adywan

satanika said:

Here's one (tiny) thing that's always bothered me... (Not sure if it's been mentioned, if so, sorry :) )



It looks like one of the claws of the Tauntaun model broke off... Makes it look a bit fake.

It's actually the webbed part between it's claws. So doesn't need fixing

ben_danger said:

 

maybe another battledroid reference could be added?

Sluggo said:

seven said:

We first see IG-88 here in the bounty hunter scene.

 

In the book "Tales of a Bounty Hunter" Boba Fett 'killed' IG-88 and he wound up here in the junk pile (next to the furnace). But for continuity, his color will have to be changed to match.

 

Ady's not gonna make a change based on an EU book. The book should have matched the movie.

I have said before that the EU does not exist to me and there will be nothing changed or added because it has been referenced in anything outside of the movies. There are many protocol droids that look just like 3PO and are different colours so there is bound to be other versions of IG-88. Also there will be no PT droids anywhere in ESB:R. The reference was there in ANH:R because it was a nod to link the two trilogies. There doesn't need to be any more in the other movies.

R5D4 fan said:

Not for nothing, but there's a music bridge that was in the 1980 version that was "improved" for the revisions. It's right when Yoda pulls the X-wing out of the swamp and answers Luke's scepticism with "That is why you fail..." Then there's the shot of the shuttle going to Vader's ship and Captain Needa hitting the floor. The original bridge was less busy, minus the blaring horns.........

Adywan, will you be using the original or the new "special edition" version?

Thanks

Joe

The pre-SE version was a horrible cut to a different secton of the music. For the SE it was returned to the way it was originally recorded (and was on the soundtracks LPs) and IMHO sounds 100% better, so the SE version will be staying.

Ripplin said:

Taken from the 35mm thread, this is a still from the Vintage Edit, but is present in the other examples as well:

Very crooked saber there, Luke. :p

Yeh, all crooked sabers will be fixed.

gavin77 said:

Just one unpopular post for those of us who actually really like the PT......go PT go.....great movies!!!

God, you're really gonna hate me when i get to the PT. I'm going to be ripping those movies to shreds, beyond all recognition. lol

doubleofive said:

I was digging through T-bon'e Star Wars Universe and was just reading his review of the 2004 DVDs. He never mentions the bad colors (he believed they were deliberate changes), but I did find this part very interesting:

Right before the DVDs were released, I received a message from a friend who’s in the industry asking if I’ve seen the bad rendering of R2-D2 in Episode V. I really didn’t have any idea what he meant but he sent me a few pictures to compare the shots. I did and to be frank, I don’t really see anything all that upsetting. He seemed to be really upset about the big eye in particular.

Here's what he had to say:

What we are seeing here, is what appears to be a horrible re-rendering job of R2-D2. What I mean by this, is that they took the actual R2-D2 from the scene (that didn't have any 'blue' in it because it would have disappeared into the blue screen effects work) and placed CGI rendered 'blue pieces' over the originals to change the color of him from black to blue. What has incompetently occurred here is two serious flaws.

The first is the obvious poor rendering of R2's 'EYE' (the view port in the head that Kenny Baker could see out of) that is the square-ish panel on the front with a rounded lens in the center of it. What you will see, is how this horribly rendered replacement view port recreates R2's lens in an absolutely ridiculous and flawed way. Instead of being the right size, it is roughly 35% smaller and has the extra space around the lens made up with blue coloring. Just do a quick comparison between R2 in ANY other shot in the saga and you will see how HORRIBLE this looks and how poorly executed this change was.

Secondly, you will also notice in the same shot, that the side blue panels on R2 now also have an overlay of 'blue' to cover the original 'black' panels. These are just below the 'eye' and go around his head. The problem here is that by the end of the shot, R2 is moving his head back and forth, but the blue overlays move at a different speed to the rest of his head! So instead of a quick fine tuning that the effects element and rendering could have had, they sloppily just threw this overlay on, and didn't make any effort to perfect this effects shot.

In general, this is a horrible rendering job, and another embarrassment that no filmmaker should ever let get out. This DVD set was rushed, and the flaws of the rush are evident; especially the incompetent and inconsistent sound mix on A New Hope including the reversed music channels in the surrounds.

After looking at it for a while, I do see what he means but since my eye wasn’t looking for it, I didn’t notice it. The dark inset part of the eye is a bit small. Click on the image to the right for a nice comparison of all three versions of the shot in question. The top shot is from the new DVD set, the bottom left is from the original release (note the black panels on R2), and the bottom right is the 1997 Special Edition version. Looking at them all together it does seem they went a little overboard with the blue for the DVD release. Personally, I still don’t think this shot looks that bad but my friend was pretty adamant that it didn’t look so hot so I’d be remiss not to mention it. I mean, this is really nit picky stuff, after all. He’s a good guy and very professional so I’m sure his complaint is valid. I think he’s an R2-D2 fan so of course he’s a little biased. The set may have been rushed but it's OK for a set to hold us over until...whenever.

Here is the comparison:

I think I've noticed the drift before and this shot has R2's panels way more blue than the others, but CG panels when the 1997 version looks just fine? What do you think? Are they CG panels or just a product of the higher resolution?

And to bring it back to the revelency of the thread, how should Ady handle this?

Only that shot and 1 other looks fine in the '97 version (and in the 2004 version but heavily saturated). That comparison shot is very misleading because the 2004 shot is from a different section where the colouring is really bad. If they had put the correct shot in there for the 2004 version then it would ahve looked almost the same as the '97 versionthey overdid the rest of the shots and there are times that you can see the new colour overlay doesn't line up correctly. Its going to eb a bugger to fix but it the colouring needs taking back a lot.

ben_danger said:

personally i think a small battledroid reference would be fun, but perhaps kurgan has a point. does ady plan to do a purist/non purist version again? it could be something that features in one and not the other.

There will be no Purist edition

Kurgan said:

So did someone say Ian says "Luke" on that John Williams special or something?

Yeh, he said Luke a few times on the Musical Journey DVD but non could be used for the Emperor scene

The Golden Idol said:

So, you have to use Winrar or Daemon Tools to create an iso file before burning to DVD, correct? Does it matter which one I use?

No. Daemontools is only to mount an image. Use Winrar to unpack the rars to give you the ISO file, then burn

Ok, i got bored today and decided to have a bit of fun. I took the original unaltered footage of the Emperor hologram ad decided to sync Ian's performance with it (well the best i could with only spending an spare hour. lol) Have fun .... Oh and the video has not been edited at all. It's exactly as it was pre-SE. only the Emperors voice has been changed

MIXING THE OLD WITH THE NEW. xvid

GoodMusician said:

 

The timing between "There is a great disturbance in the force" and "I have felt it" and again back to "We have a new enemy" are huge... massive... of course, in your edit Ady, being PAL, the pacing seems better...

 

But in NTSC... the timing is gigantic... it always seems so... "I'm not paying attention"... that's the only issue I really had... I know it sounds fine to you... but in NTSC... its a bit long..

yeh, but don't forget that it was only a test of what could be done using the original lines. it was put together in a few minutes and i did say it was rough. I won't be doing any proper work on the audio until the video side of things is complete, so i didn't want to waste any time on the audio  so the timing isn't how it would be in the finished edit

well i just watched it i didn't like the new conversation. My reasons are that the line "this boy , young Skywalker" doesn't sound right (doesn't fit together naturaly) and Vader agains mentions that he's just a boy (repetition that isn't needed IMHO). But i really loved the addition of the Emperors theme and that extra bit where vader bows then rises his head really works. Love it. But i feel that the end music is a bit too dramatic. i am warming to the interruption though, but i really do want to go with the closest possible way of returning the conversation to its original lines

The link doesn't work GoodMusician.

yes i will be doing the prequels GoodMusician. Actually i can't wait to get my hands on them. In my personal opinion i think that TPM needs the most done to it. I remember being so excited about seeing that movie but when i stepped out of the cinema after seeing it, i can remember feeling weird. There was something so wrong with that movie. It just didn't feel like Star Wars. I didn't get that with the other 2 although i did cringe at some scenes and dialogue and felt like ROTS was so rushed at the end, but i really enjoyed watching those movies. I don't think that the lightsaber duel between Dooku & Yoda worked though. I think we shouldn't have seen him use a lightsaber until ROTS. I love the part when the troopers approach him from behind and he cuts them down on kashyyyk. Can you imagine how powerful that scene would have been if that was the first time we saw Yoda use a lightsabre? I do like the PT but they just don't stand up to the OT.

When it came to the 2004 DVD set i hated the new additions along with the horrible colouring of course. I never minded a lot of the SE additions but only things that didn't change characters or story. Greedo shooting first in the SE, the Rontos slapstick & walking in front of the camera in mos eisley, the new Emperors dialogue in 2004, The shuttle scenes at the end of ESB and in Jedi the addition of "Jedi Rocks" in '97, Hayden & the "weesa free" line in 2004. I always wanted to return the Emperor scene in ESB to as close to the original as possible back when i started the ANH:R thread. I'm with the belief that you shouldn't have to change lines and situations in the OT to fit in with what we know from the PT. It should be the other way around. The Emperor scene never needed to be changed, apart from adding Ian as the Emperor. It worked for 24 years without any problems, even with the PT. The whole conversation about the twins mother in ROTJ with Leia remembering her mother is one thing that I'll be fixing in the PT. I know exactly how i will be doing that but you'll have to wait a few years to find out. If only a decent transfer of TPM with a CG yoda would become available i would be working on them alongside the OT:R projects, but that's looking less likely every year now. I really don't want to have to work on TPM the state it in, even with the HD transfer, but without that i can't do the other 2 as TPM would be setting up events for 2 & 3.

i value everyones opinion and input and i will never agree with everything that is put in front of me. no one could ever say they would go along with everything that was put forward when doing an edit. Just because i don't like something doesn't make it good or bad. it just means that it doesn't go along with my vision, but could be very useful for someone else's edit.

Keep the ideas flowing guys. :)

Now onto some more colour issues with the 2004 set.

Heres another example of just how much they screwed up ESB. They have brightened it up so much in places that a hell of a lot of detail has been lost. Just look how bright the 2004 shots are. In the first one Hand jacket should be blue and both shots have a pink tint to them and are just too bright compared to the other shots in the whole scene. Look at 3PO in the second shot. he's almost white reflection detail has been lost due to brightness.

Now this one shot took me ages to do. But the colouring has been restored in 3PO & Han's jacket and the brightness of the shot now matches the rest of the scene. Wasn't an easy task but it was worth it, i think.

doubleofive said:

GoodMusician said:

so if you simply take the trunk and the rest of the tree below obi-wan. and put it infont instead of behind him, it would fix itr.

 

Right. But Yoda looks right at Obi-Wan when he first appears next to him. And why would Obi-Wan stand so far away from Luke and Yoda. Of course, the other question is why did he shrink himself if he wanted to be intimidating to Luke?

EDIT:

Here's the shot. I guess Yoda could be looking way behind him if we wanted him to. Also, Obi-Wan is floating. Very weird.

Doubleofive, thats something thats always bugged me. Obi-Wan looks so tiny. I'm hoping to make him larger in those shots because,as you can see, Yoda is looking to the side and not behind him, which gives the impression that Obi-Wan is tiny

bkev said:

I don't know if you could do this, Adywan, but I liked how in the original version Reville said "yes" twice, with a pause inbetween, like he took a second to ponder it after agreeing. Is it possible to somehow edit McDiarmid's dialogue so that he does the same? Or maybe apply a series of filters to Reville's dialogue, and add one of the "yes"'s to the '04 dialogue? I understand what I'm asking for may (and probably is) be ridiculous, but I think that if it could be done it would work well.

I am looking to add the other "yes" because i don't like the single version as it exists in the 2004 SE. It's only a rough track but i changed the timing on some of of Ian's speech to help eliminate the long drawn out syllables in his delivery and also so i can add the extra "yes" once i can find something suitable

Darth Stewie said:

Well, its a nice splice and since you want to go back to the original dialogue I guess it will have to do. Personally, I never liked the whole scene since it creates more questions than it answers, especially with the old dialogue. I still think you should reconsider other avenues but it seems you've made up your mind. There ARE ways to make it fit into the entire story and still make it make sense. The whole debate is a which came first "vader's knowledge or the Emperor's knowledge" of Luke's existence and heritage and who's telling who what. Keeping the lines the way they were makes it that both know of his existence and the Emperor is just now realizing Luke as a threat so he elevates the threat from yellow to red. The way Clive Reville said it, it seemed that he was expecting Vader's answer and was pleased with his response. Now, with Ian's delivery "Yes. Yes." sounds like he just got some great idea from Vader. I don't buy it. No matter how much we like Vader's character, he is still a puppet on a string. He is scheming behind Palpy's back, but he is still his bitch. Hell, even Tarkin slapped him around.

I agree with most things so far on this edit of yours but my two cents are that this is a mistake. The lines shouldn't stay as they are originally or 2004 DVD's. They should be reworked along the lines of MusicMan's idea. It never made sense, and in 2004 it was a poor attempt to make it do so.

I vote no.

 

The whole scene was pretty clear to me, even as a 10 year old when it first came out, and to hell of a lot of other people. Even with Reville's delivery of "Yes..yes" (and Ian only says it once now, not twice) it was clear that Vader had just given him the idea of turning Luke to the dark side instead of just destroying him. They BOTH know about Lukes existence. Word would have reached far and wide in the galaxy about the person who destroyed the Death Star so the Emperor would have definitely have known his name. Vader is using the search for the rebellion as an excuse to find his son. He wants him to turn to the dark side and overthrow the Emperor and become the master (just see the end of the movie for proof of that). That's why he gives the Emperor the idea of turning him instead. The Emperor wouldn't have thought Luke a major threat and deemed him unimportant because there were no Jedi's (as far as he knew) that would be able to teach Luke after Obi-Wan died, so his powers would not be able to grow beyond what they were already. But Luke has now gone to Dagobah and met Yoda, which causes a tremor in the force. "We have a new enemy" = a new Jedi. He now knows he can be a threat. The original dialogue NEVER needed to be changed and certainly not to the horrible writing of the new version. The dialogue sticks out like a sore thumb compared to the writing of the rest of the movie. And the lines are back to how they were originally (apart from substituting "Luke Skywalker" for "Young Skywalker" due to having no usable audio of Ian saying "Luke")

The Golden Idol said:

Rapidshare is still saying the same thing. This is an error on the site and not on my computer, right?

Is there anything I can do besides waiting?

If you are using firefox don't forget that you need to clear both caches. the internet cache in the cotnrol panel and the firefox one (tools> options>advanced>network) .if this doesn't work go into "control panel>internet options> general>temporary internet files>setting>view files" and delete everything out of there and try again. can't guarantee this will work but at least it will rule out your cache.

doubleofive said:

Nice, simple. But where did you get "young Skywalker"? It fits in so well!

It was spliced together from the line ..."We have a new enemy, the young Rebel who destroyed the Death Star. I have no doubt this boy is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker."

Ok, here's something i just threw together to demonstrate the route i will be taking for the Emperor scene. its very rough and needs tweaking but you'll be able to see what i'm trying to accomplish

EMPEROR TEST mp3

Moth3r said:

I brought this up a while ago; here is the post. Mike reckoned the same starfield was used when it was re-composited for the 1981, only flipped and positioned differently. (I could never see that , myself.)

Although hard to see, the telecine also confirms the GOUT has the original starfield.

i agree that the starfield post 1981 is different and not a flipped version. the stars are completely different. i flipped the starfiled from the laserdisc and overlayed it to the original starfield found in the 2004 & GOUT DVDs and there was no place that they could match

Erikstormtrooper said:

Yes. Tell me more of this second moon, please.

if you look HERE you can see that the main large moon at the left is different on the laserdiscs than the one from the GOUT & 2004 DVD set

Having just managed to look at your clip GoodMusician its an interesting idea, with the interuption and everything, but the line "how is that possible" is so obvious that it was recorded at a different time it stands out. PLus i've never liked the new line "the young rebel..". I still think that returning the whole conversation to its original wording is the way i will be going and eliminating all of the new lines.

doubleofive said:

The same thing happened to me, but if you put the < br > inbetween the lines it will add the line breaks as needed.

thanks. worked like a treat :)

doubleofive said:

So Ady, did you ever consider recoloring the TIEs in ANH blue for better consistency? And Ripplin's most recent Executor is now the definitive version.

at first yeh, but because many of the models they used were actually white the colour just wouldn't take properly and looked too fake, due to the fact that when you are recolouring something you need to be able to keep the white highlights to keep the colouring looking natural

Ripplin said:

Hey Ady, I have a question that I don't think has been asked yet: if there was pristine footage of the original Emperor scene, would you use that instead of the McDiarmid re-do? I know I would.

no. simply because the original looks nothing like the Emperor we all know now. The 2004 version is fixable to make him look like his ROTJ self so that's a better avenue IMHO

the fix was only ever for the problem with burning with imgburn. there were no other problems and the fix needed to only be applied if you wanted to burn with imgburn. The problems people were having with skipping etc were all down to burning / media problems and not the release itself (apart from the unpacked version that was on torrents which had nothing to do with me). If it was down to the iso then no one would have been able to burn successfully without any skipping or freezing upon playback. Use verbatim, burn at 2.4x and the problem is solved ( also certain older versions of nero has problems burning DL correctly). and don't forget that not all players support dual layer medium (recordable media not factory pressed commercial releases). but no none has had any problems with the many NTSC copies i have sent out that were burned using the original iso i posted (pre fix)

Kurgan said:

 

Actually, can anyone confirm... are the TIEs all blue in ESB (1980) or only the ones associated with the Executor?

After studying the video its seems all the TIEs are blue not just the ones associated with the Executor (even with the ever changing shades). It would have made a lot better sense if it was just the ones from the Executor that were blue and have the other ones grey then there wouldn't be the problem with the grey ones in ANH. The one thing that annoys me is the lame excuse that they were grey because they were the Death Star squadron. So why were the SE additions blue / grey and the Death Star ones in ROTJ blue? That is why i ignore any explanations that weren't in the movies (like the EU).

Don't forget sgdelta1771 that the top picture is from my colour corrected version and Ripplin's version isn't, so the stardestroyers would be a different colour, but the Executor is the correct colour. The colours are so messed up with the 2004 dvds that to restore colours i have to mask out certain elements and correct the colours separately. also the brightness of the stardestroyers in Ripplin's picture is correct. don't forget that the side we are seeing them from is in shadow (just look at which side the shadow is on the Executor). stripping the colour out to make it almost grey just doesn't look right to me and too bland.

Ripplin said:

I just did a quick one to make the coloring somewhere in between:

I like the blue windows/lights, so I did them separately. The body and tower have the saturation lowered 25 and the lights are lowered 15.

That's very close to the colouring, if not exactly, that i'll be using for the Executor in ESB:R.

On another note i have to say a huge thanks to the members who have donated  so far. I have enough for the monitor and have ordered it and i'm only £70 off getting the quad core. Thanks for the link to newegg GoodMusician but its a US site so no good for me. although the place i will get the processor from has their prices almost the same. So at this rate i could be getting started again very soon

i think i've found another one. You can't have more than one seperate line in your sig now. I used to have 3 separate lines(spaced by an extra line) in my sig but i just updated it by adding a new section , now they are all on the same line, even though they should be separated.

rlockhart said:

adywan said:

rlockhart said:

Adywan I live in the States so let me know how to make a cotribution and its as good as done, send me a PM with some info ! I want my ESB in 720p

It's in my sig

I am new to this so point me in the right direction how do I get to your sig sorry about the ignorance.

no probs. the sig is at the end of all my posts

Jeyl said:

adywan said: I explained before that the spinning starfield will eb gone, same as in ANH:R. I've never liked it at all.

I think you should be more open to preservation Ady. There is nothing wrong with having something you don't like in a film if others admire it. After all, Lucas always said that he was never happy with the original Star Wars movies, but did we complain? I don't think so, but he went ahead and changed them anyways. Now we have you, doing one heck of a good job but now it's the same thing all over again. Changing what's not broken that fans actually like.

adywan said:

So its gone. Discussion over. lol

Please, if I wanted a response like that I would have gone to Steve Sansweet's on stage presentation for the un-altered DVDs.

"the transfers from the bonus discs are absolutely incredible, because these are pristine master tapes, and I have never seen—despite what you may have heard on Internet rumours—a better transfer of a movie."

But i'm not doing a preservation. Why don't people get that? The whole thing started off because i wanted to make an edit that i was happy with, changing things that i didn't like. But then i put details about it here and then got other peoples opinions & suggestions, while still staying true to my original vision. If i was going to do something that everyone would like then i would be doing a restoration of the OUT. I'm not going to change my mind about it especially when only a couple of people don't like the change and wasn't an issue when it was gone in ANH:R.  Oh and my comment about the discussion being over was supposed to be light hearted (hence adding lol after it).