none

Star Wars: 2004 Recomp'd star field and repositioned escape pod.  Each moved independently.  In 77-97 escape pod starts behind guys head.  2004 escape pod is not behind guys head.  And there are three stars which make an 'L'.  In 77-97 it starts to the right of the doohickey in the center of the frame/window/console.  In 2004 those three 'L' stars are on the left.

Beginning of shot.......................end of shot

Then in the next shot, i'd almost want to say the SD and star were redone in 1997 as they look much clearer, but the movement is the same, so probably just a transfer thing:

Maybe originally there were trying to simulate a glass dome, and in 1997 they said 'f'it just make it clear.

Mielr wrote: The sales could actually end up being disappointing

The problem is we'll never know.  The internal projections made by LFL of what they need to sell to break even or what they need to sell to fund this or that future project is something which won't leak, but what is important to them being a disappointment or a success, or if word of mouth affected sales.

I think these type of releases can't fail in the traditional sense, they will sell enough to cover their production, but LFL needs them to go beyond that to help fund their next venture.  LFL is in so many different media venues (movies, tv, video games) these movie releases just give these other things a financial cushion.  But if the new tv show gets pushed another few years in the future that maybe a sign of if the BD sales meet with their sales figures.  but probably something else.

http://www.the-numbers.com/weekly-bluray-sales-chart

Has sales figures, which they point out are estimates. (Week 2 figures)

Rank	Prev. Rank	Title	Units this Week	% Change	Total units	Sales this Week	Total Sales	Weeks in Release

2

2

Star Wars: The Complete Saga (Episodes I-VI)

400,743

-22.19%

915,743

$32,055,439

$77,148,815

1

7	5	Star Wars Trilogy	51,850	+52.77%	-	$2,073,497	-	366
8	15	Star Wars Prequel Trilogy	17,916	+66.18%	-	$716,472	-	151

Star Wars is associated with 'goodness', the out cry this time placed a dent into that.

Less a change question, more of a 'how do these colors come about' question:

top is mthr77 then TB97SE, and WG underneath.

The 2004 shows that the colors were altered selectively as the image no longer appears as one shade but has a two toned look. (whites shift pink, but skin has a orange tinge)  In the 97 what created the pink tone?  Blasts of light normally to shift toward white.  Was the 97 colors modified digitally or photo-chemically?  If it was photo-chemical, then the pink shift (in predominantly white shots) was a byproduct of whatever decision was applied to the rest of these shots.  Warming them up, possibly.

*EDIT*

Then the next shot, the blasts shift red in the 97.  Both the mthr77 and GOUT also seem to shift towards a similar red hue.  SW was meant to be vibrant, but would the 97 version be classified as over exuberant or fairly close, in this example.

Tobar wrote: It's funny I actually wrote a letter to Jimmy Mac of the Forcecast

OMIT

He never replied. =(

I got ignored by them as well.  Made a stupid DVD, sent them copies, they never replied.  Then saw them at the last Celebration and he said they wouldn't talk about it because they couldn't pronounce the title.

walking_carpet wrote: as a copyright holder, lucas can control what the LoC can screen or make copies for distribution?

I wouldn't consider it control.  I would guess out of Courtesy the LoC asks the copyright owner before screening, and if the copyright owner balks or does not give timely permission they do not show the work.

walking_carpet wrote:  but he cannot order LoC prints to be destroyed?

The LoC is in no way ever going to destroy a work on purpose.  But as what may have happened with the Star Wars given to the NFR, Lucasfilm could have asked for the print back, the LoC returns the print, and Lucasfilm never returns it.

From the link danny_boy just posted: (article written in 1993)

Archives, however, are restricted in certain other uses of the copyright-protected films they physically preserve. (They may make films available for on-site study but without permission of the copyright holder or the transfer of rights, archives generally cannot publicly exhibit copyrighted films or distribute them for sale. For further discussion of these access questions, involving copyright, fair use, and "public domain" films, see Section 8.)

and reading further into this doc, this part talks about how the LoC does re-release Public Domain material from their archives:

The first six videotapes in the "Library of Congress Video Collection," due for public release in December, will make available six early silent features and 29 silent shorts from the Library of Congress preservation program.

mthr Source:

Minor order thing in the SW guide: The Tantive 'smoke' wipe and Tantive SD bay shots should be swapped.

For the SE were all the laser gun fire bolts recomp'd?  (in example look at top left blast and it's relationship to the bottom of the protruding wall box)

The lightsaber core issue which was addressed for the BD, could the same be thought of the laser blasts?

WG 77-04 (the 04 inner core is dramatically two toned)

TB DVB 97 (B.99)  (bolts are smooth and consistent)

What's people thoughts on the colors of this explosion early on in the Tantive:

TopLeft is mthr boot, BottomRight is TB SE DVB, then Wookiegroomer.  Generally the TB is darker (thru out the film) in the 2004 red shift seems pretty pronounced.

Erikstormtrooper wrote: I don't understand why the LOC can't copy the existing older prints they have of Star Wars.

First off, Copyright prohibits them. 

The LoC can't do anything until copyright expires on a work.  They might be able to do things in house without telling anyone, but they can't tell anyone and they can't tell anyone.  And if it did get out that they were reproducing anything prior to copyright expiration, heads would roll.

The LoC has millions of miles of film to preserve.  When the task is that great, priorities are set.  A film (which is hugely popular, has been included in the NFR, and the copyright owner is highly respected in the preservation game) does not deserve the attention of an older lesser known or significantly older, or significantly more volatile film.

So even if the film got to the top of the list, then what method of reproduction would need to be figured out.  As pointed out in the thread's article, certain types of prints require a different reproduction method.  The best method would be a photochemical reproduction, but IB Technicolor prints don't reproduce well.  (don't think the LoC versions are this though)  So then you have to examine what equipment is available, and man power/knowledge.  Eventually the LoC gets probably all technology, but if the only equipment currently available was a 2K digital scanner would you bother?  Would that change, if it maybe 15 years before the 4K scanner to show up.

This is a thread for discussion of spreadsheets which list every shot in the Star Wars movies.  After each shot gets listed, additional information can be added.  For example: script pieces, duration/length, Special Edition changes, etc.

Currently working on: **First Pass ALL Films Complete

ShotList-StarWars-v0.6.05 :
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1H0eg40PEY3B7zF-dL6H41ntBRlp4gZo3V3pAjkgcTR0/edit?usp=sharing

Not sure how this public version will work out.  But feel free to save your own copy and make changes.  If you do make a change, let me know, so I can incorporate it into a backup version.  As this is public, it might get corrupted so might periodically revert it back to it’s original state.  I guess if anyone reading does make a change, maybe change the border so it <span style=“text-decoration: underline;”>STANDS OUT</span>.  This will make it easier to find when I do a review.

Current Progress :

Ver.0.6.05: Added Audio Changes for 2004, 2011 and 2019 mixes. Additional visual changes from DIF review.

Ver.0.6.04: Added Audio Changes for 77 70mm, 1985 & 1993 mixes.

Ver.0.6.03: Added Audio Changes between 77 Stereo and 1997 SE.

Ver.0.6.02: Added changes in the 35mm Mono Mix.

Ver.0.6.01: Added 2019 changes. Findings from Forums and DIF Review.

Ver.0.5.05: Completed RotJ SE analysis.

Ver.0.5.00: Completed RotS first pass and incorporated some of the 2005 and 2011 changes.

Ver.0.4.00: Completed AotC first pass and incorporated some of the 2002 and 2011 changes.

Ver.0.3.03: Completed TPM first pass and incorporated some of the 2001 and 2011 changes.

Ver.0.2.08: Completed initial ESB set up.  ESB 80 ended up around 1804 shots, which jumps to 1826 for the Special Editions.  More shots were modified for the SE but to a lesser extent.

Ver.0.2.08: First pass thru RotJ yield about 2105 shots.  Thru a Wall Street Journal Article, Star Wars is confirmed as 2,228 shots.  (Shot Spreadshit is missing two.)  Also from that article is mention that 748 shots were redone in various ways.

Ver.0.2.06: First pass thru Empire yields about 1850 shots.

Ver.0.2.05: Added the script number for the other 5 movies.  Have begun the change slog through ESB.  Added a page with just links to reference material which will hopefully get included over time.

Ver.0.2.03: Added preliminary 2011 and 35mm Mono change info.

Ver.0.2.01a: Finished doing the GOUT, 97, 2004 pass in the change category.  As this was the second pass through, the shot total increased to 2,221.  The 97 Se jumps to 2,241 and 2004 goes down to 2,238.  The 97SE change percentage is just under 11%.

Ver.0.1.01a: Finished the first pass which gives the shot total as 2,209.  With 181 Omitted or Removed script scenes.  (this can probably be reduced with a second reading/pass)

Ver.0.09a : Have completed the SW Shot List from beginning to middle of the Death Star attack.  10 minutes left to do.  Current count is 2,128 shots.  General estimate may finish at around 2,200-2,350.

Current Problems : Shot/Sub-Scene title is inconsistent, started by listing unlisted shots with a ‘Sub’ title (using a number), realized a ways in that I should just start a ‘Shot’ column count.  The ‘Added’ shot and ‘Removed’ values may reduce as I better read the script, since scenes are moved around and sequences shifted, keeping track of everything requires a re-read.

To Do: figure out mechanical way to transport frame count and shot length into the document.  May add a ‘moved’ change category, so that variations between the script and final film can be identified beyond the V9/A9 ‘removed’ material.  Example the “3po in wires” would be considered a ‘move’ from script (Tantive) to screen (Millennium Falcon).

Idea started from: http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Complete-Comparison-of-Special-Edition-Visual-Changes/topic/11927/page/31/

Where zombie84 had created spreadsheet of Special Edition and 2004 changes.  Had always been curious of the number of shots in the movie, will incorporate this data, but also expand as i’ve introduced a category for the 2004 color timing issue and have columns for audio changes.

Hopefully can figure out a way to save as a jpg so the change colors could make an image which visually tells the SW changes over time story.  Each shot would equal one pixel.

Would hope that this spreadsheet could be converted into something fan editors could use to document their changes.  (similar to TV’s Frink’s fan edit change documents)  But as it’s a spreadsheet might be easier to convert into a database/.HTML format.

Past Versions :

ShotList-StarWars-v0.6.02 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PzcHuIAV4JPfgJViPbOvEZkqNwiCguGWglrbJjR5rn8/edit?usp=sharing

ShotList-StarWars-v0.5.05 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdDJORXlfTDBIN0NaQXlWMk51Q2tOR0E

ShotList-StarWars-v0.5.00 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdHd1U19DZXdjYXduMF9EN1ZWVjN4NFE

**ShotList-StarWars-v0.5.00_public : **

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdE9RcndMaU9tSGNvd3J6eC1KemRoMlE

ShotList-StarWars-v0.4.00 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdEE0VHZtWFBhS1FBSW9vbzh6azN6QUE

ShotList-StarWars-v0.3.03 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdHVfd2E3LWdubkkwRW5MWEtyTHlOVnc

ShotList-StarWars-v0.3.00 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdFpaTTVrYy05dkN0c2ZndHlQTG1rWXc

ShotList-StarWars-v0.2.08 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdEVjZ1VrOFBUUDNyV2hoNnV1RFp6MHc

ShotList-StarWars-v0.2.06 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdFFNMWxCQWlNemU4dzFra1I0S3Vfd2c&hl=en_US

ShotList-StarWars-v0.2.05 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdHRmMlNNVjJXQmtfSlZyMHVVYUxvaUE&hl=en_US

ShotList-StarWars-v0.2.04 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdEYwVmFXQlpnZHNVcGtURTVVY05OckE&hl=en_US

ShotList-StarWars-v0.2.03 :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdDNiMHc4X1d5RF9pbWZuSldqN3R0NWc&hl=en_US

ShotList-StarWars-v0.2.01a :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdExTNWp4dDdmZXVGUllic29SUS1iaFE&hl=en_US

ShotList-StarWars-v0.1.01a :

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtjXdIjRQo5NdHljZ3U0aW02MlhsZGRaWUI5eFgtQVE&hl=en_US

zombie wrote: Fun fact: apparently, they were moved to storage and their status was changed to protected in order to save them because of savestarwars.com.

Only you are privy to all the behind the scenes conversations, but generally the LoC has been improving their facilities and much of the material they preserve is getting a new home in the last few years.  For instance: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Audio-Visual_Conservation_Center

The National Audiovisual Conservation Center, also known as the Packard Campus for Audio-Visual Conservation, is the Library of Congress's new audiovisual archive located inside Mount Pony in Culpeper, Virginia.  (opened fall 2008)

 

The underground vaults (some set to temperatures below freezing) contain nearly 90 miles (140 km) of shelving, not including 124 nitrate film vaults:^[6] the largest nitrate film storage complex in the Western hemisphere.

(lots of good links to articles about the facilities and what they accomplish in the links part of the wiki entry)

This should go over well with this crowd, even if it's almost 20 years old:

http://www.cinemaweb.com/access/pre_stmt.htm

"Preservation Without Access is Pointless"

Statement by

The Committee For Film Preservation and Public Access

before

The National Film Preservation Board of the Library of Congress
Los Angeles, California
February 12, 1993

 

We believe that all films have historical significance and should be preserved, and we support the use of Federal funds for this effort. However, we also believe that with the use of public funds comes the responsibility to make the films available to the public. Upon expiration of copyright, those films whose preservation, cataloguing or storage has been supported in any way by public funds must become available without restriction.

Here's a nice list of film/media preservation links: http://www.hollywoodvaults.com/resources/#resources2

I'm going to keep posting these links until someone reads them:

Library of Congress Copyright Deposit records for all the Star Wars films.

(tells you what they have, when they were procured and other relevant things)

1977 - Star Wars
http://lccn.loc.gov/96512247

1980 - Empire Strikes Back
http://lccn.loc.gov/96512208

1983 - Return of the Jedi
http://lccn.loc.gov/96501520

1997 - Star Wars A New Hope Special Edition
http://lccn.loc.gov/97510343

1997 - Empire Strikes Back Special Edition
http://lccn.loc.gov/98502262

1997 - Return of the Jedi Special Edition
http://lccn.loc.gov/2006642053

1999 - The Phantom Menace

http://lccn.loc.gov/99468631

2002 - Attack of the Clones
http://lccn.loc.gov/2002636427

2005 - Revenge of the Sith
http://lccn.loc.gov/2005644161

Why didn't R2 upload the stolen death star plans to the internet?

13. If they blew up Yavin, it's debris would have taken out everyone on the fourth moon.

TheBoost wrote:  Garidian. The only really fascinating character gets the short stick.

The Garidian subplot was much longer but cut by the ratings board as they were going to give the movie a 'R' rating because of all the 'nose' rubbing.  Short stick = death stick.  The Garidian subplot would have mirror the AotC cantina reference, tying the complete Saga completely together in a nice complete windsor knot, completely.

Personally, I would have been satisfied if the whole movie followed Han, Luke and Chewie going around the Death Star shooting out the cameras and other sensors.  I luvs layzerz!

negative1 wrote: i will take the best parts and combine them into one.

If you have two copies of the same release, then combining sounds ok.  But if they are different releases (defined by some serial number, the FOX or CBS as the website describes) don't be afraid to release two versions.

bkev wrote: Okay, perhaps I'm being cynical but - with the recent revelation that the LoC doesn't even have a copy,

The LoC has multiple copies (Copyright Deposits) of each film.  They are prints which were provided after each of the initial movie runs in theaters.  They are used and worn.

Here is the Copyright Deposit information for Star Wars (1977): http://lccn.loc.gov/96512247

The recent revelation (not so new actually) is that the National Film Registry (a subsection of the Library of Congress) did not receive the new copies they asked for.  The NFR was created so that when the public voted a work as significant, the NFR would ask the original creator for a new clean print to be struck and submitted for preservation.

Asaki wrote: So it seems like everyone has been expecting much more from LoC than they are actually able/willing to do.

The LoC is doing what they were asked, to save the films to the best of their ability. The copyright deposit copies have an uncertain future. When copyright expires they maybe used to preserve. But copyright has to expire before that conversation begins in earnest.

They are under copyright control now, which explains the limited access. The LoC has probably set a very high standard for viewing/researching as the medium is known to degrade through use. (copyright deposit copies from this period of time, late 70s early 80s, tended to be prints which were used in theaters)

Bingowings wrote:

The British Library has to by law be given a copy of any publication with an ISBN number.

Something similar should happen here.

It has and all the films reside in multiple versions in the LoC. That's the LoC Copyright Deposit copies. (the hearing impaired ones are Copyright Desposits) Here are their specs:

1977 - Star Wars
http://lccn.loc.gov/96512247

1980 - Empire Strikes Back
http://lccn.loc.gov/96512208

1983 - Return of the Jedi
http://lccn.loc.gov/96501520

1997 - Star Wars A New Hope Special Edition
http://lccn.loc.gov/97510343

1997 - Empire Strikes Back Special Edition
http://lccn.loc.gov/98502262

1997 - Return of the Jedi Special Edition
http://lccn.loc.gov/2006642053

1999 - The Phantom Menace

http://lccn.loc.gov/99468631

2002 - Attack of the Clones
http://lccn.loc.gov/2002636427

2005 - Revenge of the Sith
http://lccn.loc.gov/2005644161

The second part of this story is the National Film Registry which is under the umbrella of the LoC.  Since most Copyright Desposit copies were given after significant theater use, the NFR went an additional step by asking for newly created prints.  The NFR requested SW in 1989 when the NFR was created. As the title of the article implies (replaced), I think Lucasfilm might have given a 1977 print then, and when SE work began they asked to borrow it. Then when given back, the SE print was slipped in. (don't have anything to confirm this)

Why would it take 10 years for Lucasfilm to give a print in the first place, that doesn't make sense. If Lucasfilm did wait 10 years, the story would have beeen that Lucasfilm doesn't believe in the NFR, and would have expected that story to already have been told. But weirder shit has happened. Hopefully the new article will drag out some people who are in the know, and more facts will emerge.

georgec wrote: I wonder what Katie Lucas' twitter looks like right now...

You should start a thread for your talk about her account. She is very far removed from this topic and will mostly likely never speak about it.

Should SSW.c have a myspace page, an orkut page, a friendster page, a usenet account, an egroups forum, an AOL account, a prodigy page... 

The information the site is looking to put on the internet is on the internet through savestarwars.com.  If you want zombie to do more work by putting the information in multiple pages, that's fine, but i'd rather have him doing more research.

"Put that thing away or you're going to get us all killed."

Gaffer Tape wrote: As far as the article says, it sounds like Lucas attempted to contribute the SEs for preservation, but the NFR said no.

Yeah I think a piece is missing.  zombie can confirm.  SW was inducted into the NFA and a copy of the 1977 was contributed.  This was late 80s early 90s (pre-SE).  But when working on the SE, Lucasfilm asked for the copy back(?), and it was given.(?)  When the LoC asked for it to be returned, that's when the SE print was submitted.(?)  Which the NFA still has.(?)  Or the NFA said no too is confusing to me as well.  I'm guessing the LoC accepted the SE as any print is worth having, but don't consider it fulfilling the promise of the SW NFA induction. 

As ESB was just inducted the end of last year, it's probably safe to say that no version has been offered or submitted.

savestarwars.com has a savestarwars.com page. 

Everyone who's interested can be social on in any medium of their choice.

Unfortunate that things have come to this.  All sides look bad in this.  The National Film Registry is going to get hit hard for not living up to their mandate.  Hopefully this will coerce Lucasfilm to make a statement.

Thanks for the research canofhumdingers.  Let us know more about your trip!

Some minor things: (third to last paragraph)

But, the news may be even worse: no only do they not have an original Star Wars print

Add a 't', think you meant ": not only"

they don't have any version

change 'they' to 'National Film Registry'.   People are going to be very confused by the two separate entities under one roof.  When ever you can, use the full name to alleviate confusion.

has said recently that he would like to restore the originals but can't pay for it

 

methinks

GL said this?  got a link.  Add a space for the second.

congressman

congressperson

Here's how to find who you should be writing to:

http://www.contactingthecongress.org/

https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml

And you might want to explain 'cultural heritage protection law' if you want these letter to be more pointed.

*EDIT*

Wonder where this story has been circulating.  Hope more stats surface about the wheres and whens.

And would be great if someone at Fox could scan the document which points out what should happen to prints of the films which are found.

timdiggerm wrote: The Maker Movement comes to mind.

Make magazine covers much of what these people do and are about: http://makezine.com/

and if you ever get the chance to go to a Maker Faire, it's awesome:

http://makerfaire.com/

Cory Doctorow is a vocal proponent and wrote a book called 'Makers' which deals with some of the societal ramifications when people can print out 3d objects:

http://craphound.com/makers/

But finding a crew to create the 35mm scanning equipment, means getting involved and helping out.  Doable definitely, but finding the mind power and organizing is part of the difficulty.  I think it's coming, the book scanners have gotten more and more sophisticated and easy to use over the years, shifting towards old film types converting to digital video is inevitable.  But if it's 5 or 15 years away, not sure.

^ margands1 is a member of the forums, here are the threads which discussed his ESB recording:

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/ESB-1980-70mm-soundtrack-In-theatre-recording/topic/12505/

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/ESB-70mm-Soundtrack-1980-in-theatre-recording/topic/12501/page/1/

Information on myspleen:

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Once-upon-a-time-on-MySpleen-NEW-Star-Wars-Category/topic/12652/

and please read the below post to understand how these forums survive:

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Notes-on-Piracy-Please-Read/forum/17/topic/13347/

Kids React to Star Wars Kid

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quiMCW2ji_s

via: waxy.org

doubleofive wrote: "Scene" does not equal "shot" though...

Right the list currently is Scenes.  When I checked the first 10 Scenes of the DS Attack I ended up adding 3 Shots to the list.  This is a preliminary idea to give a sense how this list will blossom when converting from Scene to Shot.

So if there's 500 Scenes listed currently, and the idea is that for every 10 there will be 3 unlisted shots, that's another 150 shots, so the totals now 650 shots.  If the SE change number is around 275, that's 42%.  But I think the Shot total is going to be closer to 1k.