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Scott109

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Join date
25-Feb-2016
Last activity
4-Aug-2019
Posts
146

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Post
#919183
Topic
What is wrong with... <strong>Attack of the Clones</strong>? - a general discussion thread
Time

Bingowings said:

Scott109 said:

Is the romance between Anakin and Padmé really that unrealistic? I think it is a psychologically accurate portrayal of a woman falling in love with a man suffering from Bipolar Disorder, an occurrence which happens much more frequently than you would imagine.

What?

It was pretty obvious that Anakin suffered from Manic Depressive Disorder or Bipolar Disorder.

These are common symptoms of Bipolar Disorder:

  • Delusions of grandeur (“I will be the greatest Jedi ever. I will even learn how to stop people from dying”)

  • Either sleeping excessively or experiencing insomnia (Anakin wakes up early because he cannot sleep)

  • Extreme restlessness and extreme depression (Anakin is constantly active, has intense bursts of energy, throws things, weeps bitterly, and massacres the Tusken Raiders when his mother dies)

  • Rapid and unprovoked mood swings (Anakin’s mood is always unpredictable)

  • Hallucinations or visions (Anakin sees hallucinatory visions of his mother)

  • An inability to concentrate (Obi-Wan always tells Anakin to concentrate)

Post
#919158
Topic
What is wrong with... <strong>Attack of the Clones</strong>? - a general discussion thread
Time

 
Many critics whom I have read on the internet cannot understand why the Jedi Order forbids romantic love in Attack of the Clones. The same critics scorn the film’s romantic dialogue.

The Jedi Order was a monastic order of warrior monks, similar to the Christian monks of the Teutonic Order during the crusades or the Buddhist monks of the Sohei Order during feudal Japan. All monastic orders require celibacy for their adherents.

George Lucas clearly indicated in A New Hope that the Jedi Knights were a religious sect, and many religious sects encourage or even require celibacy for their most devout practitioners.

Why would the Jedi Order allow romantic love? Love could be a source of temptation for a Jedi; it could be an emotional weakness which any potential enemy of the Jedi Order could exploit.

I was eight when I first watched Attack of the Clones, and even I could understand why the Jedi Order forbade romantic love when I first watched the film. It seemed self-explanatory to me.

Is the romance between Anakin and Padmé really that unrealistic? I believe it is a psychologically accurate portrayal of a woman falling in love with a man suffering from Bipolar Disorder, an occurrence which happens much more frequently than you would imagine.

The fireplace scene in which Anakin confesses his love for Padmé is a perfect portrayal of how an extremely intelligent and emotionally repressed young man would express unrequited love, especially an unrequited love bottled up inside for almost ten years. In other words, the romantic dialogue is exceedingly realistic given Anakin’s unique situation.

Critics often scoff at the moment when Anakin says, “I don’t like sand. It’s course and rough and irritating, and it gets everywhere.” But if you grew up on a desert planet and associated sand with slavery and with abandoning your mother at a young age, you would hate sand as well.

Critics often say that George Lucas gave little thought to the prequels, but George Lucas gave far more thought to the prequels than his critics have given.

Most action movies only portray a normal, stereotypical love story in which a male protagonist saves a damsel in distress, falls in love with her, seduces her, and sleeps with her. Attack of the Clones portrays a much more emotionally complex and nuanced love story than any other film I have ever seen. And that love story is not even the main plot; it is only a subplot.

Attack of the Clones contains so many action sequences: the assassination attempts, the aerial chase through the skylanes of Coruscant, the confrontation between Obi-Wan and Jango, the chase through an asteroid field, the droid factory battle, the Colosseum battle against the monsters, the battle of Geonosis, ect.

Attack of the Clones contains so many plot twists: the discovery that an entire star system was mysteriously erased from the Jedi Archives, the discovery that a clone army for the Galactic Republic was made in secret, the discovery that a deceased Jedi Master ordered the creation of the clone army, ect.

I cannot understand why anyone would hate Attack of the Clones, as so many fans of the original trilogy do.

Post
#918858
Topic
Do you think Disney will remake the prequels?
Time

Probably.

1.) There would be a very strong demand for Disney to remake the prequels due to widespread fan dissatisfaction with them.

2.) There would be so much material from which the best screenwriters in Hollywood could derive inspiration for a rewrite of the prequels. There would be the current prequel trilogy itself, the original trilogy, the sequel trilogy, the Clone Wars animated series, the Clone Wars animated film, and the Expanded Universe fan fiction.

3.) Disney would gain billions of dollars from rewriting the prequels.

Post
#918855
Topic
ROTJ is the best Star Wars film... discuss!
Time

I disagree. In my opinion, Return of the Jedi is classic, but it is not the best. Personally, I scoff at the notion that Jabba the Hutt would be immune to Jedi mind tricks, the notion that cute and cuddly teddy bears could defeat imperial storm troopers, and the notion that the Empire would ever build a second Death Star.

Post
#918854
Topic
Could &quot;Force Vision&quot; explain how Leia knows what her mother looks like? Discussion
Time

I always thought that the dialogue between Luke and Leia in Return of the Jedi should have been edited in the special edition.

An editor could cut “Do you remember your mother . . . your real mother?” to “Do you remember your mother?”

Then the inconsistency with the prequels could be easily resolved.

Post
#917156
Topic
Star Wars Episode II: The Approaching Storm (Released)
Time

towne32 said:

Scott109 said:
etc

The secret relationship and forever alone Jedi thing were unnecessary features of the PT, anyway. I don’t know why we need so much emphasis on these aspects to be restored. There is never external pressure from Obiwan or the council acting on Anakin, regarding these rules (I think). It’s unbelievable enough that, watching the Clone Wars TV show, I always find myself defaulting to the assumption that it’s an open secret. Obiwan is obviously not surprised in RoTS.

We still have the ‘unconditional love’ scene showing us that clearly the Jedi have a nuanced view on what would be considered appropriate behavior and relationships. Anakin sidesteps the mentioned rules with a half-assed response, and then they never seek Jedi approval for their relationship.

The dialogue you have left in that scene is still painfully bad. Of much lower quality than anything Hal has left in, IMO. And it doesn’t do anything to further explain these strange Jedi rules. It’s just a bunch of, “We couldn’t!” “We mustn’t!” sludge.

Anakin and Padmé’s relationship was not an open secret. If that was the case, Anakin would have been expelled from the Jedi Order.

Anakin and Padmé never sought the Jedi Council’s approval for the relationship because they knew in advance that the Jedi Council would have forbidden it.

Obi-Wan was not all that surprised in The Revenge of the Sith because their secret marriage seemed obvious in hindsight. Nevertheless, he was not aware of it at the time.

I disagree with your notion that the Jedi Code forbidding romance was a ‘strange rule.’ It was a perfectly rational rule. Romantic love is an emotional vulnerability which an enemy could easily exploit.

The primary reason Anakin turned to the dark side was his disagreement with the stoic Jedi Code which forbade love, passion, fear, sadness, hatred, and most other natural emotions. The threat of Padmé dying was merely the straw which broke the camel’s back.

Watch this video on the thematic significance of the Jedi Code:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2BNdF_NCVQ

Post
#917068
Topic
Star Wars Episode II: The Approaching Storm (Released)
Time

darthrush said:

Fireplace scene makes me want to puke

I agree that the fireplace scene is cringe worthy as it currently exists, but if a good editor deleted Anakin’s worst lines, the fireplace scene could be saved:

ANAKIN: “From the moment I met you, not a day has gone by when I haven’t thought of you . . . If you are suffering as much as I am, please tell me.”

PADMÉ: “I can’t. We can’t. It’s just not possible.”

ANAKIN: “Anything is possible. Padmé, listen to me.”

PADMÉ: “No, you listen. We live in a real world. Come back to it. You’re studying to become a Jedi Knight. I’m a Senator. If you follow your thoughts through to conclusion, they will take us to a place we cannot go, regardless of the way we feel about each other.”

ANAKIN: “Then you do feel something.”

PADMÉ: “I will not let you give up your future for me.”

ANAKIN: “It wouldn’t have to be that way. We could keep it a secret.”

PADMÉ: “Then we would be living a lie - one we couldn’t keep even if we wanted to. I couldn’t do that. Could you, Anakin? Could you live like that?”

ANAKIN: “No, you’re right. It would destroy us.”

If you delete Anakin’s worst lines, such as, “And now that I’m close to you again, I’m in agony. The closer I get to you, the worse it gets. The thought of not being with you . . . I can’t breathe. I’m haunted by the kiss you should never have given me. My heart is beating, hoping that kiss will not become a scar. You are in my very soul, tormenting me. What can I do? I will do anything you ask,” it would be possible to save the fireplace scene through careful editing.

The edited scene would only be around a minute, but it would explain why Anakin and Padmé kept their marriage secret in Episode III.

Post
#916851
Topic
theredbaron's Episode I: The Phantom Menace Screenplay Rewrite.
Time

The dialogue is worse than the original screenplays. For example, consider the following passage:

GRIEVOUS
Two of our spies on Dxun have been killed, your Highness. The Mandalorian presence on the moon is stronger than ever. They have enough firepower to make a landing on –

AMIDALA
Withdraw all surviving personnel.

GRIEVOUS
It will be done, your Highness. Your Highness…

AMIDALA
Yes, General?

GRIEVOUS
If I may make a suggestion…We have the technology at our disposal, I propose we build an army to defend Onderon…

AMIDALA
Cloning for military purposes would be a direct contravention of Republic law!

GRIEVOUS
But your Highness, the Mandalorians –

AMIDALA
I will not condone an action that will lead us to war!

GRIEVOUS
As you wish, your Highness…

This dialogue is poor. Your characters interrupt each other far too much. Although individuals interrupt each other frequently in real life, characters should rarely interrupt each other on screen so many times in swift succession.

Good dialogue is always wittier and more intelligently argued than in real life. Good dialogue is a highly selective imitation of real speech – without the unnecessary interruptions and pauses.

Post
#915082
Topic
Star Wars Episode II: The Approaching Storm (Released)
Time

That is true, towne32. I should probably watch the fan edit before I suggest alterations, but I have been unable to find and download it online.

However, if you cut the film scenes which explain the fact that romantic love is forbidden for a Jedi Knight, it is logically inexplicable why Anakin and Padmé would choose to have a secret wedding at the end of the film or why they would have to hide their secret marriage in Episode III.

Even if the dialogue in these scenes is relatively poor, the logical consistency of the plot is much more important than a few lines of dialogue.

Post
#914982
Topic
Star Wars Episode II: The Approaching Storm (Released)
Time

A few suggestions:

Delete the scene in which Jar Jar Binks proposes that the senate grant the supreme chancellor emergency powers and revise the opening crawl to state that the senate has recently granted the supreme chancellor emergency powers to counter the separatists. Delete the character Jar Jar Binks entirely.

Restore Anakin mentioning that attachment is forbidden for a Jedi Knight, which emphasizes the motif of forbidden love and explains why they needed to keep the relationship secret.

Restore the emotional fireplace scene when Anakin confesses his feelings, which emphasizes the motif of forbidden love and explains why they needed to keep the relationship secret.

Restore the love confession scene and Anakin’s surprise reaction to Padmé, which emphasizes the motif of forbidden love and explains why they needed to keep the relationship secret.

Restore the scene when Anakin slaughters the sand people and the scene when he tells Padmé but remove the lines in which he describes slaughtering the women and children like animals. Fade to black as Anakin states, “I killed them. I killed them all.”

Restore Obi-Wan and Anakin’s antagonism after Padmé falls out of the transport, which emphasizes Anakin’s love for Padmé and his change in character.

Restore the Geonosian war room sequences which reveal the plans for the ultimate weapon.

Restore Yoda’s epic duel with Count Dooku but edit it slightly for length.

Restore Darth Sidious addressing Count Dooku as ‘Darth Tyrannus.’

Post
#912106
Topic
The legendary &quot;Starkiller Ranch&quot; Thread
Time

I have not read the entire thread. I have only read the first three pages. I have a few thoughts:

  1. Very few individuals watch the prequel trilogy first, so editing the greatest revelation in the original trilogy (“No, I am your father”) is illogical. Presumably, anyone who wishes to watch the Star Wars film series will begin with the original trilogy and then watch the prequels.

  2. Even if the audience is aware that Darth Vader is the father of Luke Skywalker, the revelation still works as an example of dramatic irony and as a profound revelation to Luke.

  3. Obi-Wan lied to Luke, but that is not inconsistent with Obi-Wan’s character. Even exceptionally moral individuals may tell a lie if there is an exceptionally compelling reason to do so. If Luke had known that Darth Vader was his father from the beginning, the temptation to join the dark side or to confront his father immediately would have been too strong.

  4. The suggested dialogue edit in from “Your father wanted you to have this” to “I wanted you to have this” is sheer brilliance and would resolve a plot inconsistency with the prequels.

  5. I would also suggest cutting Obi-Wan’s line, “I don’t seem to remember ever owning a droid.”

  6. Another quick edit: change Leia’s dialogue in A New Hope from “You served my father in the Clone Wars” to “You served WITH my father in the Clone Wars.”

  7. No flashbacks to the prequels in the Original Trilogy.