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Trooperman

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Join date
15-Feb-2005
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15-Jun-2015
Posts
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Post
#197113
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/197113/action/topic#197113
Time
And AOTC, I cant wait to hear the ideas on how to fix that, as the fireplace scene and any scene with Padme and Anakin just make me want to cringe, uy.

A really tough problem to fix, but the dubbing of Anakin has resulted in a lot of really good dialogue scenes that were butchered in the original. The only problem is that I wasn't able to redub Padme, whose delivery some consider to be even worse than Anakin's. Anyhow, get ready for something very radical on Ep. II. It's certainly taking long enough, so I hope that the time involved will be reflected in the final product, and that it will be a nice surprise for everyone this year. Because it IS coming out this year That' a definite.

Also, nice work on those screenshots for Empire and ROTJ. I'm not certain that this is the direction you're going (but perhaps I'll try it eventually if you don't), but I would love to see a version of ROTJ with the changes that CC outlined...that is compatible with the original versions of SW and Empire. You could consider ROTJ as the point that Lucas started to lose his touch with Star Wars, and therefore it needed editing to bring it UP to the level of SW and Empire. Do you see what I'm saying? Rather than having it dependent on a recut version of the classics, maybe there could be a self-contained re-edit of ROTJ. Just a thought for the future!

Also, there was some discussion about updating the computer readouts in SW to match the prequels. I would encourage you not to do that, because I'm trying my best to "age" the computer readouts in SOTDS. Actually, if anyone else wanted to create a couple new shots of 70's technology type of computer readouts, that would be even better. Only a couple (the readout in Jango's ship, for instance) would need to be redone. I'm not sure if anyone has the capability to do that, though.

Good luck, guys!
Post
#195785
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/195785/action/topic#195785
Time
Hi everyone! The following scenes have been dubbed:

-Confession and Rejection
-Arrival at Coruscant
-Coruscant nights
-The Funeral of Shmi
-Chat with Palpatine.
-Garage Scene

The Uncle Owen dialogue should be on the way as well. And the dialogue for Lama-Su is still being reworked a bit, but I’ll let “Nanner Split” know when the lines are all set.

-TM

P.S.: As a kind of neat side note, I was able to augment the dream (and not have to use the same few seconds of footage flipped and flipped and recolored in every way possible), using a couple excellent close-ups of Tuskens taken from the old ’77 “Making of Star Wars” documentary. Who would have thought that film would be useful in an edit?
Post
#194837
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/194837/action/topic#194837
Time
I'm gonna be honest... That scream when Anakin loses his arm is horrible. It sounds like some sort of huge beast in pain.

I love honesty- thanks! You won't believe me, but I had the exact same thought- it was on my list of things to rerecord. Rest assured knowing that a pickup was already recorded, and it sounds much better. The sound was kind of "temp".

MTH: The bedroom scene is making some more sense to me, particularly without as much yakking from Padme and some nice music that evokes the feelings that the scene has to to make it work. So far so good. The main issue I have with this is that it seems out-of-place and confusing, and I as an audience member would be wondering, "Why isn't Padme excited to see her parents after all this time? Why did she just slip upstairs to the bedroom without even saying hi?" This would be detrimental to the movie.

Then, I remembered...I have the power to make Anakin say anything I want. Something like "I'm looking forward to meeting your parents when they come home." at the beginning of the scene. This would explain why they went up to the bedroom to unpack- nobody was home when they came. Unfortunately, this scenario would require cutting the little scene with R2 and the children, which adds a lot more character. I guess you could assume that either the children were only left home for a little while, or Padme's sister was actually at home but didn't see them come in. We don't want to create negligent parents for Padme!

It seems to me that if they meet the parents, have the nice picnic in the meadow, and then have their first kiss, (in that order), presto! They are young kids in love, and you can cut out ALL the rest of their horrible, creepy love story, and I mean all of it.

Well, that's almost how it works, only we have a chat after they arrive on Naboo (which, thanks to the deleted footage, is now void of any politics or "terms"). Also, they do not kiss on the balcony, and the balcony scene leads into the fireplace scene. I do want you to know that my initial plan was to have them kiss on the balcony and completely delete the fireplace scene; this would make me happy. However, I've been convinced by MTH that a flat-out rejection is necessary to create a character arc for Anakin. Boy meets girl, boy loses girl, (boy loses mother), boy finally gets girl. In this way, we create an ultimate low point for Anakin in the garage, which makes everything he does far more reasonable.

Know, though, that in the new fireplace scene, it has a lot more to do with music and unspoken things implied by close-ups. None of the "Hoping that that kiss you never should have given me will not become a scar" garbage. Just "It's not possible." "What...what do you mean, Padme?" (very sad). "That was forbidden for a Jedi. I can't." Anakin is very upset. Some long close-ups. Anakin stands and walks a few steps. "Now, you do know....they wouldn't have to find out about all this." (his last shot). "We could keep it a secret." Close-ups and music plays. "No. I can't do that." Pause. "Could you live like that, Anakin?" Long pause and music builds. "No."

HOWEVER...aesthetically, I like your solution better, with the "We could keep it a secret" before the arena. There's a part of me that really likes the dramatic approach with "I love you", music builds, kiss. There's also a part of me that would really enjoy a more light-hearted touch to this. The OT was so much more fun that way. Maybe I could mix both of them- still have the partial fireplace scene, and then change the confession...

Padme: "I love you."
Anakin: (happy) "I guess you're able to keep secrets after all." Smooch.

I don't know- something like that. I think the whole "gloom and doom" atmosphere of the romance could be lifted with one or two comments like this. Anyhow, these are very good concepts. Thank you, guys!
Post
#194367
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/194367/action/topic#194367
Time
WOW.

I had no idea that newly created spaceship shots were going into this movie. They look amazing, and I assume they are DVD quality to go with the other footage. And that "ranch" logo is very impressive. Of course, I would not want it to replace the Lucasfilm logo, but it should come before the 20th century fox fanfare, before the movie. We should also have a paragraph of text explaining the criteria that must be met for legitimate ownership of the discs. Anyhow, that's very nice.

I'm waiting to see the test cut of the movie with incredible anticipation, just like everyone else. Keep up the wonderful work, and I think we'll be able to release Ep. I and Ep. II together, dropping a bombshell on the fans.

-TM

P.S.- One quick note; I've done something in Ep. II that you may want to address here as well. You'll notice a huge discrepancy in computer monitors for the original trilogy and computer monitors for the PT. I have redone monitors (in Jango's ship, for instance), to be more in the style of the old graphics. The most important thing is that the readouts are not fluid; they're jerky. Also, there are typically numbers scrolling on the bottom. I think this would be an impressive aesthetic change if you could pull it off in Ep. I.
Post
#194364
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/194364/action/topic#194364
Time
Hello everyone- sorry for my absence.

I have uploaded a couple clips to rapidshare:

Lawrence of Arabia clone war
New rotoscoped saber
2-in-1

I'm sorry yousendit only hosted them for 7 days; I will use rapidshare in the future so that this won't be a future issue.

I WAS wondering what is going to happen with Maul=Grievous. We were discussing a scene coming directly after the Dooku/Sidious meeting, in which Sidious shows off his "work-in-progress". I'm a little bit confused by the logistics of that, though. What footage were we considering using to cover this again?

You fellows also bring up a really good point about the Emperor's transformation. I had always assumed (until Ep. 3) that using the Dark Side led to physical deterioration, and as the Emperor used it more and more, he deteriorated more and more. Obviously, this cannot happen now. The question is- how do we make it seem as though the Emperor revealed himself deliberately, and he wasn't injured by his own force lightning? My solution- the dream.

Sidious slowly fades on screen, his eyes glowing.

Voice of Anakin: Who are you?
Sidious: Someone you know. Someone you know very well.

I'll tackle that when I come to it, but I think that this can be developed through Anakin's dream in Ep. III.

Also, so that Erikstormtrooper wouldn't have to fool around with images (and so I could update the images more frequently), I decided to see if I could make a couple picture pages online. The layout isn't very good and the whole site might only be temporary, but it's kind of an experiment. I don't know too much about the Internet.

Pics 1
Nightmare sequence

And finally, the bedroom scene is cut, unless the defense speaks up soon (where are you, MTH?)
Post
#191730
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191730/action/topic#191730
Time
This talk of an epic with overture, intermission, exit music, and so on is very interesting. So much so that after this saga is done, perhaps it would be a worthwhile project to make an epic out of our Ep. 4, 5, and 6, and then make another epic using our Ep. I, SOTDS, and our version of ROTS as a base. Perhaps the first epic could just consist of 2 and 3 alone. Anyhow, I think that the epic idea would be even more neat actually based on our version of the saga, rather than a separate edit. I think that once people begin seeing these films, there might some enthusiasm from other fan editors to use our films as a base for derivative projects. That might be an option. However, I'd be against an Ep. IV where the Death Star is not destroyed- as part of my films. Again, for the epic idea, this becomes a lot more feasible.

I also wanted to bring up that although I had once toyed with the idea of re-editing ROTJ, that honor really goes to CC, InfoDroid, and the others that came up with the original ideas and are passionate about re-editing the OT to fit (which admittedly was not my original plan- however, there's certainly nothing wrong with trying). I also don't think we have to wait on ROTS, SW, and TESB to re-edit ROTJ. However, I think that before ROTJ gets off the ground, we should have the kind of major conceptual discussion on Ep. III that we had on Ep. II and I, so that the ROTJ editors know where things are going. But that's a little ways off....

Keep up the great work! I'm trying to keep up on time with my end of the deal

-TM
Post
#191712
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191712/action/topic#191712
Time
He's a perfectionist, People!

Hey- I resemble that remark

No, I'll have you know that Episode III will probably take a good deal less time than SOTDS. I already have the system worked out, and on top of that, I was much more impressed with the colors and the cinematography for ROTS. General Grievous and the whole Upatu thing is what needs a major overhaul. But I think Lucas actually hit the nail on the head with the Palpatine/Anakin scenes- before Palpatine becomes disfigured. This scene and some of the ones that follow it are incredibly ridiculous. Some of the ways are very difficult or impossible to fix, such as Palptine's distorted voice and his awful makeup. But there is less to do on ROTS, and I already have the system and the universe/objectives set up.

Also, the scene where Anakin persuades Padme to leave Naboo has been dubbed, along with the Naboo picnic scene. I have gotten to a point where I am now very happy with the picnic scene. Here was the big change:

Anakin: ...agree what's in the best interest of all the people, and then do it.

Padme: The problem is... people don't agree.

Anakin: Perhaps they could be made to (read playfully)

Padme: By who? Who's gonna make them?

Anakin: I don't know. (CUT) Someone smart. (smiling).

Padme: You?

Anakin smiles. Quick cut to Padme, then back to Anakin, who grins.

Padme: You're making fun of me!

Anakin laughs and looks down as music crescendos...and CUT to Padme running through the grass. I won't reveal any more of the sequence, but know that I have cropped out the giant CG ticks! It's really a great scene now- the second part really reminds me of "The Sound of Music".


I'm glad that the Lawrence of Arabia footage seems to be working out for the Clone War. I'm checking out the other movies you guys suggested. Thank you all for your feedback! Yes, dubbing Anakin is a highlight of this movie and the next one- it's actually the original reason that I began the project. No other Star Wars editor has ever redubbed an English speaking character in English again for better delivery, especially one as critical as Anakin. Yet I think that this dubbing is so important because Anakin is the main character of the trilogy. I frankly think Hayden not only completely botched the role for Ep. II, but he wasn't the right actor to play it. Side-by-side comparisons of the new dubs and the originals reveal a ridiculous improvement in the effect of each scene, even when the dialogue matches up exactly, word for word. I think that it's this that will surprise people the most; it's a way of seeing Anakin that nobody's ever had before.

And thank you for that trailer, Sluggo! That's a great fan-made trailer; obviously I can't use any of those shots, but I wish the film had turned out that way nonetheless. I also want to thank Erikstormtrooper so much for uploading my FAQ. I thought perhaps that would clear up some common confusion about this movie.

--------------------------------------------------

I just have one problem right now, having lined all of the scenes in the movie in order for further editing: I cannot stand the bedroom scene. Portman's acting is weak, the style of shooting is weak, the conversation is weak, and I just think that this scene is a waste of time. I know that MTH was pushing for it, but I'm dying to remove this scene. Could you either OK this, or explain to me better how the benefits of this scene outweigh the losses? When viewing it in sequence, it just brings down the whole movie for me.

Oh, just a couple more things...

Your desaturation techniques seem effective to a point; my only concern is the flesh tone of characters ending up gray or blue.

Exactly- I want to keep the flesh tones. If you're referring to the dream shot, however, this gray/green lifeless effect was intentional.

Regarding the tone poems: I did notice that I wasn't able to separate the music from the dialogue. I put it aside and hoped that someone else could find a separation technique. However, a quick listen reveals that in Shmi's tone poem, the music is not very prominent and is pretty much completely inaudible when used in this dream. Between the slight reverberation of Shmi's voice, the faint Tusken grunts, and the very agressive new Sibelius dream music, the fact that there is other music attached to the dialogue seems easily hidden and thus irrelevant.

-TM

P.S.: SHROUD OF THE DARK SIDE comes out Summer of 2006, along with Episode I. Stay tuned
Post
#191679
Topic
OT.com fan edit blog: your thoughts please (Update: development underway)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/191679/action/topic#191679
Time
This sounds great, Jay. Something like this will answer so many questions and organize things not just for the fans, but for the editors as well. I second the idea to include space so that editors can upload trailers of their work. Picture galleries will also be wonderful.

Anyway- this is the best idea that's come up in a long time
Post
#188141
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/188141/action/topic#188141
Time
Thanks for the feedback regarding ideas for a new cut of the clone war sequence, especially from posters that don't come often. Thank you! Since the only thing I had immediate access to was Lawrence of Arabia, I cut in some shots from that as a VERY ROUGH test- thelawrenceofarabiaclonewar. I had some rendering problems, but it looks as though this could work. The tough part is going to be involving Mace and the Jedi.

I've ordered "Dune" (another suggestion for the clone war), and I'll check out the Ep. II DVD extras. I've actually never seen the trailer with the "Braveheart" shot. Is it in good quality?

I also wanted to mention before I forget that I was finally able to get the BR club shots in DVD quality. Forum member "ShiftyEyes" was kind enough to upload the shots for me. Thanks so much!

There were a couple video requests that I wanted to address. There was a request to upload the speeder chase clip again, so here it is: Speeder Chase. This is the LAST time

Also, I remember a request to see the sequence when Anakin jumps on Zam's speeder: Surprise.
It is rougher than the final is, obviously, including sound effects and the overly violet tint to a couple shots.

And here are just a couple screenshots:

http://img472.imageshack.us/img472/6825/shipsunsetmattelinesreduced4iv.jpg
(matte lines)

http://img476.imageshack.us/img476/5310/originalshmi4qq.jpg
http://img476.imageshack.us/img476/8194/dreamshmi0on.jpg
(some more work on the dream sequence)

http://img472.imageshack.us/img472/4074/yodaoriginal3mc.jpg
http://img476.imageshack.us/img476/32/yodanew7lb.jpg

I'm also trying to make the CG yoda in Episode II more believable, through minor color adjustments to help him seem like he's part of the frame.

------------------

I'm about to finalize Uncle Owen's dialogue as outlined previously. If anyone has any final adjustments, please speak now! Nanner Split, I am waiting on "The Island" before I finalize your dialogue, but that will be happening soon as well.

At this point, I'm actually knocking out all of Windu's blue saber shots, before I forget how to do it.

-TM
Post
#187160
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/187160/action/topic#187160
Time
http://img523.imageshack.us/img523/4248/image3copy2zb.jpg
Rotoscoped Saber

The first shot in this clip was changed from green to blue, to fit the new sequence of events. Obviously the music is temp. I think that this saber looks better than my first attempt; I did a couple of things differently. However, this is too short a clip to judge it at this point.

Here's another interesting little thing: 2 in 1. This was a point in the editing when I wanted to remove the closeup of Obi-Wan, which was sandwiched in between two shots with Anakin's two sabers. I didn't want to have to choose between them. Out of curiosity, I put the two shots side by side, just to see if the editors got lazy, used the same take for both shots, and also started the second shot right at the point that the first one stopped at. Sure enough, with a 2 frame chop to the beginning of the second clip, they joined together perfectly, creating one shot. I can't believe it was possible to do that.

I'm still struggling a little bit with turning the funeral and the scene where Anakin and Padme leave into a sunset/dusk scene. Particularly irritating is the reflective surface of their ship in the last shot. Not only that, but the color work in the last shot is causing some thin, dark matte lines around the outside of the ship. They're not really noticeable in motion, but it's probably not ideal. And on top of all of that, I had to take out the shadow of the ship. If it was nighttime, there wouldn't be enough light to cast a shadow. I don't want to post screenshots of that now, because it's very much a work in progress at this point.

As I said, the "en route" scene is quite a wonderful one now; however, I couldn't post clips without ruining the surprise of the voice. I foresee a trailer coming pretty soon....

Regarding the music for the arena- I do want something adventurous and heroic, a la the original SW, but I also want it to have some tension and some drama involved. As nice as the Episode II "march" is, I don't think the first part of it has this drive. What I have so far is...

1. Anakin and Padme arrive in arena. Original Episode II love theme.
2. Dooku arrives. "Uranus" theme, which melds into
3. The Monsters Come out, which is scored with some Bernard Hermann. Anakin and Padme escape.
4. Obi-Wan is attacked. Clueless until the Jedi arrive. Need ideas.
5. Jedi arrive. Famous Jedi fanfare.
6. Jedi attack. Sail barge alternate, Giacchino, "Mars" from the planets, etc.

I need something that has excitement and also dramatic ups and downs that I can cut the action to. Also, here's another problem I'm having. After taking a good look at the Clone War footage, I'm realizing more and more that it's kind of awful. There's no direction or drama to anything. We could've had clones in trenches, human workers for the Trade Federation, spies, snipers, thermal denotators being tossed back and forth. Instead, we have a lot of stupid CG machines, awful camera work, and no point or purpose to anything, other than to look "cool".

I know you've all heard this complaint countless times, but the difference here is that I'm curious if anyone knows of any footage in ANY movie that could be spliced in here to give us a better vision of what the Clone Wars were like. Of course the footage can be color corrected, I can easily add laser blasts...I might even be able to matte some ships in. But I was just wondering if any of you had ideas on what to do about this.

Thanks, and talk to you soon!

-TM
Post
#185556
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/185556/action/topic#185556
Time
Well, I have no way of knowing if this is in the race or not-- but I wanted to recut the race so that Qui Gonn's assessment of Anakin's powers grows as the race goes on -- this means adding close ups of him to make one or more of Anakin's incredible feats register on Qui Gonn (with the Force theme rising proudly along with his realization: this is the CHOSEN ONE!).

I really like this idea. Decrease the emphasis on the ridiculous antics of the CG drivers and crashes, and instead cut it around Qui-Gon's reactions to the powers of the chosen one. It will still be a brilliant action piece, of course, but including Qui-Gon more makes it relevant to the rest of the story. I like the idea to extend the ending as well.

I'll comment on this new chunk of script when I get time...
Post
#185555
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/185555/action/topic#185555
Time
Hi everyone. I just wanted to let you know that I'm still here and I have made some extraordinary progress. I will explain more (with screenshots and maybe video) in a couple of days, but I have removed the "purple hand", rotoscoped one or two other saber shots, made some great headway on the final duel, and dubbed and mixed the "en route to Naboo" scene. This last item I am the most excited about, as I really believe that Anakin is so much more likable now- and none of his dialogue was even changed for this scene (an exchange at the end was removed, and a couple smirks were cut out). The scene just has such a classy, better quality about it with Hayden's whiny readings removed. I've found that the scene became even better when I put lounge music in the background (the only other instance of source music is the nightclub). Of course, I'm going to do the love theme to death as the movie progresses, but since it's already being introduced at the beginning, I think it's kind of neat to change it up for this scene.

I actually came up with a different ending for the scene than I OR MTHaslett had come up with. Originally, I had had "You've changed so much." "I know." END SCENE. When I actually went to dub it and cut it, this seemed completely out of place. Now, Padme asks the equivalent of "Are you taken?" Anakin says his speal until this line, "We are encouraged to love." He smiles. Then, I've reversed the reaction shot to Anakin's deleted "I dream about you" comment, so that now, Padme is looking down, and she slowly looks up at him. I've also added a slow zoom. Cut back to Anakin, who smiles. Padme smiles. Then, I've reversed one of the opening shots, so that the camera is now pulling away from the long shot. Wipe away from scene.

With the background music and the new line readings, the scene is so much better and so much more HUMAN. There is subtext. We have less dialogue because the camera is now telling the story, along with the music and everything else that contributes to the ATMOSPHERE. I had actually recorded this scene previously, but this time through was much better; partially because of the improvements in my recording technology, and partially perhaps because I had a cold and it gave the voice a different quality. Listening to it, I'm not even bothered that the voice is mine; I just accept it as Anakin.

More later, and I'm sorry for those who have requested video clips. They will come eventually!

-TM

P.S. This whole project as it stands now is being backed up on disc today.
Post
#180504
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/180504/action/topic#180504
Time
Hi! I don't have time to respond thoroughly right now, but I'll just say that I'm surprised that you all seemed to like the rotoscoping. Maybe I'm over-analyzing it. Anyhow, thanks for the feedback, especially from new posters here. By the way, Twister, I didn't mean to overlook your previous post- that's a really good idea for the "kyberdart" ID scene. I'll be using that. Also, CC, I should really know this, but where can the "Antique" tool be found in Photoshop? Once I figure that out, it'll be easy to remove the "purple hand" in motion.

Musicman- I'll discuss the whole arena production soon. And Knightmessenger, although this has several continuity differences with the others (another one is Padme's status as queen and the Naboo government), this probably has the least number of discrepancies. Although I really wouldn't be worried as InfoDroid and his team are going to do a FABULOUS job on Ep. I. They also have a lot tougher of a job, as the ridiculous CG imagery and costume/set design in Episode I is a lot more difficult to overcome.
Post
#179880
Topic
Help Wanted: for my Blade Runner edit...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/179880/action/topic#179880
Time
Thank you so much for doing this, ShiftyEyes! Please PM me with your name if you'd like to be in the credits

DigitalFreak, I'm doing an edit/reenvisioning of Episode II called "Shroud of the Dark Side." You can read about it in the other preservation forum. One of my goals was to make the nightclub in Episode II a little more dirty and menacing. In the rough version, I had cut in some Blade Runner shots in order to expand the nightclub. However, Ep. II is all digital and Blade Runner didn't even get a proper DVD release, so I needed the footage in high quality so that it would blend (with the color-corrected SOTDS footage). I had asked before but it had never happened, so I figured that since you've made a dual-layer disc out of it, more people would have access to it and it'd be worth another try right now. Actually, since you made the disc, you could PM me with your name as well, if you wanted to be credited with providing source material.

Thanks

EDIT: I was looking for the footage between the shot in the first post above, and this shot:
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/826/night34me.jpg

The shot in the first post is the one I need the most, however. I know it's a pain to upload the video, but I appreciate it so much. You don't know how long I've wanted those shots in good DVD quality. Thanks so much, ShiftyEyes!
Post
#179782
Topic
Help Wanted: for my Blade Runner edit...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/179782/action/topic#179782
Time
Hi, this is Trooperman again. Citizen's previous offer didn't seem to work out, and I was just wondering with the advent of this new dual-layer Blade Runner disc if anyone would be able to upload the club scene for me sometime. It would be much appreciated, and you will be credited on my edit when it's done.

Thank you- I really appreciate it, and I really need this footage in DVD quality to complete the nightclub scene the way I had envisioned it.

-TM
Post
#179777
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/179777/action/topic#179777
Time
I'm glad people seemed to enjoy the new C3PO and Owen dialogue. The reason that I like the version I had outlined the best is that it provides a genuine connection to the OT characters. I can really recognize Owen and C3PO through the dialogue. For those who think it might be silly, I think that part of what made the OT great was that it was fun as opposed to dark all the time. This type of exchange I believe would be very typical back then- it wouldn't be taken too seriously. Only now does the audience have to explain every little thing (what is Padme and Anakin's motivation for taking the droid? Why doesn't Owen just abandon the droid or reprogram it, etc.).

Don't get me wrong- I'm all about explaining important plot points that don't get resolved. But on the introduction of a humourous character like C3PO, I think this will be great. The problem people seemed to have was the "500 credits" line by Owen. That was off the top of my head; if you really want to get picky about it, they're not even supposed to use credits out on Tatooine (according to Watto). Anyhow, it's wonderful that there is already a man lined up to play Owen, but before I give InfoDroid the lines, I just wanted to make sure that none of you had any final suggestions or tweaking of this script:


C3PO: I am See-Threepio, human/cyborg relations. At your service. So pleased to meet you, sir. I need not take the liberty to inform you that…(or some other typical 3PO ramble).

Anakin: I’m here to find my mother- Shmi Skywalker.

C3PO: Your mother! Well, the proper procedure is ….etc. etc. (blah blah blah- establishing him as a very annoying character from the get go).

Anakin: Just take me to your master.

C3PO: Oh, yes. I see. My master. Follow me, please.

CUT to EXT: Owen’s place.


Anakin: I’m Anakin Skywalker.

Lars: Owen Lars.

Anakin: It took awhile for your droid to take us here.

Owen: Don’t even get me started on the robot. He’s a protocol droid and he can’t even speak Bocce. The Jawa traders dumped him on me last month. (pause). I’ll give you 500 credits if you take him.

Anakin: Is my mother here?

Cliegg arrives and gives his little talk. “We have a lot to talk about.” He turns. We hear the sound of footsteps as they walk away.

It begins to sink in for C3PO. CLOSE-UP (CFSS)

C3PO: Sir, sir! There must be some mistake!

CUT to Beru serving drinks in next scene.

======================

I am now working on the arena scene, having pretty much completed the basic strokes of the Coruscant sequences. Working on the arena scene meant that I had to start figuring out how to rotoscope Windu's lightsaber. Not a fun job...

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/2012/image20copy9do.jpg

My technique was to pull apart the shots frame by frame, rotoscope each frame in Photoshop, and then plug the frames back into the video editor. As you can see through these video clips, my first attempt did not go well, no matter what I did with the video. Although the colors/lighting are different in each shot, the rotoscoped frames are the same.

1
2
3

Why the failure? 1. I didn't standardize the "spread", 2. The saber is probably too saturated, and 3. The saber fluctuates too quickly. It doesn't slowly pulse as it should, and it looks very active and amateurish. Now I'm asking myself some more questions before I try again- am I going for a prequel style blade or an OT style blade for Windu? The PT computer generated style would be very easy to do, but I don't like it as much. Of course, I might not want the inconsistency between Windu's saber and the other sabers. My other question is this- what color do I want the saber? Do I want the blue from the CG saber blades of the PT? Do I want the blue from Obi-Wan's saber in SW? Or do I want the blue of Luke's saber in TESB? I've pretty much settled on the last option, but these are all things I should have given thought to beforehand. How does the lighting figure in? You'll notice that Windu's hand has a purple glow in this shot- I tried to correct it but there isn't a whole lot that can be done about it. Do you have preferences on all of this?

Since I'm doing the arena right now, does anyone have any specific concerns, suggestions, shots they hated, etc.? Right now I'm going on my ideas and MTH broad ideas on who should escape first (and the training of the beast). Please discuss any further changes you might have before I lock down.

I very recently acquired some updated versions of my current software from my friend, and the whole editing process has become that much more efficient now. Not only that, but those of you who were disappointed that there would be no new 5.1 surround sound mix may be pleasantly surprised at the end.... It just became a lot more feasible for me. Maybe I'll pull a Ben Burtt and make a compressed Dolby stereo, 5.1 mix, and PCM uncompressed stereo mix- all completely different! (EDIT: That was a joke)

Anyway, things are going well now. I want to thank again all of you who are working on Episode I. It's really a delight to watch all of you transform THAT movie into a great film worth watching. And I'm sure others who are following this project are pleased that it will come out before 2007 or 2008!

-TM

P.S. I was recently watching the "Musical Journey" disc included with the Sith soundtrack, and I thought that the following was very funny (I had never realized it before). During the asteroid field track, at the moment the music explodes into the famous theme, the creators of the disc have used the Coruscant chase footage! Sure, the synch obviously isn't the same, but how remarkable is it that I made that music choice for that scene without any knowledge of what they had done? It must be an appropriate match!
Post
#179773
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/179773/action/topic#179773
Time
Hello everyone! I'm very sorry about my absence, but be assured that work is progressing at a wonderful rate. In this post, I'd just like to transfer the C3PO discussion into this thread:


INFODROID:
Yeah, we've all talked about it and decided that 3PO's officially out of Episode I, although Commander Courage came up with the suggestion of replacing TC-14 on the Neimoidian ship with Anthony Daniels' voice. Which, I thought was a very interesting (while radical) idea. But ultimately, how would you explain how he conveniently ends up on the Lars' farm in II (which, in itself, never made sense to begin with)?

Of course, he could be entirely edited out of II, but that's Trooperman's call. That may be the more necessary change from a saga standpoint, however, because it never added up why a droid with 3PO's personality who spent ten years on a secluded farm with him, would not be recognized by Uncle Owen when he again conveniently turns up in ANH.

I like the idea of him saying the first line in TPM since he also has the first line in IV. So, if we go the TC-14 route and cut him entirely out of II, he'd end up being reintroduced in III as Padme's valet. But, how would you explain it on screen? I mean, wasn't he on the Federation ship when it exploded? Is there a way around it?

And if we don't go the TC-14 route, how will he be introduced in II? Trooperman, you'll have to elaborate on your ideas for this please. And anyone else who cares to chime in with a viable solution would be greatly appreciated.

.....



TROOPERMAN:
Unfortunately, all I knew to begin with was that I didn’t want Anakin to build 3PO. Looking back, it looks as if the best way to do that is to cut 3PO from Episode I.

The problem is that we need C-3PO in Episode II because he sets up what is going on with R2 on Geonosis. You may or may not remember that the ship lands, Anakin and Padme exit, and C-3PO starts arguing with R2. R2 leaves and C-3PO stays, ending with “Have you no sense at all?” Then, when Padme is stuck in the pot, R2 pops up unexpectedly and saves the day (without flying). Without the previous sequence, this would make no sense to the viewer, and I don’t want to have to cut that part of the droid factory sequence. I have to have the R2/C3PO scene to set it up, because it’s even more necessary after we’ve cut the flying (which establishes his presence). He just shows up on the pathway.

Also to clarify, in SOTDS, C3PO never enters the factory, he never loses his head, he never shows up at the arena, etc. R2 also does not show up at the arena. He just has his traditional heroic moment (in the droid factory), then disappears into the woodwork until the wedding.

This is why turning TC-14 in Ep. I into C-3PO would probably not work in this scenario. C3PO in Episode II has to be the real thing. Unless, of course, we turned C3PO in Episode II into a different droid, which doesn’t really appeal to me much. With that in mind, we need to figure out why Anakin picks him up if he’s Owen’s droid.


---------------------------------

Here’s an idea I’m sure you didn’t expect from me- Redub Uncle Owen. He only has two or three lines anyway; they would hardly be difficult to remove. Also, his voice doesn’t sound anything like Owen from Ep. IV anyway, and it’d hardly be a loss as he was no great actor. I also want to point out that the following is very convenient because we have a lot of footage that would otherwise be cut out and unused (like Owen’s babbling about stepbrothers and girlfriends)…

C3PO: I am See-Threepio, human/cyborg relations. At your service. So pleased to meet you, sir. I need not take the liberty to inform you that…(or some other typical 3PO ramble).

Anakin: I’m here to find my mother- Shmi Skywalker.

C3PO: Your mother! Well, the proper procedure is ….etc. etc. (blah blah blah- establishing him as a very annoying character from the get go).

Anakin: Just take me to your master.

C3PO: Oh, yes. I see. My master. Follow me, please.

CUT to EXT: Owen’s place.


Anakin: I’m Anakin Skywalker.

Lars: Owen Lars.

Anakin: It took awhile for your droid to take us here.

Owen: Don’t even get me started on the robot. He’s a protocol droid and he can’t even speak Bocce. The Jawa traders dumped him on me last month. (pause). I’ll give you 500 credits if you take him.

Anakin: Is my mother here?

Cliegg arrives and gives his little talk. “We have a lot to talk about.” He turns. We hear the sound of footsteps as they walk away.

It begins to sink in for C3PO. CLOSE-UP (CFSS)

C3PO: Sir, sir! There must be some mistake!

CUT to Beru serving drinks in next scene.

========================

The movie continues from there, except for the following: After Anakin and Padme decide to leave Tatooine, instead of “I’m not worried, R2. It’s just that I’ve never flown before,” C3PO says, “What did I do to deserve this?”

Anthony Daniels has recorded so much 3PO dialogue between the OT films, the radio dramas, the specials, and so on that that wouldn’t be a problem. And best of all, I believe that it would introduce C3PO in a much better way than it was done in Episode I, when Anakin built him. The fact that Owen paid Anakin to take him is some real humor, which might also be good for the movie at this point (we’ve removed a lot of the lame stuff and it could use a lift). Also, it perfectly sets up 3POs and R2’s first meeting and argument.

Also, I think that the new Owen lines link his character much more closely with Ep. IV, which was a weak point there had never been a way to fix- until now.

All we need is an Uncle Owen impersonator that has the time and the means to dub six short sentences. I’m not going to pull a Lucas and insist that this was part of my “original vision”, but I really like this idea that came to me today. I’ve checked the widescreen and full-screen discs, and the outline above will actually work. Please comment The good thing is that this only affects my movie; you guys won’t have to worry about it at all for Ep. I.

Sorry for the late response!



INFODROID:
Wow, TM. That's an excellent idea I would've never considered! Dubbing Uncle Owen.

Best part is, I can put you in touch with a guy who will do the recording for you. No doubt he can sound exactly like a young uncle owen. He's fast, uses his own equipment and he's good at what he does. In fact, if you send me the lines, I'll just go to him and get 'em done for you and send you the wavs (or mp3's), whichever you'd prefer.

And the most exciting part about this idea is that C-3PO is now a Trooperman problem instead of an InfoDroid problem. Muhahahaha!

Thanks, Man!



MUSICMAN:
Thanks for the welcomes, guys! I'm glad to hear the visual work is being done. Yeah, Trooperman, that may actually be my main beef for the PT. I don't think the issue was even so much a CG issue (though some sweet model work would've been nice), as a film/digital issue. A film look (IMO) is much better for Star Wars, and that'll be a big help.

And I love the idea for 3PO's introduction! I was truly laughing at the dialogue--it'll be fun hearing Uncle Owen ask 3PO if he speaks bocce in ANH after that! I hope you go with that, because it's really good. I must say, I was a little sad to hear the dynamic duo wouldn't be present for all six films with this approach, but just that bit made me feel a whole lot better about it. Very nice!



YODA IS YOUR FATHER:
I'm still digging my version, but Trooperman's could work too. I don't think a jedi and a queen/senator would want or need 500 credits badly enough to take a rusty whiny old droid with them though. Plus it still doesn't explain why Owen doesn't remember having already owned a protocol droid called SeeThreepio when they meet in ANH.



COMMANDER COURAGE:
The redubbing of Owen has opened up all new possibilities. Without saying too much, I think everything is going to work out just fine.

And in response to YIYF, the Owen remembering 3PO thing has been an issue with fans ever since AotC came out. I've never really had a problem with it, and I don't think it's a continuity glitch in out edit either. 3PO looks totally different, and Owen never learns his name. The only interaction they had was when the droids were being purchased. I'm sure eventually Owen would have realized who he was, but things didn't go that way.



MTHASLETT:
Just chiming in to say I love TM's threepio fixes!

I think more opportunities may exist to take advantage of this new and exciting characterization of threepio. This is much more in line with the "We seem to be made to suffer" threepio we meet in ANH.

I love cutting him out of TPM and only hesitate slightly at the "500 credits" to take him beat-- I wish it could be established that Anakin or Padme have some use for a protocol droid. Otherwise, it will stick out as a strange and uncharacteristic beat.

Maybe increasing Artoo's role in this exchange would help -- i.e. they take threepio to help interpret Artoo or otherwise create a more useful arrangement of droids for their mission to save Obi Wan.

Obviously, that's an SOTD issue-- but we seem to need it solved here as well.




TWISTER:
I have a suggestion on the C3PO thing. Perhaps these lines:

C3PO: May I present two most important visitors. (mabye something else for C3PO)

Anakin: I'm Anakin Skywalker.

Owen: I expected you would come here. I'm Owen Lars that robot was a gift from my Father to your Mother. She would have wanted you to have it.

Anakin: What are you talking about? Is my Mother here?

Cliegg: (off camera) No she's not. (on camera) Cliegg Lars, (extends hand camera on Anakin) Shmi's my wife. We should head inside. We have a lot to talk about.

Sure, it's not as, funny as, the "take him for 500 credits" beat but, it might work.



C3PX:
This really isn't any contribution to the usefullness of this thread or anything, but after hearing somebodys suggestion of redubbing TC-14 with C3-POs voice, I thought how interesting it would have been had Lucas decided to make threepeo one of many droids with that same voice. It would have been just sort of a fun cameo having the droid introduce himself as TC-14 with Anthony Daniels voice. That would have been great hearing that voice speak the opening lines of the film. In Ep II the same voice could have been the voice of Clegg's droid or even just make him Padme's droid from the start. Would have been a lot better than "I'm building a droid..."

Oh, and I really think the "I'll give you 500 credits if you'll take." fits in really well with threepios lot in life. Maybe it is a little silly, but it is funny and not too over the top like most of the threepio scene shown later in Ep. II. And it isn't that Anakin and Padme need him, the guy pretty much gave them the droid so they take him. Probably Padme thinks some tech's back in the capitol might be able to do something with him. Anyway, I don't think the audience is going to be thinking "Why would they want the five hundred credits, it isn't the point. The point is to establish that the Lars family doens't want him, and with this line it is accomplished. I really like it. Actually I am getting more and more excited about the Ranch Ep 1 and Trooperman's Ep.2

Post
#176552
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/176552/action/topic#176552
Time
Unfortunately, all I knew to begin with was that I didn’t want Anakin to build 3PO. Looking back, it looks as if the best way to do that is to cut 3PO from Episode I.

The problem is that we need C-3PO in Episode II because he sets up what is going on with R2 on Geonosis. You may or may not remember that the ship lands, Anakin and Padme exit, and C-3PO starts arguing with R2. R2 leaves and C-3PO stays, ending with “Have you no sense at all?” Then, when Padme is stuck in the pot, R2 pops up unexpectedly and saves the day (without flying). Without the previous sequence, this would make no sense to the viewer, and I don’t want to have to cut that part of the droid factory sequence. I have to have the R2/C3PO scene to set it up, because it’s even more necessary after we’ve cut the flying (which establishes his presence). He just shows up on the pathway.

Also to clarify, in SOTDS, C3PO never enters the factory, he never loses his head, he never shows up at the arena, etc. R2 also does not show up at the arena. He just has his traditional heroic moment (in the droid factory), then disappears into the woodwork until the wedding.

This is why turning TC-14 in Ep. I into C-3PO would probably not work in this scenario. C3PO in Episode II has to be the real thing. Unless, of course, we turned C3PO in Episode II into a different droid, which doesn’t really appeal to me much. With that in mind, we need to figure out why Anakin picks him up if he’s Owen’s droid.


---------------------------------

Here’s an idea I’m sure you didn’t expect from me- Redub Uncle Owen. He only has two or three lines anyway; they would hardly be difficult to remove. Also, his voice doesn’t sound anything like Owen from Ep. IV anyway, and it’d hardly be a loss as he was no great actor. I also want to point out that the following is very convenient because we have a lot of footage that would otherwise be cut out and unused (like Owen’s babbling about stepbrothers and girlfriends)…

C3PO: I am See-Threepio, human/cyborg relations. At your service. So pleased to meet you, sir. I need not take the liberty to inform you that…(or some other typical 3PO ramble).

Anakin: I’m here to find my mother- Shmi Skywalker.

C3PO: Your mother! Well, the proper procedure is ….etc. etc. (blah blah blah- establishing him as a very annoying character from the get go).

Anakin: Just take me to your master.

C3PO: Oh, yes. I see. My master. Follow me, please.

CUT to EXT: Owen’s place.


Anakin: I’m Anakin Skywalker.

Lars: Owen Lars.

Anakin: It took awhile for your droid to take us here.

Owen: Don’t even get me started on the robot. He’s a protocol droid and he can’t even speak Bocce. The Jawa traders dumped him on me last month. (pause). I’ll give you 500 credits if you take him.

Anakin: Is my mother here?

Cliegg arrives and gives his little talk. “We have a lot to talk about.” He turns. We hear the sound of footsteps as they walk away.

It begins to sink in for C3PO. CLOSE-UP (CFSS)

C3PO: Sir, sir! There must be some mistake!

CUT to Beru serving drinks in next scene.

========================

The movie continues from there, except for the following: After Anakin and Padme decide to leave Tatooine, instead of “I’m not worried, R2. It’s just that I’ve never flown before,” C3PO says, “What did I do to deserve this?”

Anthony Daniels has recorded so much 3PO dialogue between the OT films, the radio dramas, the specials, and so on that that wouldn’t be a problem. And best of all, I believe that it would introduce C3PO in a much better way than it was done in Episode I, when Anakin built him. The fact that Owen paid Anakin to take him is some real humor, which might also be good for the movie at this point (we’ve removed a lot of the lame stuff and it could use a lift). Also, it perfectly sets up 3POs and R2’s first meeting and argument.

Also, I think that the new Owen lines link his character much more closely with Ep. IV, which was a weak point there had never been a way to fix- until now.

All we need is an Uncle Owen impersonator that has the time and the means to dub six short sentences. I’m not going to pull a Lucas and insist that this was part of my “original vision”, but I really like this idea that came to me today. I’ve checked the widescreen and full-screen discs, and the outline above will actually work. Please comment The good thing is that this only affects my movie; you guys won’t have to worry about it at all for Ep. I.

Sorry for the late response!

-TM

P.S.- Hi Musicman! The overall look of these is going to be a LOT different. At least for SOTDS, the colors and the lighting are being reworked exhaustively to be more realistic and film-like. Also, the cinematography is being largely redone to improve the compositions. This will all contribute to a much older look, which is what the original point of this was. I'm really glad when I hear comments from people that will really appreciate the aesthetic changes. Rather than updating the OT, age the prequels. That was always the motto for me
Post
#174217
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/174217/action/topic#174217
Time
Question: Your last statement made me think in your edit you've made it to where Anakin did not build C-3PO. Is that the case?

Yes. I've always kind of despised that idea. I was going to make 3PO do his "Human/cyborg relations" speal, actually... (EDIT: I see why this was confusing. This is one of those things I didn't update in my notes).

what do you think of the removal of "Darth" as a title?

Love it. It makes Darth V. more unique, which is great. I was going to remove "Darth Tyrannus" from Ep. II anyway, so that fits right into the plan.
Post
#174202
Topic
The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/174202/action/topic#174202
Time
He will need to be dubbed in both I and III. Obviously by the same person. Since we are retaining none of his original dialogue, his voice can sound however he choose. That said, his original voice was awesome and I would like his new one to be as close to that as possible.

I agree that Darth Maul's voice for Ep. I was very good- for Darth Maul. For the alien/robot, it's a little bit soft and not as menacing. I'd actually done some tests myself for Grievous and had a very specific idea of the way I'd like him to sound. This was back when I thought that I would have to dub all the voices myself. Later, others PM'd me (like DemonHunter) for the Grievous role. It would certainly be better for someone else to do this, but maybe sometime I'll post a few audio clips of what I think Grievous should sound like. It's a LOT different than the original, so you may or may not like it or want to imitate it. Obviously Maul and Grievous should be voiced by the same person, but I think that this person should have a very different attitude for each movie. Episode = more quiet and reserved, cold and cunning. Episode III= Loud and menacing monster.

Regarding C-3PO: I actually really like the idea to pretty much cut him out of Episode I, but again, if it makes the flow awkward, then keep it. But in either case, Anakin DID NOT create 3PO. Case closed!

Also, I love what you're doing for the music. I just wanted to caution you... I've been very careful in SOTDS to try and construct a new score that makes sense with leitmotif and so on. In other words, I didn't just choose a track from a different movie for each scene that never develops throughout the movie. That would be more of a temp track. Not that you fellows are doing that- I just wanted to warn you ahead of time. It's been so tempting sometimes to put in a piece of music, but then I realize it's not at all in the style of the rest of the score. And I take it out.

Anakin will be refered to as such until he gets the suit. I always thought it would be cool if he were "Darth Vader" before the suit, but the execution in III left a lot to be desired, so his Sith title will be reworked.

I haven't really gotten into what I would personally like Episode III to be. I have some very specific changes, but as far as big picture stuff, I'm not sure. All I know is that I don't want to try and salvage every scene possible, because pretty much all of them (barring a couple love scenes) at least had potential.

The only thing I'm sure I want for Ep. III is suspicion from Anakin that Padme and Obi-Wan are getting too fond of each other, which was an original subplot that was dropped for the movie. I'm not sure how we could develop that during Ep. I and II, though....

It's wonderful to read all of your notes and scripting for this! If I run into something I really dislike, I'll holler! Otherwise, I'd love to just sit back and watch where you guys take it, wait for the rough cuts to be done, and then preview it, without seeing hardly any of it beforehand. I think this is always a valuable perspective, an outsider's, almost. I'm sure you all know that anything begins to look good after you preview it and tweak it 60 times. I would really like to see where you guys go with this because Episode I doesn't affect SOTDS much. I will definitely comment on the changes that affect the whole trilogy, but besides that....it's your game. You're the ones putting all the hours and effort in.

One last note- Again, it's too bad the special effects guy left. I actually own 3d Studio Max myself; I just have absolutely no idea how to use it. Hopefully if I ever get the time, I can start to learn it, but hopefully another FX guy will be able to help out.

Thanks!

-TM
Post
#173853
Topic
Time to grow up.
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/173853/action/topic#173853
Time
Since Lucas has already said he has no problem with--and even finds interesting--fan edits of the prequels, I hardly consider fan edits a concern, at least for Star Wars films. If other directors squawk, we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

Exactly. That's why I think that I'm perfectly safe with my Episode II SOTDS project. How can Lucasfilm object when Lucas has said things like "The Internet is a new medium. It's all about doing stuff like that". The representative said, "Go be creative."

That's isn't just OK-ing it- that's endorsing it. I don't see any problem with that, at least.