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Implied starting date of the Empire from OT dialogue

Before ESB I think the following makes sense:

Clearly the Clone Wars happened in the distant past. Luke is astonished (in the Star Wars novelization) that Kenobi fought in them because “that was so long ago!”. Likely Lucas envisioned The Empire rising afterwards due the devastation of The Clone Wars and general corruption of The Senate that had set in. Like Hitler took advantage of The Great Depression.

It seems likely that Lucas envisioned the Jedi to have extended lifespans (similar to Numenoreans from LOTR).

Kenobi, Anakin and his wife are likely fleeing The Empire when Vader catches up to them - killing Anakin. Kenobi and the pregnant Mrs. Skywalker escape. Maybe they had been part of an earlier insurrection against The Empire before The Rebellion starts.

Obi-wan and Anakin are born OUTSIDE of Republic space on Tatooine - which is why he feels safe to take Luke there to live with his family (Owen Lars and Beru Skywalker - Beru is Anakin’s sister or cousin or…something).

After ESB:

Slight adjustment to canon. Obi-wan takes Luke to live with his brother Owen (ROTJ novelization) on the backwater planet Tatooine (still outside of Imperial territory).

It is possible that Anakin DID NOT START OUT AS THE MAIN JEDI HUNTER. He might have been recruited DURING the Jedi Purge. Maybe he gave into despair (fear) that The Jedi could never be saved and it was better to join The Empire “to restore order to the galaxy” rather than fight against it. So The Empire as an evil Empire could still exist for some time prior to Anakin becoming Vader.

Obi-wan REALLY should have changed his last name though! Unless Kenobi is equivalent to “Smith”.

More Pre-Prequel Info: from Dark Force Rising (June 1992): Jorus C’Baoth becomes “Personal Jedi Advisor” to Senator Palpatine in June of '79 “Pre-Empire Date”. Outbound Flight leaves Yaga Minor on April 1 '64 PED.

More from Dark Force Rising:

“Winter shrugged. ‘There are always exceptions to a race’s normal life span,’ she pointed out. ‘And a Jedi, in particular, might have techniques that would help extend that span.’”


Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic - General Discussion thread (KotOR, KotOR II)

fmalover said:

Darth Tremor said:

Kotor I is a classic. Sadly Kotor II I never could get past the first world.

The first world is a chore, no doubt about that. But the rest of the game is totally worth it. Be sure to install TSLRCM and give the game a second chance, you won’t regret it.

KOTOR 2 is maybe the best thing Star Wars has ever produced. Period. The game has so many themes and ideas, but never bogs you down with them - you still get to kick ass as a Jedi with a lightsaber. It is a cliché to say that something works on so many levels, but it is true for this game. Like the Thrawn Trilogy it is Star Wars for adults.

'Rey Skywalker' (Upcoming live action motion picture) - general discussion thread

I hope every trilogy they make keeps failing and they keep trotting out new trilogies to fix the prior one. Can’t wait for Episodes XXXI through XXXIII!

Now for my mini-rant.

IPs should have a beginning and and ending. Not just go on and on to suck money out of their cult-like followers. We don’t need more Bond, Indy, Star Wars, Aliens, Terminator, Batman, Stark Trek etcetera, etcetera, etc. Maybe Robocop deserves a proper send-off. Can we get Verhoeven and company back for one last kick at the can?

I don’t support Star Wars anymore. I won’t engage anymore. I’m not watching Andor no matter how good it may be. I won’t buy or watch a proper restoration of the OOT. I won’t play a proper sequel to KOTOR. I would not watch a faithful adaption of the Thrawn Trilogy.

I will ONLY engage with fan-made stuff that is free, such as the Dark Empire animated series and stuff like Project 4K77. Why? Because those are works of passion and love.

Heir to the Empire Trilogy. A General Discussion

Servii said:

I love how Zahn writes the OT characters. He fleshes them out so much and shows how they’ve grown and matured since the OT. Luke feels lost and unsure of himself, but is still a compassionate hero. Han is adjusting to life as a husband and future father. I love Leia’s whole mystery plot surrounding the Noghri. I love Mara Jade and Talon Karrde. I like the political intrigue with Fey’lya, though Fey’lya really pissed me off, which seemed to be the intent. I like Joruus C’baoth a lot and think the concept of an embittered “mad Jedi” makes for a great post-RotJ villain. I love Thrawn and Pellaeon’s whole dynamic and relationship, though Thrawn’s genius becomes a little unbelievable at times. I love how the space battles are written in a way that feels like they’re actual battles. And I love how problems in the story are solved through brains and creativity rather than just through brute force.

In terms of tone and plot, it feels like a natural continuation of the OT, though if they had been adapted into movies, they would’ve had to be trimmed down and streamlined a lot.

A really good trilogy. I’d like to reread it soon.

Never want these to be adapted into film or TV. A lot of the stuff that would be cut out is what makes these books so good. Agree that Thrawn is a little OP at times. Yeah, the new characters he introduces compliment the originals beautifully. Mara Jade becomes a Mary Sue later unfortunately.

Heir to the Empire Trilogy. A General Discussion

What do we like about what is widely regarded as the Unofficial Sequel Trilogy? What do we dislike?

I like them a lot. I think Zahn nailed the characters; I can hear the voices of the original actors.He created great villains in Thrawn and C’Baoth without just giving us another boring Darkside user.He did not try to write a screenplay - these are novels that were written as novels; not intended to be made into films. He Gave Wedge some serious “screentime”.

A minor gripe was that he created 12 Grand Admirals other than Thrawn - all military geniuses. But we of course never see them in the films. And he left their fates for others to figure out The EU never really was able explain what they were doing during The Battle of Endor to my satisfaction.

General Star Wars <strong>Random Thoughts</strong> Thread

Wow. I just realized that the opening sequence in TPM is even more stupid than I thought. Obi and Qui don’t even disguise the fact that they are Jedi!!! Yet the Neimodians (I am horrified by the thought that I might have spelt that correctly) need to be told by the droid!! They were expecting ambassadors of some sort.

What a mess. Was there a script re-write that just got jumbled up? Like, were Qui and Obi were supposed to be wearing different clothing and they forgot about that on shooting day?

<em><strong>ANDOR</strong></em> - Disney+ Series - A General Discussion Thread

A few quick, mostly negative, thoughts:

The trailer makes it look like another over the top melodramatic modern film, complete with stereotypical “epic” music.

Everyone uttering their lines with such seriousness and with “serious face” on.

Modern high contrast black, plus turquoise and orange colour palette. Doesn’t look like Star Wars.

The series looks like it is going to try and answer questions about the beginning of the rebellion that I would rather just leave to my imagination.

I do like the greyish/white Imperial uniforms. They are Imperial Intelligence/Security?

Would like a series that makes some of those who serve the Empire somewhat sympathetic. Like the PC from the old TIE Fighter videogame. You know, going into the Outer Rim and restoring order to systems ruled by gangs and torn by civil war since the Clone Wars.

It just seems like they keep going back to the same well. I really want new Star Wars, if we have to have it, to stop being in the same era as the Rey Saga. Go 500 years in the future, or in the past.

Ah well. Life goes on.

Is everything that’s new automatically bad? Are old things better by default?

Anchorhead said:

Age of the person commenting would make this discussion a lot more honest. People in their 20s and 30s aren’t going to be able to speak to the question in an informed manner. Until you’ve passed through time, you won’t understand it. You just can’t. No amount of reading, studying, researching, interviews, etc is going to change that. Until 40 or 50 years have passed, you can’t even begin to comprehend what the good old days even are or how much your world will have changed.

To me, someone who has been around for many decades, nearly everything is better now. Cars, motorcycles, technology, healthcare/medicine/medical, communications, home entertainment, food safety, air quality, water quality, workplace environments & safety, and many others I’m probably forgetting.

The only thing better 40 years ago was the amount of time I had left in the journey.

And yet, if you believe the surveys over the past 20 years, people are less happy these days. Most of the stuff you mentioned above are simply related to technological improvements; very ironic given the fact that most of us on this website vastly prefer Star Wars from “the good old days” to the new Star Wars stuff.

You still remain an awesome dude Anchorhead.

Did G. Lucas ever intend to portray the Jedi as a flawed institution in the prequels? Or was it added later in the EU?

The unlikability of the Jedi as portrayed in the PT is the culmination of a process that seemed to start with TESB. In SW77 the Jedi are portrayed as a sort of intergalactic police; a cross between The Knights of The Round Table, the Samurai, and The Lensmen. In Empire we get the warrior monk view of the Jedi. I guess Lucas preferred this view…but I prefer his original concept.

The Kenobi <s>Movie</s> Show (Spoilers)

I think Mando works because it seems inspired by the same source material as the OT was, whereas all these other series seem to be “inspired” by the OT. So they just feel like poorly executed copies.

Perhaps exploited is a better term then inspired.

In my humble opinion this series has, all things considered, veered into prequel or even fan film level quality; really bad stuff.

Your ideal Star Wars Sequel Trilogy

Servii said:

I’ve revised my Sequel Trilogy concept.

The Galactic Civil War continued for another 2 decades after Endor, becoming a long, grinding effort to drive back what was left of the Empire. At last, the receding Empire sued for peace with the Republic, with the resulting treaty favoring the Republic and ensuring the Empire could never reclaim its lost territory.

An extremist splinter faction of the Empire, calling themselves the First Order, refused to accept the treaty and launched a surprise attack into Republic space. The First Order was able to devastate the Republic world Mon Calamari before being pushed back by a joint Republic-Empire force. Emperor Roan Fel denounced the First Order as traitors, and aided the Republic in pursuing the First Order into deep space.

Going against the cautionary advice of his uncle Luke, young Jedi Knight Ben Solo joined this military effort, demanding justice for the lives lost on Mon Calamari. Ben quickly rose to the status of war hero as he became a key player in the battles along the edges of the Unknown Regions. The First Order fought with fanaticism, being pushed back planet by planet at a steep cost to both sides.

Then, out of nowhere, the First Order seemingly abandoned the war, and vanished into the Unknown Regions. Ben then spent the next few years working alongside Republic Special Ops officer Poe Dameron to explore and chart the Unknown Regions and track down the First Order fleet. Poe was eventually recalled back to Coruscant, leaving Ben to continue his search alone.

Ben finally discovers where they fled to: the old Imperial prison world of Belsavis. Strangely, the First Order doesn’t fire on his ship when he arrives, instead hailing him and telling him that he is expected at a specific location on the planet. Ben goes along with this, sensing no trap or deception, and arrives at the most heavily locked down place on the planet. A First Order officer greets him as he lands, but Ben notes that something seems off about him, as though he’s not acting of his own free will. The strange officer leads him into the deepest part of the prison, to meet with their new leader. Someone who had been kept in bodily stasis there for several decades, per Emperor Palpatine’s orders.

His name? Jedi Master Jorus C’baoth.

Palpatine considered C’baoth a potential asset due to his unusually powerful battle meditation, and instead of killing him, had him imprisoned and kept in semi-conscious stasis as a form of torture, hoping to break his will and make him serve the Empire. C’baoth never broke, and had remained in stasis all those years after Palpatine’s death. But in his confined state, his mental Force powers grew, until he was able to not just influence people, but outright destroy a person’s identity and enslave their mind to his will. When the First Order fleet arrived over Belsavis, C’baoth sensed their coming, and mentally subjugated their highest ranking members, essentially turning the faction into his own personal army.

Ben spoke with C’baoth for a long time, learning from him about the ancient history of the Jedi and Sith. The two Jedi spoke long on morality and philosophy, and C’baoth showed Ben the remains of dead planets, devastated long ago in the Great Hyperspace War. He led Ben to the same conclusion he had reached: that as long as the Jedi existed, a new Sith would inevitably reemerge, and the resulting war would devastate the galaxy, as had happened many times before. From Ben, C’baoth learns about Luke Skywalker and his new Jedi academy on Yavin IV. C’baoth condemns the new Jedi Order as folly. “It may take 50 years,” C’baoth declared. “It may take 1000 years. It does not matter. This new Order will one day breed a new Sith. It should never have been founded.”

C’baoth then made clear to Ben his plans for the galaxy. He intended to use the First Order to seize control of the Empire, and then sweep across the galaxy, forcefully unifying it under his leadership. The concept of individual freedom would be annihilated. All other Force users would be compelled to sever their own connection to the Force or be put to death. Having found Ben Solo, the heir of Darth Vader, the final piece of C’baoth’s plan was complete, and he could begin his power play.

This is where Episode VII begins. In this rewrite, rather than revering Darth Vader, Ben Solo takes up the mantle of Lord Vader as a calculated move to assert his legitimacy to the Empire. Wearing a mask and suit largely modeled after Vader’s, but modified in several ways to suit his own body, he leads a First Order surprise attack on the Imperial capital world of Bastion. Fighting his way past the Emperor’s elite guards, he hunts down and fatally wounds Emperor Fel before declaring himself publically as Lord Vader and the rightful ruler of the Empire. He then gives an impassioned speech calling for renewed war against the Republic, and the restoration of Imperial authority over the Galactic Core.

The surviving members of the Emperor’s guard are given a choice: kneel or die. Most of them submit to the new Vader, and many stormtroopers on the planet join them, while many others remain loyal to Fel. Civil war breaks out in the streets before the pro-Vader faction secures control of Bastion. Amid the chaos, a small contingent of loyalist stormtroopers break into the Imperial Palace and rescue the badly wounded Emperor. Once it becomes clear that the battle is lost, these troopers attempt to shuttle the dying Emperor off of the planet to safe territory, but their ship is severely damaged as it tries to escape, losing its hyperdrive. The ship is then pursued across space by TIE fighters before being shot down and crash landing on the planet Jakku. Every passenger is killed instantly except for Emperor Fel and a lone stormtrooper. The last trooper tries to pull the Emperor out of the rubble, but to no avail, and right before the Emperor dies, he gives a final command to the stormtrooper: tell the Republic, and Chancellor Organa, what has happened.

The stormtrooper’s name? Finn.

And that’s how I’d begin Episode VII.

You are a treasure here on OT.com Servi! Now, I know you stole these ideas from the best 2 Expanded Universe efforts (the Heir to The Empire trilogy and KOTOR 1 and 2), but that is okay! 😃