Why does Kylo wear a helmet if he doesn’t need one and it is never established before in the saga that bad guys must be helmeted?
There can be a psychological aspect to wearing the helmet.
Also he looks like a goofy kid without it. With it he can be tough and intimidating and channel his idol all day.
The “Fore Awakens” is that a golf movie?
POTY
I remember the names from the Tales of the Jedi comic series, but that’s it.
Sorry.
Bingowings confirmed as cat: Socks.
Bingowings confirmed as cat sock.
I’m just waiting until I can laugh my ass off when Trump is president and finally does something so insane and egregious that all the people who vocally support him suddenly become very very quiet.
Hopefully it won’t result in any deaths or anything.
And to embellish, because he idolizes Vader.
Not sure why that question is in this thread though.
It might make a point. We are to accept that Kylo is not a cheap recycling of elements of Anakin/Vader because he indeed does copy Vader but he does so in-universe, which is something no other character has done before.
So to have a character be a fan of other character would basically be a legitimate reason for it being a recycled element/rehash/heavily inspired element/whatever word you might call it, while it makes a somewhat logic argument for defending it if you liked the movie, because there is a diegetical statement that establishes this.
Forced as it might be, from an diegetical point of view there can’t be further development of the discussion. However, I honestly wonder if you really think that this was done inocently, or if it probably is the deliberate product of a reunion/meeting what went more or less like this:
-we need a vader like character to play the cool villain role you know, cool helmet, cool voice modulator, who doesn’t speak much and is a little unpredictable
-yeah, can’t we make Vader come back from death?
-nope, they’re gonna complain
-what if he torments the protagonist from beyond the grave?
-nope, he died being a good guy. Vader’s story is closed. We need another guy.
-what if he is a Vader impersonator because the Empire didn’t want his death to be known of?
-nope, that would be cheap
-what if it’s a guy that idolises him…and this way you would have a vader-like character yet with a good explanation?Because if you agree that probably it indeed went that way then deep in your thoughts you know it is intended to be a repetion of elements shielded by a convincing argument, but a repetition nonetheless. And we are only having a semantic argument about what qualifies as rehash/recycling and what does not, because we would agree that the intention was for it to be as conservative and as market-safe as it could posibly be. Which does as well answer to the main question of this topic, why doesn’t the Resistance have Tie Fighters.
They took too literally the “take Star Wars back to its basics” claim on the internet.
Who cares if they did though? The movie was still good and the character is still interesting.
Well I find the fact the conflict he has interesting as he is willing himself to be evil and I find his immaturity and his uncertainty to be somewhat endearing. I feel the same way about Luke’s whining and Rey’s naivety as it makes them relatable and makes me want to see them progress. I want there to be a day where we joke about how a baby Kylo used to destroy machines when he was mad.
Interesting to imagine that Luke and Anakin found their peace growing up in tinkering and constructing and perhaps little Ben was always more destructive.
Buffalo Stance - Nenah Cherry
Pretty tight jam.
I would say that Standalone is acceptable.
I’ve seen Star Wars so I can’t say as how it stands up alone as a film or not, but I’d argue that major elements of Star Wars are so ingrained in the societal conscience that even people who don’t know Star Wars would get the idea.
Hi Frank I love your thread.
XOXO
-Tyr
Socialism works fine in certain circumstances, it’s Communism that doesn’t work. The two are not synonymous.
I mean I’m no massive Liberal but you really can’t equate Trump and Obama. Trump is literally unhinged and Obama, like him or not, has been pretty sane throughout the past eight years.
What the hell am I doing back in a politics thread…
Heya folks. It’s me Tyr.
Some sheets to the wind and I’m not sure it was worth it. Oh well.
Ren isn’t interesting
This is a complaint I haven’t heard very often. May I ask why you feel this way?
Sorry for the late answer, just saw this. I don’t find him interesting because he’s just a Vader copy. Deep voice, all black outfit/uniform/whatever, identity hidden behind an ominous helmet, red light saber. Plus, in the spirit of Lucas, he’s a family member. More universe shrinking.
The in-story explanation helps a bit, but he’s still one-dimensional. I should point out that I’ve never found Vader to be very interesting. Not in his original 77 form, not in his rewritten-as-father form a few years later. For me, having Ren as another family member didn’t add to interest.
That’s also why I’m really hoping our new lead is Rey Random, not Rey Solo, Rey, Skywalker, or Rey Kenobi. that said; Rogue One has helped tremendously with my not caring near as much about Rey’s lineage as last year. I have the Star Wars sequel I’ve always wanted. If VIII isn’t what I hope, no huge loss.
But, and forgive me for bringing it up again, isn’t it kind of neat that he’s a Vader wannabe? He really isn’t Vader at all, but he idolizes Vader like a teenager and a band’s lead singer. In reality he’s not like Vader at all, just wishes he was: unlike Luke, he doesn’t see the man under the mask, just the mask and the persona Anakin took on after his fall.
I think that (not to mention Ben’s obvious lack of conviction) makes him one of the most interesting characters in TFA, and certainly one of the deeper villains in Star Wars thus far. Is he really evil? I’m not so sure.
With a spinoff that relates to the saga they can test the waters of reception without going way out and taking a massive risk like with some Tales of the Jedi “4000 years before ANH” shit. Plus it’s a cool story.
It’s pretty awful, but I still throw it on in the background during the holidays. It’s worth actively watching once.
First off, I’ve always loved the idea that Geonosis is a dead planet now. I think it was an interesting step to take to completely erase an entire species from the galaxy, especially one that we know so well. Usually people are afraid to do that, but I like that they went for it. Geez, I was actually feeling bad for them. Poor Klik-Klak. I like that he’s probably trying to say “Death Star” with his writings, but there are several items consisting of “circles within circles” in the episode. It’s a shame having read Vader beforehand and knowing what happens to the queen as well, heh. Poor guys can’t catch a break.
“He’s no Skywalker” is a great line, and it’s neat to see Kanan really moving more into the Force as well. That bridge is the biggest thing we’ve seen moved with the Force in awhile, I think.
They did a good job capturing Forrest’s likeness as Saw (bringing him back for the voice helped a lot), as well as bridging the gap between the Clone Wars Saw and the Rogue One Saw. It’s interesting to see him with the fire and the passion he had during the Clone Wars. You can really see where he develops the fanaticism and extremism and distrust of the other Rebels they talk about in Rogue One, and it’s neat that they acknowledge that not all Rebels are created equally.
A sandstorm “clogging the barrels” of the Ghost is pretty spurious, but whatever. Sabine’s line about it was a nice little grin moment, too (but I could have gone without the reuse of “that’ll end this debate real quick” - okay, we get it. It’s Star Wars. =P)
The Rocket Troopers were neat, but I’m a bit miffed that they didn’t just go with the design from Battlefront. They’re pretty much the same thing! Sabine is getting to be pretty cool herself too.
I also noticed Hera the same dots on her shoulder as Cassian does in Rogue One so I assume the two vertical green dots are for captains in the Rebellion rank system.
Don’t forget that the F-15 (and A-10, which is still a workhorse) is older than Star Wars, the F/A-18 is older than Empire, and the F-22 is as old as the Special Editions. Plus, all of these planes serve different purposes for different branches of the military.
As I said, Soviet Union effectively collapsed in 80s.
The same is true for Star Wars: The TIE Interceptor serves as a specialized air-to-air fighter while the the normal TIE Tighter is more of a multi-role craft from all the canon I’ve ever known. Same as the TIE Bomber is a specialized bomber, or the TIE Striker is a specialized atmospheric fighter/transport.
Seeing how OT space combat is based on WW2, there are basically three main carrier-based roles: fighter, dive bomber and torpedo bomber (I guess the two are the same in OT). TIE fighter obviously filled the fighter role until it was obviously replaced by TIE interceptor. Of course, like in WW2 the replacement cannot happen immediately so we can still see some TIE fighters at that point. But the fact is that in ROTJ battle the two do exactly the same role.
No major military just has “one” model of fighter that they replace continually. In World War II there was the P-51, the P-40, the F4, F6, and F8, P-47, the F4U… and that’s just some of the American planes I can think of off the top of my head, several of these went on to fight in Korea as well and some saw active service until the late 60s and early 70s.
When it comes to WW2, there were specified roles that were continually replaced by newer models. Primary US land-based fighter: P-40 replaced P-36 and P-51 replaced P-40. Primary US carrier-borne fighter: F4F replaced F2A and F6F replaced F4F. And so on…
Exactly.
So why do you see TIE Fighters alongside TIE Interceptors in Jedi?
It’s not over yet.
It is for me, sister.
Alien is an amazing film, Aliens is a good film but totally devalues the threat and doesn’t go as deep into the horror.
My grandfather’s surgery has been moved to later in January. My mom had him write out a will, she’s pretty convinced it could be the end. Losing him right now might break me beyond repair. God willing, it’ll go well and I’ll get a few more years with him. Saw my dad’s doctor again. He didn’t boost up the Prozac like I was hoping he would, but prescribed something else and gave me a list of psychiatrists to call, which I guess I’ll do on my next day off. The obsessiveness is still circling like a vulture in my head. I had a rousing flu the last few days which had me expelling stuff I ate in third grade, so that was fucking fun. I’m back at work now, stressed as usual. I had a row my brother because I guess that he felt that vomiting and shitting at the same time weren’t sufficient reason for me to monopolize the restroom, and my uncle really went off on my when I confessed that my brother had called me earlier convinced that I was shcidial, and gave me a rather vicious talking to about how I don’t consider the effect I can have on others with my feelings. I get it, but thought it was NOT a good way of approaching things. Anyway, I’m back at work. Oh, yay. My dad and my brother both lost their jobs, and they’re revoking my holiday pay for being Sick.
Good to hear from you again. Just hang in there. Definitely phone up a few of those psychiatrists and find one you really mesh with and can be open with.
I’m sorry that some people don’t have the best grasp of how these things work, and I’m really sorry that this country continually fails people with mental health issues. It’s pathetic and embarrassing and it’s going to get worse before it gets better sadly.
But you just hang in there and keep moving forward, man.
Poorly.
I was a Phantom Menace Obi-Wan in 1999 or 2000. It was a pretty sweet costume. My mom made it for me and I found a fake braid and everything.
Who said they were phased out by TIE interceptors?
ROTJ and common sense say so.
Why does the B-52H, last built in the 1960s, still make up nearly half of the US heavy bomber force? Why does USAF still fly versions of the F-16, initially developed in the 1970s, despite the development of more advanced airframes such as the F-15, F/A-18, and F-22? Can’t seem to figure out what common sense you speak of.
Don’t forget that the F-15 (and A-10, which is still a workhorse) is older than Star Wars, the F/A-18 is older than Empire, and the F-22 is as old as the Special Editions. Plus, all of these planes serve different purposes for different branches of the military. The same is true for Star Wars:
The TIE Interceptor serves as a specialized air-to-air fighter while the the normal TIE Tighter is more of a multi-role craft from all the canon I’ve ever known. Same as the TIE Bomber is a specialized bomber, or the TIE Striker is a specialized atmospheric fighter/transport.
No major military just has “one” model of fighter that they replace continually. In World War II there was the P-51, the P-40, the F4, F6, and F8, P-47, the F4U… and that’s just some of the American planes I can think of off the top of my head, several of these went on to fight in Korea as well and some saw active service until the late 60s and early 70s.
Did you read Guy Henry’s interview on it?
THE HOLLYWOOD REPORTER 6th Jan 2017
No performance from 2016 was met with quite the fascination of Guy Henry’s turn in Rogue One: A Star Wars Story — and he wasn’t even one of the few actors not involved in the film’s worldwide media blitz.
The British actor was tasked with playing Grand Moff Tarkin, with his performance capture work and visual effects wizardry helping resurrect the character played by the late Peter Cushing in 1977’s Star Wars: Episode IV — A New Hope. Rather than recasting the role, Industrial Light & Magic recreated Cushing’s actual likeness for a performance not quite like any in film history.
Reached by phone in Great Britain Friday, Henry spoke about the unprecedented responsibility he felt to honor Cushing (“It was genuinely frightening”), his offer to let director Gareth Edwards recast him (“I won’t be offended”) and speculation that the story of Carrie Fisher’s Leia might continue through such technology. (He declined to comment on Fisher, but did offer this of the technology: “I think and hope it won’t be a commonplace thing.”)
During the 18 months you kept this a secret, did your family know what you were doing?
The very, very closest of my family and friends — I graciously allowed them into the secret, because I think I would have gone mad otherwise. My name began to be associated with it occasionally. People would ask. At work, [the team behind the BBC One series] Holby City had to know I was doing something in it, but even my agent, when I was asked to meet Gareth Edwards, she didn’t really know why. They didn’t tell her. It was quite a responsibility really, and I’m glad it was kept secret right up until the very last moment.
How did Gareth Edwards and Industrial Light & Magic’s John Knoll convince you this would all work out?
I felt I couldn’t feel too responsible in the sense of the way that it looked. I had to trust John Knoll and Gareth and the team, who were convinced they could make it work. Vocally, I’m not a mimic. I’m genuinely not an impressionist. I’d be doing my very best to do my Tarkin, the rolled “r” and the voice as best I could, and Gareth would say, “OK relax on that. Just be a bit more Guy now.” I had to trust that they saw something in the reel of my work that convinced them it could be the tribute to Cushing everyone wanted it to be. It was very, very frightening, in all seriousness.
Did the reshoots affect you much?
Because the story was changing all the time, I kept thinking I had finished. “The responsibility has lapsed. Thank God, I can lie down.” Then they’d say, “Actually, can you come in next week and do half a line here and half a line there?” It was genuinely frightening, because I didn’t want to let down a huge movie, and equally, I didn’t want to let down Peter Cushing.
Do you remember much about what changed and when you finally ended your work?
It was quite difficult to remember what the last bit was. I would literally be called back to do half a line a bit differently. Half a line that had a bit more stress to it because something else had altered slightly what had happened to a different character. It was immensely detailed. It’s something of a blur.
Did you have doubts this would work?
Normally as an actor, you are you pretending to be another person. Here, I was me pretending to be Peter Cushing pretending to be Tarkin. I said at one point, “I won’t be offended if you feel the voice isn’t good enough or isn’t right or is too young.” There is a famous impersonator here called Rory Bremner. I said, “I won’t be offended if you want to get him. I just want it to be good. Don’t worry if you have to ditch my voice.” They stuck with me gamely.
When did you finally see what it would look like?
They snuck me in to show me [early]. I thought, “We might be all right here.” It was only after the London premiere I knew for sure it worked. I’d had several glasses of white wine. I wasn’t able to eat, I was so frightened. “If I haven’t done good enough here, it’s going to be so sad. That would be very bad.” I don’t mean bad career-wise. I had not done any interviews. “Don’t bother about my name.” I’d be referred to as a stand-in and a voice double who was a disaster, and I could go on. But I didn’t want to let Peter Cushing down.
Have you heard from the Cushing estate? One of its executors has praised your performance.
I haven’t first hand. If that is the case, which I gather it is, I’m so delighted. The reason for doing it was honorable. When people were talking about the ethics of bringing someone back who was long dead, I could see that if it was done for the wrong reason or something a bit seedy or just for the sake of it, that would have been wrong. When John Knoll pitched the film, obviously Tarkin is such a big part of the original. Not to have Tarkin in it would be just a shame, and I think they have done it very honorably.
Before Carrie Fisher’s death, Lucasfilm said Tarkin was a special case and it likely wouldn’t be done again. Do you think this will become more prevalent in other Hollywood films?
I can’t really see why they would. Suddenly to make a new film and get James Dean in it? I can’t see that’s likely to happen. This was very specifically to recreate this character in a way that served the story of Rogue One. Apart from anything else, the work involved in it was enormous. I always felt so sorry for the poor people in Industrial Light & Magic. They had to spend all day and most of the night with me trying to make me look like him. Tony Gilroy, who was the second unit director, said, “God, I’ve spent a hell of a lot of time listening to your voice.” I said, "You poor man. I’m sorry about that."
What would you think about Lucasfilm potentially using such a technique to help complete the story of Leia following Fisher’s death?
I have no comment to make about Carrie Fisher, because Rogue One was my film and I have no connection to other films. To be honest, I don’t know what she was or wasn’t doing [in future films], I’m afraid.
I think and hope it won’t be a commonplace thing. I can see when it can be used for a good piece of storytelling, and I’m sure they will consider it. I don’t think it’s going to be very common.
How did wearing the apparatus affect your performance?
There’s something very claustrophobic, there’s something very distancing about having the head cam gear. It’s very unwieldy. It’s hard enough on a film set to believe you are this other person. This other character. They had a lovely guy called Robert and a lady called Sonya from ILM, and they made it as comfortable and as easy to wear as they possibly could. It’s very hard to find a performance with that thing sticking on your head, the lights and lenses shining on your eyes. It’s a very particular way of working. I must say I found it terribly frightening.
Tarkin really shone opposite Ben Mendelsohn’s Orson Krennic. What was that working relationship like?
He’s wonderful. He gets himself completely into the character. He’s alive. He’s sparking. At one point, I was being deliberately louche in order to wind him up. He thought I was looking at the monitor, which was at the back of the camera. I was being deliberately dismissive. I succeeded so much, I really pissed him off. He shouted, “Don’t look at the monitor, Guy!” I wasn’t looking at the monitor, and as a true professional, I never would. [Laughsray_afraid said:
I’m pretty impressed by the Tarkin in R1. […] I bought it! Not as Peter Cushing, but as the character of Tarkin.It’s apparently true that most men are focused mainly on visuals and technical details. That’s what we read all over the net, “CGI this, CGI that”. For me the biggest deparature from original Tarkin/Cushing was the voice… oh, how I missed his rrr’s 😉 …a distinct accent from a person born 100 years ago.
What a class act. It’s interesting that they went with Henry’s voice instead of an impersonator almost consciously. I really enjoyed the effect and the character already, but the fact that from what Henry said they weren’t trying to completely imitate Cushing, but more create an homage to him makes me like it all the more.
^That is the best post yet that sums up everything that is actually known at this point. Well done!
My exact thoughts. Fantastic post, 'Falcon!