Bingowings

ben_danger said:

what if (to be super extravigant) after the a wing hits the bridge, you see imperial officers being sucked out of the bridge into space, which then moves into an extablishing shot of the battle....(ok ive been watching too much star trek.:P)

Or Battlestar Galactica (when that show was on...sob....people were spaced almost every week) plenty of elements to be pulled, altered and placed in there.

GhostAlpha26 said:

Trailer looked good.

one thing, the scene with Han riding the tantaun with the new background looks cartoonish. He is covering too much ground it seems like.

He has a lot of ground to cover in a very short time (it takes the snowspeeders a while to find them in the morning) so presumably Tauntauns are swift beasties otherwise Luke would be dead and Boba Fett would be Lando's coffee table ;-)

If the shot looks fake at all it's not the new background but the original model that's the problem and there is only so much you can do with a stop motion element (it does look a lot smoother now).

I'm posting a link here to GoodMusician's edit thread, he's edit will not be a radical story shake up but he has done some amazing changes which might inspire people who post on this thread regularly.

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/My-Episode-III-Re-Edit/post/360965/#post360965

I posted this in response to a few of the sequences he has put up and I'm repeating it here as I was advocating more radical changes.

I would be even more bold with cutting away the the more silly aspects of Palpatine/Sidious.

As the puppeter Ian McDiamid can't be beat as the mad raving drooling loon he is far less interesting.

I wish Lucas had come up with a different explanation of why Palpatine looks the way he does in ROTJ (it would have made so much more sense if that was his true face which is eaten away by the power he wields than a nasty accident with a lightning blow back.

Perhaps a Mr Hyde morph would work better?

Mace too could be cut down even more to make him genuinely surprised that Anakin has done the right thing in reporting Palpatine to him and even show respect for him. Later do we need to see him crying out so much (it doesn't seem like pain either more like Sithish rage)? Just have Anakin disarm him and then have Palpatine shoot him out of the window. The more sudden and violent the betrayal the more shocking for Anakin the aftershock. He is suddenly in too deep to step back from the abyss.

The battle droids really need shutting up and toning down, I'd rather have a real Anakin looking down a lift shaft twice as long than an obviously CGI droid hitting another while sounding like cartoon character.

GoodMusician said:

a more radical cut? Oh you mean like completely restructuring the films? Yea... I've seen some... I guess I'm just the kind of guy who prefers something a little more...cinematic.

Most people would hope to maintain the cinematic sweep (or put it in depending on your point of view) even if they are making really dramatic changes.

As for your edited sequences, the music (as one would expect) fits so much better, most of your restructuring decisions are very successful.

I would be even more bold with cutting away the the more silly aspects of Palpatine/Sidious.

As the puppeter Ian McDiamid can't be beat as the mad raving drooling loon he is far less interesting.

I wish Lucas had come up with a different explanation of why Palpatine looks the way he does in ROTJ (it would have made so much more sense if that was his true face which is eaten away by the power he wields and the less weird one was a mask, than a nasty accident with a lightning blow back).

Perhaps a Mr Hyde morph would work better?

Mace too could be cut down even more to make him genuinely surprised that Anakin has done the right thing in reporting Palpatine to him and even show respect for him. Later do we need to see him crying out so much (it doesn't seem like pain either more like Sithish rage)? Just have Anakin disarm him and then have Palpatine shoot him out of the window. The more sudden and violent the betrayal the more shocking for Anakin the aftershock. He is suddenly in too deep to step back from the abyss.

The battle droids really need shutting up and toning down, I'd rather have a real Anakin looking down a lift shaft twice as long than an obviously CGI droid hitting another while sounding like cartoon character. I'm going to copy this over to the Radical Redux Thread too because much of your editing choices are really worth looking at even if you are looking to really shake the films up.

Don't forget the relationship between droid and non-droid in the Star Wars universe is one of slavery.

Threepio and Artoo are well liked (on the whole) by their owner/masters but they are not considered much more than property.

Unless someone writes a droid Spartacus storyline into Episodes VII through to IX they (and the Clonetroopers) are slaves and would never be given medals (even by the so called good guys).

Asteroid-Man said:

Speaking of Ian McDiarmid, does anyone else think he kind of looks like a pidgeon?

I think he looks spookily like Dennis Potter:

Forgive my ignorance of the track titles but is the piece of music playing during Zhora's Snaketease available?

We only get a quick blast of it in the film but I would like it for something else I'm working on.

While we are talking about Vader's chestplate, while it's great to see the lights that Ady added I'm not sure if the right colour tones were used and they may require correction (the same goes for Artoo's light the blue light seems to be too green and not blue enough).

I would like to see the AOTC display lights added to the garage and (if the area appears in the film, which I'm not sure about) it would be nice if the family graveyard was put in as a little reminder of Anakin's mum and presumably his stepfather.

Please post some of these observations on the After Ady thread as they may be useful for people building on what he has already accomplished.

I think that interpretation of the Clone Wars would have been very popular.

Those Rontos only look ok as extra background detail when they are out of focus or obscured by motion blur (the CGI wasn't even up to the state of the art of the day and has dated terribly).

I suppose they do add to the feeling that it's an alien world with alien creatures (just as the Banthas and Dewbacks do) but only when they look convincing.

Often the Tauntauns don't look convincing in ESB (which I know Ady is going to tinker with, or already has) and people accept that because of the limitations of the day, not because they aren't really there half the time.

I don't think the crime is having them there it's having them there looking out of place and I think Ady struck the right balance with them and the CGI Dewbacks.

At least we don't have the silly painted on Jawas swinging around  them and construction droids beating the crap out of Imperial probe things now.

rcb said:

hard to see the dark side is...

 

but, yea, i'd say not to make them so big. especially when the cast walks right by them without even taking a second glance at the big wood statue.

The giant lizard statue isn't that much different from the ruins of Yavin IV, the moon could have been occupied and isn't anymore or the natives might be harmless.

The giant Ewok idol is an in joke, the Rebels frequently wander into dangerous situations without checking out the lay of the land often after ignoring what a droid is telling them (the detention centre on the Death Star, the hyperdrive on the Falcon, the trapdoor to the Rancor pit, a few minutes before that mockup they assume there are only two biker scouts when there are more and after they trigger an obvious trap).

But I will see if there is a better place to hide the teddy bear (remember though that these are mock-ups of ideas not final shots).

doubleofive said:

ChainsawAsh said:

Ady didn't spend that much time on the Purist version, if I remember correctly - it was mostly done to appease fans who were unhappy with some changes to the full version (specifically music changes and such).  Apparently there was one other big reason that he's being all secretive about.  At any rate, because it wasn't "his" verison, so to speak, he didn't release a DVD-9 of it.  And since the original ANH:R files no longer exist, that's the best the "Purist" version will ever look (which is fine by me since I don't really care about it that much).

I have a theory, but I'm not sure if its right (which I guess is why it's a theory).

A Dancing Demon? Nah, something isn't right there....

Monroville said:

Regardless, what can be done with EMPIRE and JEDI I wonder? Now if someone created a thread so we could post ideas on what could be added or enhanced....

I heard a rumour someone already made something like that (I wonder where it could be?) ;-)

Just wanted to add my card to the pile:

Sevb32 said:

Bingowings said:

Sevb32 said:

Oh then you should know. I thought that shot looked better than ever.

It does as I indicated in my posting but those observations are still true even in Ady's greatly improved version.

The far wall still looks like an interior wall and not really like an exterior one and there isn't much (other than tinkering with it's reflective properties) that can be done about it.

It was designed to be inside and in the SE it was turned into an exterior wall, Lucas's first attempt had the silly low railing and the see through shadows (which Ady has skillfully fixed) but it also reflected the tint on the far wall which Ady's version doesn't do so much (sure the sky is different and much better) but perhaps a little tweak would turn an already better version into an even better one.

But there is only so much that can be done with the set as it originally was.

 

I say so what if it leads to an interior wall. Who's to say it can't be designed that way in Cloud City?

 

You still seem to misunderstand me.

The wall looks like it's inside a building, partly because it resembles more the interior architecture of the place more than the exterior (a throw back to the fact it was initially designed that way, which would be almost impossible to rectify) but to some extent because of the interaction between the outside environment (the light intensity and colour of the sky line, which is possible to rectify if Ady wants to).

A white semi glossy surface would reflect back more of the colour and light of the surrounding environment than an interior wall would because it is closer to the exterior elements.

Ady has already done a lot of work on that scene and he would be well within his rights to say enough is enough and I'm happy with that if that is the case.

As for the sets around the pit I have no problem with them, they look great and they belong to a different kind of area to the rest of the city.

If you were to go to a power plant near Florence I'm sure the interior architecture would be very different from civic buildings (even new ones).

It's an industrial area (much like the freezing chamber) so it's bound to look different (the curves of the vanes however do carry some of the design ethic of the upper levels down to the lower areas but that may be just as much functional as aesthetic).

rcb said:

Bingowings said:

rcb said:

that seems a little, i won't beat around the bush. i don't like it.

It would be helpful if you beat around the bush a little bit.

What don't you like about it, the idea, the execution (and if so what about the execution)?

 

i don't mean to offend u at all, it just seems off for endor. i understand wat ur saying with the ewoks and all, but i just can't see them making idle carvings.

 

You didn't offend me I assure you, I just sought clarification.

Most forest dwelling tribal societies have some form of artistic expression and they worship Threepio so they must have a spiritual sense and it is theistic to some degree because they think he is "some kind of god".

They decorate themselves with bones (they are prepared to eat their enemies and even the friends of their sort of deity) they seem to respect warriors (they were going to eat Luke, Han and Chewie who gave up without a fight but didn't eat Leia who shot a couple of Imperials). And they have an oral tradition so no writing which would suggest pictographic art might be a feature.

It just depends on what level of and style of expression you think this culture would employ.

Sevb32 said:

Oh then you should know. I thought that shot looked better than ever.

It does as I indicated in my posting but those observations are still true even in Ady's greatly improved version.

The far wall still looks like an interior wall and not really like an exterior one and there isn't much (other than tinkering with it's reflective properties) that can be done about it.

It was designed to be inside and in the SE it was turned into an exterior wall, Lucas's first attempt had the silly low railing and the see through shadows (which Ady has skillfully fixed) but it also reflected the tint on the far wall which Ady's version doesn't do so much (sure the sky is different and much better) but perhaps a little tweak would turn an already better version into an even better one.

But there is only so much that can be done with the set as it originally was.

Sevb32 said:

Again, wait until the trailer.

I've seen the trailer.

Ripplin said:

^If it helps, I like the idea and the execution! Great idea and it makes perfect sense. It's no stretch of the imagination to think that the Ewoks are very good with tools and such and would have some sort of cultural markers here and there. :) The 3PO-like idol was a nice one, too.

Thanks for that, personally I think the giant Ewok idol doesn't look so good but it might be an idea someone else could do better, having it flash by a few seconds before we first see them (not knowing how big Ewoks are and seeing a giant wooden carving all be it in the distance and out of focus might pay off for when we see how small they are and later learn how good they are at fighting).

"They are big and possibly threatening, oh they are small and cute, oh they are tough and resourceful (and eat people)."

That's the sort of twisting about with a first time viewer fun that could be had with adding stuff (but that mock up may not convey that idea as well as it could).

Just like the head on a stick mock up, the idea is to flesh these small furry people out so the audience reaction is more complex than "ain't they cute".

Tobar said:

Janskeet said:

I never liked this shot:

It's obvious that balcony used to be a closed wall because why would they leave an open entrance into cloud city from outside. Doesn't it rain on cloud city? PErhaps this could be changed to look more convincing.

 

I really wish you would at least try to look around a little before posting Janskeet. Right there in Ady's first post there's a side by side comparison of that shot.

I think Janskeet was saying that the altered scene (even in Ady's version) isn't as convincing as it could be because the wall on the other side of the balcony looks like an interior wall than an exterior wall (mostly because of the architecture which would be a real bugger to change).

Ady seems to be finished with what he is going to do with it but perhaps further colour alteration (it's a white polished wall so it might reflect the tinted light more) would add to the impression that this is an exterior shot rather than an interior one with a balcony painted on one wall).

Ady's floor and raised balcony does make the illusion more convincing than it was.

rcb said:

that seems a little, i won't beat around the bush. i don't like it.

It would be helpful if you beat around the bush a little bit.

What don't you like about it, the idea, the execution (and if so what about the execution)?

Adding a bit of ethnic woodcraft to Endor:

Keeping up the R2 noticing stuff that nobody else does motif, "Dinsdale!":

I like the way it makes out that Han is laying Leia's head onto a logo shaped pillow (that old scoundrel).

I can't remember, like so many people I have a folder marked Star Wars with bits that I've dug up over the years I'll PM you what I have got but I don't think they are high enough resolution for your needs.

Hopefully someone out there has something better.