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ZkinandBonez

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5-May-2015
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18-Jan-2020
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Post
#1320554
Topic
Beyond the OT Documentaries (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds)
Time

Since people really liked the YouTube/Vimeo/etc. finds for Original Trilogy making-ofs, documentaries, promos, etc. & General Star Wars Documentaries (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds) threads and have been sharing lots of interesting videos there, I figured it made sense to start a similar thread dedicated to the Prequel Trilogy, Sequel Trilogy, Anthology films, and the various animated & live action TV series, etc.

  • When adding a link to a video, please add a title and/or description so that we don’t have to click on it to find out what it is. Any additional info would be appreciated as well, like f.ex. an IMDB page link, article links, or just a simple blurb. You can also add a photo (screenshot, poster, etc.).
  • Fan-made videos can be posted provided they are of reasonably good quality.
  • Please don’t post any reviews or blatant opinion-pieces.
  • No mockumentaries or parodies please.

 
I figured the appropriate place to start would be at the “beginning” as far as all things beyond the OT is concerned:

The Beginning: Making Star Wars: Episode I The Phantom Menace:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=da8s9m4zEpo&list=PLYn2a0e2FVIKni_wHXR5CJYBnnnYH7mIB&index=141&t - from the official Star Wars YouTube channel.

The blurb:-
“The Beginning is a documentary on the making of Star Wars: Episode I The Phantom Menace, originally produced for the film’s DVD release. It covers the entire production of The Phantom Menace, from preproduction to casting to visual effects, editing, and theatrical release.”

IMDB Page

^ This is honestly one of the most interesting and in-depth making-ofs I’ve ever seen, and regardless of what you may think of TPM as a movie I’d still highly recommend watching this documentary.

Post
#1320552
Topic
<em>The Mandalorian</em> - Season One Discussion - * <strong>SPOILER THREAD</strong> *
Time

Fated-Dualist said:

^ Ah man 😃 Sorry, should have checked first.

By the way - I love your documentary threads on here, ZkinandBonez; some really great content in there and easily accessible too 😃

I hope we soon get some docs, features and BTS content for The Mandalorian as well.

Thanks. I just made a similar thread for stuff like The Mandalorian, ST, PT, etc.

Also, I remember seeing a sizzle-reel video for The Mandalorian on one of the many videos taken by the audience at the SWC panel and I’m a bit surprised that it hasn’t been released officially yet.

Post
#1320547
Topic
<em>The Mandalorian</em> - Season One Discussion - * <strong>SPOILER THREAD</strong> *
Time

Fated-Dualist said:

by dvglzv - https://www.instagram.com/dvglzv (has some more Star Wars content on there & Batman too)

Just FYI, Darth Muffy made a thread dedicated to these and similar retro covers by other artists; https://originaltrilogy.com/topic/The-Mandalorian-Comic-Covers-SPOILERS-WITHIN/id/71304

Post
#1320008
Topic
The original Marvel Star Wars series
Time

So, I finally got around to reading #108 (the comic shop I go to messed up my pull-list so I didn’t get it until recently), and it was pretty fun, nothing spectacular, but actually a lot better than I had expected. For a comic that essentially tried to pull together key-characters/fan-favourites from 107 issues into one story, it was surprisingly consistent. It’s obviously a direct sequel to The Crimson Forever, which already had Domina Tagge as a part of the plot, but they managed to weave Valance, Jaxxon and Amaiza into the plot quite well. Jaxxon and Amaiza seemed a little bit shoe-horned in, but I though Valance’s story was quite interesting. The Valance issues are some of my favourites from the original comic series so I was a little worried about how they would handle it, and although, yes, they did retcon some of his backstory and abilities, it still resulted in a pretty interesting end to his arc despite in some ways being a repeat of what we’ve already seen. Overall though, I thought Valance was the best part of the comic and they tied it into the Crimson Fever quite well. The various artists did a pretty good job I think, and none of it felt cheap or lazy like a lot of modern Marvel art does, though some segments were far better than others.

Although this issue was mostly just a gimmick done to celebrate Marvel’s 80th anniversary, I think it’s quite nice to get a new Legends canon comic, especially one that’s essentially just one big love-letter to the Marvel comics which generally speaking was mostly ignored during the heydays of the old EU.

Post
#1319735
Topic
Small details that took you <em><strong>FOREVER</strong></em> to notice in the <em>Star Wars</em> films
Time

I’d say that the whole “turn your brain off” kind of has to be applied to a lot of sci-fi and especially fantasy (and SW is obviously both), otherwise you wouldn’t have much of a story at all. As long as it’s balanced, and the whole narrative itself makes sense, then I think it’s ok to stretch your suspension of disbelief or bend the rules a little. I mean ESB, though generally considered the best SW films, really is the most nonsensical one of them all. The continuity of that film is a complete mess if you try to make sense of it (at face value anyway), and some scenes breaks physics even by SW standards. But, it all makes sense as a dramatic narrative and that’s what makes it a good film and justifies all the weird logic IMO.

Post
#1318888
Topic
General Star Wars Documentaries (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds)
Time

Speaking of Star Wars toys in the UK, I just came across this Movietonews video from 1978:

Movietonews (1978)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9WVNMYPpJQ (7 minutes long, skip to 3:25 for SW/Palitoy segment.)

“From the Movietonews archive is 1978 footage from the UK release of Star Wars, proceeded by an item about the 1978 Toy And Hobby Fair.”

Post
#1318846
Topic
<em>The Mandalorian</em> - Season One Discussion - * <strong>SPOILER THREAD</strong> *
Time

OutboundFlight said:

In terms of “filler” episodes…

I don’t think I would consider any of the episodes “filler”. Even Chapter 5, despite not setting anything up, provided lots of insight into world as well as just a fun adventure.

I actually find too much focus on an overarching plot a sign of a “filler episode”. Let me explain. Way too many shows focus on building mysteries and teasing the audience, to the point that’s the entire show.

A good example would be Stranger Things 3. I was bored watching most of it, and I kept wondering when the plot would actually start. Because the first 75% is just slowly teasing the ending, when I would rather they either shorten the season or add new storylines to make each episode somewhat unique.

This is why I like Mandalorian so much: each episode brings something new to the table.

Well put, couldn’t agree more. I had a similar experience watching GoT a while back. I gave up during the second season because it felt so “padded”. I’d watched several episodes and one of the too many plots only advanced so far as to have two characters walk from one place to another. The dialogue was fine and added to their characters, but nothing really happened to their story for several episodes. When something finally did happen it was yet another cliff hanger and at that point I’d simply stopped caring. My personal idea of a perfectly done long narrative in TV series form would be something like the last few seasons of Star Trek DS9. There’s an overarching narrative that’s always present (e.g. the Dominion War and several character arcs, etc.), but each episode (apart from two-parters and such) still felt like their own self contained story. The Mandalorian did a similar thing, where the child and the bounty hunters / imperial remnant hunting it was the overarching plot, yet episodes 2 & 4-6 also told their own stories while still being connected to the main plot.

Post
#1318665
Topic
<em>Star Wars: The Clone Wars</em> To Return With New Episodes
Time

Tobar said:

TCW fits well with the microseries for the most part but it does contradict it in a few places. George was not afraid to completely negate anything in the EU he didn’t care for. Which is why incidents like Karen Traviss’ loud and sudden departure from the franchise happened. And why suddenly there was the weird continuity issue they had to try and smooth over when he decided to rename the Sith planet Korriban to Moraband.

What I’ve personally always been fascinated by is George’s love of the comics. He pulled Ayla Secura right out of the comics and adapted her to live action in AOTC. Her Master from the comics Quinlan Vos also almost made a live action appearance in ROTS but ended up instead as a vocal reference. Asajj Ventress, was another comics character he used quite heavily in the animated series.

He also heavily borrowed from Ki-Adi Mundi’s backstory from the comics for Anakin in ROTS. Married and being the “only” knight to be given a seat on the council without being granted the rank of Master.

And then there’s Darth Talon. Another comic character that George became enamored with. He first tried to use her in the long cancelled Darth Maul game and then later was planning on using her as the antagonist in his version of VII.

And his love of the comics continues. He’s been spotted heading into comic shops every now and then to buy the latest issues and even bought all of the original art for a Marvel Han Solo comic.

Yeah, Lucas’ relationship with the EU is quite interesting. Although a lot of SW fans would prefer for canon to be this rigid and consistent thing, it seems like Lucas always treated it similarly to how Star Trek have always done it where the novels, comics, etc. are just stories to enjoy and use as a “head-canon” or “what-ifs” until a new series or movie contradicts it. And as far as Legends are concerned, that was technically the case with G-canon, though you wouldn’t know if from scrolling through wookieepedia.


As a side note: do you know if there actually was any original art from the Han Solo series for Lucas to buy? Having read it I got the impression it was done digitally, so I’ve always wondered if it actually happened or not. Every article I’ve read always seemed to skip that part and only says he wanted to buy it.

Post
#1318658
Topic
<em>Star Wars: The Clone Wars</em> To Return With New Episodes
Time

Anakin Starkiller said:

I know, and as I said it played really loose with its connection to EU material so it doesn’t really matter, but if we were to nitpick, then CW season 7 is technically part of both continuities. CW is such an oddity canon-wise. It is, as you say G-canon, so it trumped all other content, yet it was also made to fit within the time-jump in Tartakovsky’s CW cartoon, hence why season 1 starts with Anakin being a Jedi and why it never intended to show the attack on Coruscant. However, despite being the last part of Legends, it was canonized as the first non-movie content in the new EU and has been treated as the starting point for new animated series. The reason I find this funny is that it’s a canon series that was made to fit within a non-canon series, yet they continued several unresolved arcs in a canon sequel series, which means that the Legends version (regardless of whether season 7 counts) will most likely always be unfinished.

The weirdest part is that without Tartokovsky’s CW, Grievous and Ventress just sorta show up outta nowhere.

Exactly. And so far they haven’t bothered to give them a canon introduction either, they just kind of accept that those stories have already been told despite not being part the official canon.

Post
#1318655
Topic
<em>Star Wars: The Clone Wars</em> To Return With New Episodes
Time

DominicCobb said:

ZkinandBonez said:

DominicCobb said:

ZkinandBonez said:

So it just occurred to me that CW season 7 could technically qualify as both Legends and Canon at the same time. Granted the canonicity of CW pre-Disney was kind of weird and inconsistent, but it is the only non-live-action material to be canonized after Disney bought SW, and season 7 is based on unfinished episodes from the pre-Disney days, so shouldn’t the new season technically be part of both continuities? Not that this really matters overall, but I find these kinds of things fascinating.

I would think with that profile picture you might have known about Marvel #108 “Forever Crimson” https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Wars_108:_Forever_Crimson

Yeah, as a matter of fact I just got my copy of it recently (there was a mix up with my pull-list and I didn’t get it until now). Though I’m not quite sure what you’re getting at.

Maybe I misread your comment. I thought you were wondering if Disney has produced any new Legends content, but I guess you’re talking about producing new Legends content that is also canon.

Ah, I see. No, I’m well aware that other than Crimson Forever, which was more a gimmick than anything else, that Disney SW aren’t making any new Legends content. I was just saying that CW season 7, being based on previously unfinished episodes, are unintentionally Legends stories as well.

Post
#1318650
Topic
<em>Star Wars: The Clone Wars</em> To Return With New Episodes
Time

Tobar said:

ZkinandBonez said:

So it just occurred to me that CW season 7 could technically qualify as both Legends and Canon at the same time. Granted the canonicity of CW pre-Disney was kind of weird and inconsistent, but it is the only non-live-action material to be canonized after Disney bought SW, and season 7 is based on unfinished episodes from the pre-Disney days, so shouldn’t the new season technically be part of both continuities? Not that this really matters overall, but I find these kinds of things fascinating.

The series was created by George Lucas himself. It’s always been considered G-Level canon, even after he left following the third season.

I know, and as I said it played really loose with its connection to EU material so it doesn’t really matter, but if we were to nitpick, then CW season 7 is technically part of both continuities. CW is such an oddity canon-wise. It is, as you say G-canon, so it trumped all other content, yet it was also made to fit within the time-jump in Tartakovsky’s CW cartoon, hence why season 1 starts with Anakin being a Jedi and why it never intended to show the attack on Coruscant. However, despite being the last part of Legends, it was canonized as the first non-movie content in the new EU and has been treated as the starting point for new animated series. The reason I find this funny is that it’s a canon series that was made to fit within a non-canon series, yet they continued several unresolved arcs in a canon sequel series, which means that the Legends version (regardless of whether season 7 counts) will most likely always be unfinished.

In the end I just like these shows for what they are regardless of what continuity they “officially” belong to, but since canonicity is a thing I find these oddities fascinating.

Post
#1318647
Topic
<em>Star Wars: The Clone Wars</em> To Return With New Episodes
Time

DominicCobb said:

ZkinandBonez said:

So it just occurred to me that CW season 7 could technically qualify as both Legends and Canon at the same time. Granted the canonicity of CW pre-Disney was kind of weird and inconsistent, but it is the only non-live-action material to be canonized after Disney bought SW, and season 7 is based on unfinished episodes from the pre-Disney days, so shouldn’t the new season technically be part of both continuities? Not that this really matters overall, but I find these kinds of things fascinating.

I would think with that profile picture you might have known about Marvel #108 “Forever Crimson” https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Wars_108:_Forever_Crimson

Yeah, as a matter of fact I just got my copy of it recently (there was a mix up with my pull-list and I didn’t get it until now). Though I’m not quite sure what you’re getting at.

Post
#1318567
Topic
<em>The Mandalorian</em> - Season One Discussion - * <strong>SPOILER THREAD</strong> *
Time

timdiggerm said:

ZkinandBonez said:

timdiggerm said:

It is fascinating that, with the exception of 7, you named the episodes that barely, if at all, moved the plot along. My favorites were 1, 3, 7 & 8, so I am…well, like I said, fascinated.

It’s not that weird, is it? Not everyone likes/prefers series to tell one large story, but rather wants mini-adventures with a connecting through-line. This is one of the reasons I enjoyed this show so much as I don’t like the modern Netflix/HBO style of stretching one story into hundreds of hours. I get why some people like it, but to me it just feels like padding. SW shows like the Mandalorian, CW, Rebels, etc. manage to keep my attention much easier because most episodes are (more-or-less) standalone stories, that occasionally continues or adds to a larger narrative. In this sense The Mandalorian was nearly perfectly structured for my preferences (I actually would have liked a few more episodes like 4-6).

Similarly, my favourite episodes were 2 & 6.

That really helped me understand. Clearly, I want the opposite (though honestly, I did really like 2 & 6, it’s just that the overall plot grabs me more). So, the fact that the show manages to hit some notes for both of us is pretty great; they’re striking a good balance.

Yeah, Favreau and Filoni both seem to have a really good grasp on the nuances in what both SW fans and regular viewers want out of a show and have struck a really good balance, which is no small feat in general, let alone with SW.

Post
#1318559
Topic
<em>The Mandalorian</em> - Season One Discussion - * <strong>SPOILER THREAD</strong> *
Time

timdiggerm said:

It is fascinating that, with the exception of 7, you named the episodes that barely, if at all, moved the plot along. My favorites were 1, 3, 7 & 8, so I am…well, like I said, fascinated.

It’s not that weird, is it? Not everyone likes/prefers series to tell one large story, but rather wants mini-adventures with a connecting through-line. This is one of the reasons I enjoyed this show so much as I don’t like the modern Netflix/HBO style of stretching one story into hundreds of hours. I get why some people like it, but to me it just feels like padding. SW shows like the Mandalorian, CW, Rebels, etc. manage to keep my attention much easier because most episodes are (more-or-less) standalone stories, that occasionally continues or adds to a larger narrative. In this sense The Mandalorian was nearly perfectly structured for my preferences (I actually would have liked a few more episodes like 4-6).

Similarly, my favourite episodes were 2 & 6.

Post
#1318513
Topic
<em>Star Wars: The Clone Wars</em> To Return With New Episodes
Time

So it just occurred to me that CW season 7 could technically qualify as both Legends and Canon at the same time. Granted the canonicity of CW pre-Disney was kind of weird and inconsistent, but it is the only non-live-action material to be canonized after Disney bought SW, and season 7 is based on unfinished episodes from the pre-Disney days, so shouldn’t the new season technically be part of both continuities? Not that this really matters overall, but I find these kinds of things fascinating.

Post
#1317547
Topic
<em>Star Wars: The Clone Wars</em> To Return With New Episodes
Time

RogueLeader said:

Honestly I think it would make more sense to introduce her as a new side/main character in the Rebels sequel. If it is a direct sequel to Rebels, following Sabine and Ahsoka’s quest to find Ezra, maybe she could come along on the journey.

Personally I would love a more general post-ROTJ series that brings in vibes of the popular post-Endor EU stories. It could be a perfect way to show the further adventures of Luke, Han and Leia, and their story could converge with that of Ezra, Sabine, Ahsoka and Thrawn.

Right, and I can see it working, I just personally think Filoni’s series are better when he’s just left to work with his own characters. So far the only “higher priority” characters have been movie related, which makes sense, and even then Rebels had very few new movie references other than Saw (which was technically a CW character first anyway). I do like your post-Endor suggestion though, and I’d love to see him do something similar to CW with Luke, Leia, etc. He’s already shown that he can do Leia, Lando, etc. really well, so seeing the OT gang alongside Rebels favourites like Ezra and Ahsoka would be a great foundation for a new Filoni cartoon. I just personally feel that adding a bunch of Marvel comics characters would just muddy it all up, better for him to prioritize his own continuity and the relevant live action stuff that most of the viewers have probably seen anyway.

Post
#1317376
Topic
<em>Star Wars: The Clone Wars</em> To Return With New Episodes
Time

Broom Kid said:

Rumor is we’re getting a sequel to Rebels after this, and possibly an animated show based on Doctor Aphra.

I haven’t watched Resistance, but from what I’ve gathered it hasn’t continued any of Filoni’s main story threads, so a Rebels sequel is good news. I’ve been re-watching it recently and now that SW seems to move into TV series territory, and since Disney+ seems like it will be making bolder stuff than what Disney XD allowed, it seems like the right time to (hopefully) complete Ahsoka and Ezra’s stories.

Not too sure about Aphra though, seems like a weird choice. Admittedly I never really liked the character (what I have read was just fine IMO), but I still don’t really see that character getting her own series. It seems like an odd thing to do for someone who’s story so far has been told exclusively through comics. Could these rumors relate to something similar to the Forces of Destiny shorts maybe? That makes more sense to me.

Post
#1317102
Topic
Cassian Andor Live-Action Series
Time

Mocata said:

I see RO was being similar to John Carenter’s The Thing, which also had a strong cast of characters, despite none of them having any clear backstory, shown or told. We learn who those character truly are through their response to the crisis in the film, and I personally think that’s so much more interesting than just a series of flashbacks

The Thing is a masterpiece, carried by a cast who are distinct with small amounts of screen time between them. They are memorable and often charismatic. RO has no such cast. And it’s the wrong genre for that sort of ensemble.

A war film can’t have an ensemble cast? I mean that’s what RO is, it’s a war film set in the SW universe. In a sense RO is The Dirty Dozen in space, so I’m not sure how an ensemble cast can be incorrect for the genre.

Also, those first two sentences are extremely subjective, and many people would say that RO has all of those attributes. They are all distinct characters, I personally would say that they are quite memorable (same more so than others, but that also applies to The Thing). And many of the characters are quite charismatic, at least to the extent that it makes sense within a somewhat gloomy war film.

Mocata said:

canofhumdingers said:
When he found the hallway full of rebels, he did what he routinely does in the OT and goes into action.

What he routinely does is stand behind the front line cannon fodder while they die in droves, then he steps forward to assess the damage. He doesn’t move that fast, ever, and he doesn’t use his lightsaber or the force wastefully like that. If only the way he acts was the issue… but the main problem is that he’s clearly been added in a reshoot for fan-service. Any theme of sacrifice (which was barely achieved with the blandest cast) is thrown out by a finale that cheers on the bad guy. Am I crazy is this all wrong to anyone else?

Fan service aside, Vader’s situation was rather unique in RO compared to anything we saw in the OT. In ANH they had the Tantive IV in a tractor beam, it was trapped within their hangar bay and a whole SD compliment was ready to storm the crew of one little ship. In RO there was a massive battle going on that was completely unexpected and the DS plans had been transmitted aboard a ship that could take off at any minute. In such a desperate situation it would be dumb to not send in Darth Vader if he was available. After all, pre-ANH, that was pretty much Vader’s role in the empire, to do the jobs that ordinary troopers couldn’t do (not easily anyway). Storming the Tantive IV after it had been captured was a task that didn’t require Vader, storming the Tantive IV while they were still downloading the DS plans and could escape at any minute, that is a task for Vader.

Also the idea of “cheering” Vader on is a bit of a misreading of the scene. Yes, people like Vader, but the scene is clearly meant to be intense and frightening, and in the same way that people like horror movies, people like seeing Vader being menacing. So yes, it’s fan service, but it’s also an intense scene adding tension and urgency to the rebels escape from Scarif. Also, the strange thing about SW is that interpretations are always very different between fans and regular viewers. I thought the Vader scene was “cool”, and so did my brother who’s also a SW fan, but other people I’ve talked to found the scene scary and/or tense, and there were definitely kids in the theater who were shocked to see Vader mow down good guys.

Post
#1317030
Topic
Design failures (and successes) of the PT
Time

Voss Caltrez said:

Z6PO said:

Look at the automobiles from the fifties, with all their curves, and then by the seventies they’re all boxy.

But it still doesn’t make sense.
1950s cars are all curvy, 70s they get more boxy.
But why is it that all the “1950s” ships in the PT look like they just got driven off the lot, while the “1970s” ships in the OT look like they’ve been around for more than 20 years? They’re all dirty, and worn-in.

The general idea is that since the rebels didn’t have a “military budget” they simply got whatever they could get their hands on, and aesthetics wasn’t exactly a priority either. The Y-Wings f.ex. are canonically old de-commissioned CW-era fighters that had been stripped down to their bare essential even before they stole them. Also the OT is after all 20-ish years post PT, so even if some of the more “modern” boxy designs are only 10 or so years old, that’s plenty of time for them to end up looking old and worn in by a rebellion that literally hides out in caves and has minimal equipment for maintenance. The degree of wear also varies from ship to ship. The Tantive IV and the Calamari cruisers are much more well maintained as they were in the service of their respective militaries before joining the rebellion, but on the other hand something like the Nebulon-B frigate is meant to be stolen imperial ships much much of their outer plating stripped off (similar to the Y-Wings.)

As far as retcons go I think they’ve mostly done a good job of it.

Post
#1316721
Topic
Cassian Andor Live-Action Series
Time

Mocata said:

ZkinandBonez said:

Also, how was Jyn’s origin cut? The first 10 min. or so is her backstory

The first 10 min shows her father’s history catching up with him. Her training and subsequent falling out with Saw have been dropped.

Right, I see what you mean, but still…

ZkinandBonez said:

…then we can extrapolate the rest from a combination of visuals and dialogue post time jump. Her being in a jail, being transported to a labour camp, her fighting the rebels who tries to save her, as well as her interactions of Saw, her initial disinterest with the rebellion, etc all speaks volumes of what happened post flashback. They only speak about her past twice in the film, and I don’t really see that as a problem, I’d say that’s quite efficient, not perfect of course, but quite efficient for a film like this with so many characters.

Plus, what I think is so nice about the first 10 min. of the film is that they establish the whole conflict of the film, the motivations of the main character which is directly tied with Galen’s arc as well (so two for one there), the motivations of the antagonist, and it introduces us to a character that becomes relevant later on. A flashbacks to her time with Saw could have been nice, but I’m also glad that RO didn’t turn into Lost where every other scene turns into a flashback. It worked for that show, but would have bogged down this film. And I don’t see the use of exposition as a problem if it adds to or clarifies what we have seen before. I mean the OT has several scenes where people just sit down as discuss something important, so I don’t see why RO can’t get away with it (I’d even say they did it better in some cases).

Post
#1316678
Topic
Cassian Andor Live-Action Series
Time

Mocata said:

The problem is that we are told his backstory not shown it. The same with Jyn since hers was cut. It’s the same as Anakin and Obiwan being “good friends”. We never see that. He’s in a bad place after being in the war so long? So much for TLJ being the only example of deconstruction and grey areas. Too bad our experience in the movie is him flying about with a comedy robot, and a couple of darker moments that are quickly glossed over.

I see what you mean, though I’m personally glad that the film wasn’t a collection of backstories. I feel that backstories are quite overrated, and what I liked about RO was that we learned about the characters through their actions and interactions with other characters. Though I’m looking forward to this series, as for RO taken on its own terms as a movie; I never felt that I needed to “see” Cassian’s past as I got what I personally needed to know from his personality and actions. I see RO was being similar to John Carenter’s The Thing, which also had a strong cast of characters, despite none of them having any clear backstory, shown or told. We learn who those character truly are through their response to the crisis in the film, and I personally think that’s so much more interesting than just a series of flashbacks (though that can of course work in other movies/shows).

Also, how was Jyn’s origin cut? The first 10 min. or so is her backstory (as well as Galen & Krennic, plus an introduction to Saw, which IMO is quite efficient storytelling), then we can extrapolate the rest from a combination of visuals and dialogue post time jump. Her being in a jail, being transported to a labour camp, her fighting the rebels who tries to save her, as well as her interactions of Saw, her initial disinterest with the rebellion, etc all speaks volumes of what happened post flashback. They only speak about her past twice in the film, and I don’t really see that as a problem, I’d say that’s quite efficient, not perfect of course, but quite efficient for a film like this with so many characters.

TK-949 said:

I honestly don’t remember. I have seen the movie twice, and just remember I couldn’t relate to any of the characters, especially Ando Carissan (I’d like to buy two L and an I), therefore I didn’t care if they were successful or if they survived or not. Not to mention the further damage done to Darth Vader’s character. I’d have to watch it again to come up with specific reasons, why I dislike him so much, but I don’t intend to, unless it’s a version without Special Effects and cut to only Alan Tudyk’s scenes.

But I have to admit, I might give it a chance. It could be as awesome as the Mandalorian, if the right people worked on it. Filoni managed to make Anakin a likeable character. I watched the hell out of The Clone Wars, but I still won’t watch any of the Prequels ever again.

Fair enough. This is of course very subjective and I personally really liked all the characters, especially Bodhi Rook, whom (apart from Jyn) I think changed the most. I can see why Andor was a bit underwhelming to a lot of people though, but that’s one of the reasons why I think this show could be really interesting.

Not sure what you mean about the Vader scenes though? How did it “damage” the character. There were no signs of the PT version, he was foreboding, lethal, witty, all things that I personally would associate with OT Vader. I get the fanservice argument (I just don’t see that as a problem myself), but I honestly can’t see how anything was wrong with his characterization. If anything I’d say that was one of RO’s big accomplishments.

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#1316656
Topic
Cassian Andor Live-Action Series
Time

TK-949 said:

Great. The most unlikable character from the worst of the Disney movies gets his own show. Yay!

What’s so bad about him? I’m genuinely curious as I’ve seen others express similar opinions.

I personally thought he was a really interesting, albeit somewhat underdeveloped character (though that’s hard to do with an ensemble cast anyway). The idea of a rebel who’s willing to bend the rules a bit and get his hands dirty for the “greater good” or just in order to survive is, to me at least, a really interesting alternative to the squeaky clean rebels that we usually got in the OT and EU material. The thing I really liked about the RO characters was that all they all seemed like real people with elaborate backstories and unique motivations, but we only got glimpses of it through their actions during the conflict of the film.