Going back to the Snoke scene do you think you can make Palpatines essence “Bust out” and twirl like when Palpatine exploded in ROTJ instead of the subtle smoke you currently have?
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-534d4baca5b6cab7f596007f5b954ee1
Wow this video really hit the nail on the coffin.
It can also be interpreted as
“see you around
In the after life,
…punk.”
Having her kill her parents, just like having them sell her to protect her, is an idea that’s good, but not as good as the alternative. I prefer the idea that it really did seem possible they might come back and she had to slowly come to terms with it.
Yeah but she already came to terms with that in TLJ which leaves us with very few options for her internal conflict in TROS. I think throwing some dirt on Rey’s “squeaky clean” image by making her the one that killed her parents would go along way.
Here’s an idea.
To put it mildly I disliked Rey’s backstory in TROS, specifically her parent’s characterisation as “good” people that rejected their father’s legacy. For me this removes any nuance from Rey’s arc and renders her triumph as somewhat redundant.
Now as some have said we can change this by removing any trace of her parents “selling her to protect her” and maintain that they where indeed filthy junktraders who where cast out to Jakku by their father “Palps” and tried* to get out by selling their daughter.
Here is where it gets a little radical
*TROS flashback: as a young Rey screams for her parents to come back she suddenly bursts into anger and unleashes lightening at the ship disabling it and causing it to crash land, killing her parent’s, thus being buried in a paupers grave on Jakku.
This event traumatises young Rey to such an extent that she blocks this memory from her mind and even alters it, subconsciously making up a narrative that someday they will return for her.
For me this gives Rey a more pronounced struggle against the dark side and a strong inclination to it, add to that her dark lineage and that puts all the odds against her, but it ultimately makes her triumph at the end more impactful and makes for a more interesting arc.
This idea could be implemented with a few dialogue alterations here and there especially during the Kijimmi force fight since Kylo is wearing a mask, young Rey shooting lightning at the ship during the flashback can be done with some VFX work and maybe reusing some shots from the Passana sequence.
I’m not really sure what can be done with Ochi of Bastoon and his place in the story though.
What do you guys think?
I think the “sold for drinking money” line should be kept, I’m sure down the line many edits will remove “the good parents” aspect from TROS to emphasis Rey’s triumphant rejection of her evil heritage.
What always bothered me about the movie was that we know within the first 5 minutes of the film not only that Palpatine is back, but where exactly he is. So where is the point of us going on a fetch quest with our heroes, when we already know what they gonna find and where they gonna find it? That’s why the movie lacks suspense. So we need to shift the Kylo Ren scenes on Exogol around a little bit. I don’t know how yet, but that’s kind of a biggie for me at least.
This goes along with (1). Maybe we can shift the Palpatine reveal with Kylo towards to middle somewhere, so to create a build up towards Palpatine. The crawls needs to be changed (goes without saying) and RIGHT AFTER the crawl we could start with the #FortniteMessage by Palpatine. Or Maybe start with Rey’s training sequence and shortly after incorporate the #FortniteMessage into another scene or create a montage of a few planets while the message is being voiced over. So like the entire Galaxy was listening?
If we get the extended Mustafar scene (one can hope), we can intertwine Rey and the gangs search for Palpatine’s wayfinder with Kylo’s search for Vader’s wayfinder and him ultimately getting to exogol first. He finds Palpatine and is told to bring Rey to him(rogues idea) so they can rule the new empire as empress and emperor. This should probably be placed before the kijimi sequence where kylo informs Rey of her True heritage.
“Huh not dressed in Black Tie? Be gone with these peasants!”
poppasketti said:
Any other thoughts on the Matrix-style slomo? It sounds like people might be leaning toward its removal.
I like it.
Well he lied for 4 years about not being involved so I’ll take that with a grain of salt.
He probably wasn’t allowed to say he was involved.
Yes but that likely applies now as well.
Well he lied for 4 years about not being involved so I’ll take that with a grain of salt.
New leaked concept art from Trevarrow’s script
https://m.imgur.com/a/lX9JG8F
I missed kenobi saying for DEMOCRACY
Yep it was definitely something added late in the crawl.
I don’t like how Luke’s reason to secluded himself changed from wanting to stop the endless cycle of Sith and Jedi and wanting the force to choose someone worthier, to him suddenly being there out of fear which Rian Johnson explicitly said he was not.
The movie also establishes that the First Order probably could have, at any point, jumped ahead and just wiped them out, but Hux instead chose to just follow behind and essentially torture them instead of just getting it over with.
Where does it establish that? Are you sure we are watching the same film?
Which is ALSO a thematic element that keeps getting referenced and paid off later in the movie - the villains’ hubris and arrogance gets them ruined. Had Hux been as ruthless as he pretends he is, the movie would have ended after 30 minutes. Had Snoke been paying attention instead of feeling himself, he wouldn’t have gotten bisected. If Kylo had been paying attention instead of raging out on Crait, he would have figured out what was really going on before it was too late.
Well since the dreadnought was aiming to fire at the resistance cruiser at the start of the film I’m sure had it survived Poe’s attack it would have done the same thing.
Here’s a larger point that I’m trying to make - aside from the fact these “plot holes” aren’t really plot holes at all, if your deconstruction of the story is being done solely to point out how there are ways to effectively end the story after 30 minutes because the bad guys “could have” done something else that they didn’t do and it would wipe out the good guys, then you’re not really worried about the story or the plot-holes, you’re basically trying to invalidate the movie, period. That’s not fixing a story, that’s anti-storytelling. That’s suggesting that our heroes need to be so pigeonholed BY the plot that the course of action they take is the only possible course of action they COULD take. That’s video-game routing, not large-scale movie storytelling. What’s the end goal of this criticism, and what is it that it’s saying about the story and the characters and the themes and ideas they represent?
No I am not trying to invalidate the film, in fact I enjoyed the film and I like the themes and character ercs in a broad sense, but when put under close inspection, the way things are set just don’t add up and it takes away from the overall experience.
If the basis upon which you build these large themes and character arcs is weak the hole thing collapses, you completely ignored what I said concerning the fire range of these ships and their capabilities which I’m afraid is officially canon.
If we are talking technicalities Snokes ship had very short range and so did the star destroyers, the dreadnought on the other hand is a different beast, it obliterated the resistance base at a long distance and has the capability to destroy a fleet.
I like TLJ as a hole but for this instance I have to say RJ wrote himself into a cul-de-sac.
Enter major plothole:
The film tries to make a fuss about Poe being reckless and endangering the fleet by destroying the dreadnought when in reality his actions saved the fleet from certain death.
If the resistance escaped without destroying the dreadnought(a fleet killer) the first order would have traced them through lightspeed and the resistance would have been at a dead end.
While we are on that scene, I think the way it was originally edited makes the leia contact very confusing to the point that it lowers the dramatic impact of the scene, I would change it so that Kylo gets distracted by her death instead of the call itself, I would also extend the moment Rey and kylo have by having Rey confessing her true feelings about taking “Ben’s” hand before the healing sequence which for me makes it all the more “romantic”? maybe compassionate, it also gives their moment a little more time to breathe.
Original order of scenes:
Re-edited version
While John Williams has been a consistent architect of music for these films I think that some of these sequences would be better served with no music, just the fight and the sounds of the world around them. Sometimes less is more.
The death star battle is the last big duel of the trilogy and saga, i don’t think that is ok for it to not have soundtrack or to have a score less memorable than duel of fate
Other thing that bugs me, and would like to know if is possible to fix in the edit.
In TFA when the option to sell BB-8 becomes available, she looks sad and refuses to sell the droid because she KNOWS that she was sold. Her parents, selling her to a slaver because they “loved her and wanted to protect her” sounds bad and not only is pretty cliche, it also feels jarring with the ending of the movie.
So Rey decides to take the skywalker name and act like the skywalkers are her family forgetting about the parents that she just discovered actually “loved” her and sacrifice their life for.
Rey palpatine’s would feel less jarring with the previous films if her parents were actually selfish and actually sold her from drinking money.
Having a truly dysfunctional family, would make “Rey Skywalker” and the message of deciding one’s path and family, more meaningful and would keep the weight of the revelation in TLJ for the most part intact.
The message of “bloodline doesn’t define you” doesn’t have any weight when her dad was the direct son of sheev and was a “decent” and “good” person.
This 100%. The fact that Rey’s parents already chose to forsake their dark heritage undermines Rey’s arc BIG TIME.
OutboundFlight said:
In TROS, Leia transfers her life-force into Ben, which allows Rey to heal a fatal wound in Ben without her dying.
If that was indeed their intention they did a pretty terrible job of conveying it.
Has anyone asked the question of why they fight in the first place? What were Rey’s motivations to attack Kylo and subsequently stab him to death? I felt nothing during this whole sequence, it felt so contrived it was as if they where trying fill a mandate (“gotta have a big lightsaber battle!”)
I’m sure Williams recorded something for that sequence but it’s probably sitting somewhere in the cutting room.
Unless they go all out in a BTS documentary walking through all changes through production but I doubt that will ever happen with the squeaky clean image Disney is “trying” to portray.