brimforge

Now THAT's improvement ;-)

the others were somewhat too "yellow" for my taste

The main problem of the PT was, that it left many things to the "EU", so keypoints were explained there instead in the movies ...

So the main goal should be:

A) remove things that are not explained onscreen and don't need to be shown either

B) try to make unexplained things, like "force ghosts" or "Sith" (or any other interesting keyfeature) more accessable

Lucas did himself and us in general a bad service in introducing concepts like "midichlorians" (I don't have a problem with that), but not using it further to explain why NO Jedi/Sith are cloned (THAT would have been the MAIN reason WHY, imho!) - the worst "explanation" was the "rule of two"...

so this project is on hold ?

too bad, I really like the idea editing all into one movie - be it only OT or even OT+PT

and will it destroy only Alderaan or will you show it as a growning "phantom menace", that wrecks havoc on its path, till it is destroyed by the rebel forces ?

Darth Lucas said:

oh_riginal said:

I'm not sure if you are planning on revealing the 2nd Death Star during the ESB scenes, or keeping it within the ROTJ section. However, you could cut from the Millennium Falcon's departure from the Rebel fleet and wipe to Vader arriving at the 2nd Death Star, but possibly have Palpatine already there, waiting in the throne room for Vader to come report to him? I don't know, just throwing some ideas in there.

 Remember, in this edit there is no "2nd Death Star" as the first was never destroyed.  Any shots of the 2nd Death Star will either be replaced with shots of the first from ANH or the old death star will be rotoscoped into the scene in place of DS2.  I think the scene with Palpatine and Vader will be my best bet, however, in bridging the gap between Empire and Jedi, but some dialogue will have to be removed/changed so that the whole construction aspect is gone.

 so you are using "DS1" in RotJ - will you be using "DS2" in ANH, as if we will get to see the construction or something ?

maybe with a scene, where Tarkin or Jerjerod talks to Vader about soon to finish the "ultimate weapon" ?

a very cool project, too bad you had lost some of your work due a harddisk failure - always keep a backup somewhere ;-)

Next STOP:

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/If-you-need-to-B-tch-about-something-this-is-the-place/topic/11555/

"Do you speak b*tche?" - no more to say. ;-)

some folks here need to get a RL - with a hobby, wife, kids ... or just do an edit themselves, to see how much work THAT really is!

so keep cool and enjoy the ride (as long as it takes) ;-)

back on track (hopefully ...)

Ronster said:

I thought Han already had a death warrant out on him and Vaders new Bounty was in conflict with the Jabba Bounty?

hm, but Jabba also wanted Solo alive or he would have him executed at the moment Fett brought him back - Greedo was just a little hasty (and had his own grudge with Solo)

not saying, that the other BHs would have tried to take Solo alive (if they knew hew shoots first!) - therefore the "reminder" of Vader is valid for ALL in this group, Fett is just his main man to talk to ...

ok, I wanted to try A connection that coul tie up the loopholes and bridges on how, what we would get in a "Clone War"

so my take on things, was that (some) Jedi search for suited candidates, that have a decent force-sensibility and maybe other traits that are beneficial for cloning ...

on the other hand, this could also work as the "bad guys" looking for their "champion/s" to get their army started

just needs to give the impression, that the clones didn't come out of tjhe blue sky and nobody really cares why and how "ordered" them - it was a very dumb thing, even in times of conflict, to use a "weapon", that is of uncertain origin and not tested (as proof: "Order 66")

as for how story could evolve, I made some suggestions in the other threads, but I prefer to have a "droids/clones" then "clones/clones" war or "clones/clones" from the start - but if one side changes it makes more sense, as for why robots are not so good looked at in the OT (except them being still "slaves")

Jedi could start a "clone army" because of the returning threat of a Sith Empire - and if one states in the E1-crawl or "prologe", that before the Jedi had a war against Mandalorians or Sith / Dark Jedi, it could be reasoned, why they are so few in numbers (being a BIG galaxy) - back then also clones could have been used (but to a "better" outcome), meaning this is the "last" Clone War (in a series of many)

after this the technology is banned or simply destroyed, because imperial technicians prefer to build "Battle Moons" and not "small armies" ;-)

brash_stryker said:

Yes. My interpretation was always that the scanners only extended beyond the surface of the ship, therefore by attaching itself like a limpet to the Star Destroyer's surface, it went unnoticed. 

It's pretty damn obvious that it doesn't actually have a cloaking device. If it did, why would it need to attach itself like that at all?

Han knew from experience (or military training?) that those cruisers got a blind spot somewhere, so he tricked them real good ;-)

if such small ships could have cloaking devices, surely Fett would have built one into his ship - but he just flew out of detection range, so no worries there ...

hm, depends on what one wants to accomplish and how the edit should flow ...

if one took flashbacks or timelaps into account, then Qui-Gon = Dooku (with some tweaking) and the whole "who ordered, why clones, what?" problem could be solved to an extend - only the rest needs to fit the plot

Ronster said:

But the orders Vader gives suggests Boba had previously been given orders not to kill his bounties and did. So he did not follow orders and had to be warned specifically not to disintegrate this particular bounty and was very clearly like I let you off the last time you did that.

But if you like to think of Boba fett as someone who just flies around the galaxy following orders and that bounty hunter assassinations are as clean cut as what you make them out to be then ok.

I always thought he just reminded Fett (and the rest) that this was NO assassination job, cause it would be easier to kill the subject and bring proof back to collect the bounty ...

in the old west bounty hunters had often the choice "dead or alive" - somtimes dead was rewarded higher (depending on the criminal)

but in this case Vader needed his bait to lure Luke into the trap and test the device (carbonite freezer) on a living person - so no killing today ;-)

so I watched a docu about cloning and I got a little idea:

there needs to be some conflict as to why (Re)public is hostile or indifferent towards the Jedi - and not us seeing the Order as out of contact with reality - so in the docu they said today there is only one sample needed to clone (the process itself is still complicated and not 100%) - why not spill the whol "midichlorians" (which most aren't fond of) and keep the twist that Qui-Gon (or Dooku) forseeing a war prepaired Jedi clones (Ani could be one chosen donator - another reason why he could be brought to Corscant) - as for the "Grand Army of the Republic", it rings wrong to my ears, that they would use some shady "bounty hunter" - in my context he should be A) a "simple farmer" (with the best genetic traits) or B) an elite mercenary (chosen from a list)

it did sound very random (ok Dooku/Sidious searched for a ideal type, but that was offscreen ...)

ending in a real "Clone War" - Jedi (or Sith) against Republic Troopers (before there could he Droids or both sides could clone "best" fighters) - making a unique outfit (armour, ships) more important, or one could get lost in the massive battles ;-)

arg, "LOST Planet" wasn't what I had in mind ... at least my version would have an ending, that made sense ;-P

@Ronster

hehe, I thought more of a "recap" of "The Old Republic" (or other "Tales of the Jedi") - so we really don't need to explain (again?) what the Force is, or Jedi, Sith, and so on ...

had some ideas, but they need some more thinking and cleaning before I throw them into this room ;-)

edit: I remember one thing I forgot to include in my lists:

3PO and R2 on Endor - so ok, the astromech is sort of the "swiss army knife", he has his purpose (even if he fails to open the door ...)

but 3PO stands out as the sore thumb in the green woods :-/

here I would add some idols (totems) picturing some gods or deities, resembling our golden boy ;-)

again the protocol droid is only part of the group because story needs him as the translator ...

Doc Sportello said:

That's funny I originally titled it The Hidden Planet, based on my love for the 1956 film The Forbidden Planet and obviously The Hidden Fortress. Later changing it to The Missing Planet to match Obi-Wan's dialogue exchange with r4, but I agree The Hidden Planet is the superior title. Very Flash Gordon.

"The Hidden Planet" it is!

 Ha! that are two very nice references ...

I would have called one Episode "The Lost Planet" to keep it ambiguous, as to if the location is not known or it is destroyed ;-)

Ronster said:

The story needs a reason to be told, and show how things are connected that you would never guess. Not My Dad, My Mum, My Brother, My Sister, My Uncle, My Auntie, My Son, My Daughter,My Business, My Politics,  My 2nd cousins goldfishes niece. It is a Trash piece. The thing about it is the plot is so bad and so mind numbingly simple that I would even struggle to write something as bad as these films and I am not a writer.

Are we really meant to believe we are in this large Universe where everyone is related to one another in some way at a very close level. The story also lacks any kind of maturity that even a child would ask simple yet big questions without thought and if aimed at children how did it manage to educate or teach them anything of the world we live in. What was the moral of the story?

You could argue that the prequels focused on Politics and that they tried to show that some politicians will say whatever they can and manipulate to get into power for their own desires?

 some of your ideas are really hard to fit in, but this sums it up:

the OT was a fairy tale told for/to teenagers, so kids and adults could relate to it ...

the PT is a soap told to kids - and this is why it failed!

Lucas didn't understand the whys and whats of the OT - back then he just took "Dune" and mixed it with many good ideas from great stories (Flash Gordon, Kurosawa, etc.)

the PT lacks most of the "background" - and when it comes into play (AotC - "The Searchers") it blalantly copies the original (in design)

Star Wars had its share of politics too, but it was presented in short interesting dialoge brought by clever characters (Tarkin!)

more than Rise of Palpatine/Vader (or Fall of the Republic/Jedi) we need to see the conflicting parties in the senate (hawks VS doves), the military pushing for more control and power (money!) and the peaceful systems (Alderaan) warning to not burn the whole galaxy and bringing a civil war afterwards (like what we got in the OT!)

maybe show some plotting, even the "good" guys take desperate meassures, founding coalitions with others, who are shady ...

best possibility to add Mon Mothma and other pre-Alliance members (also cut scene available here)

there are some nice ideas how to lay out the events of the PT - "Clone Wars", that meant for me ALWAYS, that there would be at least 1 group who used cloned troops to overcome the other side

the question remains: what after the last "Clone War" ?

one solution, which stands out like the "pink elephant", is to have Jedi clone troops - should they fight against "Sith" ? or "Mandalorians" or just against Droids, later the other side steals the cloning technology and it goes to an all-out WAR ... resulting , that cloning is forbidden or completely lost (or forgotten)

"Midichlorians" had the only purpose in my mind, to explain, why there are / could be no clones of the Jedi (or why the "Sith" didn't do it first - other than have that stupid "Rule of 2")

as for lightsabers: I am on the train that there should be more colors than blue/red/green - because in the beginning Lucas had only white ones (Wow!) - and blue/red is nicer looking - later green was made to help post production, because blue saber on blue sky wasn't that good ...

so back then it was a technical problem/sollution - not the mystical meaning (yeah later maybe) - so what, let the Jedi have multicolored sabers, mabye not all colors, only the light ones for "good" and red always for "Sith" - and maybe "purple" for outcasts (like "Dooku")

like I said before, Lucas took many ideas from "Dune" therefore "Prophecy", "Genetics" and the "Messiah" - even the desert planet - are mirrored in Star Wars - but he forgot to add "Spice" or another link, so that some points make sense (as to why "Tatooine" should be the most important planet, even when we are told by Luke it should not be so ...)

Ady wants to make the "cloning tech" the maguffin of the PT - fine, even Bingos "Heritage" or "Cult" idea could work, all depends on whats next ;-)

not sure if I want to have the "slave plot", yeah "Spartacus" would have been cool, but we didn't get there - but if one like to have it, maybe try some footage from "Stargate" ? - give a new look to "Tatooine" or other planet and can be tweaked into more

so if we take homage, better make "Ben Hur" into a "Skyhopper" race (like some proposed), and Anakin a skilled pilot - even the idea to have him or Owen be spice traders would fit nicely

like Bingo, I am fond of the "Jekyll/Hide" transformation of Anakin - making the "Dark Side" into a "drug" that alters mind, soul and body ("Secret Window" indeed) - so extra to some nightmares he got, he could have fights or visions (which we later learn are internal conflicts like Lukes "duel" in the cave)

but I would keep "Maul" aswell, only change "Dooku" to a fallen Jedi (maybe restore the "Lost 20") - "Maul" would transform from "ex-pupil" to "proto-Vader", killing himself off in RotS in duel with "Anakin"

no "Grievous", because his storyline was all offscreen, so he didn't function as a working character - better cut or salvage what can be used from him

for "Sidious": I would keep him in all PTs as a holo, like in ESB, no connection to Palpatine (which is a ruthless politician, but only interested in "history" and "arifacts"), never leaving his secure lair ...

maybe keep "Padme" alive, only for her eventually to die in ANH or show up much older from exile in RotJ

which brings me to an idea very radical:

as for 6 parts of "Star Wars" - I would start before "Episode 1" with a prologe of different scenes, overlayed by voiceover explaining what is what, then move on to "Chapter 1" - Episodes 2-5 would be all with crawl and no dialoge at end, but "Episode 6" should end with an epiloge, that states what happened in the next months/years (maybe to leave an open end for more adventures ...)

Bingowings said:

ROTJ and the PT allow for more scope to actually build story. In many ways Ady and the team are allowed more freedom while re-sculpting the PT because the interested audience are not as attached to the material in it's current form.

 having started my journey with Jedi back then, following the marvel comics to eventually seeing Hope and Empire - I am more on the train to "revisit" ALL movies (the PT just needs more attention) - if only for 6 or even more parts ;-)

having read the whole thread, I collected some ideas that ring true for me, not meaning, Adywan or someone else needs to build their edit around it, just putting my credits into the pot ...

first on with the OT - and what Jedi "needs":

- a general thought: what if Obi-Wan didn't know ?

what if he really thought he told Luke the truth about his father ?

meaning: let "Maul" kill "Anakin" in a lava-battle, reminding us a little to what Sherlock Holmes and Moriarty happend (with Watson=Obi-Wan watching) - so he saw the fall of his pupil and friend, can pick up the lighsaber for Luke and doesn't be the cruel liar ...

- another idea for this "bigger insight" of Obi-Wan (through the force!):

as Obi-Wan sacrifices himself to help Luke and friends escape, he merges with the Force and finds out, A) Anakin didn't die, he became "Darth Vader" (aka "Maul") - B) and this is a concept on how to keep Yoda "a secret" (not for us viewers, but when I was younger I knew he was the Jedi Master and not some gnome!): if Yoda "died" in the "Clone Wars" (or during "Order 666"), maybe he got shot down on Dagobah, making his "island" his new home (ala Robinson Crusoe), even a Sith Assassin could have crashed with him ...

so Obi-Wan after "death" could have gotten "infos" about his pupils and master (as to where he is, telling Luke later on Hoth in a vision) - in RotJ the dialog needs to be altered, so he doesn't throw his "point of view" curveball, and giving Luke another lesson how the Force unviels the shroud of darkness ;-)

moving to RotJ:

- I like to have Luke complete his training, maybe build his lightsaber on Dagobah, then going over to Vader and the new Deathstar (hm, some brought up the question, if the rebels name it like that - why just don't call it the "Ultimate Weapon", because it will be or is)

- the Palace rescue is rather botched, so if it isn't all for Luke or a overall plan, the better, because it seems very improvised, so Leia got impatient and took matters in her hands, before Luke could come up with a working one ...

- dancing scene: why not add "Mara Jade" (don't know how she called herself there) for an interlude - mixing a new version of "Lapti Nek" without the lyrics, only the melody (because we got very different music in Star Wars, so a disco style isn't so bad)

- Boba Fett shouldn't be Jabbas bodyguard, if he is in Jedi, then give him a purpose, like deliver the info to the Rebels (that could show he hasn't a clear path, and only money is his interest)

- thought about the Sarlacc, the beak isn't very convincing, give it better working tentacles also, like in "Tremors" or "Grabbers" ;-)

- what I really like from the ANH:SE is the "Imperial Transport Shuttle", this should be the one that the "strike force" could take to Endor, the other is just too small and more like a limo for personal transport and not for equipment shippments ...

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sentinel-class_landing_craft

speaking of shuttles, how about changing Palpatines to the one he had in RotS ?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Theta-class_T-2c_shuttle

only with more imperial / royal markings - so Vader would be the only one with the classic Lambda shuttle:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Lambda-class_T-4a_shuttle

now the viewer has more ships and is not distracted as to why the Empire has only 1 ship for all *g*

as for ships: we need MORE B-Wings - I want to see them blast apart some SDs like in the promo shot, that was posted everywhere back then!

- so the Rebels land with the "new" ship and split to get to the shield bunker ... this could add later for the search Vader orders: some Troopers or a Biker patrol could find the empty ship and report this - giving more tension, as to what the next morning will bring (more Troops!)

maybe the Rebels could have brought the "Endor Speeder" (that was made into a toy, but never seen onscreen), for scouting out the area?

I like the notion that the Rebels could stakeout the place before moving in with Han and company ...

- now to what I dislike: Ewoks to be a brutal fighting machine - no no no to that, if at all, they should be scouts and clever inhabitants of the woods, so helping the Rebels, YES, but NO extreme Rambo traps - that is the thing that just jumps out to comical ...

have them put up some fight, but not giving much damage to heavily armed troops!

only one thing I could imagine that would work as a "suprise" which is in line with this primitive tribe, could be that they lure a (some) beast(s), into a stampede to attack the Imperial Forces (making them use Nature against Technology!)

nice, looks so much better, curious what can be done to make the story "better" ;-)

hm, maybe "Bane" could be used as "proto-Vader" ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wk-kNvr2Bgs

yeah, in general that will be the case, it would be only interesting for special edits (of OT) where you need the classic sounds

an extra sound/voice library for PT edits would be cool, for example if one likes to keep "Dooku" (or just change his mood), maybe turn him "good"

reading the "ideas/radical redux" threads - I really would like to use the better(!) voices of the Super/Battle Droids from "Republic Commando", they were menacing and not funny at all ...

extra/new dialogue for "Anakin" (Sebastian Shaw? / James Franco!) or "Obi-Wan" (Alec Guiness/Ewan McGregor) could help tweak that beast to sound more like a Star Wars trilogy ;-)

hehe, sounds a little like the "Alien" in MiB (at the beginning, when they catch illegal bordercrossers)

hm, they pixeled his face, could they have manipulated his voice too?

if so, then a realistic sounding "alien" would be very easy to accomplish ;-)

I tried to fake some Jabba lines (as Windows sounds), you just need to know how and what "tools" you need ...

http://i.imgur.com/Xe8ESJ3.jpg

hm ...

works for me

wow, after reading all the interesting stuff here, I got some ideas and suggesstions:

Bingo, your idea to either put the Executor or another SSD in ANH - if it didn't take away the reveal shot in ESB, it would be a nice addition, so maybe - should it show up several times during ANH or just at the beginning (aka as Vaders ship) ?

I like the notion to replace "windows" which seem to be placed at odd spots with monitor screens or to change the setting to match the scene (escape pod)

the whole Deathstar update left a few questions:

- should it be over Coruscant ? maybe better to have that "Area 51" near Endor (and possible gas planet)

- show how the DS jumps to/fro Hyperspace

- nice idea with the "hiding" (nebular / asteroid field) ... not sure if we need to see only bits and pieces or always know it is the baddies station (maybe show its true size later - "look at the size of that thing!")

- inside could use some redecoration (I really like what Angel tried and did in some pictures => less red, more dark&gray)

not sure if some tubes or parts in the scene with Obi-Wan switching off the tractor beam aren't hidden in the shadow (need to rewatch that)

jumpcut to a curious idea: 3PO the carrier of the plans and R2 as his "bodyguard", hehe I like this on the level, as there are to be "spy droids" - only them knowing what they are doing *g*

indeed ANH needs more holograms, if possible and maybe Jabba is one of those scenes - on the other hand Han making a new deal at his palace would be nice too

I always had problem with the death of Lukes (foster)parents - how come that the Imperials shoot some jawas like it was an attack from Sandpeople, only burning the Lars homestead ?

the burnt skeletons are kind of creepy, maybe one could replace those with two covered bodies (or change the scene so that Luke is standing above them later)

Old Ben should scare the Tusken off with the classic Krayt dragon sound, but not with his arms waving - the suggestion of a shadow is cool, maybe leave the valley empty and Obi throws some rocks with the Force ?

Interesting as nobody thought of it, or found it not fitting: why not have a meditiation chamber for Vader on the DS ?

it would solve his brooding, long walks around - and he could search his feelings about the distubance that Old Ben caused

on that level, I don't think the "Vader knows Leia" idea works - not even Vader "sensing" Luke ...

as I was younger, my take on the Force was that it worked like in Highlander, where one was born as Immortal and all other knew that you are one too - the scene where Vader feels Kenobi, suggested this to me

later he senses Luke, but only when he uses his new found skills in the Force - Leia never had training, so Vader should not "feel" anything in her, maybe strong personas in the Star Wars universe have a high "Force level" by birth (and some like Luke/Vader" are stronger) - plus when one is trained, the practice of the skills feels like waves in the Force

as for "Padme" - good idea that she could have teached Ben/Yoda (and "Ani") how to become a Force ghost* - question remains who Leia called mother ?

possible sollution(s):

- "Padme" never died, the coffin was empty and all in the galaxy think she is dead (under Bail's protection she lived on Alderaan and raised her daugther)

plus the addition, that "Padme" is "Mon Mothma", the real leader ot the Alliance (this "reveal" could be either offscreen or in "Episode VI")

- she died long bevor ANH (therfore the ghost is possible) and Leia meant her foster mother (knowing or not, why she was sad ...)

*how did "Padme" learn this skill ? (she a Jedi too?)

I thought about Kenobi fight on the DS:

- he could do a "stunt" like Luke in Jabbas Palace, but he is a sneaky one so better not leave corpses ;-)

and blaster fire could trigger alarms too ...

the journey of the old hero through the maze, only to confront the "minotaur" (aka Vader) is a nice picture!

so should Ben fight or just hold off his ex-pupil until the others have escaped ?

the Kendo style is good, but I rather have a classic fecing duel - or leave it at mind games, we wait for the big one, only for Obi-Wan to raise his weapon to sacrafice himself ...

I think better position Vader before the blast doors, which are closed, later they are open for Luke/Ben to see the whole picture and escape the hangar

lastly I really wish the approach to Yavin IV that the Falcon takes is reduced to a minimum, it drags and brings the movie nearly to a stop.

Ok, that was all I could come up / remember, maybe got some more after I read other threads here ;-)

Jaitea said:

All mine are gone, I was getting an email every couple of days from youtube about copyright, so I eventually lost all mock-ups....damn the Blu-Rays

too bad you didn't put more stuff on vimeo, I read the ideas you and Angel threw into the pot, but couldn't see the outcome :-(

ok the first was way to yellow, now it got more the reds, it's better for the eyes

doesn't help correct the neimodian on the right side, he looks just weird ...

StarmanSkywalker said:

Dude, it is a set. xD

still, even a "real set" can look very cgi, and by the way they produced scenes in combination with blue/green screen, anything that makes the stuff seem "real" is better ;-)

hm, Obi looks ... how can I describe it?

but the droids and the neimodian are really strange

maybe because it's a closeup, that messes with some colors and the focus brings out more of the details, that are hidden in a wideshot?