Trooperman

Thank goodness.

Dressed to Kill (1980).  I wish I hadn't (although there were some fantastic parts, like the museum scene). 

I just came back from Raiders again...this time the regular 35mm version. 

It was radically different than the IMAX.  The sound mix was not as good (the music was softer and sounded thin/hollow) and the colors seemed to be heavily tinted yellow to the point where whites were not white anymore.  Plus, contrast was often soft/blurry....frankly it looked like I remember seeing "Crystal Skull" in the theater. 

This in stark contrast to the IMAX showing, which had rich, beautiful, realistic colors, gorgeous sharp, hard contrast- and beautiful, powerful, punchy audio that put the music first but also spread dialogue and effects to the front left and right- lots of ambiance. 

The IMAX also had the original PG rating card at the end, whereas the regular version had the modern PG card. 

Advantages of the new 35mm version: they didn't remove the grain.  Was nice to see grain in the movie.  Also, the establishing DC shot doesn't stick out like a sore thumb like it did on IMAX. 

And it was wonderful to see the reactions of the handful of others watching in the theater.  This was the last night that Raiders was being played.  The other people liked the shooting scene, the part where the fly climbs into Belloq's mouth, and the truck chase especially.  Also they loved when the Nazi's face melts off.  They sat through all of the end credits with me- very unusual for audiences today.  Afterwards they commented on how short they were..how if it were made today the credits would be a lot longer.Then they asked me if I saw the fly climb into Belloq's mouth...

In general, they were just happy to see it on the big screen again ("since I was 10", one guy joked).  It was kind of bittersweet that there were only about 5 people there in the theater considering what a great movie it is, but those people were all 30 and older.  It really made me happy to see them able to go back in time, even just for a couple hours, and relive a part of their childhood. I actually left after chatting briefly because they were just continuing to sit there and I felt like I should leave them alone...I felt like I was intruding on their childhood...that this movie belonged to their generation, not mine....

So overall I had a great time:)  But I do think they need to take care of those digitally manipulated yellow colors and the blurry images in the next release...

I can't wait for this to come out.  Look at the richness of the colors.  It looks like technicolor.

*sigh*

I think the more salient point is the fact that this poster seems convinced that the original versions of the trilogy were designed for tube TVs because HD screens "didn't even exist" back then, and so the GOUT is the best possible version.

LOL

obi-rob-kenobi4 (theforce.net) said:

In reality George Lucas gave the OOOT obsessors exactly what it was that they wanted in 2004. He gave the smug, obnoxious little punks and hipsters and criminals the exact thing that they were illegally selling and shearing and downloading and bootlegging and he gave it to them on a convenient dvd. And no matter what you try to say YES it was the best quality possible. For THAT particular version of the films it is the only way to watch them. That particular version was not ever restored/changed to be able to properly watch on a 50'' flat screen. It was/is only watchable on a tube tv. Thats the whole point Lucas was trying to make when he released it in 2004. You wanna see it so bad? Ok tell ya what ill do Ill make it so you dont have to be forced to watch it on vhs anymore and you dont even have to be forced to watch it on a computer screen anymore. You can watch it on a dvd on a big screen tube tv. Flat screen, HD tvs did not even exist when this was made, it was made to be seen on a movie projector or a tube tv screen. Thats it.

LOL

Washington Post in 1980:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/style/longterm/movies/review97/empirestrikesbackmartin.htm

Lando walking down the hallway.  His line: "So you see..." is clearly audible in the mono, not in the stereo (although it is there, faintly).

-Release it one way in the movie theater and then completely change the colors for DVD/Blu-Ray years later and say it was always meant to be that way.

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

Is it a completey new mix, or is it the 35mm mix with extra things layered on top of it?

It sounds like a completely new mix to me, based on the very different treatment of the music all the way throughout.

I'm pretty much done listing changes for now, but I know there are lots now.  Thanks again to Puggo for making this available!  New dialogue in ESB..that is really exciting:)

-TM

Han screaming when he is getting interrogated is MUCH louder in certain spots during the Vader/Lando conversation. 

This is a really, really, really great find!!

I'm going to start just editing this post now (also edited to reflect that this seems to be not necessarily the 70mm mix, but instead a 3rd mix- the "ESB mono mix."

-Right after the magic tree scene, 16mm features the classic TIE sound effects from "Star Wars".  The 35mm does not.

-Right after Luke puts the charge into the AT-AT and blows it up, the very next speeder Veers' AT-AT shoots down has an airplane sound effect in the 35mm which is mixed much, much softer in the mono.

-Music is generally mixed much more prominently, with much punchier brass and violins, in this mono track.  For a good example see the Hoth base scene right after the power generator is blown up. The music is inaudible in the 35mm and only fades in when 3PO appears- the missing music is not only audible, but very prominent in the mono 

-For instance, in that very same scene, right before Leia falls down, she screams twice in the mono mix.  No extra explosion before she falls.

-And as C3PO is climbing up the ramp, the most prominent sound in the mono mix is the flutes and the swooping strings.  In the 35mm, it's C3PO footsteps on the ramp, and the ramp sound effect- only to have to dial the music back up for the next scene (Vader).

-The shot after the Falcon escapes Hoth, the X-wing flyover is not nearly as prominent in the mono-music is

-The asteroid field sequence- all the sound effects are drastically muted and some are entirely missing in the mono mix.  Focus is on the music.

-The scene right before the big Han/Leia kiss on the ship...much louder computer sound effects on the mono.

-Right after Leia screams seeing the Mynock out the window...audio of her footsteps on-set much more prominent.

-Yoda: "Consume you it will...as it did Obi-Wan's apprentice."  For the mono mix, a different, less aggressive take of "as it did Obi-Wan's apprentice" has been spliced in.

Mavimao said:

Hmm... C3PO only says "Hello?" once when he thinks he hears an R2 unit AND the troop's voice is different....

Holy crap!

AND the droid's "Eh chuta" sounds like a different take!

Yoda training scene

35mm:

"Ehh...run!"

70mm mono fold-down:

"YES...run!"

That is true, but if I'm not mistaken we are mostly just assuming what is in the 70mm mix based on hearsay and what is in the Special Edition...

When R2 is being loaded into Luke's X-Wing, C-3PO says the word "and" more audibly before saying "do take good care of yourself."present

C3PO has an ADDITIONAL LINE (not documented elsewhere) at the beginning of the carbon freezing scene.  "Oh dear, what now?  I don't like the look of this."

"Oh, this is suicide!  There's nowhere to go."  present on the mono folddown.

Yoda makes a frightened "Ehhhhh!" sound just before Luke says "Like we're being watched" and points his blaster at him.

Missing from all the official releases, but present in this mono-folddown (one of the purported 70mm differences)

Trooperman said:

I also noticed an interesting deviation between the 16mm mono and the laserdisc rip. 

Remember how in the special edition (and presumably the 70mm), Yoda's speech (when he's riding on Luke's back)

"Anger, fear agression..the dark side of the force are they.  Easily they flow...quick to join you in a fight...."

is much louder in relation to the R2 beeping sound? 

 

The 16mm mono has the loud version- the special edition version. 

I just noticed another deviation- when Luke kicks Vader in the carbon-freezing chamber, he goes "Uhhh" instead of "Ahhh."

THIS LOOKS LIKE A MONO-FOLD DOWN OF THE 70MM MIX! 

I also noticed an interesting deviation between the 16mm mono and the laserdisc rip. 

Remember how in the special edition (and presumably the 70mm), Yoda's speech (when he's riding on Luke's back)

"Anger, fear agression..the dark side of the force are they.  Easily they flow...quick to join you in a fight...."

is much louder in relation to the R2 beeping sound? 

The 16mm mono has the loud version- the special edition version. 

This is now my go-to version for "Empire Strikes Back" (until the new 35mm transfer comes out in the future). 

It looks great, and again- when you watch something that doesn't look completely perfect, I think you actually get MORE involved with the story.  It looks natural.  he perfectly stabilized, zero-grain digital look these days is distracting. 

The same thing with LP records- they are not pristine and digital like CDs- consequently they are much less distracting to listen to and you can actually get involved in the music.

Cold, digital clarity does not help you focus on the content- it draws attention to its perfectness. 

Anyway, this looks great.  Like with negative -1's sample clips, I love the hard light, high contrast look of this...most official DVD/Blu-Ray releases don't look like this esp. if they went back to the original negative. 

So we will probably never see something that looks like this from Lucasfilm even if they do decide to release the OOT. 
Thank you very much for this:)

-TM

What immediately strikes me is just how good the original lightsabers looked.  They didn't need to be redone for the DVD- they look smooth here, and colorful enough.

McFlabbergasty said:

 

I am 20 years old and have been going to an engineering college in the Southeastern United States for the past two years......

I read the rest of the post.  It sounds like what you really need are some goals.  Check out "Time Power" and "Focal Point" by Brian Tracy.  Work through some of the exercises.  That should get you back on track:)

McFlabbergasty said:

How do I break all of this? I ask that no-one give me any religious answers.

 

Dude, you're not going to want to hear this, but because this forum has no rules you can't stop me;) 

Part of your problem might be the fact that you are not asking God for help. 

There, I said it...

Bingowings said:

Release the thing in 3D, IMAX, ID and 3MAX especially if it adds nothing at all to the quality of the piece.

LOL.  Definitely a current trend.

How To Make a Modern Hollywood Blockbuster:

1. Never cast anyone over 30 except for Morgan Freeman

2. Insert Morgan Freeman whether his presence in the movie makes sense or not

3. Never use more than three notes for the musical score (you don't want to be accused of manipulating your audience, do you?)

4. Hire Hans Zimmer to do #3

5. Film it on 35mm fllm, input it into a computer,and then crush all the detail out of the image and tint it green, blue, red, or if all else fails...teal and orange.  This makes it look cool and "artistic".

6. Make sure the sound effects are really really loud so they can drown out the music.

7. Buy the rights to a really good story and then completely change everything about it.  Get a local 6th grader to proofread.

8. Include one scene with Morgan Freeman completely stopping the story to deliver a moral "lesson" that is completely irrelevant to the story and makes the audience feel guilty for absolutely no reason.

9. If you don't have a large casting budget, hire an actor with British accent (everybody will hear the accent and exclaim what a good actor he is).

10.Remember- if less is more, than more must be even better.  That goes for everything, especially CGI.  Every scene is better with CGI (you can always have one scene with no CGI and long close-up shots with the actors wearing worried and somber faces- people will think this is "artistic"). 

11. Always put an obnoxious pop song at the end whether it fits or not.

12. Always use extreme close-ups and never stay on the same shot for longer than 1.5 seconds. 

There, I think I've found the formula;)

-TM