Bingowings

thunderclap said:

Bingowings said:

Thanks for letting me know about the Slumberland edits, (they had somehow fallen off my Radar).

I've started to download them now and I'll give them a good look.

Are they up anywhere in a smaller format (AVI for example) my connection is awful here and it would take forever to get the disc image versions?

I don't know of smaller AVI version.  Sorry.

I finally seen all of them and they are good edits, a few jump cuts and imperfections but many great decisions (some of which I've seen elsewhere).

However they aren't very radical edits, not many plot points are changed so they don't really fall into the subject of this thread which is a search for ideas to really shake up the prequels, rather than sanding down the rough and unsightly edges of the trilogy as it currently exists.

Mackerni said:

That is EXACTLY what I wanted to do ... and I LOVE your ideas...

Could you emerge Yavin IV with Endor? After all, they are both forest planets

You could swap Endor with Alderaan and Yavin with Endor.

It would mean removing the Falcon but here goes.

Dooku and the seperatists were the beginning of the rebel alliance.

They give the founders of the Alliance the plans.

The rebels try to defend Alderaan against the uncomplete Death Star but fall into a trap and get caught between it and the Imperial fleet.

They take massive losses and Alderaan is destroyed.

They retreat to their rebel base to plan a second attack.

Studying the plans they find a weakness in the station.

The Imperials track them to their base in the polar regions of Endoth.

They launch a ground assault apparantly driving them off the planet but this is a ruse to lure the completed station into the system to pick off their fleet.

The Rebels leave a small group of fighters which attacks the station's weak spot ( a large vent which leads the main generator ).

Luke doesn't blow up a Death Star (he's too busy confronting the Emperor and his father).

But he does take part in the defence of Endoth and goes off to face Vader.

 said:

Originally posted by Bingowings:

"It might be easier to put [flying R2] into Jedi than to take it out of the prequel trilogy."

Man, I keep debating with myself over whether or not I like flying R2.  Is it so unreasonable to suspect that, between the PT and OT, the jet system was "removed for the adventurous little droid's own good", or that he used it to navigate the bottom of the swamp on Dagobah?

I really like your suggestion too Bingowings.

EDIT: I made a post earlier about how the Kenobi/Grievous rivalry could have been fleshed out more.  It just occurred to me that rivalry could have been a more fleshed out element of the PT in general.  I mean,  we've got the Kenobi/Grievous rivalry, the Padme/Nute Gunray rivalry, and the Anakin/Dooku rivalry.  Granted, as is, they are not very deeply explored, but if they had been it would have added a lot more depth of character to both our heroes and villains.  The Anakin/Dooku rivalry would have been especially fitting considering Anakin, ironically, ends up replacing Dooku as Palpatine's apprentice.

Cheers Rhikter, I love your ideas too.

The only way I can think of padding out the Nute Gunray/Padme angle would be to go down the Magnoliafan route and re-dub all of his lines so he says more. There isn't enough in the current footage to build upon.

The Anakin/Dooku conflict is almost impossible to pad out visually. There is plenty of extra dialogue that might be used in other productions but very little footage which can be adapted to this aim.

I would like the Obi Wan/Dooku confrontration to be removed, Ewan is very wooden in that scene and the dialogue he delivers adds next to nothing to the plot. Christopher Lee turns out a nice performance in that scene and it would make more sense if Anakin was being tempted by him.

Dooku might sense the same potential in Anakin that Palpatine does and fully realise what would have to happen to himself if Skywalker were become Palpatine's apprentice.

After being rejected his next course of action would be to try to remove him.

Rhikter said:                                                                                                                                                                             I'd never opt for a CG 3PO though.  I think we can all agree that CG 3PO in AotC seemed very "lifeless."

Not to mention headless and gormless.

As for the R2 flying thing, the only instance in which R2 could have made good use of this function in the original trilogy would have been escaping from Jabba's Barge in ROTJ.

As I've said before, I don't mind Ady or anyone else tinkering with Jedi.

It might be easier to put that into Jedi than to take it out of the prequel trilogy.

Rhikter said:

Originally posted by Bingowings:

"Another idea that occurred to me was rather than removing Threepio from the prequels perhaps sticking him (the full Gold version) in all of them..."

Hell, it could be pulled off very convincingly if you outsourced it to someone with green-screen experience and got an actor in a decent looking 3PO costume.  Plus, since the actor in the suit would be able to make gestures appropriate to the lines, you would have a level of control over the direction of the character and his function in the story that you would not have if you were just redubbing existing 3PO footage with sampled Anthony Daniels dialogue.  Adywan has already proven his proficiency with changing backgrounds completely, so this could be very feasible.

There are lots of productions with Threepio in them that aren't Star Wars movies (The Making of Star Wars, The Muppet Show, the anti smoking adverts, etc) perhaps the footage could be taken from some of those, cleaned up, colour corrected and scaled to the footage it's being inserted into without using a fan in a suit.

It would be nice to put this material into a true Star Wars film.

adywan said:

Rhikter said:

Everyone need to go to www.woot.com right now!!!!

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I got that for Xmas last year. Not too bad really

 

Nice to see you on here Adywan.

I hope this thread is giving you some food for thought.

Another idea that occurred to me was rather than removing Threepio from the prequels perhaps sticking him (the full Gold version) in all of them, in the background as Amidala's personal protocol droid or a droid for general senate use (like a presidential Limousine).

He needn't talk much...maybe some dialogue could be used from elsewhere in prequel trilogy or from other Star Wars projects  should he have to speak.

But it makes much more sense for her to own a protocol droid than for Anakin to build one for his mother.

darth_scourge said:

well you might have heard that FanEdit.org has been destroyed by the Empire.

 

Gutted.

 

If I took an original Van Gogh, cut it up, rearranged it, painted in some new bits, and then showed it at a gallery, would I be shot down?

This is a terrible blow as that site (like this forum) went to great lengths to prevent piracy.

It casts a shadow over the fan-edit community and puts the future of this forum in doubt.

Kurgan said:

adywan said:

The spinning starfield is going to go, i'm afraid. It happens in ANH & ESB only. It was gone in ANH:R and i will be doing the same for the one time it appears for ESB:R

 

At the risk of wandering off topic, just this once.

Backstroke Of The West:R would make entertaining viewing. Just take a nice print of ROTS and get some voice actors (if they could keep a straight face) to re-dub the lines from the BOTW subtitles.

If only we could get the original actors in to do it.

TheoOdo said:

I'll never view the prequels as being related, at all with the original series because there's too many plot holes. There's, first of all, the "do you remember your mother", "yes", "but she dies in childbirth", "oh, well, i dunno lol" blunder.

Then of course there's the "he thought he should have stayed here and not gotten involved", "what? and remain a slave? gee, uncle owen sure is a dick!" blunder which is also connected to the "how can he make judgements about him leaving tatooine? he never knew him until he came back!" problem.

Then there's the "wait, nothing at all happened to my throat or lungs, why do I need a breathing mask again?" problem. Then there's the "I was trained by yoda...well, actually, i was trained by liam neeson but whatevs lol" and just the overall irreparable fail of the series. No central, identifiable sympathetic main cast and no nasty antagonist. I was ready to accept Darth Maul in that role but that didn't really work out, did it?

We will have to see what Adywan does with ROTJ:R about Leia remembering Pandabear.

I don't have a problem with him adjusting ROTJ (when it makes sense...No spooky Hayden Christensen ghosts please) as it's almost as gone wrong (in it's current form/s) as the prequels in my book.

You could make a case for Leia (being a senator...like her mother before her) during her time in the post seeing heaps of archive recordings of Padme...ergo the images and feelings bit.

As for staying behind...yep that was a big balls up on George's part and one well within his scope of addressing in AOTC.

Maybe there is somewhere a deleted scene where Owen suggests to the pre-Sith Anakin that he should stay on the farm from now on.

But why didn't Lucas have Anakin arrive before his mother's kidnap was obvious?

She could have been out picking mushrooms, the family could have had a chin wag about him leaving the Jedi (which he seems to want to do anyway so he can get married and look after his mother) and then the news comes in about the kidnap. It would have added to Anakin's self loathing if he was just moments too late to prevent her abduction and death.

Now that is a serving suggestion beyond any fan editors ability (unless you get a fan film crew to shoot the missing material with really good look-and-sound-alike actors).

The Yoda thing gets covered in the prequels, it's a bit hamfisted but I'm Ok with Yoda being Kindergarten Jedi and Qui-Gon being Obi-Wan's Graduation Year tutor.

These are all the prequels we are going to get and Jedi is a bit of a mess, that is what fan-edits and this thread are about, making the best of what we have.

C'est la vie.

Josh said:

If only it were so easy bewy.

Rhikter said:

Originally posted by Bingowings:

"...you could construct a moment of realisation during the Grevious/Obi Wan duel by dubbing a new line in, adding an eye close up and maybe a very brief flashback and Bingo!"

That's too much plot development to cram into RotS, plus it doesn't do justice to the relationship between the two characters.  If someone did try to do Maul-Grievous I'd like it to be something that unfolds over the course of the PT.  Something along the lines of: Maul and Kenobi meet in TPM, Grievous is then introduced in AotC hell-bent on getting revenge against Kenobi, and then the rivalry is finally ended in RotS.

You know how most television dramas have an "A" story and a "B" story.  The Grievous/Kenobi rivalry could be the "B" story of the PT while the Anakin Skywalker plot would be the "A" story.

Prompting the question of how would you do it?

It sounds great and I don't want to put you off but short of replacing Jengo with Maul Grievous during the Kamino fight which would be a massive undertaking where would he fit?

DarthBo said:

Guys, I'm fairly sure he was kidding.

Plus the Executor looks quite silly in grey.

I think it looks great but as it's been said tonnes of times now this is Adywan's project, he's doing the hard work so he makes the choices.

Sluggo said:

We had a rather lengthy discussion on the Maul/Grevious idea a few years ago.  A lot of folks made a good case for it, and a lot made a good case against it.  I think the concept was ultimately discarded as being impossible to pull off.

Take a look around the old discussions in SW Preservation and General SW Discussion and see if you can find them.

It needn't be that difficult, Adywan removed the red eye lens from every shot of Vader and changed the colour of Artoo's lights in ANH:R (not that I'm down playing how much effort went into that but is show's that it's possible).

Sticking Darth Maul eyes on Grevious would be only slightly more taxing, you could construct a moment of realisation during the Grevious/Obi Wan duel by dubbing a new line in, adding an eye close up and maybe a very brief flashback and Bingo!

Grevious used to be Maul and his sabre prowess and hatred of the Jedi suddenly make sense.

Maul-Grievous looks grand, in fact they all do.

It would be nice in ESB:R, ROTJ:R or Ady's prequel edits if we saw Stormtrooper/Clonetrooper armor actually deflecting the odd laser bolt or two.

I find it difficult to understand why the boys in white bothered to suit up watching all the Star Wars films.

Sure they look good but it seems that Palpatine was sold a dodgy batch.

In a related point it would be nice, either in ROTJ:R or the prequels to see the Royal Guard effectively guard the Emperor. (perhaps in a re-staged Vader choke scene) we all know they look cool but it would be fun to see why.

thunderclap said:

I know Adywan is planning on re-editing the prequels but I'm curious if anyone else here has watched the Slumberland edits?  A lot of what people are suggesting have been done in these cuts.  Adywan may in fact be able to go off these cuts instead of re-doing them completely as the Slumberland edits are quite good.

Thanks for letting me know about the Slumberland edits, (they had somehow fallen off my Radar).

I've started to download them now and I'll give them a good look.

Are they up anywhere in a smaller format (AVI for example) my connection is awful here and it would take forever to get the disc image versions?

TheoOdo said:

TMBTM said:

TheoOdo said:

Naboo is retitled "Alderaan"

In this case Adywan will need to cut the extra OT SE Naboo shoots in his ROTJ revisited.

I think it's a good idea, but it could cause many editing troubles for a result that, perhaps, don't really worth it.

 

Well, that's an '04 addition and after all Adywan's edit was originally started to fix the problems with the '04 edit.

I honestly don't think it'll be missed. I was certainly unhappy to see it there for the first time, but maybe that's just me.

The shot need not be entirely wasted. It could be stuck at the beginning of the celebration scenes in Episode 1 (minus the hideous Gungan cry).

If Tatooine and Geonosis were merged for an altered Episode 2 the Tatooine celebration could be used there to mark the removal of the Federation from that world.

As for the Yoda/Palpatine lightsabre thing, I don't have a problem with the idea (a Jedi uses the Force for defence and even master Jedi would use a lightsabre to defend himself and others). Palpatine would use anything to attack someone in his way, when stealth, scheming and manipulation fail why not use a sabre? His fighting style was interesting and unique too. The main purpose of the fight isn't to kill but to manipulate Anakin into making a final choice by placing himself under Windu's blade so it's inkeeping with the whole Sith way of doing things. It just looks a little clumsy the way that the idea is executed.

I wouldn't have Palpatine maimed into looking the way he does.

It would be difficult to achieve an edit to alter this but I'd have had him slowly transformed into the mess we see him in ROTJ because of advancing age and being consumed by his own evil, rather than getting a Force Lightning blow back.

It might be possible to stick his unaltered face over the top of the prune version in the key scenes of ROTS to get this across.

The naming of Vader scene is really out of place, Palpatine goes from a subtle Mephistophelean performance to a comedy bad guy in a few seconds. He doesn't even match the version we see in ROTJ.

While we are on the subject of things Sith, I'd have Anakin use force lightning on Padme ( I hear some hisses from the readers at this point).

At no point does Vader use this Sith skill in the OT but he chokes people left, right and centre (I've already voiced my hope that Adywan stops Luke from doing the choke move in ROTJ:R).

When I was a child I used to think Vader used this method of killing and torturing people because he himself can not breath unassisted and I still like this idea.

If the old Force choke constantly reminded him of killing his pregnant wife would he keep on doing it, thus rubbing his own nose in it?

If he had used Sith lightning on Padme it would explain the sudden delivery of her babies and even go some way to explaining her death in child birth.

It would also explain why Vader never does it again and underline the horror in Jedi of seeing Palpatine do the same move on Luke.

See it all makes sense now.

I hope?

Lord Riddler said:

Greetings.  I used to run a website called "Wattos Junkyard" back in the late 90's.

 

Anyway, I have been fasinated with the work that has gone into the "Re-Imagining" of these great films and I am a huge fan of the Episode IV version.

 

Seeing this thread, I would have really only one thing to wish for if I was in charge of re-editing "ROTJ".

 

Basically, a visual conflict be seen when Palpatine is killing Luke of Vader's images of his past.  Flashes of Padme, his mother, Qui-Gon etc...

 

It shows an inner conflict and I feel would add much tension to the scene.

 

Anyway, I look forward to conversing with you all.

Something like this, perhaps?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZGyFm6zZeU

will said:

Does ol' Palpy even need to be from Naboo/Alderaan?

 

 

In the EU he does (but who cares in this context) as a Senator he didn't just represent Naboo but a collection of systems in the area, the Republic is a big place but with all this doubling up of representation it hardly sounds that democratic to start with.

It almost makes you wonder what the Alliance were fighting for in the first place.

If Palpatine had a good strong wife with a strong interest in herbal remedies like the Emperor Augustus had ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37lXkrGMpMQ ) the galaxy wouldn't have to wait long to get rid of rotten Emperors.

Doesn't Augustus look like Boss Nass BTW ;-)

 PS. It goes, hopefully without saying, that if you liked that clip do go out and buy "I Claudius" it'll be one of the best spending decisions you'll ever make.

All this talk of TIE colour is making this thread sound like Savile Row.

Master Qui-Gon said:

Yeah but how would you handle that Amidala and Bail are senators of the same planet?

 

Amidala could be head of state (like a constitutional President or Monarch, she is a Queen) Bail (a Viceroy) could be the local Senator and elected political leader once Palpatine has been promoted to Chancellor.

Living here in the UK HM Liz Windsor is the constitutional head of state but her Prime Minister Rt Hon Gordon Brown (texture like sun) is the elected political leader of the country and leads the country in the UK Parliament and during treaty negotiations.

The Queen still has certain powers (she can in theory desolve Parliament and war can't be declared without her approval, something Margaret Thatcher discovered to her embarrassment during the Falklands War) but it's the PM that heads up the day to day running of the shambles.

A similar set up exists in Eire which has a constitutional Presidency.

So you could have Queen Amidala and Viceroy Bail Organa both representing different arms of the running of Alderaan.

In a revised prequel trilogy she could remain Queen all the way through and just edit the references to her being a senator.

Do any of the scenes with the other Queens of Naboo add much to the story?

The other Queens could be further decoys if the scenes are needed.

Would the Emperor allow the destruction of his (supposed) planet of origin?

I can't think of a better way of setting an example to the rest of the Galaxy, tyranny begins at home.

Sure, Tarkin came up with the plan but I could see Palpatine giving the scheme his blessing.

Palpatine doesn't need public approval at that point, he wants to control the galaxy through fear.

Showing that even his own people weren't safe from his destructive whims would polarise opinion, the Rebels would be more rebellious but the floating systems would be less likely to join in the fight.

Bail Organa was going to be in TPM and Adrian Dunbar filmed some scenes in the role :

but Lucas either didn't like them or him and his image was retconned into being Bail Antilies in the EU.

If Naboo was to be reduxed into being Alderaan it wouldn't be too difficult to alter Pananka's line refering to Bail one way or the other, Dunbar never appears in any of the final shots anyway.

Dunbar is a good actor I'd like to see the footage, maybe he was another TPM cast member who didn't take to George or visa versa, Ralph Brown described Lucas as "a man lacking in human decency", Terence Stamp was not impressed when he was asked to act to a mop because Lucas had given Nat Portman the day off  (George didn't think her presence was necessary) and Hugh Quarshie was "made an offer he could refuse" to be in AOTC.

rortiz77 said:

Bingowings said:

rortiz77 said:

I made a video time ago trying to sync the opening scenes from TESB with the John Williams music cue "The ice planet Hoth" (that's supposed to be heard there). I changed some shots order, added two new shots and extended one shot in order to make the music fit. Maybe it can give some ideas, maybe not.

In case you are interested:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fhie3MEXvzY

BTW, Ady, in case you are interested I will translate the subtitles for TESB Revisited to spanish (as I did for ANH).

There's a few jump cuts in there but on the whole it works a treat, a great piece of work.

The music might be even more in sync if the surplus to requirements shot of Han's Tauntaun was removed.

We can hear him on Luke's comlink, we see him ride the thing into the base, do we really have to see the model (and it's not a very good shot) stomping around far, far away?

 

 

Thanks, I'm glad you liked it. I agree, the "Han on Tauntaun from a distance" shot seems totally out of place, it has always bugged me. Maybe the music sync would be better without it, I'm not sure. I did this video quite long ago even though I published it on Youtube three months ago.

And the jump cuts are due to my limited knowledge on video/audio editing.

It might be worth giving it another go and even attempting to eliminate the double impact to see what it's like too.

I'm no expert on video/audio editing either (I'd love to be able to seperate music tracks from the rest of the sound mix for example, some films are wrecked by too much, too loud or inappropriate music) but little mini projects like yours A) help you gain new skills and you already have a degree of flair in that department B) serve as illustrations to other editors like Adywan about what might work in their projects.

It was nice to hear the music cues in the place that Williams intended them to be.

TheoOdo said:

Naboo is retitled "Alderaan", giving the planet some sense of relevance next to the original series. You could argue that Naboo doesn't look like Alderaan, but you have to realise that this fan edit would constitute and alternate canon. The more high-tech cities of Alderaan undoubtedly exist, but away from the magnificent and historical palace of it's royalty featured here.

* Also, some creative voice editing can be used to make reference appear to Alderaan actually in the film. For example Panaka mentions later that a senator from Alderaan is being considered for the position of chancellor. Use this sound bite earlier in the film and Panaka could in fact say "Alderaan has no army!" as opposed to "We have no army!". I think this works even better, because we know this to be true from the original series as well.

I love this idea a lot.

Giving Alderaan large chunks of screen time makes us care a lot more about the place when it's destroyed in ANH and from space the two places look very similar.

It also explains the lack of mention of Naboo and it's people in the OT.

Making this one change binds the saga closer together.

Oh for Zod's sake!

It's Ady's fan edit, he can put pink TIE fighters in with yellow spots on if he wants.

He has made his justification for going with grey and that is surely enough for a fan edit.

If other people want to have ESB:R with blue TIE fighters they can (giving credit where it is due) put them back in themselves.

Some of the people posting on here seem to act as if this the Adywan Pizza Palace where you can insist on the toppings you demand.

These threads are for making suggestions, not barking orders at the poor chap.

We aren't paying him for these fan edits so there isn't any space for foot stomping.

PS. Remember the spinach, olives and extra Jalapenos on mine or else!

rortiz77 said:

I made a video time ago trying to sync the opening scenes from TESB with the John Williams music cue "The ice planet Hoth" (that's supposed to be heard there). I changed some shots order, added two new shots and extended one shot in order to make the music fit. Maybe it can give some ideas, maybe not.

In case you are interested:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fhie3MEXvzY

BTW, Ady, in case you are interested I will translate the subtitles for TESB Revisited to spanish (as I did for ANH).

There's a few jump cuts in there but on the whole it works a treat, a great piece of work.

The music might be even more in sync if the surplus to requirements shot of Han's Tauntaun was removed.

We can hear him on Luke's comlink, we see him ride the thing into the base, do we really have to see the model (and it's not a very good shot) stomping around far, far away?