Please forgive the squishing as I haven't got the original artwork so I can't trim it to size accurately but I was thinking something along the lines of this one to match the basic look of your brilliant ANH cover:
Darth Lars said:I can't believe that there are people who still defend the Jabba scene in ANH-SE:
ChainsawAsh said:
I don't think putting Jabba in is necessary at all.
1) His scene becomes redundant with the lines of dialogue moved from there to Greedo's scene
2) Jabba comes across as a pushover who isn't dangerous in the slightest
3) The tail ... oh Christ the tail ...
4. This scene becomes the first time that we see the Millenium Falcon. That fact completely ruins the scene when Luke sees the Falcon for the first time and gets to exclaim "What a piece of Junk!".
5. There is a (two?) guy here that looks like and is dressed exactly like Greedo. What's up?
6. Why would Jabba contradict what Greedo says and let him off the hook? That removes the motivation why Han is so ruthlessly chased by Boba Fett later on.
7. Showing Jabba destroys the mystery around his character.
To be honest for what you describe as the reveal shot to be blown, the Falcon should look amazing and Luke should instantly burst our awe bubble with that line. The Falcon however does look like a piece of junk (but it goes like greased lightning) and it is shot in a rather unremarkable way so that scene just sets up a slightly running gag. So I don't think the Jabba scene spoils anything in that regard.
Greedo's lot looking the same isn't a major problem either, most hippos look the same to our eyes but hippos can tell each other apart (someone could alter some of the costume details but they may just be wearing a standard jump suit, how many people have you seen wearing blue jeans and a white tee-shirt on the same day?).
Greedo was clearly trying to make a big name for himself and pocket a bit of money on the side, if Solo was in genuine peril there and then he wouldn't be hanging about so casually. He sincerely thinks if he can get a quick job he can pay off his debts and Jabba will leave him alone and in the scene he tells Jabba that he has a new job and Jabba ups the price but delivers a warning that if he doesn't get the money back there will be consequences. So it doesn't bother me that he let's Solo try to get more money either Jabba is a buisness man and Greedo wasn't as good for buisness as Han was but if Solo disrespects him any more he will have to be made an example of.
And there is no real mystery to Jabba, he's a gangster, an alien gangster but a gangster none the less if Han owed the money to a tax collector (even an Alien tax inspector) would there be any more of a mystery?
The real problems in the scene are the execution, the dialogue adds nothing new (something that could be altered with different subtitles), the model still doesn't look right (it looks more like Jabba now but the colour and lighting is way off and the texture is all wrong) and Han stepping on the tail is way off.
Bumping off Greedo is something Jabba could forgive if he made some extra money out of it but would Vito Corleone (or any of his family) put up with an underling kicking him up the arse and cracking a joke about it infront of his friends?
I don't think so.
To make this scene work would require a lot of effort for very little pay off (it might be doable and I'd welcome attempts to try).
It could be done like the opening scene of The Godfather showing Jabba in the shadows and not all at once (which would require reframing it but would get around the tail problem) or by showing Jabba as a hologram (so Solo could walk right through the tail).
It's in Artoo's character to rush out and try to rescue, the humans just as it's in Threepio's character to warn him not to do so and get dragged into trouble despite himself so I was happy with that part of the droids role in the sequence and the jets make sense for an astrodroid to have (a lot of his work would be on the outside of ships doing repairs, the only time where it would make sense for him to use them in the OT would have been escaping off Jabba's barge and I've suggested that as a change for ROTJ.)
The bit that doesn't work is what happens to Threepio.
Not only is the idea utterly stupid and the joke not even remotely funny but the effects are so bad it looks like a fan made spoof scene (Robot Chicken only not very funny).
George never figured out what to do with Threepio in the prequels, which is a shame because the idea of having them as the Greek Chorus of the saga (having this huge Galactic saga underpinned by a couple of robotic slaves) is a great one.
It might have been fun to have still have him fall off the little bridge thing but into the bowels of the factory line and shut down the external defenses around the Seperatist conference allowing for Mace and the Other Jedi to land undetected (Obi-Wan and Padme land but they are detected straight away).
RoccondilRinon said:It was a very silly movie, but fun. You just can't take it remotely seriously, but hey, you're not meant to.
The sillyness detracted from any fun (as did the lack of internal logic) it wasn't a comedy like Mars Attacks!, Ghostbusters or Men In Black (all much better films) it wasn't so bad it was good like Plan Nine From Outer Space, it was a jingoistic gung-ho bit of pseudo-patrotic sentiment pretending to be escapist science fiction.
In short it was Mars Attacks! without the jokes or Starship Troopers without the internal logic and satire (now that too is a much better film even if it isn't as good as the book).
ANH and ESB painted a very big galaxy, ruled by a huge Empire (with it's own internal bickering) backed up by a huge starfleet of thousands of ships (and presumably billions of troops) with a criminal underclass and a growing and viable Rebellion.
Going by the end of ROTJ everything shrank down to two old men about twenty capital ships and less than a hundred troops that could be taken down by teddy bears armed with stone age weapons of an afternoon (sure there is a huge body of EU material which continues the fight off the screen but from what we see on screen everything is tied up in nice little dissapointing bow).
That and the toilet humour, slapstick and references to Tarzan put ROTJ into much the same footing as where Independence Day would later place it's big flapping flag and set the scene for what didn't work with the prequels.
Echo3 said:I LOL'd. sorry if its been posted.
Who can tire of this Intergalactic gem?
Jonno said:Right, here's version B as promised:
Came out pretty well actually - good thinking, Bingowings!
Looks smart but I was thinking of the slightly less blue varient without the giant Yoda (if you have it, sadly I do not) :
Ripplin said:Bingowings said:But Independence Day is a terrible film, it's Mars Attacks! without the jokes (not to mention the only film I actually shouted at and I got applause too).
What did you shout at it, if I may ask? ;) Sounds like you were doing live Rifftrax.
I've only seen around 3 or 4 minutes of Independence Day; one scene with Randy Quaid saying some tired catchphrases (the kind that make it seem like they're really trying to make it a catchphrase...which I hate) and one with a dog jumping away from some fire in a tunnel in slow motion or something. I immediately thought 'ehhh, this is not for me' and I've never actually watched it. I did see Mars Attacks! and that was a colossal waste of time. :p
Anyway, ESB wishlist... Hmm, well, I wish someone (especially Adywan in the ESB:R thread) would comment on that idea of having R2 fall straight into the hole after he fixes the hyperdrive, rather than that bounce/whatever thing he does.
Remember there was the long death scene with the first lady in the desert and then she turned up alive only to die again in the bunker?
Come the second death scene I had enough (not just of the wringing out of emotion with that scene but also with the film generally) so I shouted,"For God sake woman hurry up and die!", I love cinema and I love escapist science fiction and I would normally never shout out anything even in a bad film but this time I did and I must of caught the mood.
It sounded like the death of liberty.
Ripplin said:
Bingo, I keep seeing your mock-ups only because someone has included them in a quote, because you keep editing your old posts. :p
I'm just trying to save space and posting the mock up to illustrate a point I have already made.
SomethingStarWarsRelated said:Alright here we go, ben_danger :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKtom9v3kL4
See I told you the eye droid with a scanning laser idea had legs.
There are a few too many calls of "Padme!"(I half expected someone to call out "Doctor Scott!", "Janet!") and the OT music doesn't always capture the mood (it's sometimes heroic when it should be evoking dynamic tension).
But on the whole a successful stab.
But Independence Day is a terrible film, it's Mars Attacks! without the jokes (not to mention the only film I actually shouted at and I got applause too).
I recently got the game for the Gamecube and from what I've seen the cut scenes are among some of the best I've seen in a Star Wars game (the game seems to be rather fun too and it cost £2).
I'd like to see this when I've finished the game, naturally.
I think that part of the success (so far) of the Star Trek movie is down to media manipulation.
TPM was massively slated by the press and this coupled with a rather rose tinted view of ROTJ made that film seem a lot worse than it actually was.
The Matrix was that year's media favorite and the cinema going public (sheep) bought into that line too (it's a better film than TPM but not that much better and the sequels were not that different and they were slated by the press and booed by the audience).
The Trek film is being almost universally applauded by the press, prompting people who hadn't visited the Star Trek universe to assume it was a massive difference.
Everything in the new film has been done before in other Star Trek productions, there isn't one unique concept in the film at all.
It's being marketed as "Not your dad's Star Trek", well it is, warts and all and it really should have been something so much better and daring.
I was using the models for reference not any encylopedia the sets have a window shape that is matched by one of the varient models, that sets the scale...unless the Star Destroyers in Jedi are a very different size, as does the relative size of the Tantive.
The shot through the windows seems right to me but either that's out or the other shot is out.
So scale doesn't matter....hmm :
MJPollard said:Maybe the point of the scene was to show something dramatic, rather than be 100% anally-retentive nit-picky correct about every little detail right down to the last goddamn fraction of a millimeter. *wink*
No that's what were here for ;-)
I found the new Trek movie to be exactly in the spirit and feel of almost all the Star Trek movies, it's essentially a remake of Nemesis (which was in itself a rehash of Wrath Of Khan).
It was no better and no worse (the media seems to be behind it so the cinema viewing public is too).
It carried over all that was going wrong before with Star Trek as well as a large amount of what was always enjoyable about it.
The special effects look better but that's to be expected after such a long gap, the story doesn't make much sense but it often doesn't with Star Trek movies or Star Trek in general.
There were some nice performances but there were some terrible ones too.
It's over-rated but not that bad.
It shares with the prequel films a feeling that the action sequences were based around the levels of a computer game.
Kirk and the Romulans jumping from one polished surface to another is no more emotionally engaging than Obi-Wan doing it in TPM.
It also had that unnatural, "Hello, I'm well loved character A, you must be well loved character B, nice to meet you for the very first time" feel to a lot of the conversations.
The new style Chekhov is the Jar-Jar of that film too (Silly voice mannerisms Chek! Annoying to the point of distraction Hov!) and Sulu is suddenly without any noticable charm or charisma.
And don't get me started on the pointless Scotty introduction to get Kirk back on the ship subplot.
It's not the bold new reworking everyone thinks it is, it's just an average Star Trek film full of the usual flaws just as TPM was an average Star Wars film with much of the same problems that Jedi had (only without the great OT cast to pull it along).
One of the shots is wrong going by the bridge size in the type three pod (but as I said this Destroyer has a type two pod therefore the scale maybe different, it might even be more out of scale as it's impossible to see where those windows might be in a that pod).
We know the Tantive is much bigger than the Falcon and fits into the main hanger at the bottom.
My instincts tell me that the shot of the Falcon parked on the side is the most off of the set and the Falcon should be smaller (which might make it necessary to bring the Avenger closer so we can clearly see the Falcon).
But it's Ady's call.
Going by the windows in the third pod down I'd say the Falcon is too big when clamped on the back but it's clearly charging a ship with a type two pod so who knows?:
rcb said:i think the gun towers should be on the mountain. maybe we should put some by the sheild bunker :)
The gun is to guard the dish so it makes sense it should be on the same range as the Dish (which like an observatory would need to be high up) putting on the same mountain could create problems.
Besides the dish itself is huge and certainly would have defenses of it's own.
I imagine not all mock-ups would be pertinent to the topic heading of this thread or the other threads Angel posts on as long as we get the relevant ones ;-)
Same goes with Axia and everyone else.
The colours are all screwed up by skydrive again I had to yank up the saturation and yank down the brightness to get it to look remotely like the image I was working on.
The big gun/guns would explain why none of the fighters in the space battle didn't drop down and try and take on the base from the air (seeing as they were getting their arses pretty much handed to them a few fighters wouldn't have made that much of a difference to the space battle if the ground base was as unarmed as it seemed to be in the theatrical cut).
It seemed odd to me that there was no air support during the ground battle.
The Tie Bombers didn't appear in the space battle at all and they seemed to me to be the ideal craft to bring into play above the treeline.
Think Apocalypse Now's helicopter runs but against Ewoks and Rebels (mockup quality as always is limited to source material and only there to illustrate a concept not to be a representation of a final scene).
Is there a piece of John Williams music that sounds like Ride of the Valkyries?
Tie Fighter Attack from ANH has a Wagnereque feel to it BTW.
It would possibly mean taking the blast of it out of the Death Star run (it really needs to go from the Sarlacc Pit fight, why the hell wasit there in the first place?).
I just thought of a ending to the Tie Bomber sequence too, when R2 lugs into the bunker he tells the big base gun to target the bombers and then gets's shot (so it's a down moment, followed by an up moment, followed by a down moment)
For those lucky enough to have the technology to do it a video mockup of this idea would be very welcome.
The problem with a pan down is that there isn't enough footage of the action from high up to merge with any images of this sort.
A pan up may be possible because a lot of the bunker footage is shot from the ground pointing slightly upwards which might be merged with a new model shot.
The image I made certainly couldn't be used because it's from very high up (to get the bombers in) and a scale very unsuitable for a shot of that kind.
I'd love to see the same concept but with the Gone With The Wind art (I can see why the original box went for white with that poster art) the "Star Wars Saga Continues" blurb is a bit intrusive too (it could be reduced a few tads and still work).
It would be nice to see some mockups of the exteriors of some of these giant Genosian structures.
It was odd how many open air areas they have which somehow vanish into the landscape.
Just thought I'd chirp in and say amazing trailer, I wish these versions would get a cinema release.
I'm much more hyped by those few minutes than any of the blockbusters offered this summer (even if we do have to wait until next year).
I'm really looking forward to this, the original idea was so good that it deserved a second chance (at least).
vaderios said:Octorox said:Well I mean it WAS supposed to be a sunset shot....there's no hint of that in Vaderios's version.
I quote this again because i reconsider that.
No Its not Sunset from that point of view! The sun is behind the building so from that POV we see the city and its darker.
I did in purpose to lower the horizon so the city is visible.
The sith should hide and not be in towers ;)
-Angel
This shot doesn't need the force field glow because the hanger isn't open to space, the colours are great though but I like the original teeth of the hanger door.
