Ronster

TV’s Frink said:

Ronster said:

Perhaps they don’t put it in the correct manner of speaking like I have but.

They don’t, and neither do you. That post was rude and so was yours, especially the part where you told us to fuck off for not accepting someone’s rudeness.

If people don’t like waiting they can go do it themselves. That includes you.

I could never do or even others who ask “is it ready” could probably never do what is happening here,

All I am saying I don’t mean to be rude but it’s also rude to shun peoples desires that they want to see something… Ok it is not ready… Let me remind you that I will never ask when it is ready because I trust in what is going on and can be patient enough to wait.

But it’s a bit of a misunderstanding when people ask that question and it’s only based off enthusiasm not evil or just wanting to know it is done, that is all I am saying. People get too heated about people asking a common question when something takes a long time. It’s not like they are being spiteful it’s just a consequence of the fact the project has been delayed again and again and people want to see it.

I am not saying release it now unfinished but I am saying people just want to see it and that desire to be expressed is fair enough and nobody should be bashed for that. Because the team doing this edit probably feel the same way.

I just hate drama over nothing.

No it is not… If the person doing whatever they want to do with a film and doing an edit is reluctant to release that is understandable until they feel it is ready…

Nobody has to put any input other than the creator… But this is a team of pretty skilled people… even then would whatever you propose be good enough? Probably not…

The thing is it’s all good and well saying contribute… But at the end of the day let’s be honest don’t contribute something that cannot compare to “the standard”. And if you cannot reach or exceed the desired standard then you are simply not good enough for what the project dictates.

people just want to see it and to be honest that is fair enough. Stop bashing people for expressing desire and get over it.

It’s not evil. People have waited and waited and fair enough it’s been delayed but honestly fuck off if you think people can’t express their desire to see something they appreciate and admire. Perhaps they don’t put it in the correct manner of speaking like I have but. People really are excited and they don’t know how to say they want to see it other than… “Is it done yet?”

Just relax and stop bashing people for being excited and we all hope it will be amazing because if it was not delayed then it would not have had any extra thought. It’s evidence of extra “Hang on a minute!” thinking and loving the source and that can be nothing but a very good thing.

Alderaan said:

After seeing Independence Day: Resurgence, this weekend, I just watched Stargate again. Really like it, and only Emmerich film that I think is any good. I don’t think the editing is the cause of any of the weaknesses in Stargate, so I doubt a fan edit would do any good, but good luck.

Biggest problems to me:

1. The film intimates that Catherine’s team had already decoded the first six ciphers on Stargate combination, and they only needed to figure out the seventh and final one. This is really, really stupid, because they could have just tried every cipher for the last symbol until the combination worked. I think in reality what happened is that they thought only six symbols were needed, and it was Daniel who made the discovery that the combination was seven symbols long. But the film messes this up, big time.

2. The soldiers who go through the Stargate with Colonel O’Neill and Jackson, those guys are really not believable as elite soldiers. Pretty much worst special ops team I’ve ever seen on film.

3. Daniel’s character doesn’t exhibit any vulnerabilities in the film, and I think this is really a mistake on the part of the director. Colonel O’Neill has the whole subplot of his son’s death, and there’s some real weakness for him there, but Daniel doesn’t have anything. People walk out of his speech and he just laughs at himself. The soldiers punch him and he just shrugs it off. They throw his belongings out into the open desert and he sits down and eats a candy bar. Really messed up on his character I think.

Finally, the story is not bold enough to embrace some horror elements and until the ending it doesn’t really have many moments of joy either. Emotional rollercoasters are necessary and lacking.

Not sure if you can fix any of these things with a post production edit and no new footage. But I still love the film regardless of it’s flaws, don’t understand how anyone can hate it at all.

Ok I have been doing some research and reading the novel and the draft script which has thrown some answers up regarding your second point. And some alternative scene orders potentially which is what really I am all about. Putting things back in the correct order and within context. It seems that there were a few alternate versions of scenes filmed.

This I believe is quite evident come the finale which is a bit of a mess but there is more to this film than we see on the screen. The film has been toned down slightly for the PG rating which it would not have got if the changes were not made. So we ARE talking censorship and we ARE talking about things being changed to make it softer, when quite evidently it has quite a hard edge and can feel quite grim which I admire about it. It’s not all happy but is elated and it also has this dark tone but believe me it was weakened slightly.

The first evidence I have noticed of “Tinkering” or re-shuffling (I honestly hate this technique of changing films to have a weaker impact). Is when the pyramid lands and the troops are attacked.

The first 2 soldiers that are attacked are in fact killed. The other (last) two survive to see the watery pit. Basically I am going to do my best on this to make it feel adult and joined up. The obvious cut is with the second soldier who witnesses his dead mate being dragged behind the pillar. I plan to add Blood to the sand under his body to give that a harder edge. And screams of pain. But this guy that is scared and backs off. There is an important part missing where he spins and shoots the Bullpup at the camera. You can see it right at the start of the ultimate edition documentary. So it was definitely filmed. It was a scene extension. But it was censored. I am going to try and fix it but I don’t know but I will try. The next point is the guy with the hand gun I think it’s a P90 or a Beretta obviously offloads the clip in his gun and then goes for the MP5 back in the center of the room. So I am also going to try and fix this somehow.

Next up on the list is the scene of the guy who get’s bashed at the end of that sequence get’s dragged along the floor in front of “Ra” this scene come’s later as when O’neil (Kurt Russell) is dropped in the watery pit this dude is clenching his face with fresh wounds so that scene happens before Kurt get’s thrown in the watery pit but probably in that order.

The end of the film is also going to be put in a better order that “Makes Sense” as it is bullshit although likeable bullshit it’s so obviously shuffled to tame it down and break the flow so I am definitely going to improve the action in this film if I can. Let me know your thoughts on the action and how it has been tamed or censored.

I have also ordered a dvd version of the 2008 DVD release if this documentary footage is not on that disc then it’s on the rare Japanese Laserdisc only perhaps which would be bad. Hopefully it’s on the 2008 optimum DVD release. Fingers crossed!

So far I have only placed the very first special edition scene on a tmeline and looked at it. I am not going any further until the 2008 version arrives.

Is there any truth to there being an extra shot or an extended shot in the bar fight for the big Sherpa slamming Indy against the wall or something?

I think it’s probably true in terms of behind the scenes footage but is it actually in the 35mm version?

And good work, less saturated told you so… and you agreed! but it’s only now you are doing it 😃

Parts 3 & 4 double whammy only this once because I missed a few weeks out because I was really busy.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3f23cI00Px3cEZ5N1htM0IxY0E/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3f23cI00Px3Njd3Q2ZfOFpIalk/view?usp=sharing

Hope you enjoy the clips. part 2 is gone.

That is the plan as far as the look goes. Yeah even though I said I will get away with the deleted scenes from that documentary in 240p super rezzed I do really need it in 480p if possible it would make it match and not be just comparable. But I don’t have the laserdisc so still calling.

It will look good still… been ripping the sources so I am trying to gather it all together.

Also been studying the pioneer dvd some more some shots are slightly more un-cropped.

The Japan Laserdisc documentary…

RayRogers said:

Why not use the most current Blu-ray release for this edit? Why use the inferior DVD?

Because to get some of the deleted footage in the film it can only be found in either 480p or 240p. Be glad that the 240p footage is going to be comparable to the 720 x 576 footage.

I also don’t have a very powerful computer and don’t want to spend money on a new one to do this. I want to extend the film with the deleted scenes and I can not do that in HD so I am not doing it in HD and going to make a SD extended cut.

It’s probably possible to do but I do not know how to upscale something over 4 times the resolution to make it comparable. It’s not about pixels put it that way. And also the sound mix on pioneer dvd is better than Blu Ray, the Blu ray sounds heavily subdued compared to the OLD Pioneer mix because it gradually get’s watered down as it goes through successive releases when additional mixing is done on it especially to create 7.1 mix.

In a nutshell the new Blu-ray does not sound as good as it should and it also don’t look like I remember it. So I am making a new Special edition.

Something that has also become of interest to myself personally is when deleted footage from films ends up in other media or TV series or even other films. And Stargate happens to be one of those.

https://giant.gfycat.com/ForkedFineBelugawhale.gif

^ This is how I remember the wormhole and it’s exactly this color I want it to be.

doubleofive said:

It’s more that Ronster is thinking because ANHR had restorations of the deleted scenes from ANH (did it?) that he would include part of the deleted scene from the RotJ Blu-ray on ESBR because part of the rigged-together “deleted scene” was built using elements from ESB.

Either way, I’m pretty sure Ady including the deleted scenes for ANH because it was before the Blu-rays and he restored them himself. Revisited is not about having all the bonus features in one place. Maybe if Ady restored them, but even then, why would he split a deleted scene because it was made from other elements?

It Had deleted scenes as an extra on ANH revisited DVD-9. Sorry I thought ESB:R would have deleted scenes also as an extra. If not sorry for the confusion. I just thought it would be similar to the DVD-9 but I guess it won’t be.

The reason I said this is because loads of people think it’s a deleted scene from ROTJ and it is not, that is why I said it. So as to clear up any confusion.

doubleofive said:

Ronster said:

Make sure you put Vader in his Meditation chamber from ROTJ when Luke hides the lightsaber in R2-D2 as a deleted scene from Empire… It is not from ROTJ! (Just the Vader part everything else is from ROTJ). I had suspicions about R2-D2 fixing the x-wing from the edit-droid disc but it’s definitely got a clapper board saying Revenge of the Jedi before the clips.

Make sure who does that? Pretty sure the deleted scenes were deemed unusable for Revisited.

I was not saying put it in the film but when ANH:R was released it had deleted scenes right. So that short snippet should be put right. It should be listed as a scene from empire and not an edit to promote the 2011 Blu-rays.

There is plenty of elements from empire Re-used for ROTJ but this scene of Vader in his meditation chamber is very specifically from Empire and has nothing to do with ROTJ so all I am saying is it should be listed as such and not have the wool over our eyes for the sake of a promotion of the 2011 blu-ray set.

Edit:

Check footage slowed down to help fit with the dialogue for the deleted scene which did not go there. The hologram screen is behind Vader (Set from Empire not built for ROTJ). Where did it go in the Empire Strikes Back? I am not sure really, but the only use I can possibly think of for this shot was an after the end credits scene. The dialogue was not there just Vader breathing and the sound of him clenching his fists in anger cut to black. That is my guess but I really have no definitive answer of where it is meant to go in either film. It is nowhere in the script for ROTJ or Empie and I doubt they re-created the set from Empire specifically for those 5 seconds or so not to be seen or used again.

Some very different coloring on a photo of the Head puppet (blood stained mask) might make you think this thing was not hungry!

I was going to post Shrek but I know once the fur is added it’s gonna look great.

Small thing I noticed… The Second shot after Luke leaves the planet Hoth in the x-wing and we see a rear view of the x-wing banking left and it’s engines… It is flipped horizontally it should be banking right… Check the story board also.

Make sure you put Vader in his Meditation chamber from ROTJ when Luke hides the lightsaber in R2-D2 as a deleted scene from Empire… It is not from ROTJ! (Just the Vader part everything else is from ROTJ). I had suspicions about R2-D2 fixing the x-wing from the edit-droid disc but it’s definitely got a clapper board saying Revenge of the Jedi before the clips.

The screen cap that you posted in the first post was shot under Earls court in London. I used to work there years a go and I have been in that kitchen in the basement.

The Blu-ray looks the closest (1st picture) to what the kitchen used to look like. But Earls Court has now been knocked down so anyway Just in case you were looking for what looks like the real thing the first picture looks like that kitchen because it was not turquoise it had white / off white tiles.

Well funny you should mention the wormhole sequence. Although undecided exactly what to do with the wormhole sequences the David Arnold Score is missing the Drums (1st wormhole sequence). So they edited this to be different.

I want to re-create the version that is in the trailer though at least as far as the swishes go. Either I will add the Drums to the wormhole or I will add a Low Rumble like in the trailer or both so definitely new sound mix on this.

I am not to keen on the whirring sounds in the original film it’s ok but I think the wormhole sequences could do with some kind of update but nothing too radical. The Documentary has a different sound mix that I posted above so it must have had numerous iterations of the sequence.

The Color of the Animation is also far too white in all recent versions. probably too much gamma.

I think it’s a real shame that on that end sequence we don’t actually see the gate activated and I think it would be a great addition to show the gate activate in the Pyramid It’s like a wasted opportunity and excuse for more of a build up to the end It says mission accomplished in my eyes. And feels a bit cheap TV movie at that point over budget as it currently stands. Thinking laterally I could show the Gate on Earth open and then cut back to the Gate on Abydos.

The other thing that is probably another definite decision now is removing the effect from within the teleport rings and having them just go white rather than show the badly composited squiggly lines.

The helmet morphs will look a lot better when the colors are corrected.

One fix I really want to make is the Guard that Daniel kills for killing Sha’re (His New found love). So In this shot Daniel fires 3 shots we only hear one shot and there is no physical effect for the last 2 impacts and I also want to add a residue burn for each consecutive hit.

OK I THINK I FOUND THE SOURCE OF THE MYSTERIOUS DOCUMENTARY THAT HAS BEEN EDITED

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Making-of-Stargate-Rare-8-NEW-Japan-Only-LaserDisc-Sci-Fi-/141861154575

So it’s a Japanese only 8" Laserdisc.

Damn that will difficult to not only buy but no Laser disc player.😦

This is the documentary I am looking for in original form as it is here!!!

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3jo1v_making-of-du-film-stargate-part-1_shortfilms

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3lhwt_making-of-stargate-part-2_shortfilms

Edit:

The Panic is over on these shots… I have super resolutioned it and it is good enough to use but only just.

So I don’t know if I will end up with an extra 10 minutes now but it will have within the region of 60 - 70 extra shots. Most being about 2 or 3 seconds long. I am getting more excited for that old grittier look. And a much darker tone. Becoming more against updating special effects but I still might as long as I can make it look of the time.

Yeah I thought a bit about the subtitles… I am using the region 1 Ultimate edition dvd as the main source but do plan to keep original captions not really thought about the 8000 years BC one might be better off left unexplained and a bit dumb to keep it.

But I might alter the text of ancient egyptian subtitle translations. I really don’t like that yellow font and it will be burned in white as one version I have simply does not play the English translation. But I thought about an Egypt style font for the subs.

Yeah you are right about some of these flaws and I really am not sure what I can do about those points you raise.

I will type in my rough list of things that I am considering some of which are fully decided.

1. Intro before credits from special edition will remove the Mothership to save the reveal for later and restore music
2. Show the lift in the elevator shaft decending in to the base the first time daniel arrives
3. Extended version of the first time Stargate opens
4. The base will be evacuated upon the mission is green lit.
5. Extended Ra mothership Landing
6. Show Ra emerging from his Sarcofagus in the correct scenes in front of the captured soldier
7. Extended Nagada attack by Gliders
8. Various extra location & Landscape shots
9. When James Spader & Kurt Russel are taken before RA there will be more violence and more Guards get killed
10. Daniel will have a vision before he is resurrected by RA
11. Extended Sequence where Daniel is ordered to Kill his comrades
12. Extra shots of Death Gliders and extended final Battle
13. you will see RA lose his Hand
14. I will try and save RA’s kids in the teleport Rings
15. Restore the music cues to the celebration Salute Sequence and Dialogue
16. Color Correct the film closer to the VHS colors
17. Re-do some effects shots or use alternative footage.

It is more complicated than that but generally this is the Plan. And it is about getting the tone to be better and be a bit more violent / action / gore. The current Special Edition will be extended.

In reference to “Jackson has Identified the 7th Symbol”

I will probably change it to “Jackson has Identified the 7 symbols” they could have got that far with a different combination but It clearly was not the correct one in the right sequence or it can also mean that they have never got that far before when the line “THIS is as far as we have ever been able to get” is said.

Daniel does exhibit a weakness of falling in love and putting others in Jepordy for his feelings. But it also gives him the strength to fight rather than be a coward. He finds something to fight for that is his Arc.

This appears to be the reason for the re-shoot with Gary Kurtz and the different Wampa… But no sign of the arm prop version in the comic book being filmed.

Comic Book

I just really want to add some extra thoughts on this if you do not agree with them I do not mind as I looked at it and here are 3 things that came to mind I am not strictly speaking just some small extra thoughts.

1. The hero Fanfare that plays when luke cuts himself down (John Williams music) was for the roll out of the way, you can clearly hear the cue for the strike on the Wampa comes directly after the fanfare. Or atleast this is what I think. I have not tried it but I feel the music is playing earlier than it should be. Or there may be a pause (break in music) before the fanfare cut’s in.

2. Sound of Lightsaber retracting is leftover from the alternate edit so the sound mix was not re-done

3. When Luke initially leaves the cave and is climbing out the footage here seems speeded up initially and then the footage seems to go to a different speed when luke gets up to wave his arms about before falling (2 speeds all in one take).

That is all I really look forward to whatever this becomes.

I am glad for this news as the Original Puppet is just the best looking and most scary version and looks the most real.

I like the Wampa moving Arm prop which matches the Original Puppet too which is in the film and is in one of the trailers and a deleted scene but I think it is really effective.

The whole part where the Wampa attacks Luke is weird though even in the original theatrical version and the special edition. There is one of those Music fade cuts there suggesting a missing scene could be there.

Mark Hamill did one of his great interviews joking about that he did not know that the Wampa’s arm was going to come off when he waves the lightsaber as the Wampa Approaches. He is telling the truth because I don’t think that shot was meant to go with the Wampa’s arm being loped off. What I think is the weird thing is that posture Mark Hamill is standing upright. In the Comic book Luke rolls out the way on the ground and swipes at the Wampa. And it’s that rolling out the Way that I think is what is missing and the whole Wampa suit costume was not needed for the arm being sliced off as only the Lightsaber and the moving arm prop were needed for that moment that we would have actually have seen it loped off.

After the Wampa’s arm is cut off we then cut back to luke back on the ground again getting up. (from Rolling out of the way).

So you have 2 versions of the sequence mixed together neither being fully complete with different Wampa’s.

Is there any truth to the Wampa eating Luke’s Taun Taun in terms of the theatrical cut who knows? Not me but perhaps the head puppet was used in close up for this? you only need a head and a arm to show the Wampa eating. It’s certainly an interesting piece of cinema… I am most curious about what magic could be done on this.

I want to see the version that used mainly the head and the arm basically we are yet to see it.

But I think the sequence went something like this.

Luke rolls out the way and swipes Lightsaber at the arm prop >>>> Close up Head puppet in Pain >>>> Arm prop falls on floor>>>> Luke get’s up and legs it.

Jaitea said:

doubleofive said:

teharri said:

At this point we should move the conversation to Return of the Jedi Revisited

They’ll be a thread for that when the time comes.

Would that be opened by Adywan or yourself 005?

J

The way I understood it was that the changes to ROTJ would already be decided once the thread is opened.

I honestly do not think Jedi is as complicated as Empire. But then it all depends on what the aim would be for Jedi revisited I suppose.

Personally I just am looking forward to
The change list. To understand what the team want to do. ROTJ has had much more discussion on here where as many are blinded to Empires problems and decide it is perfect but will always put down ROTJ.

ratpack1961 said:

I have my own false memory from seeing ESB in a 1981 re-release. When Luke is in the Wampa cave, I have a distinct memory of Obi Wan telling him to use the force telepathically to lift the lightsaber.

When the VHS of ESB came out, I was shocked that Obi Wan’s voice was absent from that scene. I think when I first joined this forum it was one of the first things I asked about. At this point I don’t think that voice over existed but I don’t know how I came up with that as a kid. Unless those re-release prints had some weird meddling by Ben Burtt that is now forgotten in time.

This was in the script exactly the same as you put it.

It is possible that the voice over exists although I never heard it or remember it

Cool I really like this film… Just in case you were not aware a live action remake is planned. So probably a good investment if you could sell a high quality scan of the original back to the studios.

In the documentary (sorry can not remember which one) you see the stunt double do back flips before he jumps out but I am also pretty sure they detonate the window frames to break also before he flies out.

The idea was probably to have an alternate camera angle where it appears he smashes through the rest of the window. Just saying…

I imagine it would be but I am not sure… Basically it is in 4:3 and is all footage from 1994. It was made at the same time as the film. It is split in to different sections. As I said it has music to jurassic park when the natives make their uprising against the pyramid. But there are more deleted scenes than this.

I have the UK single disc directors cut done by Kinowelt in Germany.

I have the documentary in 240p but I want to get it in 480p if possible.

The documentary on the US ultimate edition 2 disc set is not the documentary it is a new one. But the old original making of is on Blu Ray but with the deleted material edited out.

I have the UK special edition and the US special edition 2 disc version so I have bought and checked them.

Unless you have the French DVD it might be on there?

Ok the CD arrived and it is quite a nice collectors item it has 2 posters and the CD-Rom in a big box.

There is a few clips on it you cannot find anywhere else but it is small sized footage. It’s not anything completely significant but it is nice to see all the same and the test will be upsacling it to DVD quality.

The documentary I am looking for though is still evading my search. I bought the blu-ray hoping it would be on there and the documentary is on there but the deleted scenes have been edited out of it.

On the Blu Ray it is listed as “the making of Stargate” and “Original Stargate previews” but I am trying to find the original unedited documentary. Can anyone tell me if this was released on DVD?