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act on instinct

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22-Sep-2018
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31-May-2020
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Post
#1332073
Topic
Episode IX: The Rise Of Skywalker - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

OutboundFlight said:

I don’t understand how every time the concept art is better than what we got.

This is just always going to be true, look at available concept art for any of your favorite movies and you’ll find content you wish was in the film, you can have anything on paper but in production things will be lost in translation.

Post
#1332013
Topic
Star Wars: <strong>The Rise Of Skywalker</strong> Redux Ideas thread
Time

Chase Adams said:

act on instinct said:

Rey had zero idea who Anakin Skywalker was and seeing him in his young form is too out of left field for me, for him to appear I think he would need to show up before that moment for a Rey connection to work.

She says in TLJ that she knew about the redemption of Luke’s father… Also, Anakin literally speaks to her in TROS. There’s several other minor examples of her knowledge of Anakin but these are the main ones.

She also previously knew about the legend of Luke Skywalker but if she never shared a scene with him I would be feeling the same thing of who is this old man she’s looking at, if Anakin could be seen more than just heard when he helps I would find the whole thing less jarring, I understand he’s part of the family but his presence doesn’t feel organic.

Post
#1330848
Topic
Conclude the Original Trilogy differently
Time

It’s a really fun creative thought experiment. As far as not rewriting what we already have I still find myself arriving to the same place when it comes to a few details, though the events wouldn’t all unfold the same way. Jabba for example can’t just be namechecked for the first two movies and not make an appearance, we already know that’s where Han was taken and although that leaves who and what Jabba is up to interpretation we still know he is a crime lord, even from there the idea that Han in carbonite becomes a trophy is too perfect for any alternative I could come up with, the rescue is a different story.

The Emperor similarly I would still want to appear in person and show his stuff, Boba would likely have a bigger supporting role, same for Lando. Yoda wouldn’t die at least not so early or without another key assist. Leia would also have a larger key role in spiritually saving Luke, she would be revealed as pregnant within the movie. Luke himself would be more on his own again in a sort of monk like meditation/training state, he still needs a new lightsaber so where he went and what he was up to would be related to that as well for the first act. Ben’s ghost would call out to Leia and Vader not just Luke.

…uhh…I’m out for now. Anything else I can think of is pure spitballing…like…what if Han heard some information we missed during his torture in ESB that could be a strategic turning point in the plot by the time he’s rescued which would be a lot closer to the end of the second act?

Post
#1330469
Topic
How do you feel about Star Wars being re-titled A New Hope in 1981?
Time

A New Hope is my second favorite title of all the movies behind RotJ, but I do prefer the original crawl with no subtitle for the same reasons you mentioned differentiating the saga from standalone. Still, even as a kid before there were any prequels I found it kind of thrilling that the starting point was Episode IV: A New Hope, it was a very small thing that added to the lived in quality of the universe and it made a weird sort of sense, it did feel like the middle of something larger. Other changes I can forgive or tolerate, but the subtitle I genuinely approve of, simple and inspiring.

Post
#1329677
Topic
Star Wars: <strong>The Rise Of Skywalker</strong> Redux Ideas thread
Time

Making him more transparent just isn’t on the books, is it? I could go somewhere in between on the color but that vibrant doctor manhattan blue needs to go.

EDIT: it just occurred to me on the audio side of things that when Obi-Wan speaks as a force ghost in Return of the Jedi there’s a bit of a reverb that Luke doesn’t have in his scenes as a force ghost, there’s an opportunity to play around with either trying to mimic the original or put a modern spin on it. I slapped together a very crude example.

Post
#1329451
Topic
Star Wars: <strong>The Rise Of Skywalker</strong> Redux Ideas thread
Time

Right, I was about to add that only so much can be done coming from an already finished grade as the base, for example those tricky teal shadows, I made a new version to remove them though I wouldn’t want it to be at the loss of the scene’s character. Still, with selective color tools and high resolution we have a lot of room to work with.

I also enjoy the throwback look! Overall my color preferences lean naturalistic to give my bias.

Post
#1329380
Topic
Star Wars: <strong>The Rise Of Skywalker</strong> Redux Ideas thread
Time

sans_fi said:

Yes, please, someone color correct this movie…

TROS
TROS

When will color grading move past these overdone hue shifts? I thought we were done with the green filter in the 2000s! My take below, agree with others you don’t want to make it too far neutral the colors should still reflect the emotion of the scene, it’s just my opinion scenes and sets that looked just fine get hidden underneath grades that get too carried away trying to change the look for the sake of it.


Post
#1328581
Topic
The Sequels - George's Original Trilogy
Time

ShamanWhill said:

– Darth Talon would make for an interesting antagonist, but I don’t think she should live past Episode 8. Perhaps Jedi Killer kills her in an act similar to Snoke’s death in TLJ. If the Dark Whill / Plaguies remains the big bad it won’t be as crazy as the DT… it would be more Jedi Killer promoting himself to directly serving the Dark Whill.

There’s actually concept art of her seducing the Jedi Killer and then leaving him murdered. I think it would make for a interesting twist in Episode IX. My idea is this: in order to destroy the Evil Whill, Luke must become one with the Force and confront him, but of course Luke must die in order to do this. So he surrenders to the Jedi Killer, leading to his death. Once Luke is dead, Talon then murders the Jedi Killer, revealing that she was using him the entire time. Then Anakin and Luke face off against Plagueis, while Leia and Kira fight Talon; both a Physical Battle and a Meta-Physical battle.

I think the Jedi ultimately killing the Jedi Killer in an act of passionate betrayal (been thinking about contradictory premonitions lately) and thus becomes the Jedi Killer is the way to go, it’s the right double bluff, the motivations are strong, the relationships are deeper. This is where I get a little wary, that momentum should carry over into pushing those protagonists forward, they should have some relation to Luke and maybe Anakin and possibly Plagueis but the ultimate battle should only be enhanced by them, not the main focus. The new characters should not by the finale be watching in awe of ancient Gods they have no direct association with, in a way that destroys the stakes; the grandchildren, the new characters, have to be the active component. And that’s appropriate, the baton pass isn’t the wrong idea fundamentally it’s how we get there.

OutboundFlight said:

– If we go the Sam Solo route, I’d prefer to make it so that Sam thinks he doesn’t have the force because he doesn’t have a natural affinity to it like Kira. But perhaps in the 9th episode, he realizes he had it all along, he just needed to believe he had it in the first place.

You’re right. Based on Midi-Chlorian biology, it wouldn’t make sense for Sam to have 0 Force powers. We can make it so either he’s not interested in the Force, of that by the time he was ready to learn, Luke had already been betrayed by the Jedi Killer.

OutboundFlight said:

Sam Solo is an intriguing opportunity because he’s not like Kylo Ren at all, and being the son of ‘rebels’ we could really have a fun chance to play up the ultimate cocky rebel, especially in the first episode when it’s lighter and establishing the new generation. Think about a teen Han Solo, reckless son of a famous politician, imagine him trying and failing to pick up girls by claiming to technically be the prince of a planet that doesn’t exist anymore. Plus that need for speed and everything that’s been said already about latent ability buried under attitude, like Anakin with the pods but with a charming heartthrob instead of a 9 year old boy. And it nails in on the family situation and gives an easy arc for the character to show contempt and even jealousy toward his family on a bratty kid level only to take responsibility and show his love when the stakes get serious and his family is threatened.

– Why not make Kira’s mother a mystery? Luke never tells her who her mother is, and she spends a while wondering who it might be. It could another Jedi (inspired by Mara Jade) in hiding that returns by Episode 9.

I agree it would make the story much more interesting. She’s described as a loner, so maybe that was the case. I don’t know if making her the daughter of another Jedi would work. Luke was supposed to be the last, and he was described as the last in George’s outlines. If she is a loner/orphan, then she would have to be Luke’s child. But that raises many questions; Why was she hidden? How come Luke doesn’t know? I can understand if she was hidden because of Luke’s betrayal, then that would mean she was a baby, so almost 2 decades have gone by of Luke in hiding? I don’t know if that’s a right move to make.

Twins separated at birth, just sayin’.

Post
#1328112
Topic
The Sequels - George's Original Trilogy
Time

ShamanWhill said:

DominicCobb said:
This thread is just speculative fan fiction. Don’t pretend it’s anything else.

Of course. I never said it wasn’t. I’m sorry you came into here thinking it was otherwise. I should’ve been more clearer. I would like to justify our “fan fiction” though: at least it’s more rooted in the creator’s ideas than Disney’s trilogy was. So which one is the real fan fiction?

Maybe this discussion should be moved to the Script Writing and Re-writing section?

Post
#1328092
Topic
The Sequels - George's Original Trilogy
Time

Cthulhunicron said:

I think you could also argue that a force user that is trying to maintain a balance between light and dark would not stay neutral. A grey force user, to me, seems more like ANH-era Han Solo, but with a lightsaber and force powers. I can see someone like that being guided somewhat by their emotions, and not afraid to get involved in a conflict if they’re angered by some injustice.

The problem that arises for me, is that this again doesn’t seem that dissimilar from a regular Jedi, just maybe a bit more self serving. We’re told from dialogue throughout all 9 movies that once you start embracing the dark side, it corrupts you. So even if someone believes they can maintain a balance between light and dark, I feel like they will still wind up being corrupted, based on the logic within the Star Wars films. The dark side is defined as embracing anger, hatred, and lust for power. I don’t really see why someone should try to incorporate those emotions into their life if they are seeking balance. I don’t see any evidence that TLJ or TROS are advocating a “middle path.” Luke says the Jedi need to end, but then later says he was wrong.

I think a lot of people are misinterpreting the dark side as simply being emotions, and that embracing the light side necessitates suppression of all emotions.

This is how I feel, I see the criticisms in the Jedi Order of the prequels, but not the concept of a Jedi. Yoda never renounced the title, or Obi-Wan or Qui-Gon, unless they were Jedi in name only (JINOs) and were secret greys I don’t see why Jedi has to be so limited. And again I’m not sure where grey would even take us narratively.

yotsuya said:

So I don’t see the Jedi we have seen as balanced. We may see something different a few hundred years earlier, but I think the problems with the Jedi go back to the split with the Sith (provided that piece of the EU stays accurate). It would be a natural turn of events for the Jedi to start teaching complete avoidance of anything pertaining to the dark side.

I feel like we’re getting closer, the idea that the force has further untapped potential hidden behind ancient misinterpretations would be really engaging to watch both sides try to discover the secrets. Almost Like the Sith dagger except not stupid.

ShamanWhill said:

And I understand your valid trepidation on demystifying the Force. Just remember that we’re going to make it clear, these beings feed off and control the Force. You could say they are the Force, but they still aren’t, they just control it. And it’s okay that we get close to answering these epic questions, because this is the ending of the Saga. We’re wrapping things up for good, leaving no questions unanswered for future sequels.

You have me in complete agreement there, I would say it’s impossible to leave NO questions unanswered but I’m very interested in the finality of a much more total resolution compared to the previous trilogies.

I will say there’s going to be a certain point where there just isn’t enough information for the sequels George would have made as those movies were not fully developed. I don’t think it would be absolutely wrong to take good ideas that would make sense from the trilogy and make use of every part of the buffalo here, they weren’t Lucas but they were still made by Lucasfilm and even if the details would change it’s always easier to edit from something than to write from nothing.

Post
#1327956
Topic
The Sequels - George's Original Trilogy
Time

But couldn’t not taking a side produce or prolong suffering due to inaction? Wouldn’t under that definition disillusioned Luke be correct in no longer fighting? I think these philosophical questions are what the characters should be struggling with, but as the ultimate answer for me it doesn’t track, doesn’t resolve anything and I question how it even forwards the narrative. So much about Star Wars is about choosing trust and love and that being an active thing that even puts you in danger but it’s the right thing to do, balance as neutrality clashes against that for me.

Post
#1327952
Topic
The Sequels - George's Original Trilogy
Time

There is a mix that makes sense and it’s somewhere between “Does it control your actions?/Partially, but it also obeys your commands”. The Force is on the one hand guiding but on the other it can be influenced, again there’s the idea of a Sith so powerful he could manipulate the midichlorians. With that in mind I’d much rather free will and its cosmic consequences be the thrust of the conflict over the Jedi being in the wrong about how they observe the force, with grey being the actual balance. Once selfishness is not considered a moral bad I think the mythos gets too muddied to follow. The Jedi are not infallible but they are in tune with the force to the extent that they can commune with Jedi from the other side and still exist in death, I think that lends some credibility.

Post
#1327890
Topic
The Sequels - George's Original Trilogy
Time

ShamanWhill said:

The question is tho, where does this corruptor come from, and why did the Force allow this happen? I think it would be interesting if there was something going wrong with the Whills/the Force.

Seeing as the Sith are also ancient and the force can be wielded by them albeit through the dark side to me points a bit closer to the direction that the Force/Whills are a vaguely neutral energy that can be taken advantage of, unless they are playing a larger game. The Force does seem to allow bad things to happen then watch and see how it plays out so I don’t see a problem really with a person who does have free will abusing the force without the whills intervening so personally, ultimately I might wonder if those beings could even conceptualize morals in that way or at that scale. The whills should have some intention but the risk of demystifying and damaging the relationship of the force to the audience is at an extreme high, I definitely understand why going microbiotic to begin with is already too much for some though I find it vindicates their inclusion in the prequels. Embrace the Midi-Chlorian…

Words of wisdom to consider from Filoni about the force: https://youtu.be/USr1elOOWJg

Could you elaborate a bit more on the luring and sacrificing comment you made? I don’t know if harnessing someone else’s power is possible. You either have a high Midi-Chlorian count or you don’t.

This is actually a pretty hard one because the further we try to fill the gaps the more difficult questions concerning how the lore can be faithfully expanded need to be given an answer. I think harnessing a Jedi’s power after killing them also is a weak idea as well as derivations of that premise like collecting kyber crystals or anything along those lines would be too on the nose. Still, I think the closer we get to revealing beyond the veil and the inherent relationship between life and death to the spiritual realm there leaves room for interpretation as to where that energy goes and how it can be measured or perceived. As you mentioned with Luke his own misinterpretation could lead to his disillusionment, so even if the Jedi killer is failing to achieve this ultimate power through their violent means the motivation can stay the same, same as it ever was for dark siders really, misguided power seeking even if it means going through people.

Post
#1327652
Topic
The Sequels - George's Original Trilogy
Time

Again I worry about characterizing the whills too far so much that they become individualized almost like greek gods, I’d rather see the evil act originate from a mortal character that corrupts the balance and we get a closer look at the interplay between the human will’s influence over midichlorians vs the whills. There can be a need for powerful force users to be lured and sacrificed to harness that power which could be what happens with Darth Talon. I think a lot of the trilogy arc would be the mystery behind the force as it builds to a climax, with dark siders and light seeking deeper, more ancient answers, hard and heavy on eastern influence.