Completely fair. I think somebody did some upscaling work on it in this forum, though. Might have even changed that matte painting. But AI upscale can only do so much.
I will say that inserting deleted scenes isn’t entirely unprecedented for a special edition, as proven with the ANH Jaba scene. But that scene really sucked, so it’s a good thing it got removed from Revisited.
If this edit wants to be the definitive remaster of RoTJ, I think that scene could definitely be cool to see. Especially since Vader reaches out to Luke in a manner very similar to Kylo and Rey speaking to each other from across the galaxy. I really like the idea that Vader could have been trying to form a dyad in the Force with Luke.
But it does take away from Luke’s mysterious appearance at the palace, I suppose. I dunno, I think I prefer being able to see somebody making a lightsaber in a live action movie over that, though. Also makes it more clear what the plan is exactly to rescue Han.
Both of those you can draw up to Luke simply being an inexperienced and sheltered young man - referring to things by either the wrong designation or a slang title. But if I ever get access to a cleaned center channel of Luke speaking around those scenes I suppose I could take a look at it.
Thanks for testing that, Ady. I’ve added a different take which I think sounds better. I’ve tried putting the unmodified line in a rough test, and I definitely see what you mean, it’s missing that robotic quality despite it sounding like JEJ:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1zlE34aGJd-yL0S_f52YbJwPko4fPAUQb?usp=drive_link
As you’ve made clear enough, you don’t feel it necessary to change this. The only reason I’m posting about it again is because I’m sure this will go in an alternative audio track project made by Octorox (or somebody else) at some point. What will likely end up happening is just replacing “Obi-Wan” with “Your mother” in the audio track to minimize any noticeable loss of that robotic quality between the sentences themselves . But all posts I make about this topic from now on will go in Octo’s miscellaneous projects thread, instead.
Reposting this here.
Is anybody familiar with the voice filter that they applied to JEJ’s voice for Return of the Jedi? The voice line sounds just like him but without the filter. I actually encountered this same issue with my C-3PO voice clone, where I had to apply the Threepio voice delay effect (I learned how to do this online) in order to get him to sound like a robot and how he usually does. Alternatively, like I said, we could just replace “Obi-Wan” with “Your mother” and splice the new line with the original dialogue in a manner similar to Hal’s work in Ascendant with Kylo Ren. Although I’m sure that approach could be improved even further with the aforementioned voice modulation effect.
One other thing I have a question about is related to Hal’s custom special edition of ROTJ. What did he end up using for Boba’s grunts and “What the…?” line. I’m assuming it was Tem, so that’s why I ask. I’d love to see a test of this because I seem to recall something like this existing at some point.
Thanks for testing that, Ady. I’ve added a different take which I think sounds better. I’ve tried putting the unmodified line in a rough test, and I definitely see what you mean, it’s missing that robotic quality despite it sounding like JEJ:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1zlE34aGJd-yL0S_f52YbJwPko4fPAUQb?usp=drive_link
As you’ve made clear enough, you don’t feel it necessary to change this. The only reason I’m posting about it again is because I’m sure this will go in an alternative audio track project made by Octorox (or somebody else) at some point. What will likely end up happening is just replacing “Obi-Wan” with “Your mother” in the audio track to minimize any noticeable loss of that robotic quality between the sentences themselves . But all posts I make about this topic from now on will go in Octo’s miscellaneous projects thread, instead.
The problem is that none of those sentences feel immediately intuitive with each other. It feels like a bunch of random thoughts stitched together haphazardly, unless you understand Padme also lost everything and still chose love despite it all. But that might not come to a casual viewer immediately, much less Rey.
It also doesn’t account for Leia’s look of grief/sadness.
I didn’t know you still had access to that Zorri line. Yeah, I tried it myself but wasn’t fully satisfied with it due to the voice modulation being gone.
I can try to regenerate all of the Kylo stuff again at some point for further tests, along with the dagger thingy. Something like “That dagger showed me what happened to them.”
You bring up a solid point about the Leia flashback. I think a part of the reason I had originally brought hatred/anger into all of it was to account for that look she gives him. Positive connotations like Leia having close attachments with a lot of people doesn’t necessarily match her expression. And I do agree that if we were to solely do AI voices over the flashback that it would blend in nicely. Granted, the tail end of Luke delivering the monologue is over a shot of Rey looking at Leia’s lightsaber, so it would still have an AI voice in “the room”. So perhaps it isn’t something worth worrying about until we know for sure how this would sound.
I’m wary of reverting to prophecy to handwave away the reason why Leia feels it necessary to give up being a Jedi. That would mean both Luke and Leia gave up on important stuff because of worrying about the future. I guess that matches with their father screwing up because of worrying about the future, but it still kinda sucks for the Skywalker fam. I think it’s more simple to point out that Leia is in clear violation of a core Jedi tenant being practically married and having a child. As for why they even started training? Perhaps she didn’t realize she was pregnant until they were already a long ways into it.
I think the attachment statement works best being a part of the sentence concerning Leia choosing diplomacy. Diplomacy is all about getting to know everyone around you on a deeper level. Also, after “But” you should ideally be giving a reason for why Leia isn’t suitable for being a Jedi, rather than simply admitting it was personal preference (which feels more like a cop-out). Who knows, perhaps Luke was partially in favor of Leia stopping the Jedi path because of being with Han and having a son? As we see in Book of Boba, he wants Grogu to completely forgo Mando and his past. But I think we can all agree this isn’t the right way to do things as a Jedi at the end of the day. This edit would give the example of Leia to prove that.
So the lesson in the sequels is finally what it should have been all along: defining yourself by your attachments (Rey Skywalker) is a really good thing, even as a Jedi, but you have to have the strength to let go when the time comes. And to not fall into hatred or anger when they are taken from you (Anakin and the Tuskens). It was actually George’s intention to convey this lesson through Star Wars, I believe. Hopefully Rey’s new Jedi Order differs from Luke’s in this way for her upcoming film. It kinda sucks that in the EU this was precisely the lesson Luke incorporates into his own new Jedi Order, but this is the path Lucasfilm has chosen, so it’s best to just embrace it at this point.
Yes, the DOTF dialogue is as follows:
Luke: “This is why the Jedi live in isolation. The pain of loss only leads to the dark side.”
Leia: “I’ve lost everything, and everyone. But I’d still choose to love.”
As for the whole Leia knowing thing, we can certainly keep giving that more thought. I believe the last line we left off with was:
“Because you’re a Palpatine. Leia sensed his power in you.”
But, yeah, this doesn’t effectively convey that it was something that happened between episodes 8 and 9. Off the top of my head, the next best thing would be “Leia sensed his power as she trained you.”
I think I’ve figured it out. We need to make Leia the antithesis of her father. Bound by attachments, but strong enough to not let them bring her to darkness.
“She was quick to learn in our training. But Leia was defined by her attachments, choosing to lead the galaxy through diplomacy, as our mother once did. Throughout her life, Leia lost everything, and everyone, but, in the end, she still chose love. A thousand generations live in you now. Leia’s legacy will guide you on Exegol.”
I’ve come to accept the fact that Padme has to be a fan-service reference, because it’s almost impossible to weave her into the sentence in any other way. That being said, I suppose it isn’t entirely fan-service, as it clarifies the type of diplomacy she favors (political). As for the connective tissue between the two phrases, it’s now a juxtaposition. Stating that Leia is defined by her attachments, and then subsequently stating that she lost all of them, yet she still chose to love, is powerful stuff. It brings the saga full-circle, where Anakin’s daughter is able to succeed in overcoming loss, and his grandson is able to save the one he loves from certain death in the first place.
Eh, unless I was to rent out a theater or watch on some really high quality headphones, I don’t really care much about it being lossless or not. I’m not an audiophile in that way.
Regardless, I know Octorox has already completed an alternative audio track for ESB Revisited in the past for prequel continuity (Boba voice and Yoda being only “a” master that trained Obi-Wan). This is something we can also pursue for this project.
I didn’t know about that. Is the audio lossless? That’s my biggest concern for the eventual Revisited Blu-Rays.
I dunno, you’ll have to ask Octorox.
Regardless, I know Octorox has already completed an alternative audio track for ESB Revisited in the past for prequel continuity (Boba voice and Yoda being only “a” master that trained Obi-Wan). This is something we can also pursue for this project.
Ady’s test here for ROTJ is awesome visually, and will only be more awesome once Boba actually sounds like Tem. Whether we have to make a fan-made alternative audio track or not, we’ll still get there, eventually.
Oh, that makes exponentially more sense. Thanks for clearing that up.
I believe somebody said he could bring on Ryan Golden. Honestly, I’d prefer he does it. But if it’s any other impressionist than him, then AI is definitely the way to go.
I don’t think Kylo/Ben is particularly afraid of who he is though, is what I’m saying. Unsure of it? Certainly. But these are two very different concepts. And it’s clearly the same recording of her saying it to Rey, which is kinda immersion breaking in this impactful moment. That phrase is integral to Rey’s arc, while Kylo’s is moreso about understanding that he is under no obligation to choose the dark side. And that there’s ultimately more power in the light.
The only thing Kylo is ever afraid of is that he isn’t as as strong as Darth Vader. But that’s largely dropped by TLJ and would only be relevant in this movie if you were to insert the Vader/Kylo duel vision I’ve been working on in my thread.
I don’t think it works because everything has already been said at that point which is important. It also doesn’t feel thematically relevant for the moment. The focus is supposed to be on how life is being drained from Leia to him.
I have a TROS Leia voice clone that sounds really good. It’s based only on her archived lines from the movie. What did you base yours on?
Do you have a test clip? Sounds awesome.
It’s not like Rey going to Ahch-To doesn’t make sense in the original, but you could make the argument that nearly killing Kylo Ren isn’t really on the top of the list for reasons why she thinks she’s doomed for the dark side. Even despite the fact that Leia was trying to save him at the same moment. She does the same in TFA without any remorse.
Nearly killing somebody she’s actually friends with for a second time, though? Talk about compelling. Doing what she did to Kylo can still serve as the straw that broke the camel’s back, but it really shouldn’t be THE defining reason she gives up on everything.
EDIT: Also, are you planning on changing Rey’s off-screen dialogue on Ahch-To from “I saw myself on the dark throne. I won’t let it happen” to something like “I killed Leia. I won’t let myself take the throne, next. I’m doing what you did.”
Heck, I’m willing to help you fine tune the whole Leia heals Ben thing because I think your ideas around the Death Star duel have a lot of potential. I’d just slot all that stuff into Ascendant myself if Hal doesn’t want it officially. I’d recommend generating different lines than what you currently have for Leia, though.
I’d start off by removing “Never be afraid of who you are. Ben.” because it kinda ruins the moment. As for the rest of the lines, I’ll need to think more about what to experiment with.
What about the short spurt of Force lightning on Finn?
I had no idea the work for Rey’s lightsaber sputtering out and her tickling Finn with some lightning was completed. While I disagree with the majority of the changes in this edit, those changes do sound pretty cool for Ascendant.
Granted, I believe Hal previously said that her blasting Finn was too much or something. Honestly, I think both of these things are what is missing in Ascendant to make that scene impactful beyond mindless lightsaber clashing. The lighstaber giving out signals Rey’s own feelings of unworthiness to contribute to the Skywalker legacy, and her blasting Finn is yet another reason to abandon everyone without a second word. If these two things are indeed completed, I’d love to see them.
Okay, so I (partly) take back what I said. It looks like SORA can also accept video input and apply what is essentially just CGI over top of things based on your text inputs. Granted, you still couldn’t insert things like TIE fighters, but I could see this being extremely useful for other things like changing the environment in shots. I bet it could also remove things from a certain shot, too. This would all be extremely useful, obviously.
I think it’s important to state anger/hatred instead of a vague sort of darkness. Because that is the natural reaction to losing everything in your life you’ve worked so hard for. It takes somebody incredibly special (and I mean that in the nicest way possible) to train the descendant of the man who has taken everything in your life away from you. And beyond that, to actually love her as a daughter and want her to succeed.
A shorter version is indeed required, but yours is missing the link between the two phrases, which is Padme’s loving path and Leia also choosing love despite her circumstances. In other words, we have the “non-sequitur” stuff going on again. But I see what you’re getting at. We need some way to make it clear that she chooses to become a politician and then general instead of a Jedi. Which is why I specifically stated “lead the galaxy” because Jedi aren’t supposed to necessarily be leaders, they’re protectors. Maybe I just need to go back to “choosing instead to lead the galaxy…”?
I also think we still need “through the darkness” because we need to justify why the next thing Rey would say would be concerning getting to Exegol. By removing that part like you’ve done, we generalize things too much and make her response kinda come out of nowhere.
EDIT: This is where I’m at atm - “She was quick to learn in our training. But Leia feared the hatred that consumed our father, choosing diplomacy and love like our mother. Throughout her life, Leia lost everything, and everyone, but, in the end, she still chose love. A thousand generations live in you now. Leia’s legacy will guide you through the darkness.”
I like a few things there, and there are some other things I’d keep the way they are.
“But Leia feared the hatred that turned our father” - I don’t think it was hatred that turned Anakin, hatred only came about once he had already turned. We can still use this wording, but it would have to use “anger” instead of “hatred”. Think back to Yoda in TPM - “Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.”
I’m always going to disagree with wording Padme’s part as an afterthought, it needs to follow similar syntax to the mention of their father. You have to ask yourself: “Does this sentence make sense still if we exclude this reference?” If it does, then it’s fan-service, and not actually integral to the plot.
“Throughout her life” is necessary instead of what you have so that we can include Alderaan’s destruction and not just what she looses after declining the Jedi path. I prefer “still” over “always” only because it’s meant to emphasize that she was able to hold onto her ideals despite her circumstances.
I’d nix the “Rey” part, but the rest of that sentence is worded well. So, putting everything together:
“She was quick to learn in our training. But Leia feared the anger that turned our father, deciding to lead the galaxy with our mother’s compassion. Throughout her life, Leia lost everything, and everyone, but she still chose love. A thousand generations live in you now. Let Leia’s legacy be your guide through the darkness.”
One thing we could potentially do is simply replace “We’ll always be with you” and/or “But this is your fight” with some wording that could help clarify the intent of the original syntax.
“She was quick to learn in our training. But Leia feared giving in to hatred like our father, choosing instead to follow our mother’s path. Throughout her life, Leia lost everything. And everyone. But in the end, she still chose love. A thousand generations live in you now. Let her legacy guide you as you face the darkness.”
EDIT: A slight adjustment could nonetheless remedy the disconnect between the two ideas - “choosing instead to serve the galaxy with our mother’s compassion.”
If you understand that her mother’s path is to love and serve others despite everything, then the two sentences don’t have that “non-sequitur” quality. Padme fought for the Republic and Anakin despite losing both to the dark side. I know DZ said that Leia didn’t technically lose everybody, but I think that’s arguing semantics, especially because I hadn’t even considered how she lost her entire adopted family and home world. I was only considering what she lost in the sequels themselves. She lost her son to the dark side. She lost her brother first to the unknown for like 10 years, and then death. She lost her husband to that same son. She lost the New Republic she helped build. She lost nearly all of the Resistance she helped build. At some point you just have to accept the fact that Luke really isn’t exaggerating all that much when he says these things.
What Rey has to deal with in terms of loss is a cakewalk in comparison. Palpatine denied her a pair of loving parents. That’s about it. Thus why Luke telling her this story is meant to wake her up to the fact that she can overcome her hatred with love quite easily as a Jedi. All of this is wrapped up nicely in a conversation already in the film:
“All you want is for me to hate. But I won’t. Not even you.”
“Weak. Like your parents.”
“My parents were strong. They saved me from you.”
Her parents stood for the same type of love that Leia did. They all laid down their lives so that their children could live a better life.
The space horses they ride look a lot different than the real-world ponies they use in those Ewok movies though. I’m not sure how it could really be used.