been here?”
Obi arrives at Utupau

Option #2
I’m Pregnant
Briefing
Palpatine Appoints Anakin
Jedi discuss
On this council
Spy on Chancellor
Third Padmé scene
Gunship conversation
First Padmé scene
Grievous makes a call
Anakin’s nightmare
Opera
Second Padmé scene
Kashyyyk
Goodbye old friend
Was Obi-Wan here?
Obi-Wan on Utupau

I think if you were to to try to put it in your ROTS, hypothetically, Dom, you could just swap the first deleted scene with third, the second with the first, and then put the second deleted scene inbetween “You’re sounding like a seperatist” and the Kashyyyk scene, with maybe some type of Coruscant establishing shot to create a buffer between those two Coruscant scenes to maybe imply time has passed and it’s the next day.

Thanks! I don’t think it would have to be cut, necessarily. I just figured that that scene served a similar purpose, so it could be replaced if everything couldn’t fit.

Thanks! Like I said, it would be a tight fit, but Padmé is one of the big three of the prequels, so I feel like it would be nice to give her a more active role in the film if it’s possible.

And you would have to trim a few lines from each scene for it to make sense, so it would shorten them but maybe it would help maintain a brisk pace?

The most important thing is that they’re positioned appropriately for it to make sense. At the moment that positioning is the only one I can think of that would work, but maybe there are other options.

And as I mentioned, just putting the Padmé/Palpatine scene first and the “Seeds of the Rebellion” scene second would help set up Padmé as a founder of the Alliance, but adding the final scene could help link Bail with the Jedi and create more doubt and tension between Anakin, Obi-Wan and Padmé. Could be interesting.

While this isn’t a major
radical idea, I haven’t seen this idea mentioned before, but maybe it has.

I think most people would agree that one of the weaker aspects of Revenge of the Sith is how Padmé does not really have much to do in that film. Luckily it has become commonplace for ROTS edits to reinsert most, if not all, of her deleted scenes. While this does give her more to do, really what she does doesn’t have much an influence on the overall story. It’s more of a sideplot, and it really doesn’t go anywhere.

While the scenes technically show us the beginnings of the Rebellion, it’s not really the Rebellion, but more about the Petition of the 2000.

Basically, I’m wondering if the subplot could be restructured to give Padmé a more fundamental role in the founding of the Alliance.

I’m curious about the possibility of slightly reordering the appearance of these deleted scenes in a convincing way. Instead of being last, the first deleted scene we see could be when Padmé meets with Palpatine about the Petition of 2000. Palpatine “reassures” them that he’ll do the right thing. This versions would cut the reference to the regional governors, and just refer to more constitutional amendments in general.

The next deleted scene would be when the senators discuss Palpatine appointing Regional Governors across the Republic. With this restructure, the senators are now clearly upset that Palpatine is still abusing his power despite their wishes. Now, the “organization” that Bail alludes to more clearly appears to be referring to what eventually will be the Rebellion. They are taking the next step in order to preserve the Republic. I do think this scene could be trimmed too, like Padmé being defensive of Palpatine, since she would have already seen that Palpatine can’t be trusted.

Now, while not totally necessary, and I still don’t know for sure where the last scene could be placed best, but adding the scene where Padmé requests involving a Jedi she trusts could help tie her plot into the main crux of the story.

Since she never refers to the Jedi she trusts by name, it leaves room for doubt in the audience. Of course we’d assume this is Anakin, but has his close position with Palpatine affected this?
It would be nice if this scene could take place before Anakin visits Padmé, when he asks if Obi-Wan has been there to see her. Anakin senses that he had been there, and now the audience is wondering if Obi-Wan is the Jedi she was referring to earlier. It is not made clear, so we would begin doubt Padmé’s honesty, just like Anakin probably is.

If Padmé did speak to a Jedi about the proto-Alliance, it would not only help add to why Bail immediately goes out searching for Yoda and Obi-Wan after Order 66, but it makes Anakin’s paranoia regarding the Jedi, the Senate, and especially the two people he is closest to, Obi-Wan and Padmé, more understandable. It could add to Anakin’s suspicions regarding Padmé, so him lashing out at her on Mustafar would be a more predicatable reaction.

All the scenes would require slight trims to have the restructure not be contradicted by each other, removing references regarding the Petition of 2000, regional governors in the first scene, cutting Bail saying not to get the Jedi involved just yet, etc.

It also could add to the tragedy of ROTS, because in a way Palpatine isn’t wrong about the seeds of doubt he plants in Anakin. Even though they have good intentions, the Jedi and a group of Senators are really making plans against the Chancellor. For obvious reasons, but Palpatine is still technically right. He made them react exactly the way he wanted them to.

With this restructure, we now could see Padmé take a more active role in the narrative. Also, since Padmé makes active decisions in the last two films, returning to liberate Naboo on her own and going to Geonosis to rescue Obi-Wan, this could fit more into her previously established character.

My biggest problem at the moment though is figuring out where to place these scenes.

If generally sticking with the theatrical format, I think the Palpatine/Padmé scene would need to go in between Obi-Wan asking Anakin to spy on the chancellor and Obi-Wan, Yoda and Mace’s gunship conversation. I think this scene could replace the Anakin and Padmé couch conversation “You’re sounding like a separatist!”

The scene where Bail discusses this secret “organization” would need to go after the gunship scene. And the third scene, where Padmé requests that they involve a Jedi she trusts, would probably need to go inbetween the first Kashyyyk scene and the scene where Anakin says goodbye to Obi-Wan.

It would be pretty tight, but I think it could work. And I like how other edits reorder certain scenes, like rearranging the opera scene, but o haven’t figured out such a restructure would fit other edits. And like I said before, one could at least swap the Palpatine/Padmé meeting and Bail’s “organization” deleted scenes to imply that Padmé is a founding member of the early Rebellion.

While just swapping those two deleted scenes would add more to Padmé’s story and tie her legacy into the next films, I think adding the other deleted scene in this way also does a lot to add to Anakin’s growing doubts regarding the people he’s closest to, and how he would feel like Palpatine is the only person he can turn to.

Anyway, just a thought I’ve had for awhile. Not sure if it would work but maybe it is something that could be explored. If you guys have any ideas about scene order or anything else, please share them.

Those are good ideas. You could just throw the moon(s) into single frame samples just to see where it would look good.

I had a similar thought about D’Qar, since it does have a ring it would be cool to see it from the surface. The ring looks so thin though I don’t really know if you would even be able to see it from the surface, and also it looks cloudy in most of the Resistance Base scenes, so it probably wouldn’t be feasible anyway.

These “what if” visualitions someone did are pretty cool though. This could’ve been cool for D’Qar but it’d be cool to see something like this in one of the films eventually.
http://www.planetary.org/blogs/jason-davis/20130626-earths-skies-saturns-rings.html

I also think it makes sense in the situation. Excluding the awkward shot where they just walk past each other, we see Chewie go off to follow Finn and make sure he is okay. It’s just like how Finn helped take care of him earlier in the film. Plus, I think it is in character for him to focus on taking care of someone else to distract himself from the grief. It isn’t until later when things have gotten quiet that we see Chewie by himself, absorbing everything that’s happened.

So, I don’t think it will be really be as distracting if that one shot removes Chewie or is just cropped.

It definitely wasn’t intentional, but it is ironic that JJ forgot about Chewie just like George did in the original story. Though it is a little more noticeable than a missing medal!

I really like this look. Would definitely would be interested in going back and watching the movie with this applied.

Another random unrelated thought. I don’t know exactly which shots, if any, it would be appropriate it in, but I thought it would be an interesting idea to put the moons of Jakku we see in the very first shot of the movie somewhere in the sky in laters scenes. Maybe we see one or both of them in the sky when Rey is working, at Niima Outpost, or at Rey’s At-AT. Etc. etc.

Just thought it could add some variety to make it feel a little more alien and differentiate it more from Tatooine.

I’m not saying either side is right or wrong, but I do get yotsuya’s perspective.

If you worked at a bookstore, for example, and you had to choose whether to put Star Wars books in the fantasy section or the science fiction section, which section would you put them in?

Obviously you would put it in the science fiction section. That’s where Star Wars books are in most book stores (unless it has it’s own section). Yes, it is not traditional science fiction, because the science really doesn’t matter, it’s just set decoration. But because of that it is like a science fiction setting, but in the subgenre of space opera, because the sci-fi aspect is more about the aesthetic. I think that’s what you’re getting at, right?

I agree with that, but if I had to describe to someone who had never seen Star Wars before, I wouldn’t want to describe it as science fiction. I think that is sort of misleading, because it leads people to have a certain assumption about it’s content and themes. So space opera or space fantasy are definitely more accurate descriptors.