The guillotine is too silly but there’s compelling stuff for sure, I mostly feel like by comparison it looks like it has much more in the way of variety in setting than TROS.
As long as I get to be snarky about it so I come out on top!
I actually really wanted to see the Oracle, I was guessing it was mostly something of a cipher to extend the explanation or at least draw out the Palpatine reveal which they decided to cut for time. Here are some leaked concept images that show as much, doesn’t look like too many changes as much as trims.
The medium is the message.
Let’s Get Drunk and Talk About Star Wars
I think Revenge of the Sith proves both paths are options in a given story, still the series shouldn’t be without a hero exactly or wholly reject redemption as a been there done that, the themes are too universal. For me Star Wars is a lot about trust and agency, so Star Wars should be about good and evil and making the right choices in that way, as long as the characters who fail to do so are represented as having tragically failed, Kylo for example wouldn’t have to be turned good but would need to be tortured deep down to remain bad without breaking the ultimate moral.
I agree the expectations going in were what led to the weak opening, the word of mouth is what’s inspired more recent talk of possibly not making a billion.
Star Wars, the trench run is a masterclass in editing, while it shows the most technical cracks of the three it only reinforces just how amazing it can be, I fall in love with it more every time.
I don’t want to clog up this thread with off topic discussion but since this is where most of the lightspeed skipping thoughts are I wanted to follow up with just a few more of my own. I think the concept is self explanatory, it doesn’t actually need any extra setup, what I find missing is the payoff. Just brainstorming here but I think the falcon should have found its way to Exegol through skipping, that way it’s more than just a one and done flashy action scene, instead it would serve the story. That’s the bigger issue for me more than any kind of break in logic, I don’t care if the numbers don’t add up, I just want the elements to interact in a satisfying way.
Now to pay my unreserved love tax: I loved babu frik, even when I thought I’d hate him instead he’s the most successful new alien for me in the new movies so far.
Shopping Maul said:
somehow my ‘canon-brain’ experienced TROS as if I’d been living in seclusion for 40 years and TROS just happened to be the sequel to some amazing movies I hadn’t seen yet. This probably sounds insane!
It really doesn’t, this feeling absolutely resonates with me as well and overall I feel like each of the three movies have that quality when viewed in isolation that improves the experience more than watching the trilogy as a whole. Glad you had the experience you did! It’s refreshing to see from OT fans.
I agree with the room for improvement but I also liked lightspeed skipping…
Fair enough, I think the Snyder Cut actually does show how far fan support can influence considering if it was always in the cards I agree it would be out already, instead there have been a lot of hints about its release on streaming later this year though I’ll eat my words if that never comes to pass. Even still I look at Sonic and Deadpool as instances which had higher ups change their tune and reverse a decision, not verbatim released to extended but proof of fan influence, other extended cuts I think are more of an acceptable excuse or “out” to allow Lucasfilm to potentially release one while maintaining dignity and without admission of guilt.
Broom Kid said:
This breaks down along the idea that extended/director’s cuts only happen because the audience asks for it. That’s not usually how that sort of thing happens, it’s not a supply/demand sort of deal for the most part.
The times they are a changin’. I made the thread because the demand is there and Hollywood does seem to respond when there is significant demand (not that this is a form of petition or any call to action), the means might be unconventional but not unprecedented in the social media age.
Broom Kid said:
The whole reason we’re even discussing the possibility is tied to a single Saltier Than Crait post that is fairly ridiculous, and supported by an unsourced, unverified report from a heretofore unheard of “news” site nobody knows anything about that is also ridiculous in its own way.
Again no, or not my intention at least, I didn’t start this thread as confirmation of anything or a reaction to any news I read, that’s actually why I posted so early after release. More of a prediction coming from a hunch as to where they play their next move. It seems very likely from even casual observation that among other things TROS was at least somewhat hacked in the edit, an extended cut is what’s on a lot of fans’ minds and I’m sure Lucasfilm is looking closer than we might expect. Nothing is ever concrete enough the tide cannot turn, the real magic trick is when a studio makes you think everything ended up exactly as they had planned in the first place.
Rumors are starting to circulate about an extended cut being released to theaters toward the end of the month:
THE 192 MINUTE J.J. ABRAMS RISE OF SKYWALKER CUT IS COMING SOONER THAN YOU THINK
It breaks down to this:
- An extended version of The Rise of Skywalker will be announced in the coming week, releasing near the end of January, and including 3-5 additional sequences fit into the narrative. This should bring the cut up from 142 minutes to about 165 minutes.
- Rumored sequences to be included in this cut involve an extended Endor sequence that occurs before the final shot in the current film, Lobot and Lando in a sequence that predates the chase in the desert, and a slew of ghost Jedis returning alongside Luke and Leia and participating in the final sequence to unseat the Emperor.
- This new cut will be simply treated as an Extended Cut, and will include a post-credits sequence highlighting additional sequences that will be released with the official Blu Ray release of The Rise of Skywalker which will have a special J.J. Abrams Director’s Cut version of the film at 185 minutes.
- When The Rise of Skywalker enters the streaming window exclusively on Disney Plus it will include an additional 7 minutes of extra footage that didn’t get finished in post production as a part of its exclusive run on the streaming upstart.
Quoting here for relevance.
Gentle nudge to discuss those rumors in this thread I made about a possible extended cut…
I agree it really undercuts Luke and Han’s development for them to have failed in the same ways they seemed to grow from like relapsed addicts. Just wanted to add again why it’s also different for me when Luke has seen firsthand the living proof of Vader and all the destruction he’s caused he still says he cannot kill him to Obi-Wan, and then to Vader, so it yes for me it is extremely abrupt to the point of whiplash when Luke reacts to his defenseless nephew’s dream. Maybe if it were depicted visually as a premonition it would have sold better for me, but I feel like I’m just taking his word for it that the thoughts were seriously super bad, I don’t know it just doesn’t seem organic at all.
EDIT: I typed all that out just to see Dre’s post already covered it haha
I wish I was better at ignoring these threads. Reading these same eternal recurring discussions is tiresome.
Hey, it’s still better than watching the news.
Broom Kid said:
It’s actually a lesser mistake, considering the first time he tried to save one of his genocidal relatives he kicked the hell out of him and then cut his hand off before just barely managing to stop himself from delivering the killing blow.
This never tracked with me, I think it conflates wildly different circumstances, a young Luke already being hunted in active combat is not the same to me as an old Luke reading the thoughts of his sleeping nephew. I was fine with the backstory of how Luke failed Ben being ambiguous and I wish it stayed that way, when the truth is revealed it still for me feels so abrupt and Luke seems barely nudged into going 0-100, again it’s not that I hate Luke failing thematically or turning away from the force but the ultimate written explanation is where I just can’t make that leap.
I guess this is where we eventually get to our own fanedits and personal headcanon, I want to agree it’s probably best to consider TLJ in the standalone category, but a few establishing pieces might need to be added from TFA for it to truly work and make sense to the blind viewer. The ending as ambiguous is fine, ha maybe the ultimate subversion would be that we never did get a definitive conclusion and are left to wonder, definitely a meta take, makes it more fun to me in theory.
Well you could set them up but I feel there’s not really room for both them AND Palpatine as the big bad while neither are developed where they really responsibly should be by the third act, one would seriously have to go or at least go under developed. RJ isn’t obligated to answer all the questions but I think he and JJ were too precious about each other’s ideas and it mutually made them stay away and go “I’m not touching that.” leading to leaving the thread just hanging in the air. It’s less about what I want and more working with what you got. I don’t think the Knights of Ren were even what I would have wanted but it is a lot of new potential left over, I think they were caught up in their own stories they didn’t pick up the ball and see what the trilogy needed at large. Course JJ has his own issues fully fleshing out concepts and characters, Maz really ended as a prop and pretty redundant to have initially received so much attention, JJ also fumbled Phasma all on his own in just one movie.
I actually do count it as a point against Rian for not utilizing the Knights of Ren better, that was another softball pitch he more or less ignored. Maybe that sounds like getting into what you wished for vs what you got but really does become a question of why not, it’s like TFA is JJ holding up his hand for a high five but RJ is looking the other way, leaving him hanging. TROS is the finale, probably should have been them as the villains instead of the Emperor, but with so much to get done of course if the Knights weren’t developed in the 2nd they are going to be rushed in the third. And really them being even in the finale in the first place feels like it’s just there to serve continuity that became more background lore than anything. Now that doesn’t mean it’s all Rian’s fault but I think it shows how disconnected their visions ultimately were and why people keep saying they should have gone in with a plan.
Been seeing it around the question with TROS of why didn’t JJ just work with what RJ left him, that’s what people were asking when TLJ came out, just in reverse order. TFA and TLJ feel like two 1st movies, I have started asking those I know who really hated the movie (but aren’t major fans enough to really care to give it as many rewatches or chances) if they would have liked the movie more with no changes if it was just the first one, so far all of them have said yes, so point for team RJ should have done the whole trilogy.
I was responding to your response so I get the confusion, no worries, but yeah I wouldn’t agree, I’m not even sure many TLJ haters would think that without contradicting themselves considering the level of distaste for Rose and she’s an original character. I think you feel I’m underrating his contributions to Breaking Bad and I feel you’re overrating it, but my point was to say we’re talking about Rian as a writer, and without trying to dismiss him entirely I don’t think his contributions were why Breaking Bad fans love Ozymandias so much relative to what Vince Gilliagan and co. had built up to over those seasons, though not to say he didn’t do a good job.
I will say of the established characters I was disappointed with Rian’s execution of Snoke, and not for lack of backstory, felt like he was made into a mustache twirler when he didn’t need to be, even if the overall story focus isn’t about his character having the most nuance.
Broom Kid said:
No, I directly quoted you.
(…) the idea that he doesn’t work well with other people’s creations doesn’t hold a lot of water to me.
Okay well I never said that
Broom Kid said:
The idea that he doesn’t work well with characters he didn’t create doesn’t make sense considering one of the best shows on television, one he had zero hand in creating or developing, kept having him come back to direct increasingly more and more important episodes.
The idea that he doesn’t work well with people or their creations doesn’t hold a lot of water when looking at his career, a career which has never actually had a failure in it, looking at both audience, critical, and financial receptions.
I think maybe you’re misinterpreting or responding to someone other than me because my point was not to slander Rian as hard to work with, or to minimize the role of a director. But it is clear he did write TLJ and did not write Breaking Bad which was deep into its own arcs which were followed completely under his direction. The difference between those two examples is the amount of control and authorship.
He didn’t write those episodes of Breaking Bad though, and he didn’t do a bad job directing TLJ either, in a way Rian got what he wanted as we’re discussing mainly the story and characters of the movie he made and not the failure of taking on a large production. TLJ isn’t a mess in the way 1984’s Dune is, for example.