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Worst Ideas in Star Wars/Good Ideas that went Horribly Wrong

FreezingTNT2 said:

theprequelsrule said:

Anakin’s fall to the darkside was terrible. The whole notion that he was tricked into believing that the Jedi were attempting a coup etc. Yuck, yuck, yuck.

How would you have handled Anakin’s fall to the dark side instead? What would you have done instead of having him believe the Jedi were evil?

I’m not sure to be honest, but give me a decade or so (the time between ROTJ and 1994 when Lucas started writing the PT) and I could come up with something that was at least OK.

Obi-wan failed to give Anakin proper instruction - as he told Luke. But we never see that in the PT. Obi-wan always tries to make Anakin a proper Jedi. Anakin is just shown to be an arrogant prick, and borderline mentally ill.

Here is an idea - the PT starts in the Clone Wars with the Republic losing and the Jedi order decimated and desperate for more Knights. Anakin is not suitable morally, but Obi-wan is convinced it is worth the risk due to his great skill in the force and as a warrior in general. He is convinced that he can reform his ethics, but fails to do so.

<em>The Mandalorian</em> - Season One - * <strong>SPOILER THREAD</strong> *

DominicCobb said:

Considering they seem to have been careful not to retell any stories from the EU (besides when it’s something mentioned in the films, like RO and Solo, where things are done completely differently from the EU), it’s hard to imagine them doing an adaptation of an EU story. But never say never I guess.

Give it time. Think about it; you have a very popular story arc and character - so you have a built in audience for it. You have many fans, including myself, who want to see our OT heroes in their prime again. There are many scenes from those books that I would love to see in live-action (Luke’s fight with the Noghri for instance).

As I said years ago in an earlier thread, a mini-series of a dozen episodes or so would better suit The Thrawn Trilogy then trying to compress it all into 3 films.


mykyta-R4 said:

Why not a film or series friend? Is it difficult to do beacuse of the book content - or chance of ‘messing it up’?

Messing it up.

Part of the charm is it’s 1950s (or earlier) sensibilities and dialogue. No way those things make it intact in any modern adaption. Can you imagine a modern adaption of Star Wars today in which Han calls Leia “sweetheart” or the scene between the two on the Falcon where they first kiss? No way those things make it into a movie today.

Worst Ideas in Star Wars/Good Ideas that went Horribly Wrong

regularjoe said:

A great idea - Christopher Lee as a rogue Jedi
Failed execution - see above

and while talking about bad (and badly executed) freakin’ ideas:
General Greivous.

I like the idea of a Sith who is a sophisticated gentleman on the outside but inside is evil to the core; Lee played Dooku always calm and in control on the surface and I wish Lee had been given more screen time.

Greivous was very well executed in that Clone Wars microseries, but yes his conception was a silly idea. One of the prequels problems was that Lucas kept introducing a new “main” villain every movie. What would have been wrong with Darth Maul as the main antagonist for the entire PT?

The Empire Strikes Back is the best Star Wars movie. Or is it?

TV’s Frink said:

I stand corrected.  I officially encourage everyone to protest the blatant racism in Star Wars by never watching it again.  We should all probably stop coming here as well, since this site apparently supports a racist movie.

It’s now 2019. I bet there are a lot more people out there who actually think TV’s Frink (too bad about the ban) is making a serious suggestion worthy of consideration.

Worst Ideas in Star Wars/Good Ideas that went Horribly Wrong

Tack said:

I feel like ESB did more harm than good for Vader. I came across an article in an old issue of Famous Monsters of Filmland (around 1978) and it had a really interesting point about the code of honor which Vader seems to exhibit in the original Star Wars, and it read quite a bit of character into him that is easy to imagine being a reason for the spike of popularity he achieved between 1977 and 1980. I’ll try and post it if I can find it again. It made some interesting points.

Anyway, in Empire Strikes Back I feel like the nuance of Vader’s characterization was almost entirely lost. The constant killing of his subordinates (to a degree it almost becomes a running gag), the comparatively angry delivery of his lines versus the more soft-spoken delivery of the original, and the fact that his dialogue becomes considerably more blunt. He has his moments of greatness, certainly, but I feel like from the outset of development they were too far gone into making him over-the-top evil rather than the comparatively mysterious and intimidating figure he was in the original film.

I’m actually curious, does anyone else think this?

An interesting opinion, and I think you are on to something. ESB Vader is not someone you can imagine having a conversation with but in SW, yeah if you were of sufficient rank, I can see it. In SW he is far more of a human being rather then this uber-powered Sorcerer/Dark Paladin type character. Of course the Jedi themselves were conceived very differently too.

On of the most interesting things about Vader in SW77 is the question of his position in the Imperial Hierarchy. Apparently Vader does not outrank a Grand Moff nor, in all likelihood, other senior military commanders and government officials. Admiral Motti is certainly not afraid to express his poor opinion of Vader’s abilities and religious sensibilities; and in a very disrespectful manner. Deleted scenes from ROTJ, as well as early drafts of both it and ESBs scripts, show that he is not the unquestioned successor to Palpatine. Interesting stuff!

Episode IX: The Rise Of Skywalker - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *

TavorX said:

regularjoe said:
All this talk of sidelining OT characters, do you think these people are going to live forever and keep reprising these roles?

If you want more and new Star Wars you’re going to have to make your peace with new characters, new story lines, new actors, new stories.

I was totally on board with Rey, for example. Very excited in fact. But just because I initially liked her character in TFA doesn’t automatically mean I’m happy with how they handled her and basically every character in this ST thus far. Who knows, maybe TROS will magically make me appreciate what they’ve been trying to do all along, but seems highly unlikely. It’s not so much having to make “peace” with the new stuff, I’m all for new stuff. It’s more so that in a lot of our eyes, they are squandering both old and new characters. Thus it all falls apart.

Ridley brought some nice spirit to Rey. She is pretty in an unconventional way too. Those scenes on Jaku showing her typical monotonous/pointless day were my favourite scenes of the TFA, and they show the potential in her as an actor and JJ as a Director…but it has all been squandered away I fear in the name of Girl Power and $$$$.

Worst Ideas in Star Wars/Good Ideas that went Horribly Wrong

Spottyfriend said:

Slavicuss said:

Qui-Gon Jinn wasn’t necessary. All that was needed was Obi-wan and Anakin. The prequels could have begun with them already Master and apprentice, building their bond right from the beginning of Ep. 1 - instead of pissing away the first chapter on a little boy and his mom.

Obi-Wan should have been older, and already a Jedi Master in Ep. 1, and Anakin, a teenager not a small boy.

Lucas traveled too far back into Anakin’s past for the prequels. We could have been spared all the childish crap that swamped Ep. 1.

Completed agreed. That’s why I am a fan of (much of) Clone Wars - it does what the Prequel Trilogy should have been all about: Anakin and Obi-Wan’s relationship. Also, this is why the Machete Order is the superior watching order - it skips Ep. 1 and is better for it!

Interestingly, early drafts of the TPM did not include Qui-Gon (according to various sources). Man Liam Neeson was awesome as Rob Roy though!

Ranking the Star Wars films

My combined Films/Video Games 2019 Rankings:


  1. Star Wars
  2. KOTOR 2 (game)
  3. TIE Fighter (game)
  4. X-Wing (game)
  5. Empire Strikes Back
  6. KOTOR 1 (game)
  7. Dark Forces 2: Jedi Knight (game)

Very Good

  1. Return of the Jedi
  2. X-wing Alliance (game)


  1. The Clone Wars (TV Series)
  2. Jedi Power Battles (game)

5. The Force Awakens - I want to say good, but in the end I have to punish it for being a soft reboot
6. Solo
7. ROTS - just barly made it up from “poor”
8. X-Wing Vs. TIE Fighter (game)


  1. Starfighter (game)

Bad…like really Bad

  1. TPM
  2. AOTC.
  3. Masters of Teras Kasi (game)
Zahn's Other SW Books (was: Survivor's Quest vs Outbound Flight)

OutboundFlight said:

Well I suppose due to my name I’m legally required to post my thoughts. I prefer Outbound Flight, it’s was one of my favorites in the old EU. Not my actual favorite which might be counterintuitive, but hey, the name “OutboundFlight” is much slicker than “HeirToTheEmpire”.

I’ve also found Thrawn one of SW’s most interesting characters, despite him never appearing in any movies (yet). There really aren’t many “smart” SW characters besides him. He’s the opposite of the Jedi - the Jedi have wisdom and the force, Thrawn has intelligence and battleplans. His death is perfect, dying at the hands of the one people he underestimated - largely due to their connection with a force user.

Thrawn is almost too good in the original Zahn trilogy…but yeah, I like the moral point - that deception eventually blows up in your face…he is too practical, overriding his original moral sensibilities. Thrawn kind of fell to the darkside himself in service to the Empire.

Vision of the Future was the perfect sendoff to Star Wars for me…leave the future adventures of Luke, Han, Mara, Lando, Leia, Wedge and all the rest up to our imaginations. The duology is my canon SSD (Sequel-Sequel-Duology). Of course, it was last book written before the PT ideas infected/defecated on SW.

His books after Vision of the Future were significant drop-offs in quality - I never even bothered to finish Allegiance.