RogueLeader

EddieDean said:

Here’s an idea I don’t think I’ve seen here before-

Someone on Youtube has added scenes from the ST to a vision Luke has as he looks within Kylo’s mind during the Rashomon flashback scenes, so that the audience can see the darkness within Kylo that horrified Luke enough for him ignite his lightsaber in reaction:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eg4fZlt197U

I think it works really well, and actually seeing what Luke sees (show, don’t tell) helps the audience understand why Luke considered striking a student.

You could use scenes from all three movies. I’d probably choose the some shots more focused on Kylo than on Sidious, but either way it also adds a layer of irony - played out this way it’s almost like Luke saw a dark future that he feared, but through his fear, he actually brought it to pass.

This is an idea I’ve had before! You can find other versions of this idea around YouTube. I don’t think I ever posted this here, but I wrote up this idea awhile back.

Third, in Luke’s second vision, we actually get a glimpse of what Luke sees. Glimpses of a dark figure, but never a direct look. Silhouettes. A man in black with a red flaming sword, striking down his opponents (taking from Rey’s TFA vision, and maybe Kylo killing the Mustafarians at the beginning of TROS if that’s fair game). We could potentially see him killing Han (maybe just the shot of him falling to keep it ambiguous), the burning temple, etc. One of the last vision shots could be of Leia in the base on Crait, looking down the hallway to see a cloaked figure. We briefly cut back to Leia looking up at the figure, then cut to a shot of Kylo Ren, when he is bringing his saber down to kill Lor San Tekka. Making it seem as if it is Kylo coming to kill his mother. Then it hard cuts to Luke igniting his saber in response. So whether or not you have it as an uncut vision or make it intercut with him reaching for his saber, it makes it feel like Luke is totally absorbed in this vision of the future and is igniting his saber as almost a defensive reaction to the last vision shot of Kylo striking, an action to defend Leia, rather than taking a few moments to contemplate killing his sleeping student. It puts the audience in Luke’s mind, showing how he is enthralled by this prescient hallucination. Luke is so powerful that the clarity of his visions makes him lose sight of what is present and what is future.

I wouldn’t even be against a subtle Palpatine laugh, like TLJ: Legendary has it. Doesn’t necessarily mean Palpatine played a part in manipulating Luke, but it can be interpreted that way by those while like that.

A lot of tribute videos on YouTube do a variation of a vision montage, so there’s a lot of ways you could do it. I just specifically like the idea of the last shot being Kylo striking, and then Luke immediately igniting his saber in return.

True. I know the canon novels have the New Republic paint Leia as a war monger, but she sort of was even if it was justified. I agree that think it would’ve fit Leia better if she was trying to maintain peace as a politician rather than just be a general.

So you’re saying that you would’ve had the New Republic on one side, the Imperial Remnant on the other, with their being peace or a truce between them, and the Knights of Ren as the main antagonists trying to stir up trouble?

Love your idea for the Knights of Ren! I also think it would’ve given Kylo a more interesting motivation. His motivation for turning to the dark side was never expanded upon in the films, but this would give you the idea that he felt he was doing what was right for the galaxy, even if it was misguided. Him and the other Knights may believe they could control the dark side without it controlling them, but as the trilogy progresses we’d see how it corrupts them.

The Force Awakens novel opened with this “quote” from the Journal of the Whills:

First comes the day
Then comes the night
After the dark
Shines through the light
The difference, they say
Is only made right
By resolving the gray
Through refined Jedi sight

It is an intriguing prologue, but the trilogy never delves into that. Your idea could resolve the “gray” and put the arguments to rest.

For example, I wish Luke had a moment in the trilogy to give some spiritual speech that was on the same level as Yoda’s “for my ally is the Force” speech. You could’ve had Luke explain to Rey why Kylo’s philosophy is wrong in an interesting, optimistic way. I think it’d still be nice to show how Luke’s Jedi Order might be different than how it was before, how he “resolves the gray”, but with an answer that isn’t “Grey Jedi”.

Really, the ST could’ve posed an interesting question and theme. Okay, Anakin brought balance to the Force, but what does that mean? And how do you maintain it? That question could’ve not only applied to the state of Jedi and the Force, but also to the state of the New Republic? How do you protect democracy, and keep it from falling to fascism again?

This is a common idea people have, but you could’ve had a simple role reversal and the Imperial remnant could’ve been the rebels, with ragtag stormtrooper militias committing acts of terrorism across the Republic. And Leia could’ve done some politcking, trying to weed out senators who are trying to turn the Republic back into an Empire. Our heroes could be wondering who has stormtrooper uniforms in their closets.

Speaking of which, I picture the ST “stormtroopers” looking more like this.

I mean, this would’ve been cool for the fandom, too. Imagine the 501st having their members make costumes like this. Could’ve had some pretty cool action figures too, and encouraged fans to kitbash their own stormtrooper figures. I think it narratively makes sense to see how the Imperial element has regressed and become more extremist in the wake of their defeat.

You could quote Yoda and go with “Shadow of Greed”

I love how you lay out the logic of that approach for Rey’s story. You’re right, TFA outlines that Luke failed to rebuild the Jedi, so it would’ve made sense to see Rey succeed at that. There is the implication that she will, but you can say the same for Luke at the end of ROTJ.

One thing I liked about Colin Trevorrow’s Duel of the Fates script was how it ended with Rey and company building a new home for future Jedi.

Maybe it would’ve been too much, but it could’ve been fun to have had a significant time skip with Episode IX, and we see that Rey has already begun training new Jedi. And you could’ve had a fun climax where the new Jedi fight the Knights of Ren.

I think one issue would’ve been introducing several new characters, let alone giving enough screen time to existing characters, like Finn and Poe. Even though Finn and Poe do have their own stories, they could’ve had them both start down the Jedi path too. I think people wanted to see Finn become a Jedi, so you could’ve had more hints to them both being Force-sensitive. And maybe Rey succeeds where Luke doesn’t because she doesn’t try to rebuild the Jedi are her own, but with the help of her friends. They do it together. And you could’ve contrasted Rey’s relationship with her friends and Kylo’s relationship with the Knights of Ren. Maybe there is infighting amongst the Knights, or they’re planning to usurp Kylo. We could see how the Knights of Ren are just like the Sith, despite trying to be different. And with the new Jedi, we could see how they might function differently than the old Jedi, and how they hopefully won’t repeat the same mistakes as them.

A lot of potential ideas there.

NFB, you’re not being pretentious or arrogant at all. There’s plenty of people doing more straightforward Kenobi edits, which are all great. You just want to do something more experimental, which is also really fun too! Just takes some more time to mull over it all. I actually think it is great that you’re going back and spending some time thinking about how to approach the series from your own creative perspective.

Making another BCS/BB comparison, I think another positive to keeping Reva as a crucial part of the narrative is that it gives you a story arc for a character that has an unknown fate. One thing that has kept BCS compelling is seeing what happens to the characters that weren’t in BB.

I also like the idea of introducing Reva through Vader, in a sense, and that he is pushing her on this mission. She still has her own motivations, but I think it feeds into the power play amongst the bad guys in this series.

This random thought goes in total opposition to what I just said, but what if you just cut out all of the pointless adventure? You could save yourself a lot of work and just make it a short film or standalone episode, at least the length of a regular BCS/BB episode, or at most 60-90 minutes.

What if the story was just about Obi-Wan going on a spiritual walkabout, having a few visions (potentially shared visions) of Anakin/Vader where he sort of comes to terms with his trauma. Episode III ends with Yoda apparently having training for Obi-Wan, so you could frame it as Obi-Wan being guided by Yoda through the Force, or simply him remembering Yoda’s teachings.

It reminds me a bit of EddieDean’s approach to the Mortis episodes, where reinterpreting scenes as explicit “visions” allows you to get away with more non-linear and experimental editing, which might fit well with the approach you’ve already been taking with your edit. Vader and Obi-Wan have their confrontations in rather dreamlike, barren landscapes anyway.

Regardless of what you do, I do think you should just have fun with it. People have plenty of Kenobi edits to choose from. If it ain’t spark in’ joy, toss it out.

I think this is a very valid point of view that I tend to agree with. I’m sure people will chime in arguing which interpretation is the right one, and it may be right, but it definitely feels like it has been muddled, arguably by Lucas himself as time went on.

But I personally think the ambiguity feeds into the Force’s religious connotations in-universe pretty nicely, since religions have fought wars over which interpretation is right, with either side claiming theirs is the Truth.

Lol, maybe Han was also a fan of podracing.

If he did really have a middle name, I would guess that it would be Organa. I would think Leia would still want to carry on the family name of the Royal House of Alderaan.

Speaking of which, I always liked the idea that Kylo Ren was sort of a “dark prince”, since he would have some claim to the throne of Alderaan. I could imagine citizens of the galaxy whispering amongst themselves one of his nicknames, Prince of Ashes.

Can’t wait to check out the Fall of Ahsoka episodes!

Love the idea of a coda to the Clone Wars that includes that fantastic scene from Rebels. Just calling it “Maul and Obi-Wan” is a simple way to make it clear that is sort of a bookend to their story (or at least Maul’s). Calling it “Old Wounds” could be a nice alternative though.

Would you still do the blue opening text? It could help give context for the scene. I also wonder if it is worth it for a 5 minute episode. Would it work to just go straight into the short and trust people to figure enough out through the conversations, but still leave enough questions to make the audience want to go watch Rebels to figure out more of the story behind it. Just some thoughts, but I love this idea, since it ties back into the idea that this edit is meant to “refocus” on Maul, the Mandalorians, etc.

Just listened to Hal and Speakhard’s conversation today during a long drive and it was great! Having spent some time not messing around with fan edits too much, it was great to revisit the history and also listen to sort of a retrospective on what was accomplished with Hal’s Sequel Trilogy edits.

Speakhard, I think you had a great thought on how this need people have to add their voice to the Star Wars story reflects the franchise becoming sort of a modern mythology, which was Lucas’ goal. It is kind of ironic, because I do wonder if Lucas’ choice to make the Special Editions and not make the original unaltered trilogy available kind of sparked the idea that these films aren’t really set in stone, but can be altered.

Kind of a fun but unimportant thought, but I like to think that in-universe all of these stories exist and have been documented at some unknown time in the far future, where no one really knows how these events actually went down, and people have these contradicting myths to choose from. For example, one version of the “New Hope” text has Han shooting Greedo first (and only), while another has Han shooting second. Or in terms of EU vs Disney Canon, both versions contain a story of the son of Han and Leia falling to the dark side, so perhaps future scholars believe that fact is likely true, but the details are up for debate. Anyway, a very nerdy thought, but I think the idea would help appease fans who get their pants in a knot about what is and isn’t canon. Or maybe people believe it is all made up, just like how King Arthur likely never existed.

Also, speakhard, I think you were right on the money about how TFA Restructured turns the original movies weaknesses into strengths. Like Hal said, TFA is basically a soft reboot of ANH in many ways, but that copying or parallelism works to the edit’s advantage when it sets up saving Hosnian Prime at the climax of the film, when you expect our heroes to save the day in the nick of time just like they did in ANH. I also think NeverarGreat’s Starlight Edition of TFA builds off this idea by having Rey tap into the dark side in order to defeat Kylo Ren. It is unexpected, it provides a more complex rationale for how the untrained Rey is able to defeat Kylo Ren, and it sets up the need for Luke Skywalker to return even more, not only to save the galaxy but to save Rey from that darkness within her.

Listening to this conversation was kind of cathartic in coming to terms a little bit more with my gripes with ST. Honestly I’m kind of back and forth when it comes to my feelings on the films, so that’s not set in stone, but lately I’ve been more okay with them bringing back Palpatine (still choosing to ignore Rey Palpatine though). I think future ST edits could do more to help set his return up. I think there is still more that could done with a future TROS edit, but I’m really happy with the reception Ascendant has gotten since its release.

I’m sure I have more thoughts that I’m forgetting but I really loved the insight you guys shared! Definitely would recommend others to check it out.

Also, Hal, I think Hal 9000 is a fitting name to go by, since the act of fan editing is, in essence, rebelling against the creator.

Very cool Octorox! It’s cool to see the scene order I suggested!

I do think, narratively, this is a nice placement for the training scene. We are not (re)introduced to Anakin and Obi until they are explicitly mentioned.

I do think Anjohan’s ordering is also has a lot of merits, and probably makes sense from a practical standpoint, since the physical differences of the actors probably stand out more when the training and elevator scenes are back-to-back. I think it works either way, and just depends on your preference. The differences don’t bother me personally.

Also the background doesn’t bother me either. Trying to add traffic to the background definitely feels like TOO MUCH work to be worth the effort.

It does sound like rescoring is a pain, but the choices you’ve
made so far feel like a massive improvement over the original to my ears.

Another editing suggestion regarding the first Grand Inquisitor shot: I really like what you did here. Kind of a spooky reveal of the Grand Inquisitor. (It is impressive how you truncated that interaction, and it really improved it.)
I do think it might help to try to cut away from dolly in shot of the bartender behind the bar before he starts moving left of frame. Maybe before he sits the bottle down. Since he is static in the following shot, the movement stood out to me.

I also wonder if you could place the shot of Kenobi (the one we see after the bartender says they hunt Jedi) right after the reveal shot of the Grand Inquisitor. Cutting to Kenobi, who is a distance away from them, in my mind helps sell the idea that the bartender walked to the front of the bar while we were away, even if only for a brief moment. I also think there is a nice logic of revealing the Grand Inquisitor, then showing Kenobi’s immediate “oh shit” reaction.

This isn’t important, but there is one shot in the scene of the Grand Inquisitors shadow passing over a bar patron sitting down. I feel like this shot would be great to build up to the GI reveal, maybe being placed before the first shot of the bartender reacting to the GI walking in. The shot is used in the scene already though, but you could replace it with a shot of the three patrons at the bar top that was cut from your version (we see that shot around when the GI walks up to the lightsaber marks on the wall). Just an idea though! [And if you do use it, the shot might work better if it was reversed, but I can’t tell.]

The song you used at the end of the scene fit quite well!

I also like the idea you had of using a shot of the ringworld from Book of Boba Fett (feel like I should be saying Mandalorian). I do think that specific shot, of a ship leaving the ringworld, might be a little confusing since we just saw Obi-Wan about to board a ship on Tatooine, then see him leave a different place on a different ship. This might not work, but I wonder if you could use different establishing shots of the ringworld to imply that Kenobi is hiding/meditating in a storage container on the outer surface of the ring, the substrata, rather than on a ship floating through space somewhere. The colors of the ship Kenobi is in matches the color scheme of the substrata, so I feel like you could sell the idea. You could add pipe sounds or something too help sell the idea with ambience. And then after Kenobi has the vision, you could use that shot of the shuttle leaving the ringworld to make it seem like Kenobi is leaving to go rescue Leia.

Again, I do agree that you could accept Star Wars logic and Leia was kidnapped not long after Obi-Wan left Tatooine for totally different reasons, but I think this idea does help clarify his motivations a bit. And having a nice, quiet establishing shot or two could help with the flow of the narrative too.

You are totally right though regarding your thoughts of Bail. If Bail had Obi-Wan on speed dial all of this time, you’d think he would’ve just sent a message to Obi-Wan directly in A New Hope.

Also, great job with the binocular shot! Think it works better now.

I hope I’m not giving an overwhelming amount of feedback. I think what you’ve done so far is great, and you should trust your gut!

I’ll have more feedback later but maybe more prominent footsteps could be added as they are walking to the saloon. I like the idea of keeping them mysterious, building up their reveal through the reactions of the crowd. And we can hear the heavy footsteps halt in the shot before the Grand Inquisitor reveal. I do think the transition between those two shots feels a little noticeable, but maybe that would help.

Is the transition from Reva “killing” the Jedi and then seeing his feet strung up the same as the last version? The transition felt a little quicker than I recall it being. But yeah good job on not showing a close look at his face!

Might want to get more feedback on the new establishing shot you chose for Obi’s meditation scene, but I think something like that shot could work well.

I’ll give more feedback later when I have more time, but it is looking good!

Damn, it’s crazy how much the descoring and rescoring has changed the tone of this series. I’m sure all the foley you’re having to do can be exhausting, but I promise you it is paying off. I think a lot of your new music selections are an improvement. The only one that stood out to me was hearing the Across the Stars motif during Leia’s rescue. I know the idea is probably because she is Anakin and Padmé’s kid, but I’ve just always associated the song with romance, so it doesn’t really work for me there. Could Leia’s motif potentially fit there instead?

I wonder if it would be possible to imply that more time has passed when we see Ben meditating on the ship, and not that he got an alert that Leia was in danger as soon as he was off world. Perhaps fading out as he walks toward the ship rather than a hard cut could help suggest that. And/or potentially a shot of a transport ship flying through space? Or maybe a brand new shot to show he is chilling in a warehouse on some totally different planet. Just something to show that a little time has passed.

I think using a shot from Rebels is interesting, and I think you could potentially get away with it (especially if the footage was more shaky and scratchy, perhaps, through the view screen). I do think you might need VFX to address how we don’t see the sun in one shot, then see it in the binoculars, but then don’t see it in the next shot. I do like what you’re trying to do with this scene though.

I don’t think you need the scene with Obi and the Jawa. It flows nicely as-is imo.

What you’ve done with the Inquisitors showing up on Tatooine is really cool! I have some notes I could give on that to maybe help make it work more, but I can hold off on that for now. I think this is a cool direction to go in though. I wonder if you cut the close up shot of the Jedi hanging. With his new “death” and the shot of his feet hanging combined with the new creepy Inquisitor music, I think not seeing the damage is better than seeing his body hanging there relatively unscathed. I think you can get away with the wide shot of their ship flying off though.

I wonder if in Obi’s Leia vision, one of the last shots we could see is Daiyu or something, or hear one of the kidnappers say, “Set course for Daiyu.” I agree with your Luke/Bespin comparison, but Luke did still see Bespin at least. But I guess Obi could’ve seen it off screen too? Idk just a thought.

I think the overall structure is working well so far. A part of me does wonder if I miss a bit more of Leia’s introduction, but I may be biased a little bit. I did realize you run into a question of why the kidnappers set up a dummy hostage, if there plan was no longer to capture her rescuer, but maybe that was just a safety measure they take with all of their hostages? I personally think the muffled Leia line works by the way.

I also wonder if it is fine that Obi and Bail have no contact after he senses Leia in danger. Like, could you potentially have voiceover of Bail as Obi-Wan arrives at Daiyu, implying they communicated after Obi-Wan sensed Leia.

I might have more thoughts later, but pretty cool so far!

He is! We’re both big Star Wars fans and watch all of the new shows and what not together whenever I get a chance to visit.

I couldn’t tell you time code off the top of my head, but it is in your Politics of War episode. I think it might come from the original Senate Murders episode but I’m not sure. It’s the scene with the two bounty hunters (the fish dude and the Selkath), and they’re talking to Dooku’s hologram. It happens near the end of the scene I think.

It’s funny, the Mortis stuff used to be one of my least favorite arcs because of its implications with the Force, but your version really brings back the mystery that makes the Force so interesting. This is definitive for me.

I also was gonna tell you that I actually was telling my dad about what you were doing with Refocused last night (I showed off your excel spreadsheet) and we also watched Politics of War. It’s pretty nuts how you truncated three episodes into one. My dad couldn’t tell where one episode ended and another began, and I honestly couldn’t either. The only real hint is Padmé’s costume/hair changes, but that is arguably just her changing wardrobe for different days and occasions, and we only even thought about it because we knew it was an edit. It’s really great. I think my dad wants to go back and watched Refocused now so he doesn’t have to commit to the entire series.

I did want to mention that I think I saw a rogue frame during the scene where Dooku hires the bounty hunters. You may have already noticed that and saving it for your next polish export.

I could do! I could move it later, so the conversation goes:
Obi-Wan: “I don’t understand.”
Daughter: “When you reach the altar, it will give you what you need.”
Qui-Gon: “Trust in the force.”
This way, it helps justify Obi-Wan essentially being given a useless response by Daughter, though it doesn’t solve the issue at hand.

That is true, though I didn’t necessarily feel like we needed more explanation at that point. I just felt like we needed some reason Obi-Wan goes along with the Daughter into this cave after she essentially kidnapped him. Yes, this episode can rely on dream logic, but I feel like it would be useful to have a line during that first shot of them walking up to the cave. Something to acknowledge the situation. Like I said, Obi-Wan could say, “What is this place?” or “Where are we?” And/or the Daughter could say, “Come with me” or some line about her brother. I felt that the Qui-Gon line would’ve worked during that shot as a way to reassure Obi-Wan. It could work in that place you suggested as well, but I feel like some kind of line would be nice to have in that first shot. I hope that makes sense.

Love everything you said in response, Eddie!

Yes, the additional Qui-Gon bits totally help increase his presence, and it adds to the sense that he is guiding them through this.

Could you just push that line “Trust in the Force” to the shot of Obi-Wan walking with the Daughter? I think I recall that line not being totally necessary for the previous scene, but it benefits Obi-Wan’s lack of questioning.

I think “Take only what you take with you” line does work, but it might be worth playing with alternatives. Maybe cobble together Anakin saying something like, “What’s there?”
“Trust only what you take with you” is fine but you lose some of that meaning that I interpreted, which I thought was nice.
Another potential line you could cobble together could be, “Take only what is with you”, just would need to source that “is” sound.

Didn’t notice the secret line! Nice touch, I’m glad I came to a similar conclusion.

Oh, another suggestion! I wonder if you could squeeze in Ahsoka saying, “Master!” when Anakin wakes up. And before Obi asks if he’s alright. I guess it was just weird Ahsoka didn’t say anything to Anakin after he helped save her. It is one of those things that still works because we’re in dream world. Generally all of my suggestions fall into that category. I do agree that the red saber idea or having a Obi-Wan like during the white out are not necessary. The transitions I brought up might benefit from extension, but I watched it with my dad and we didn’t notice and editing issues.

Anakin Starkiller said:

I’ve actually already done that. I left Snoke’s voice in since that moment lands much better with three voices and I don’t see any plot holes that would create. Just because Snoke and Palpy are working together doesn’t mean Palpy can’t impersonate Snoke on occasion to manipulate Kylo.

Sounds pretty good! I think I played with it before at one point, but I’m glad the idea works. And you’re right that Palpatine still could’ve impersonated Snoke. I guess I was worried about confusing people, but him saying he trained Snoke should make it clear that Snoke was a different person.

I love the idea of the destruction of Hosnian being a mass sacrifice to resurrect Palpatine. It’s so sinister and dramatic! Reminds me of when I wrote backstory to his resurrection where he drained the life force of Ewoks and Gungans.

Maybe it’d be good if Snoke was the one to say it. That plus the line about training him would really clarify the relationship between the two (master and apprentice).

At the very least, maybe during the shot of the mysterious figure rising from the muck, we could hear Snoke say, “Darkness rises!”

I think something that would really help in regards to setting up Palpatine is having Vader’s helmet actually speak to Kylo, which would get paid off by the “every voice” line. I’m sure it’s been done several times over by now, just gotta dig up the best version.

This is one of my top desires for a ST edit. I think it would be cool if Kylo received a vision from the Vader helmet in TFA that clarified his motivation to turn to the dark side. But you also could place Kylo touching Vader’s helmet in TROS at the beginning of that film, and give him a vision there where Vader speaks to him and shows him the way to the Wayfinder.

And Sasquatch, I think it is a matter of not wanting to add more backstory to Rey’s parents when it isn’t really necessary.

Eddie, what you’ve done with this episode is brilliant. Watching it I couldn’t even remember what had been cut. It doesn’t necessarily feel like anything is missing.

First, some suggestions that I wrote as I was watching the episode: I wonder if a jump out of hyperspace sound could be added right as we began fading into the first shot. Something to help blend the music fading in.

When the Daughter takes Obi-Wan to the altar, I wonder if you give Obi-Wan a line, something like, “What is this place?” I do think this episode runs fine on dream-logic, but I think it could help with the flow. Or maybe the Daughter could say, “I will take you to them” or something like that. Or just simply use “Come with me” that was cut as they’re walking to the cave.

Since this is a dream anyway, I wonder if you could change the color of Ahsoka’s lightsabers from green to red? When she pulls out her lightsaber and it slowly ignites, and Anakin looks shocked, I think seeing that it is red would add a nice punch to the moment. And since this is all a dream it is a cool way to have a brief glimpse of Sith Ahsoka.

I also was confused about how exactly you used the fireplace eyes shot of Ahsoka. Could you explain that a little more? I may have just missed it.

Color changing might make the green tower light in the background turn red, but would that matter? Maybe you could just recolor the green bulbs to red in the other shots too, since it is supposed to be a dark side place anyway.

Before the Son says, “Can you feel it, sister?” I wonder if we could get a hint that she is there with him. Like, she could simply say “brother.” It just gives us the idea that she just arrived there or something. But again, I guess it isn’t necessary because dream-logic.

Potentially a longer beat between Anakin healing Ahsoka and then waking up? Feels like the transition is too quick, especially since Ahsoka looks back normal now. Another beat of white screen might help feel like slightly more time has passed. But with the music transitions this might not be feasible.

I’m still trying to figure out the secret Qui-Gon line you’re referring to! I thought it might be “control your fear” before he sees his mother, but you mentioned that so I guess it isn’t it. Also, did you add something to that voice? Because at first it almost sounded like the Father. Which would raise some interesting questions. Is this a test from Qui-Gon, or from the Father, and Qui-Gon is simply guiding Anakin through the Father’s test? Or, is this all something Qui-Gon has put together to help them through what’s to come? Or, Qui-Gon just guided them to this place (a place he may have once visited himself) and let the Force take it from there? I may have just misheard the voice thing, but I like the mystery of it all.

I don’t think this is what you were referencing, but before Anakin enters the Son’s lair, do you have Qui-Gon say, “Take only what you take with you.”? Kind of awkwardly worded but I think it works. Since to me, Qui-Gon’s not talking about what he’s physically carrying, but what he’s emotionally carrying. And this could imply that the darkness within him is what has corrupted Ahsoka, and not the Son. BUT, if the Son is simply a manifestation of Anakin’s own darkness anyway, it’s one in the same.

That’s what I love about what you’ve done with this episode. These interpretations were arguably already there, but now they aren’t bogged down by all the other stuff with them trying to get off the planet and what not.

Speaking of which, I’m not sure how you interpreted the dagger metaphor, but I took it like this:

The dagger is a metaphor for self-sacrifice. I don’t think Obi-Wan understands this until he sees the Daughter jump in the way to save her father, and then sacrifice the rest of her life force to save Ahsoka. To me, this foreshadows Obi-Wan eventually sacrificing himself to not only save Luke, but transfer “hope” from himself to Luke. I think this is touched on with the “There is no hope” and “There’s always hope!” lines.

I do wish there was a way to make it clearer that Obi-Wan is getting something from this moment. Like, a close up of him observing what’s happening would be nice, but the only sort of close up is when he is shielding his face from the light. Like when the screen goes white, hear Obi-Wan say, “I… understand”, but that might be too on the nose.

I know awhile back you interpreted Obi-Wan failing to use the dagger properly as his failure to save Anakin from the dark side, but I think it could be interpreted both ways. Like I said, keeping things vague gains the benefit of fostering multiple interpretations and double meanings, just like the original Dagobah Cave sequence had.

And I think the question of “Balance” benefits the most from what you’ve done with this episode. With the way it ends, there is clear analogy being made to the morality play the Mortis gods depict, and what Anakin eventually does to bring “balance” as George laid it out.

It’s funny, because I think this edit simultaneously simplifies the message, but also, through vagueness, increases the mystery. I could go on more about what I got from this episode but I’ll stop my long post for now. Great job, Eddie!

I think Octorox said he is using a deepfake.

I agree that Hayden’s voice is slightly deeper than how he sounded 20 years ago. If you go back and forth and listen to his voice in the rest of the movie, you can maybe tell better.

It seems a bit of people place it right after the bombing, which is probably a good place. But I feel like there is a natural segue between the bombing and their training, when usually there is a narrative flow between scenes (with the exception of ROTJ). After the bombing, it makes sense to go to Padmé’s senate deleted scene, or the council meeting with Palpatine to discuss the problems in the Republic.

Idk if it would work but I also could picture a version where Palpatine is talking about putting her under the protection of the Jedi, and Palpatine says, “maybe someone you’re familiar with, like an old friend…” (either cut there or keep ‘Master Kenobi’) then hard cut to the Anakin/Obi-Wan training scene.

The only issue with that would be you would go straight from that to the elevator scene, so the difference in their appearance could potentially be more noticeable, but if we are just considering the narrative flow I think this is a logical place for the scene to be. It would be nice to add an extra line for Obi-Wan, where he walks off camera after practicing with Anakin and says something like, “Come now”, or “Let’s go”. Or maybe hear Obi-Wan’s comm beep to life and hear Windu’s voice say, “Obi-Wan”, then cut to them riding the elevator.

Eddie, are music and dialogue pretty separate in the audio tracks? I’m guessing they must be if you’re able to rearrange dialogue fairly well. I’m curious if this would make restoring also feasible (you may have done this already in past episodes and I’ve forgotten/missed it).

Spence, I think it is cool that you managed to keep the whole series basically, but just trimmed it down to a decent movie length.

I think you should stick with what you have as-is, but it might be worth looking at interviews with the guy who wrote the film screenplay the series expanded upon if you haven’t already. For example, Reva dying was something that happened in his script, but it seems like the rescue from Fortress Inquisitorius wasn’t a part of the original story, nor did any other Inquisitor feature beyond Reva.

Anyway, sounds like you basically have it done, so I wouldn’t spend too much more time on it (especially since you were also pretty dissatisfied with the show anyway).

EddieDean said:

Here’s another little clip from the episode Mortis: Oops! All dream-speak!

I wanted to remove the Father’s references to real geography (“nowhere to go”) and replace them with something far more metaphorical, but which still transitioned into him sending Anakin to bed. The following Anakin-Father scene is WAY too explicit with the Father talking about how real they are, so is going to be cut entirely, but some of its dialogue, chopped up and reordered, made a nice segue into Anakin’s bedtime, with more dreamlike logic to it.

Nice. I love that his new line rhymes.

Reading Ralph McQuarrie’s interviews regarding it is so funny. It’s like he draws these very alien designs, George gives him feedback, and eventually he ends up with a teddy bear. I like to picture George never explicitly saying, “Basically teddy bears”, but Ralph ends up with that based off George’s vague feedback and realizes what he is doing.