Ronster

darth_ender said:

Somehow Bothans delivering plans to the Rebels was an idea that we successfully voted upon in spite of voting down other Bothan ideas.  A lot of this is quite complex, which is why I wrote a short scene (and in my opinion, a short scene in this situation is a good thing).  However, as I've stated, the votes are guidelines and not rules, and we therefore can change what needs to be changed.  We've gotten a lot more participation of late, so the next vote may be quite a bit bigger.  I myself prefer simple but meaningful changes.

 

So speaking of changes, I'm still working on the script (I know, I said I'd be done yesterday, so sue me).  One point made by Ronster with regard to my cut of the Endor battle (and thus my script, as they are similar) is that it took too long for the fighters to enter the station.  I'm thinking that we should include a brief dogfight scene (as discussed above) where the various Rebel fighters try to gain access to the superstructure and the Imperials try to prevent that.  So according to my script, the Ewoks and Rebels have the Imperials on the run on the surface, Chewie and a couple teddy bears get the idea to hijack a walker, but we don't know that yet.  Cut to Death Star, fighters shooting each other.  Falcon and several fighters also are scrambling to find the entrance to the superstructure.  This explains part of the holdup and can include more of the dogfighting and intercom chatter you guys were talking about earlier.  Then cut back to Chewie and Ewoks swinging onto the AT-ST and committing grand theft walker.  Thoughts?

I think in your version the shield was down when chewie steals the AT-ST so are you suggesting cutting back and fourth would work well as in the original this happens before the shield is down but I definatley feel this might be a good inclusion and a good place for some dog fighting aswell as at the first point when the shield is still up.

the whole thing about Jejerrods conflict would be better used to target the small moon not Endor thats suicide. That small celestial body you were talking about Darth Ender might work well as a better target than Endor... If they blew that up then it might wipe out the rebel fleet and there own fleet too lol how about that and this could happen during the dog fight not the attack run...just thoughts coming to me don't think that I am all go for it just exploring.

@ray_afraid thats why I just suggested Boush / Leia

I like Bingowings Idea...... This does execute things differently and would definatley fit better in ROTJ than a recycled a new hope begining.... A transmission is very simple indeed... What ship would you have it be bingo wings? somthing neutral I suppose. hey ok what about it is Boush on the ship a bounty hunter ship no need for lip sync either if it's boush / Leia

Ok so in your version we would simply need to see that ship rendevouz with the fleet carrying the plans? or keep it traditional USB Stick Droid Download and out the airlock?

Later we see Boush with chewbacca

Just thoughts trying to amalgamate ideas here

It's quite good but I feel it is'nt long enough sorry but thats my Opinion does not mean I am right or anything

darth_ender said:

Well, my little scene involves few visuals, is short, gets across any additional information anybody wanted, is simply a clue to the story's progression and involves no emotional connection, and fits in with the recent vote.  I think it may be all we need, but I'm not sure everyone liked it.  I like the idea of showing simultaneous DS constructions, but I'm not sure how to pull that off...yet :)

You know all too well what I am talking about... If you open the movie as normal with Vader going to DSII then what do you put inbetween Luke Leaving Dagobah and getting to Tattooine.. The emperors visit stays where it is agreed so thats what I am talking about... It does not need to be Bothans it can be anything I am talking about cuts away and padding.

Ok forget about Bothans look at it like this instead as a series of choices

1. Original opening > Dagobah > Blank > Tattooine

2. Blank > Dagobah > Original Opening > Tattooine

3. Original opening > Tattooine > Dagobah

or my Idea

4. Blank > Dagobah > Original Opening > Blank > Tattooine

Thats what I mean really like I said I don't care about Bothans but I do care about the structure

Bingowings said:

I just had a thought which might augment the Bothan idea.

One of the major criticisms of ROTS was the long building time for the first Death Star compared to the second.

What if the Bothan information included security footage of the building of the first Death Star which after analysis showed a second Death Star at an earlier stage of construction being built along side it.

The Bothans could have followed this up by finding out it's current location and also the details of the Emperor's visit.

It's a good idea only problem with it is that the whole structure of DSII was different although I agree it was being built along side DSI...

Cant we just have the plans stolen from the shield generator on Endor and before they escape they get captured or self destruct the ship whilst being captured as I suggested... Atleast that way it involves the Shield Generator from the start... We see this as one of the goals our hereos must get to before Jabbas palace and rescuing Han then DSII later... urgghh I dunno what to do about this

it seems nobody can agree but then I think It is only a matter of time before somone sees the light and nails it... We desperatly need somthing to make the structure work properly and make the plot more cohesive in the process.

I still maintain I don't want to see Bothans only hear that they died trying to steal the plans but I don't mind seeing them try in exterior shots of a ship being destroyed...Say or any other simplistic way... Ambiguous way

Bingo-wings please could you perhaps give me your alternate take on this idea please you have a good imagination. Link Below

http://www.mediafire.com/?nczs921vtp0ouh8

The main Idea was to show a failure and the empire capitalise on the situation... I think you can come up with somthing for sure The probe droids are meant to be escape pods they would need modifying obviously.

Angel said:

Ronster said:

And I would also like a bit of dog fight action like from ANH especially with the Targeting HUD Graphics it would make it feel a bit more  like the original and TBH I think this is one of the main things missing

Just to add that ROTJ has already reused footage from ANH in terms of cockpit shots. The already cheap production got cheaper. Always welcome to see something new.

-Angel

Well not once do we go inside a Tie-Fighter Either surely that's got to change too? The Tie Fighter Cockpits were just cool the with the hexagon window so cinematic.... A real opportunity lost also in my opinion That would help dog-fight action too I guess with the black strormtrooper flyboys and a bit of rearview window to boot. Obviously what's going on outside the window will be different but you get the idea

Here's to making an even cheaper ROTJ Hoorah!

darth_ender said:

Ronster said:

darth_ender said:

I really like the idea of radio chatter.  Only question is how to show it.  They were trying to set a furious pace when making the film, and the rapid switching gives that feel.  Unfortunately it leaves little time to include chatter over the radio.  We need to seek out parts where enough focused is left on one particular cockpit or bridge where we can insert others' lines over the radio.

Well I meant.... say in one of your proposed new shots say... Use a cockpit view and whatever that is going on outside the window is new, with radio chatter say or a face shot of wedge in cockpit or even a hud with radio chatter.... targetting computers are also good for this and Gunners on the falcon... There are plenty of opportunities and will make the CGI exterior shots perhaps less intensive and break things up nicely. Even Madine looking about with coms chatter would work... You need to create the opportunities but it will help the exterior CGI shots run smoother with perhaps less work too.

Blowing up Fish face in cockpit would be easy too :) lol

And I would also like a bit of dog fight action like from ANH especially with the Targeting HUD Graphics it would make it feel a bit more  like the original and TBH I think this is one of the main things missing

Many good ideas here.  I'll include them in the vote.  I'm still updating the script from the last vote (yeah, I know I'm late), and I'm making sure the changes I make can actually be incorporated.  I really do like the idea of more dogfighting, radio chatter, and HUDs.

I found a new flat today and sorry If I seemed harsh on people before was having a bit of a bad one, but things are looking up and I hope my mood today extends onto others also.. I was also angry because I don't have much time at the momment to do the things I want to do... But hopefully this will change a bit over the next couple of weeks or month say

@Angel what were you saying about not re-using any footage? Lol :)

Vladius said:

ShepardCommander said:

2. Leading the Battle of Endor. Why they signed up Lando to command? He is betrayed once Han, do the military commanders trust him? Or Han leading the ground forces. And where the other soliders dissapeared, that only the Ewoks remain? Can't the ground team communicate the Fellet, and call in some air support to destroy the shield generator?

Someone's forgetting the little maneuver at the battle of Taanab.

Remember save Lando? life or death there really is no inbetween.... ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WH0olbts9-4

darth_ender said:

I really like the idea of radio chatter.  Only question is how to show it.  They were trying to set a furious pace when making the film, and the rapid switching gives that feel.  Unfortunately it leaves little time to include chatter over the radio.  We need to seek out parts where enough focused is left on one particular cockpit or bridge where we can insert others' lines over the radio.

Well I meant.... say in one of your proposed new shots say... Use a cockpit view and whatever that is going on outside the window is new, with radio chatter say or a face shot of wedge in cockpit or even a hud with radio chatter.... targetting computers are also good for this and Gunners on the falcon... There are plenty of opportunities and will make the CGI exterior shots perhaps less intensive and break things up nicely. Even Madine looking about with coms chatter would work... You need to create the opportunities but it will help the exterior CGI shots run smoother with perhaps less work too.

Blowing up Fish face in cockpit would be easy too :) lol

And I would also like a bit of dog fight action like from ANH especially with the Targeting HUD Graphics it would make it feel a bit more  like the original and TBH I think this is one of the main things missing

Angel said:

Ronster said:

Would Empire at War really look like ROTJ though?

Not a chance ;). Still when someone wants to propose a change or an additional shot, this game might give inspiration of how a shot could be. Like a previz moving storyboard.

Later it comes the real deal of doing CG and coordinate the flow.

-Angel

 

 

Ah ok I see... Well it's the B-Wings blowing up a Star destroyer or the attack on the Comms ship and the destruction of the executor which seem to be the things that either got left out or could use better visualizing... I dont think it should be overdone too much 2mins max extra if that... Not to mention some Ship to Ship destroying more ties and rebels biting the bullet plus the Falcon Gunners would be good too even via huds and cockpits and comms this could be fairly easy to Pad out to 2mins Extra I reckon with using some deleted scenes.

I'd really like to see the Y-Wings Bombing somthing too and I hope that Idea of yours makes the cut... Would you modify shots from ANH to do this?

Only just saw your expanded comment about the ENDOR HOLOCAUST lol poor little Ewoks.... They would be an endangered species after this, would make for a great David Attenborough documentry somone should definatly do this idea for a laugh...

Angel said:

Ronster said:

Well done on this, I noticed it was a differnt formula to directing ROTJ when I was thinking about the Audio and no Comms chatter at all really...

Interesting enough now you said that the comlinks are missing.

Beautifull takes can be the cinematic view of Empire at war (game). At some rare moments you can take a well placed action and illustrate how the batte would you love to be.

-Angel

Perhaps this is a bit of progress then to break the Bond... Make it feel a bit more like the original in some respects, whilst trying to incorporate new shots through cockpits with Comms and exterior shots, it obviously needs to be a demo take to see how it comes off. Would Empire at War really look like ROTJ though?

Angel said:

The space shots in ROTJ i count is 64.

The cockpit shots i count(including the close ups of any bridge but not the far shots) is 58.

This count excludes any hangar shot and any death star interior chase. Also ignores what happens in the throne room. Only when we see ships in space in various backgrounds.

I also noticed that for 85% there is a space shot-cockpit shot-space shot-cockpit shot.

That count only can show us a nice amount of work that the movie already needs before go and add more shots.

have that in mind how many more shots of space should you consider adding?

Any thoughts of braking that bond of cockpit/space shot? Will it look odd?

Its good to start talking measuring and counting shots so we can have a better view of what is going on and what is most or less possible of doing.

-Angel

Well done on this, I noticed it was a differnt formula to directing ROTJ when I was thinking about the Audio and no Comms chatter at all really... I understand it is a difficult one just to incorporate audio to make it feel more Like A New Hope and to break the bond as you say would break the flow the director chose to take... But the Lost Rebels Audio could be incorporated with clever use of Cock-pit view shots or even HUDS which we see none of also... I Just feel it has gone from it's roots and forgotton some of what made it so popular in the first place... A simple Ring-Mod on the Voices of the Lost rebels would probably create the desired effect... you could even take some lines from ANH and re-use wisely with this effect such as "Pull Up" if ships were to crash into the shields on first approach we could also then have a classic cockpit view of what it would look like flying towrds DSII just befor the attack run which we do not get in ROTJ at the momment... It's only Ideas anyway but ROTJ did go off track a bit.

Even Lines like "Fried Calamari Tonight" might work as Comms Chatter with Effects added and you might be surprised that perhaps the key is to break that Bond the director chose as you say, for things to be achieved either through FPS Cockpits and Huds especially with the falcon Gunners also.

fishmanlee said:

Vladius said:

Yeah, me neither. It doesn't feel much like Star Wars.

Good, ROTJ was always too much like Star Wars.

Yeah ROTJ was like the ugly duckling of the trilogy, it tried to go in some new directions.... I don't really know what Bothans would look like TBH hairy no doubt I suppose, and I do not care for them at all,

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Uploaded with ImageShack.us

 you know I don't want to see this guy! but what I do want to see is atleast some suggestion as to the struggle the rebels went through, to get the plans and then perhaps loose them and have them delivered somehow.

The 2 key plotlines are:

Mon-Mothma "Many Bothan Spies Died to bring us this infomation..." She looks overly concerned as if somthing was not right this gives us license for the bounty hunter

Then the twist - Emperor "I let the Rebels Escape with the Plans" or somthing like this, yep I lured them in

Not only that it would be good to see some of this unfold but it would also help to pad out the begining... Win Win in my book, just need to figure out how to do it...

Vader Obviously goes to DSII because the plans were stolen and they need to get ready for the attack by the rebels.

By bringing the rebel fleet into the movie aerlier It might help build more anticipation for the final battle as it all happens so fast in the last third.

Just been catching up on the chatter on here, and it still seems that the begining is not quite nailed down yet... I am not trying to push my ideas but when it comes to anything new scene wise the best approach is definatly keep it as ambiguous as possible... Like you can have a whole ship blow up that was full of Bothans that had the plans but you don't know until later at the briefing that they were Bothans and you never even saw one... You only heard about it after seeing the ship blow-up say. Is it Sluggo with all the models he has a Tantive could we use that to perhaps blow up loads of Bothans? Atleast then it would not be re-using footage....

For the Plans being handed over I modified Bingo-Wings Idea but again tried to avoid any characters only some audio dubs and a droid (containing the plans) floating towards the nebulon frigate which is delivered via a bounty hunter.... I would not mind it being Bobba but I thought it would be good to use say Bossk or even IG88 you could do a CGI Job on him no probs.... No need for lip sync too...

Anyway I have had a look into After Effects and have had a play with the free trial on there, I plan to do some visualising and hoping I find the time....

Fishmanlee provided me of a Bobba Fett Cartoon special... Anyway this has some Audio in it I planned to snatch for Luke Reaching Tattooine

Lukes First Line will be modified from ESB from were not meeting the others to "were meeting the others" Chatting with R2

Luke will then enter the Atmosphere and we use the line "Beggars Canyon" from A new Hope

Next Line Bobba Fett Cartoon "Hang on R2"

I have done 2 rough mock-up shots while learning and basically luke is using his Targetting Computer to scan for the Falcon and this works well.

Next Line ANH "Nothing" - targeting computer off

Next Line Bobba Fett Cartoon "See If I can Locate the Falcon by Visual Sighting"

anyway it needs quite a bit of work yet so I will try to get somthing up sooner or later,

Another thing that I have noticed that in ROTJ unlike ANH the space battle there is no interference on any comms chatter between pilots and I think this would be a nice addition, but it mainly jumped to cockpits to do the conversing rather than use the comms audio many times but I really liked the interference on the voices.

@Darth_Ender the opening crawl needs words like "Rebels desperate struggle" and "Final Hope to Halt The Empires Tyranny and restore order to the Galaxy" stuff like this

Sluggo said:

Ronster said:

I take the point about not "re-using footage" as a complete dismissal, I have been re-using footage to convey my ideas as I am not the best artist, and It would seem that instead of anyone who can do descent art saying I see what you mean but how about this because you are re-using footage.... It seems that people who are not doing the CGI are putting alot more effort and thought into this project and exploring more ideas with little or no visualising going on.

Thats how I feel about it frankly

Anyway with reference to the Vader Luke Duel on DSII...... Vader says "Obi-Wan has Taught you well" but Yoda has basically taught Luke much more atleast in this version so would it be worth inserting an audio clip of luke saying "Yoda" after this line to serve as a correction to Vader.... A bit more of a battle of words, and a revelation that Yoda was still alive atleast at the begining of the movie.

It bugged me when I did my re-cut but had not thought of it again until just now...

Bold and underlined.  Strong feelings for sure.

 

I wouldn't mind keeping the Obi-wan line in the cut.  It is a good reminder that the old story was Obi-w and and Vader/Anakin.  Besides, it may be viewed that Vader may not have known Yoda was alive, but that Vader understood that Ben had indeed become one with the force and had become more powerful than Vader had previously imagined.    If such is the case, it isn't a big stretch of the imagination to think Ben was training Luke.

Keep the Obi-Wan line Luke says after the line Yoda to correct him....

I have quite alot on my plate right now... I need to file my Tax return or face £1000 fine and move house relativly soon so I don't have much time on my hands until the end of February - March realsitically so I won't be doing any more rough cuts or Visualizing for quite a bit...  I'll pop in from time to time but I won't be keeping up with this as activly as I was.... So I'll just leave it as this for now and if I find the time to make any contribution then I will do, but is unlikly at the momment

I take the point about not "re-using footage" as a complete dismissal, I have been re-using footage to convey my ideas as I am not the best artist, and It would seem that instead of anyone who can do descent art saying I see what you mean but how about this because you are re-using footage.... It seems that people who are not doing the CGI are putting alot more effort and thought into this project and exploring more ideas with little or no visualising going on.

Thats how I feel about it frankly

Anyway with reference to the Vader Luke Duel on DSII...... Vader says "Obi-Wan has Taught you well" but Yoda has basically taught Luke much more atleast in this version so would it be worth inserting an audio clip of luke saying "Yoda" after this line to serve as a correction to Vader.... A bit more of a battle of words, and a revelation that Yoda was still alive atleast at the begining of the movie.

It bugged me when I did my re-cut but had not thought of it again until just now...

well if we can't re-use any footage you had better go back to the drawing board... on this begining because it aint working right at the momment... I wish I was a graphics wiz kid

DominicCobb said:

MrInsaneA said:

Getting from Dagobah too Tatooine isn't hard....just have the X-Wing and Millenium Falcon do a fly-by. Then cut to Lue, C-3PO and R2-D2.

Sorry if I missed something, but I thought the Emperor went in between Dagobah and Tatooine.

what do you plan to put in the gap where the falcon and luke part ways... If they did not part ways then luke would look stupid with "I'm coming too" think about that...

I said it before and I'll say it again

Some new opening....If it involves stealing the plans this would be great tie in to later on

Dagobah up until Ben & Luke

Vader DSII Only like the original

Delivering the plans to rebel fleet

Luke gets to Tattooine / Beggars Canyon / Looking for the falcon

Meditation chamber Vader contacts luke

Original Jabbas Palace run / sail barge / Leaving tattooine

Emperor goes DSII

Falcon gets to the fleet

Fixed and would have perfect pace

darth_ender said:

It's not so much the visuals as it is the story.  In my mind, the final shot on Dagobah would be Ben/Luke discussing that fun stuff, and the final line would be, "You must face Darth Vader again," moved from earlier.  To simply go from there to X-wing/Falcon flyby to Tatooine seems too abrupt.  It's the way TPM handled scene transitions, and if I could only fix one thing in that movie, that would probably be it; the movie feels rushed and we never feel like we're absorbing anything important from of any scenes.  Many fanedits seem to do the same thing, since it's far easier to remove elements from the original film than to add new ones.  Their edits result in the same feeling, and it doesn't allow for proper mood shifts in my mind.  I wouldn't want our ROTJ edit to end up the same way.

Well said that man!!!

that's what always ruins the illusion when things just happen too quick or you feel like but how did they get there so fast.... I got a big problem with ESB and Vader just popping out of nowhere on hoth it really pisses me off!!! I even did a rough mock up to show my idea and I've asked adywan to fix it and basically he said no :(

so I'm a little concerned

Angel said:

Ronster said:

The only problem my brain keeps coming up against is that we have 3 cuts away so if it starts with the original opening you cannot have the emperor to pad luke travelling to tattooine as you leave a gap when they leave tattoine. And I don't think you can open the movie with the meditation chamber....

Perhaps a better opening might be this... We see a star destroyer go overhead like all the other movies. We then cut to a bridge shot of Vader looking out the window and see either Endor or another planet and then cut away to surface of the planet Tantive attempting to escape. (Reversed footage of Organas landing and a flight shot on the surface atmosphere).

Back to the bridge and Vader "I want that ship!" Resume the Pursuit using footage of 1st shot of ROTS composited Tantive but in space and not the one in a new hope, but re-use the footage for the capture of the tantive suicide destruction and escape pods. basically finish it off there atleast that would feel much different from ANH somewhat? I dunno Could cut this down further and make it more ambiguous.....

No reused footage. Lightning, quality and vader's suit change all the time. Always something from scratch unless other movies can provide altered footage for desired shots.

-Angel

I guess you are referring to the black levels on Vader.... Hmmm, you really making this tough for me but I get what you are saying no re-used footage, but how then? can you CGI a Tantive? and make it look like a model or another ship perhaps... I think you should tell us what we can or cannot do to make this or somthing else like it work, would it really hurt to use a little bit again?

MrInsaneA said:

Ronster said:

@Darth_Ender.... It seems the main problems we have are:

1. The Opening - How should it start?

2. Bobba Fett

3. Space Battle - Visualizing what to do and where do we put it?

4. Lando - Live or die no inbetween

so addressing the first point we need to come up with somthing, perhaps Angel or Anlanfae could visualise somthing.

the second it would seem it either we have him fly away or harder route kill him off... The clincher is what to do about Han hitting the Jet pack is that particular shot able to either remove Han / move him over to the right a bit. I don't think having him fly out of the sarlac works because what will you do with him after that?

the third point is definatly one for the graphics team, I don't think that we should try to overdo it but somthing a little extra would be nice here and there

fourth as for Lando it seems more than likely we should just keep it as the original has anyone anyway changed their minds after my attempt at trying to show this. I don't know what to think myself about it but gave it a basic try anyway.

Essentially there is not too many differences this is the main bulk of indecision.

I am actually surprised about the majority NO on luke not telling Leia she is his Sister.... I thought this was my best idea, please watch the whole of my last cut on the previous page to see that all that it entails is a few cuts here and there she is lukes sister she just does not know it. Luke knows it / Vader knows it / Obi-wan tells Luke and also if you remeber he tells Luke to keep it a secret. It made perfect sense to me but anyway if I could not persuade you guys on that one nevermind.....

I'm pretty sure it's pretty clear cut what people want as far as sequence of events go at the start of the movie (Death Star II, then Dagobah, then Tattooine.) the main issue I think is whether to include Vader communicating with Luke on the Executor. IMO this should be after Vader arrives on the Death Star as originally planned. He goes to his meditation chamber, and mentally contacts Luke on Dagobah. 

Boba Fett....that's a tough one. I think if we can do more things with him and his death, we should. If we can't, at least have Han PURPOSELY hit him into the Sarlaac. But I'm really against his non-inclusion.

And Lando needs to live. Lando dying wouldn't be tragic so much as it would be anti-climactic. Plus the Falcon flying away from the exploding Death Star is one of the most iconic scenes in ROTJ.

Anyways, that's just my opinion. 

The only problem my brain keeps coming up against is that we have 3 cuts away so if it starts with the original opening you cannot have the emperor to pad luke travelling to tattooine as you leave a gap when they leave tattoine. And I don't think you can open the movie with the meditation chamber....

Perhaps a better opening might be this... We see a star destroyer go overhead like all the other movies. We then cut to a bridge shot of Vader looking out the window and see either Endor or another planet and then cut away to surface of the planet Tantive attempting to escape. (Reversed footage of Organas landing and a flight shot on the surface atmosphere).

Back to the bridge and Vader "I want that ship!" Resume the Pursuit using footage of 1st shot of ROTS composited Tantive but in space and not the one in a new hope, but re-use the footage for the capture of the tantive suicide destruction and escape pods. basically finish it off there atleast that would feel much different from ANH somewhat? I dunno Could cut this down further and make it more ambiguous.....

@Darth_Ender.... It seems the main problems we have are:

1. The Opening - How should it start?

2. Bobba Fett

3. Space Battle - Visualizing what to do and where do we put it?

4. Lando - Live or die no inbetween

so addressing the first point we need to come up with somthing, perhaps Angel or Anlanfae could visualise somthing.

the second it would seem it either we have him fly away or harder route kill him off... The clincher is what to do about Han hitting the Jet pack is that particular shot able to either remove Han / move him over to the right a bit. I don't think having him fly out of the sarlac works because what will you do with him after that?

the third point is definatly one for the graphics team, I don't think that we should try to overdo it but somthing a little extra would be nice here and there

fourth as for Lando it seems more than likely we should just keep it as the original has anyone anyway changed their minds after my attempt at trying to show this. I don't know what to think myself about it but gave it a basic try anyway.

Essentially there is not too many differences this is the main bulk of indecision.

I am actually surprised about the majority NO on luke not telling Leia she is his Sister.... I thought this was my best idea, please watch the whole of my last cut on the previous page to see that all that it entails is a few cuts here and there she is lukes sister she just does not know it. Luke knows it / Vader knows it / Obi-wan tells Luke and also if you remeber he tells Luke to keep it a secret. It made perfect sense to me but anyway if I could not persuade you guys on that one nevermind.....

Great Work Darth_Ender!

Most ideas outright win which keeps things simple for direction and is nice to see how all the ideas fayred up.... Interesting way to look at it now it's all on paper.

Had a bit of a bad day yesterday as had a row with my landlord and am getting evicted from my flat soon but anyway I re-did my rough-cut to take my mind off things, and improved alot and tried some new ideas it is mostly structure, so even if anything I did in it like Lando getting blown up which got voted against you can now see how it might of looked... I actually pulled it off resonably well with what I am working with bit of a fluke but anyway here are the main changes and link.

http://www.mediafire.com/?286b58g9cda2gvb

41m 28s

1. Trimmed Luke & Leia + Father & Son Vader flashback on Endor.... The idea is to show anger and anguish, and the glass cracking behind as he stares toward the camera this him using the force and will be a cgi shot for that... To show Vader is boiling over inside, not sure if people will like this idea but I gave it a go none the less.

2. Madine dies my way

3.Restructured so that Shield generator now is destroyed before the executor crashes and this is lukes exit point. Padded the bunker with prision cell block footage ANH and vaders death

4.Change Ackbars lines to "the Shield it down! concentrate all firepower.... we need to give those fighters more time"

5. Cut lots of silly Ewok

6. Millennium falcon is destryed you need to imagine it's in flames while it flys towrds the fleet and the DSII blows up but after that it is quite a blissful yet sad momment. Princess Leia Theme added.

7. quite a few other subtle changes, bit more streamlined,. but inclusion of Darth Enders Shield generator hot-wire into base and possible fix to the smoke and lasers everywhere comment.

I hope you give it a try or even a flick through, I'm quite happy with it, I would like to add more to it like space battle ideas but not right now, the main thing was getting it correct to flow properly as Darth_Ender did point out a pretty big failing that I had things a bit the wrong way round.

Hope you Enjoy it :)

It's a Ringlefinch....

sorry thought you were trolling, can see that you voted and  you want everyone to vote, now I see what you mean... Only half the votes are in...

Well I do not see a problem granting a few days extension but then that is a bit weak, if they did not vote then really it's their problem but I hope they vote too!

I also thought it was too early to vote but then whatever just go with the flow