hairy_hen

Those screenshots do look pretty good.  I'd imagine that it's probably on par with the results of G-Force's AviSynth script applied to the GOUT. The script probably wins overall because of the anti-aliasing, but it may have a bit too much grain reduction for some.  All a matter of taste, I guess.  The shots affected by DVNR smearing are probably beyond salvage by any restoration short of replacing them from a different source entirely.

What really disturbs me, though, is the idea of using of the ghastly 2004 audio with the original version of the film.  That mix is, to put it lightly, an enormous pile of crappe that has absolutely nothing in common with any of the original mixes.  At all.  Beyond its obvious problems that have been well documented, the FX portion of the mix has been horrifically EQ'd towards the low end, giving the entire film a distorted, nasty sound that is about as far removed from what it should be as it can get.  Add to that missing and out of synch sound effects, as well as other issues I won't get into, and the result is a sonic catastrophe.  If an SE version absolutely had to be used it should have been the 1997 mix, because while its dynamic range tends to fall short of the 1993 version, and C-3PO's dialogue is very noisy, it still has that recognisably Star Wars sound . . .

This would still irritate me even I hadn't just spent the past month restoring the original 1977 70mm mix, which is the best the film has ever sounded by far.  Granted, I haven't actually made it available yet (although it will be soon, and in 5.1 no less), but seriously, the audio problems with the dvd remix are so vast that I can't understand why anyone would ever want to listen to it!

Sorry for ranting there.  lol  I don't mean to detract from the effort made to this project, because it does look rather good image-wise.

No heavy bass there in the '97.

I am sure this audio track is going to sound great! I'm looking forward to apply this to the "GOUT", if the audio samples you posted is any indication it looks like it will be the definitive track imo. :)

I think this will be my definitive version also.  I'll most likely watch the movie with this track from now on, unless I want to hear the mono mix once in a while.  It is a definite improvement over the one I made last year--quite aside from having much greater theatrical authenticity in removing the '93 additions, the boom track is significantly improved, in synch and in level balance.  I would recommend that anyone who has that version replace it with this one, frankly.

As far as Empire and Jedi go, my previous versions of them sound rather good, I think.  While not strictly authentic to any official release, coming from the '93 remixes and the special edition LFE channels (and Jedi has the deleted music from Ben's scene on Dagobah reinserted), the overall effect works very well.  I don't actually have them in 5.1 format or I'd upload them myself, but they can be found on dark_jedi's versions or perhaps can be provided by Satanika, assuming he still has them.  I may revisit Empire for the sake of replacing the hacked up music cues, but I haven't decided for sure yet.  Without actual recordings as we have for Star Wars, recreating the 70mm mixes of Empire and Jedi can't be done precisely, so hybrid versions are the best bet.  Obviously I like mine, although other approaches could be taken.

I would recommend against using the SE mixes to synch with the originals, because as tempting as it might be to have discrete 5.1, they often place undue emphasis on flashy and distracting surround effects.  Not only are these not necessary, they are consistently too loud compared to the rest of the sound, and I think in general there was a lapse of creative good judgement involved.  But then, that's true of the SE's as a whole.

msycamore said: I just hope that ridiculously loud bass when R2 fall down in the canyon isn't included ;)

A 12 decibel reduction takes care of that, no worries.  Just a tiny bit of oomph, instead of a dumpster hitting the ground from ten stories up. ;)  I don't mind that sort of thing in recent films, but the aural aesthetic of Star Wars doesn't support an overly exaggerated low end for that type of sound effect.  If it's really objectionable I could remove it entirely, though it does sound good as it is at present.

I've been trying to find more information about the technical specifications of 70mm magnetic audio, but haven't really found much that I didn't already know.  I'm not sure exactly how much headroom each channel contained, or what sort of mixing standards were in place at the time.  Various sources have suggested that the modern digital surround formats brought the powerful sound of 70mm to a much greater number of theaters; it's probably reasonable to assume that the dynamic characteristics were fairly similar, but I'm sure it's not exact.  Specifically I'm wondering whether the practise of lowering the LFE level by 10 decibels to increase the headroom was in place when Star Wars was mixed, or if that came about afterwards.  I can pretty much tell when I've made the bass too loud just by listening, but it would be helpful to have a concrete maximum db figure to refer to.

That would just be for my own edification really--aside from fixing the Alderaan explosion and checking a test file again, I'm basically done.  It really sounds awesome!  I'll always wonder how close it is to the real thing, but I can definitely live with this version.

If by some miracle the 70mm mix was ever given an actual transfer and official release, depending on how it was done it might not be possible to put it out exactly as it is without some tweaking.  The two LFE's would have to be summed together, and the mono surround probably distributed equally among both rear channels to get a proper 5.1 format.  If there is bass information in the boom tracks that goes above 120 hz--possible, since it was a new format and obviously Dolby Digital standards hadn't been established--those would have to be put back into the mains.  A bit of stereo panning in the surrounds or from front to back might not be objectionable if it was done tastefully, or possibly boosting the bass response if it seemed necessary; though the goal should clearly be to keep it as authentic as possible.  This is Lucasfilm we're talking about, however . . .

Count me in as enthusiastically awaiting this release!

I wonder how much improvement it presents over the version 2 that I currently have.  The difference between that and the official cd versions is amazing, particularly on the SE tracks; the benefits of this are probably a more subtle building from there.  Still, improvements are always worthwhile, and from what has been said about the LP layering, it should sound excellent.

Must be a relief to be finished!  It wouldn't surprise me if you didn't want to listen to this again for a while, ABC--I know how tiring it can get listening to the same thing over and over.  Still, you can't stay away from this great music for too long.  :)

We're nearly there, folks . . . I listened to the test file today and I need to go back and lower the LFE level a bit in a few places--I had overcompensated for the oddly subdued volume sometimes found in the SE's.  The newer versions tend to let their loudest bass impacts come from changed CGI shots or added sound effects; I toned those down considerably and gave the original bass moments greater prominence, but inadvertently overdid it in a couple places.  I haven't been able to turn it up as much as I'd like for fear of disturbing others, so I'll have to check again when I have the place to myself, but even at low volume I could tell I hadn't done it right.  Fortunately, these should be easy enough to fix.

You're right about the 1999 Alien dvd having an isolated score track--but I only have the 2003 version, plus the cd is said to sound better.  ;)

That is a very interesting idea, ABC.  I don't know if I have the necessary skill with audio to make something like that work, but I would like to hear it if someone did.  I've been toying with the idea of making isolated scores sourced from your remastered versions to synch with the dvd's, but that wouldn't be for a while yet.  Some time ago I made an isolated score track for Alien using the Intrada cd release, mostly because I wanted to be able to see the film using the music as composed and not the appalling hackjob of the official mix.  Gave some thought to trying to replace the music in the film itself, too, but it turned out to be rather difficult.  I might go back to it at some point . . .

Anyway, after taking a bit of a break, I've finished with the LFE channel.  All that remains to be done is to make a test file so I can hear the bass effects integrated into the film, and then make any tweaks to the volume levels as needed.  After that I'll upload the files!  Hopefully it won't take long for the 5.1 upmixed version to be made after that.

Synching sound files to each other can be a major pain . . . I'm glad that part is done with.  I ended up using the bass from the 1997 version more often than not, because it usually sounds closer to the original; though there were instances where I thought the 2004 effects sounded better, so occasionally I went with those instead.  There may be a few instances where a particular bass effect was not actually in the original soundtrack, or was mixed differently than either SE version, but I've tried to keep it as authentic as possible in spirit.  The volume levels are basically my best judgement of what sounds right.  Sometimes the SE's have really loud bass in strange places that don't warrant it, and can be surprisingly subdued in others.  In general I've aimed at making the bass powerful, but not to the point of being overwhelmingly loud.

I listened to this file and it is very interesting to hear the actual in-theatre recording again.  Part of the time I ended up muting the right channel and just listened to the '77 version.  It has been useful in my effort to recreate the 70mm soundtrack, causing me to go back and do a couple edits over again.  I found that there are actually 2 extra Chewie vocalisations in the cantina scene, one of which I hadn't really noticed before.

Much of the older version does sound very much like the DC mix, though there are some oddities, which I presume are shortcomings of the recording and not actual differences.  For one, the surround channel is barely audible throughout; and the bass content is indistinct.  I can hear that it's there, but it isn't clear enough to tell accurately--sometimes it seems noticeably louder than what's on the laserdisc, and other times more subdued.  This can probably be attributed to the theatre acoustics in addition to recording flaws.  It makes for a good general reference, though ultimately I still have to rely on my own judgement in terms of creating an LFE channel.

I'm going to have another listen and see what else I can find.  Thanks for this, Moth3r!

Moth3r, I would be very interested in having the comparison track, both for its own sake and to determine if there is anything that I need to re-edit for my version.  By all means please upload it! :)  It's strange how they bothered to mix in something so minor as that water noise when legitimately improved effects such as the mono mix "deceleration" sound when the Falcon comes out of lightspeed are nowhere to be found in the '93.

msycamore: Actually, those scenes weren't all that difficult.  It was only a matter of finding appropriate places to switch--conveniently located sound effects help disguise the transitions.  The dynamics obviously do not reach the levels that they should in the cell bay shootout, but it still sounds good--vastly preferable to those ridiculously loud shattering glass sounds.

I will certainly be uploading the stereo version for anyone who wants it.  I'll most likely save it as a FLAC file and then split it into a few RARs to make the uploading easier, which can then be used as a PCM or high-bitrate AC3 track, whichever is preferred.  This method may yield slightly greater fidelity than what can be had from upmixed 5.1, and would be ideal for those without a surround setup available.

The 5.1 version would be best for those with surround setups, in order to take advantage of the extra bass content.  This is the only real reason to do the upmixing on the computer, since non-standard formats like 2.1 are problematic and the playback results are entirely receiver-dependent.  The bass was an important part of the 70mm theatrical experience, and I would recommend that it be heard this way if possible.

It should be noted that downmixing a previously upmixed surround track back into stereo is not ideal, because the surrounds may have a 20 millisecond delay added to them, which could cause phase issues if combined back with the main channels.  The six-track original wouldn't have this issue, of course, since its mono surround channel would contain discrete effects only.  Upmix results won't be precisely the same--the matrixed surround cues emanate from both rear speakers as they should, but there is also additional stereo ambience derived from the left and right front channels (as well as a bit of unavoidable crosstalk, although much less with modern algorithms than with the original Prologic).

The GOUT Empire in particular exhibits noticeable dynamic compression compared to the laserdisc.  If it came from a vhs master that might account for the discrepancy, but it's hard to say.  All three have an average playback volume that is four decibels lower than the LD's because of the AC3 dialnorm setting.  Adjusting your receiver's gain upwards to compensate when listening to the GOUT will eliminate much of the perceived lack, on SW and RotJ at least, but of course the lower bitrate works against them as well.

Every altered sound effect from the DC mix has now been replaced!  One or two may be a bit rougher than I'd like, but they're as good as I can make them, and it sounds great.  There is something thrilling about hearing the film's "true" soundtrack emerge from the layers of revision that have been imposed on it.

All that's left to do is the LFE channel.  I'm going to take a short break to rest my mind and ear before doing that, since it can be a bit wearing listening to the same thing over and over; and I've got a set of Beethoven symphonies conducted by John Eliot Gardiner that just came in the mail demanding my attention, and a half-finished Legend of Zelda story that isn't going to write itself, lol.  But I'll be back on it soon, and it shouldn't be long before this is all finished.  I already have the 2004 LFE track synched up from my previous project, so I just need to synch the 1997 version and decide which bass effects work best for the film.

msycamore said:

The Improvements is really easy to notice now with your new samples, so much detail and life revealed in the sound it's amazing, even when compared to the original RSO ones! Fantastic EQ! this is how its gonna be done, not loud and bright to fool the ears in to think it's sounding better, just gentle and subtle EQ. Thank you and well done ABC!

I agree entirely with this.  Interesting point about being bright and loud to fool the ear into thinking it sounded better: at first listen to the samples I actually preferred the SE versions because of that, but on further comparison realised (as I had already known) that they have a very harsh sound.  The scorching high frequencies become fatiguing after a while.  The warmer, more vinyl-like sound of the remaster calls less attention to itself and may seem a bit subdued on first comparison, but is so much more pleasing in the end.  The differences are particularly apparent having all the different versions to compare.

I haven't played them on my stereo yet, but I'm going to do that soon.  So far I listened on headphones--even though they're not that good the improvements are easily heard.  What I found particularly striking is just how many cuts between takes the film-sourced versions actually have.  Some of them are so obviously hacked together, I can't believe they actually thought that was an acceptable presentation of the music!  Even some more subtle cuts are still apparent because the reverb and decay of a previous note suddenly stops.  The RSO versions have much less of that, and there clearly wasn't anything wrong with the continuous takes on them, so why the hackjob was deemed necessary, I guess we'll never know . . .

Also interesting to note is the potential for greater dynamic range found in the RSO release.  Being mastered at a lower overall level, there are occasionally transient peaks that exceed the average by several decibels, and since the whole volume isn't jacked up towards maximum they have ample headroom without compression; by comparison the newer releases do not allow these peaks to exceed any other.  There is something to be said for going somewhat high in order to use as much digital bit-depth as possible, but not to the point that you are negatively affecting the sound.  It's a subtle thing, since obviously these are not overdriven to the point of clipping the way a lot of pop music can be, but it's definitely a factor in the sound of the newer releases.

ABC, I have to say I'm envious of your talent in using EQ to get such a good sound from less than ideal sources.  If I had your ability, my 70mm project would undoubtedly be more seamless than it currently is, but I don't have your level of skill, alas.  :)

I'll have a listen to the samples as soon as I can crank my stereo without bothering anyone.  ;)  So most likely tomorrow . . .

The one I have currently is version 2--I'm interested to see how this improves on it.

And it is for precisely that reason that I don't believe the list of differences between the 70 and 35mm versions of Empire to be completely accurate.  The 70 was released first, with the 35 having a few additional special effects shots and minor editing differences that were changed afterwards.  So given that, why would several lines of dialogue suddenly go missing from the later version?  Surely it should be the other way around?  I find it counterintuitive to believe that the second mix should released 'less complete'.  The choppy music editing I can almost believe would have been done at a later point, if someone involved in the process decided they didn't like how it sounded in those places as composed (though why they would think that, I have no idea), but really, the whole thing just doesn't make much sense.

Without a proper recording for reference, it would be impossible to make an accurate reproduction of Empire's 70mm mix.  If I were going to do anything with it, I would use the '93 version for its dynamics and just replace the hacked up music cues with the appropriate sections from the SE, since those really do sound better, and possibly insert the missing sound of the snowspeeder crashing, and leave it at that.  The different dialogue just gives me an 'inauthentic' feel every time I hear it, and R2 not tasting very good is funnier anyway.

I'm glad to hear that my edit of the quad laser scene works!  I had some doubts that it was of acceptable quality, but that may have come from listening to it too many times and overanalysing.  It isn't perfect, but it seems to work fine unless you listen really closely and are extraordinarily picky.  ;)

Huzzah, updating my browser sorted out my posting issues.  Teh wootness and stuff.

I'm quite certain that the stereo mix was done first.  My reason for saying this is because there a few sounds from the 70mm version that do not appear in the 35.  Most notably, during the first trench run, when Vader destroys the first of the Y-wings.  The explosion is in two parts: first, the fighter is hit, the picture cuts to the pilot reacting to his imminent destruction, then it explodes.  In the stereo mix (and the similar '85), there is a second of near silence during the pilot's reaction; in other mixes, this shot is accompanied by a loud screeching sound.  I first heard that effect in 1997 and thought it was an SE addition, and then later thought that it was one of the '93 alterations.  Imagine my surprise when I heard it on the in-theatre 70mm recording!

Since it makes little sense to suppose that this sound would have been removed from the first mix to the second, only to later reappear in the mono version, it is logical to conclude that the six-track was not the first to be completed.  The differences between them are nowhere near as pronounced as what was done to the mono mix, so it's not difficult to believe that there wasn't any more time to make changes before it had to go out.  I can't say I'm all that fond of the mono mix, partially because many of its changes sound like "special edition fixes" to me, though some of them do add positively to the film.

On to progress: as I thought, the quad laser scene was somewhat difficult to get right, but eventually I managed it.  My first thought was that I would have to use the 35mm for most of the scene, but I refrained from this as I would have found the dynamic loss unacceptable.  Instead I listened closely for ideal switching points in order to eliminate the additions while keeping the rest of the '93 version intact.  I've uploaded another test file for this scene (in 2.1 format again), because I'm curious to know how successful my efforts were.  I can't say it's 100% seamless because of the difference in music reverb between the two sources, but it works much better than I originally expected.  It's probably about as good as I can make it, but I want to know if that is good enough.

Download here: http://www.sendspace.com/file/y6yrtg

Only a few more changes to be edited out, and then the LFE channel, and this thing will be done!

I don't actually have the comparison track, because I've had trouble with newsgroup access, but I did download the in-theatre recording of the 70mm mix around that time.  Sadly, I no longer have it, for it was a casualty of my old computer's death.  The sound quality wasn't that great and the speed was too slow, but I do remember that most of it sounded very similar to the Definitive Collection mix.  I've been making my replacements based on the list Belbecus provided, which I have saved to a text file.

There's one thing on the list that is confusing me a bit--he lists "water noise" during the garbage pit scene, but I've listened to it several times and for the life of me I can't find any extra water sounds that aren't in the 35.  I think there are more splashes in the mono mix, but I have yet to find them in the '93.  Just to be safe I used the older mix during that section in case there's something I'm missing, but I'm not sure.  I know there are a few sounds that appear in the 70mm that weren't in the 35, but as yet I haven't found anything in the 35 that wouldn't also be in the 70!

As far as dynamics go, I've noticed that in the loudest passages on the DC, the very highest peaks are occasionally clipped.  I'm not 100% sure if it is like that on the laserdisc itself or if that is an artefact of the sample rate conversion to 48 khz; but since Belbecus used a very high quality converter I imagine it is probably inherent to the source.  It isn't really audible, since it doesn't ever clip for more than 60 samples or so, but it's interesting.  Based on that, I would speculate that the 70mm original probably had additional headroom beyond what appears on the DC mix.  Certainly its bass response would have been greater with two LFE channels--the '93 version could include only as much low frequency information as two channel dynamics will allow for.  I recall the in-theatre recording sometimes showing peak distortion, often coinciding with LFE from the special edition.  Exactly how loud the bass actually was is unclear, and will be the aspect of this recreation that is most subject to my creative judgement.

I only have the '85 mix as a lossy version from the Editdroid disc, but aside from a widening of the stereo image and the insertion of C-3PO's line about the tractor beam, it appears to be identical to the '77 stereo, including the dynamics.  I too have noticed the music reverb you mention in the quad laser scene; it must have been a creative choice of some sort.

Since the 70mm mix featured surround sound, a 5.1 track would probably be the best way to release this, but certainly stereo or 2.1 versions can be made available if desired, as well.

I appreciate your encouragement!  It's definitely closing in on completion . . .

Ah, of course I mean the original 70mm mix from 1977, not the SE. ;)

If there's any discernible difference between the DTS and Dolby versions of the SE, I'd be very surprised.  Any such disparity would probably relate only to their differing ways storing and encoding the audio data--ie, theatrical DTS format stores the LFE information in the surround channels and low-pass filters it out to the subwoofers due to bandwidth restrictions.  They may have corrected for phase and level slightly differently because of such things, but that's the only reason I can think of.  Regardless, the SE soundtrack is decidedly inferior to the '77 original both in dynamics and sound quality, though still vastly preferable to the awful 2004 dvd mix.

There is definitely at least one 70mm print of Star Wars in the hands of a private collector, according to this link: http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/archive/index.php/t-141011.html

Steve Hoffman was lucky enough to see it a couple years ago, and according to him, it still looked and sounded fantastic despite its age.  Obviously going from a theatrical print may not be ideal, but given all the alterations that have been made to the original, possibly even at the negative level, this might actually be the best surviving copy of the film in existence.  At least it is in the hands of someone who treats it with care and respect, even if the chances of it being transferred and released are very slim at best.

What I find interesting is his assertion of its superiority over the SE in quality terms.  That the '97 soundtrack is significantly less dynamic is obvious from even a casual comparison with the DC mix--but he also says the image of the SE was much softer than what he saw.  I wonder if that means they really did scan the whole film to digital for the sake of re-compositing the effects.  They only had 2k scanning in the 90's, which is less resolution than 35mm film to be sure, and if true it would certainly account for the disparity.

Okay, so far I'm about half done replacing the altered sound effects.  I think the extra TIE fighter blasts during the quad laser battle will be the most difficult, because the whole scene has one continuous and prominent music cue.  I try to keep the 35mm segments as brief as possible, because I want to retain as much dynamic range from the '93 version as I can, but necessarily any replacements will be somewhat compromised in that respect.  I can partially compensate by selectively raising the volume, but it's always going to fall short of the original in that respect.  The sound quality of the 35mm mix has noticeably lower fidelity, too, but that's the price that must be paid for the removal of inauthentic sounds.  Thus far I think I've done pretty well disguising the inserts and making the transitions unnoticeable, so it shouldn't be much of a problem.

Satanika said he would take care of upmixing when it's done, so a 5.1 version will be available.  I believe he used the ATSurround plugin for Foobar2000, which is probably pretty similar to Prologic II.  I can't wait to hear this thing when it's completed.  :)

There is a list of differences between the 35mm and 70mm versions of Empire, but since there are no recordings available, I find myself a bit sceptical that all of those are actually from the 70mm soundtrack at all.  Remember, it was produced first, with some effects shots incomplete compared to the later 35mm release--so how does it make sense for it to have a more complete soundtrack with additional dialogue and more polished music edits?  That doesn't seem logical to me.  Some of those differences may be authentic, but some could well be apocryphal.

Ah, sorry about that.  My browser for some reason is having trouble getting the post button to work, so I ended up copying and pasting the text onto a different computer and for some reason it ended up in a strange font.  I'm not sure what the problem is, but I'll try not to have that happen.  :)

I remember reading about his work with interest.  I ended up starting this myself since he hasn't been around lately--I think his project files were deleted?  Moth3r, you had an interesting notion of using the surround effects from the rear channels of the '97 mix in place of the matrixed sounds on the '93.  I considered doing that, but it seemed ultimately it would be more problematic to combine too many things together, and for the most part I think the film's rear channel effects tend to stay within the Prologic 100 hz to 7 khz range anyway, although I haven't tested that for sure.

I'm finding that I have to be very careful where I transition between the '77 and '93 mixes.  Placing a transition just before a loud sound effect or between scenes tends to give the best results.  Short cross-fades of 250 samples or so can give a better blending than a straight cut.  Switching in the middle of a music cue is difficult, because the difference in sound quality between the two sources is then the most noticeable, and for that reason I've occasionally had to let the '77 stereo run on a bit longer than I would have liked in order to find a good place to change back.  Belbecus posted that the stereo image of the music in the 35mm mix is narrower than it is for the '93, and I have also found that to be the case.

Sometimes I almost feel like I'm nitpicking the 1993 version by doing this, because many of the added effects are innocuous or contribute in a positive way to the overall sound.  But at the same time, eliminating the additions brings it more in line with the way I remember it sounding, growing up with the '85 mix on vhs.  And a few of the additions really were unnecessary, so I'm not sorry to see those go.

The 6-track magnetic soundtrack of Star Wars found on 70mm prints has never officially been released on home video.  With the dynamic range, bass, and discrete channel surround sound provided by the format, it gave the best sonic experience for the film.  Later remixes have never completely captured the feel of the original.

It has been shown that the 1993 Definitive Collection laserdisc soundtrack comes the closest, since unlike other releases, much of this mix was sourced from the 70mm printmaster.  But because of numerous sound effects added to the 1993 version (some of which are worthy additions, while others prove more distracting), it sometimes leaves the listener with the feeling that they are not hearing the film’s “real” sound mix.  It is also a stereo/Prologic downmix while the original utilized discrete channels.  The 1997 special edition was mixed for the 5.1 format, but contains even more added sounds and often has a rather different balance – and strangely, less dynamic range than the 1993 version.  The 2004 DVD mix was done over from scratch, has no resemblance to the original whatsoever, and is – to put it mildly – highly questionable in its creative choices.

For a while I pondered whether it would be worthwhile to try to recreate the 70mm soundtrack, and in March 2010 I decided to find out.  To do so required the altered segments of the 1993 mix to be replaced with their equivalents from earlier home video releases, adjusting the levels to match and retaining the '93 version’s bass content.  To replicate the theatrical experience further, a custom LFE channel was assembled, edited carefully to blend with the rest of the soundtrack, and the matrixed stereo upmixed to five channels, creating a soundtrack in 5.1 format that sounds very much like what was heard on 70mm prints. With the only references available being in-theater recordings of 70mm screenings as well as the 1993 laserdisc mix itself, and no access to the discrete channels of the real thing, obviously this version cannot precisely replicate the original mix in every detail. But short of its ever being included in an official release of the original movie (for which I won’t hold my breath), this is the next best thing.

As of May 2018, I have produced the third version of this 70mm recreation soundtrack, which can be found accompanying the 4K77 project. Earlier versions have been used in the Despecialized Edition and elsewhere, and I hope this new version will provide a meaningful improvement in quality, as well as fulfilling the stated goal of trying to sound as much like the original mix as possible.

I am definitely looking forward to hearing the audiophile edition!  I've enjoyed previous versions a great deal, and if this is an improvement I am all for it.  The LP mixes nearly always sound superior to the others, and having more LP layers is definitely a good thing--I've always liked hearing the instruments that are brought out more in those versions.  Keep up the great work ABC!

I was considering doing something of that sort, but pretty much abandoned the idea because frankly, it's just too much of a pain.  Not only are there overt editing differences, but apparently, there are missing frames every time an optical composite was re-done for the special edition.  You'd have to upmix and patch in sections of the '93 mix for places where the edit was changed as well.  Considering that even different audio mixes of the original versions don't easily synch to each other, one so altered won't be made to fit the original film without a lot of tedious work.  It could be done, of course, and I would be interested in such a thing if it was, but it would be difficult.

The '97 mix does sound rather good in 5.1, but I think ultimately I still prefer the '93 version since it is closer to the original 70mm mix, and has greater dynamic range and sound quality.

I especially like hearing the sections that are supplemented with 7FN's LP transfer.  It is fascinating to hear the extra flute, synth, and vocal parts that seem to have been left out of the other versions, not to mention the added clarity of the mix in general.

After those, most of the tracks that came from the RSO cd usually sound the best.  It's funny how review sites tend to favour the SE's as having better sound quality than older releases, when clearly that's not the case.