Ronster

I would stop worrying about weather this print is the holy grail of all prints and just adjust for the muck all over it.

I think you should use the WOWWOW and simply get rid of the Hue’s in the pixels after the sampling.

You can not reverse the blown out Blu Ray but you can simply de-saturate any weird leftovers.

It’s still like night and day. I think you need to stop thinking “exactly” because the 35mm print is probably far from exact also.

So you what you will have is very much “in the spirit of the original theatrical presentation” and would still be a huge improvement over what is currently available. Don’t beat yourself up!

Ok so I cleared some of the hues out the WOWWOW regrade for this shot. Does it look massively different? Not really…it looks pretty much the same but I reduced all the magenta and yes there is a problem with Blue again. Looks better now. Looks pretty similar to the 35mm but without all the dark crap in it.

It’s not like bad to be slightly different. But to be massively different yeah that is and that is why you are doing it right? So don’t worry too much about being 100% accurate to a old print that is not exact anyway.

Your regrade mildly adhusted.

The yellow I think is correct don’t fight it. Blue might be the problem. At the end of the day do what you like. I have no objections to the color. But this I think might be closer to what it is “Meant to look like” taking in to account the problem with the dark grain and how it’s smearing the wall blue. It might also mean this guy has a grey jacket too 😃

Just trying to be helpful. I am not asking you to change it.

I think I know what might (?) be happening although your color match program is very very good. It is sampling the dark grain in the shadow and throwing off the sample in a sense.

Making the regrade slightly darker in the dark areas. As the 35mm has lot’s of dark speckles in the white. This is obviously sampled and throwing it off. As the WOWWOW HDTV version has no dark grain speckles.

Not really misunderstanding but Would all prints have the yellow noise then?

Or just the particular 35mm print? Or Is it 2 different transfers from the same print?

It’s a shadow… But I like the color and I know you are trying to match 2 different transfers as the same color.

All I am saying is, it is giving you a clue what that is meant to look like. And weather you want to pay any attention to small little things like that. It will give you more information about what the film is “Meant to look like”

weather the 35mm looks like that or not is another matter. All I am saying is it’s a clue. No problems with what you are doing, and I am far from an expert but that for me is a indicator.

It’s a key to a door.

Contrast issue top left corner.

That now will give you the variance as the 35mm does not exhibit this problem. It’s shot’s like this that give you the answers to the problems. Although I only adjusted the brightness and contrast yellow starts to creep in.

Popped the top

Ok thanks it’s no good as a color reference but most important of all I missed a music cue where Bruce get’s locked in the Room with the sliding doors.

Bruce voice missing when he punches the reflection of Han also.

There is probably more so I am evidently not done.

So just as well that I did not rush.

Theatrical cut at heart and the UK TV edit.

It is the same transfer as the DVD but better encoded on the DVD although some shots In the Diagostini source I used had even worse colors meaning that it was a partially corrected Raw Scan that was Prior to the Special edition and the Laserdisc release.

kazoo3 said:

I’m back again if anyone is interesting in having the original theatrical cut i’ll be uploading it to mega.nz

From what I understand of the transfer it’s similar to the DVD versions, The colors are quite literally all over the place with thick Magenta, yellow/red and Cyan hues. Bad drops of video gain, gamma and value and also brightness and contrast issues.

Serious issue with Blue Gamma and contrast also is noteworthy.

I will be uploading the final parts of my edit which can be found here for streaming only at this time.

http://originaltrilogy.com/topic/Enter-the-Dragon/id/18025

If you want to compare the 2 go ahead. I spent hundreds of hours color correcting and remixing the sound with a few alterations to scene orders and extra footage not in the theatrical version or the special edition. Fixed missing frames and sizing issues and the film slipping out of the scanner and other problems where the shot is full frame but not cropped. I fixed all the jump cuts and I also fixed some audio synch problems.

I may need to go over it briefly again if I decide to release it so it is for streaming only at this point. I might also upscale it. Not sure I am quite finished with it yet. I am letting the dust settle on it.

The project is now deleted but I have a cut that I can adjust from this point. The last parts will be up for streaming Sunday or Monday which means I will be deleting the parts that are currently up at this time.

And any version as of the 25th anniversary The spatial cleaning is so much everybody looks like plastic. So it’s not an option.

Sorry, what happened?

did you miss a part?

I have tried to leave the parts up to stream for some time so you can see them…

you should use the subscribe feature on the thread.

Yeah It’s got a red banner labeling it as “Restored Edition” and It is a new transfer of the film. With that label it’s probably safe to assume that the original audio will be an option on there? Or one would hope so…

It’s an “In house” restoration by Universal also not farmed out.

Personally I bought the book “Beware the Moon” which expands on the making of the film, big fan of Rick Bakers work. If there is anything that confirms any of these scenes I will keep you posted.

Some of the footage that surfaced is in Beware the Moon Documentary with a big “UNUSED FOOTAGE” plastered on top but it also has like the AVID time code on it so it’s in an edit machine but the “Tramp scene” the “Oozing toast” and some of the others appear to be LOST… Which is a damn shame but it’s that same old spiel again.

The test screening was in America with the different cut so I doubt it’s lost. But people claim to have seen it in the UK some of the missing scenes namely “Tramp” and “Toast” and “Nazi Demons”

Paul Davis the maker of the documentary “Beware the Moon” confirmed the “I just killed Bambi!” scene

There is no new special features on this 35th Anniversary Edition. But Yeah this Film AAWIL and Conan the Barbarian fully uncut I would be a happy man then. Make it so Hollywood 😃

I have been looking in to this film yesterday, It is one of “The Best” horror films, and it appears that the official line on some material (Trims and cut’s) that was excised from the film was thrown out by Twickenham Studios in England.

But the original test screening had a few differences. And people on the internet keep saying they have seen a different version that was either screened by accident in the cinema of the harder cut. Others refer to a uncut VHS tape bootleg doing the rounds.

Is there any truth to these tales?

On the DVD for the 20th Anniversary a number of shots did surface featuring some of the cut material. In good quality also.

Do you think Landis has a copy of the original cut? Landis recently blurted out about the Original Star Wars films to be restored… But he also said something along the lines of “I’m not as lucky as George, they won’t let me go back and change my films because I don’t own them”

The Main Missing scene is called the “tramp scene” where the tramps meet their doom apparently one on top of a car bonnet (Hood). This scene was deemed very disturbing by the test audience (what do they know?) but Landis very much regrets cutting the scene out the film.

The other possible differences are as follows.

1. Extended Change sequence

2. Werewolf seen coming around the corner before the Banker on the underground (subway) runs (Banker Mauled on escalator?)

3. David Spits out the Bankers thumb in the wolf den in London zoo

4. The Nazi Demons dream within a dream David is gunned down in his hospital bed before waking up and his parents being gunned down is also more graphic

5. The first dream sequence when David wakes up he tells a nurse “I just killed Bambi!” as he dreamed of eating the deer.

6. Jack’s bit of toast from hospital dinner falls out his throat and he brushes it off his jacket

7. More shots of the werewolf in Picadilly Circus running amock and an extra shot more graphic decapitation (different angle of the Decapitated head flying off hitting the car segway in to existing shot) also shot’s of people on the Bus before it crashes and someone fly’s out the window of the bus.

8. Shower sex scene toned down

9. Teaser trailer footage of the blood moon would appear to have been part of the film at some point. The werewolf has probably just killed a sheep.

There is also a possible reference to a “Larry Talbot” escaping an asylum and a “mad man” being on the loose prior to the slaughtered Lamb arrival or even before the truck is opened to let David and Jack out of the sheep pen. Weather this was a bit of news on the radio of the truck? And also something the audience are privy too and not David and Jack But a small tidbit and obviously another gag.

Cut Music (could not obtain the rights)

Cat Stevens - Moon Shadow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPazGVuBXmY
Bod Dylan - Blue moon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuEBLltOgek

Called out for not using

Warren Zevon - Werewolves of London https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDpYBT0XyvA

Basically I think considering this was the first film to ever win an academy award for “Outstanding Achievement in make up” it’s a shame that a lot of the make up a special effects shot’s are actually cut from the film and a good number of gags.

So do you think this alternate cut is floating about or not? was there any differences in the pre-cert vhs releases?
It was originally x-rated in the UK and premiered in the UK before America. Basically the claim seems to come from the UK audience having seen a version initially in cinema and or on pre-cert or x-rated VHS or bootleg.

Original Audio never released on DVD or Blu-ray. Laserdisc and VHS contains original sound mix.

35th Anniversary in 2 days time.

Although we are only looking at a few snippets here one of them is totally convincing as being the real deal and that is quite amazing in it’s own right.

Basically yeah very cool find and considering they went to the trouble of trying to reassemble the Italian cut but in English there is a lot of worth to those small bits of footage and sound mix. It is an unexpected find. But apart from the remains 5 minutes left to be found it seems this film is just about complete Now.

Good work!

And I only just really became aware of this project. It’s a very interesting discovery this print and obviously your intentions are to restore the US cut.

So what to do with these extra pieces of footage?

Basically it seems the film could now be possibly complete now minus the 5 minutes scene in the Socorro Sequence.

That first deleted scene is 100% proper it’s not a deleted scene really it’s very good editing it feels like a mistake that it has been excised whilst the skeleton scene feels pretty rough and does not add much.

Although nobody has yet found those missing 5 minutes Socorro Sequence basically It does make you believe that it’s out there. Somone in Italy has it.

Do you have the Tuco torture scene undamaged?

Is there any plan for an alternative version other than US cut also?

MalàStrana said:

ZkinandBonez said:

Ronster said:

Just FYI I watched Zatoichi (well half of it) last night,

Huh? Zatoichi is like 25 films and a whole TV series, how do you watch “half” of it in one evening.

The Kitano remake is simply called “Zatoichi”.

Yes the Kitano remake… And I think the “Visually impaired” was a joke by the director it can be a bit whacky in places. But he is constantly reffered to as blind by others and himself at the finale. I reckon Gareth Edwards liked it.

I liked it but not to be taken too seriously.

@Dominic Cobb not worried I just don’t understand why they did it. No big deal but let’s hope that it’s not going to be too soft.

SilverWook said:

You can say “Hell” and even “Damn” in a G rated film. At least one used to be able to.

Just FYI I watched Zatoichi (well half of it) last night, it was getting a bit late but I referred to Donnie Yen’s character being blind and compared his character to zatoichi.

Whilst watching the film the English subtitles instead of referring to Zatoichi as being “Blind” the subtitles exclaimed him as “Visually impaired”.

This is the world we live in now. But I do not understand why a condition someone suffers, and may I add is not said in malice to explain such a condition that they have should be altered to please some nutter.

Parts 5 and 6 are here.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3f23cI00Px3YkgxS0ZJS1BMUGc/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3f23cI00Px3a1VtLVhXUnZkVkE/view?usp=sharing

The rest have been removed.

Hope people are enjoying the color correction and the new sound mix?

Lord Haseo said:

Ronster said:

Lord Haseo said:

I think the interrogation/torture scenes pretty much warrant a PG-13 rating. Someone on TheForce.net claims that in one of their viewings parents covered their kids eyes when Kylo was mind probing Rey.

Seriously if you watch he never touches Rey and he also takes his mask off changing him from a monster to a softly spoken young lad. There is nothing remotely hinting at torture in the scene. You can bet there was a version where he kept his mask on though.

He touched and violated her mind with the Force. He even made one of the most rapey statements I ever heard when he said “I can take whatever I want”.

Foot massage?

It was always going to be PG by today’s strictness it’s just how close to R/15 it would be and that is nowhere near R or 15 and It does not make a film better by being more violent or what ever but it also does not help all this worrying about offending people or getting obsessed with studio’s doing self censorship before submission. Political correctness is stiffling.

A film still needs to be fun and also needs to be educational at the same time. What messages you can take away from censoring somone with a grazed head are not only odorous but also ominous. What is the point?

Lord Haseo said:

I think the interrogation/torture scenes pretty much warrant a PG-13 rating. Someone on TheForce.net claims that in one of their viewings parents covered their kids eyes when Kylo was mind probing Rey.

Seriously if you watch he never touches Rey and he also takes his mask off changing him from a monster to a softly spoken young lad. There is nothing remotely hinting at torture in the scene. You can bet there was a version where he kept his mask on though. To top it off Rey succeeds in torturing the bad guy’s emotions (Kylo Ren) whilst tied up using the force to read his mind.

@Frank it was filmed but removed but it was to do with the joke made in star wars about “Let the Wookie win”. Maz Katana’s bar.

SilverWook said:

ROTS and TFA were PG-13 though.

And was the Force Awakens submitted to the MPAA or the BBFC with Chewbacca ripping the aliens arms out of it’s sockets in the bar?

Hell no.

Studios self censor them selves the film boards now just stamp it whatever points it get’s. I doubt there is much re-submission of films these days. It’s all pre-prepared for submission so as any unpleasant surprises can be avoided and there is no skating on the limit.

The censors won, movie studio’s lost and don’t want to fight like they used to. Or try to get away with having more fun. I can understand ROTS getting PG-13 but the TFA was like a weak PG nobody had an argument about anything apart from Kylo throwing a tantrum. Zero Abrasiveness.

Ra’s severed hand from Pioneer DVD but it is in all versions of the film. The close up shot was cut though

Good news and bad news I have the documentary with the extra deleted scenes in 720 x 576 it’s on the french collectors edition version of the film. So I have it in DVD Quality and it will be a perfect match quality wise. And the extra or alternate bit’s of sound mix from it too.

But I am probably not going to start this project until the winter time as I just spent ages on a project recently and I don’t want to get back in to doing another one just yet as It takes up too much time.

More info on the guy who has the handgun. The timeline is swapped in that when the soldier is taken before RA he is thrown on the ground then smashed in the face. THEN he is dragged across the floor with the blood on his head after he has been hit very hard and not before. The Blood on his head is not present when he is thrown in front of RA’s sarcophagus.

Before the age of digital removal This is a normal way to soften a sequence by taking the Context of cause and effect of violence and swapping them in time so as the violence remains but the act and the after effect are removed in context so that we can see the injury and then we see the actual moment the violence occurs but they are without any context to one another as we are time travelling and the 2 appear to be unconnected events.

This happens in quite a few points in the film where cause and effect are swapped pertaining to perceived violence. Or worst of all there is a gap and we get a jump cut where the violence is simply hard cut out and we skip quite literally over it.

Perhaps you are right but I just think studios are self censoring before they even get to the certification process. That’s what I believe is happening today and they are aware of the points that can be racked up that will push a film in to another age bracket.

Perhaps they keep it loose before they decide what can stay and what must go, but it’s so obvious that Studios only want to make big budget pg/13 films.

We used to get big budget 18/x rated films… And I miss them films but I don’t imagine Disney releasing any x rated films any time soon.

Call me old fashioned if you like.

Yesterday I watched a few episodes of Project Greenlight which was sponsored by Miramax and dimension films (formerly part of Disney) and It was an interesting series. Basically they were looking for new talent of screenwriters, Directors. So anyway because the movie that would get made was low budget what sort of film did they decide to make?

A monster horror… which was really gory. But they stated that it was seen as economically viable on a budget of around I think it was 8 million USD. But before the film was 100% finished Dimension films divorced Disney and became the Weinstein Company. The test screenings did not object to the gore that was in the film only that the monster had no origin story but If you watched an earlier episode the origin story of the monster was removed at the request of the studio because of the budget they had set. So they shot themselves in the foot as they were concerned more about making money but essentially tanked the project by cutting the budget and chopping out the most important part of the monster and where it came from. It’s all quite amusing and I think you have to take a hat off to Matt Damon and Ben Affleck for objecting to the studios attitude overall because all they were worried about was money nothing more. But essentially that tanked the film and the project.

But for Disney and Star Wars money is not an object, but it absolutely must be a PG rated movie. What gives…
I think the point is the only people who are objecting to gore and violence are the studios themselves rather than the audience. Nudity is a different ball game but still I think it all depends on what film you are trying to make 😃

doubt it…They would just pick another shot.

It’s no wonder the budgets on these movies are so expensive. You think about it if that soldier got bashed on the head. We have a soft rubber gun made to do that for safety. Then the make up artist who put’s the graze there then all the people who are paid to object or ensure continuity.

Graze then has to be removed in post production by digital effects. The material is now worthless that was shot with all the crew present. Would it have not been better to make that decision before creating it?

How much did something like that cost. A lot of money I am sure. It just makes the mind boggle over these decisions that are made and price is not an object really. It’s cost them more to remove it than to just leave it alone. And the movie industry complains about how risky film making is. They are exposing themselves to even more risk by this silly self censorship and may I add making films that are full of fluff.

abnormal interference is really what this is.

I am not entirely sure about the motivation behind this removal of a graze on the head, but some nutter thought it needed to be changed. Perhaps that soldier no longer get’s bashed on the head?

But then the next question becomes ok so you removed the graze on the head because you also removed the storm trooper smacking him over the head to cause the graze.

So eventually these films just get so watered down and loose their edge, that the director originally had when shooting the scenes.

The answer is of course don’t bother to make films like this. Just make episodes of my little pony and everyone will have nothing to say about it. Perhaps they could try to make a war movie where nobody got to fight any enemies and not one shot is fired.

I am looking forward to them they sound great 😃

No but seriously who cares what certificate a film is apart from the studio. Ok that matters in the cinema but for home video nobody gives two hoots.

This is so typical… “It’s going to be a gritty war movie” but we are going to remove a bloody graze from some poor soldiers head because it might scare the kids?

I am quite sure kids fall of their bikes or their skateboards or what not and get injuries akin to that are fairly common.

Who on earth would bother to spend money on softening that graze on the head because it is deemed to be… Actually I don’t know what a graze on the head is considered to be other than a graze on the head.

It’s complete and utter madness. certifiable insanity.

I just want to say a couple of things, I am liking the adjustment but…

1. The re-grade on the opening credits on my screen looks a bit hard to read. But the WOW WOW is much easier to read. Do you think that perhaps that 35mm scan has pushed it a bit too bright?

It’s just I don’t think they would make the opening credits difficult to read?

2. The Regrade on the bar shot, although the red tint is mostly gone you have a magenta remnant left in the image, I would also say it’s still a bit too red saturated. I assume it’s still early days on that but something is not right here in the bar. That is a black leather jacket Marion is wearing?