RogueLeader

That was sort of my train of thought as well.

Maybe instead of using any radio shots, you could just have Kylo looking up, the eye close up, etc., and a shorter line from Palpatine. Just a brief, “Find me…” that could sounds like a whisper in the wind.

Again, this isn’t against the work you’ve already done. I think it looks great. This is just constructive criticism on the idea in general!

Well, it wouldn’t hurt to at least compare them and see how they feel, if it isn’t too much trouble for Poppa. I also like the Rey and Kylo interaction, but I don’t like the reuse of Kylo’s reaction shots.

Honestly I think it would make more sense to introduce her as a new side/main character in the Rebels sequel. If it is a direct sequel to Rebels, following Sabine and Ahsoka’s quest to find Ezra, maybe she could come along on the journey.

Personally I would love a more general post-ROTJ series that brings in vibes of the popular post-Endor EU stories. It could be a perfect way to show the further adventures of Luke, Han and Leia, and their story could converge with that of Ezra, Sabine, Ahsoka and Thrawn.

I mentioned this in an edit thread I think (or here?), that it would’ve been interesting if the Hero Saber had some kind of effect on it. Maybe it could pulsate or oscillate regularly, which would’ve played nicely in opposition to Kylo’s unstable blade.

“acknowledgement of the shadow must be a continuous process throughout one’s life”

I wasn’t super crazy about them bringing back Kylo Ren’s helmet in this film (although I really dig the cracked look), it actually might end up being a godsend for us to play with Kylo’s dialogue and chracter motivation for the first two acts of the film.

I still am not 100% sure what will be doable until the home release, but I am curious about how far we can change Kylo Ren’s motivations in TROS. Kylo’s whole, “We both have darkness, join me on the dark side” is arguably pretty basic and not really a fresh idea, and I wonder if we can make it more interesting.

What if, instead of just wanting Rey to join him on the dark side of the Force, he wants to prevent Rey from finding Exogol and trying to kill Palpatine? After realizing how Palpatine has been manipulating him all these years, he wants to prevent Rey from having the same fate. Kylo may have also seen this vision of Dark Rey, but instead of it appealing to him like he thought, he realizes he doesn’t want Rey to share his fate.

For example, maybe we can change the line, “You can’t go back to her [Leia], just like I can’t” to, “You can go back to her, but I can’t” (This is an unmasked line but maybe it could still be altered naturally)

So the dilemma for Rey is that she feels that her role as the last Jedi means she has to face Palpatine, the last Sith, and kill him. But Kylo Ren is preventing that, so he is another obstacle that she must face to fulfill her destiny. Maybe Palpatine’s motivation could be changed to, “Bring me the last Jedi, and I will give you the fleet.” Maybe Palpatine’s plan from the beginning is to get them both in front of them to drain their life force. But instead of bringing Rey to him, Kylo tries to prevent her from finding a way there.

I think this might also help make Kylo seem a little more intelligent than he is in the theatrical. Even though Kylo doesn’t want to kill Rey, like Palpatine told him, it appears like he is still doing what Palpatine wants. In this version, it might seem like Kylo Ren is already suspicious of the extent of Palpatine’s power and him potentially being able to possess others, which is why he doesn’t immediately kill him when they meet. He wants to figure out how he can outsmart Palpatine, but if Rey finds the other Wayfinder she would be falling into his trap. So instead of saying, “The only way you’ll reach Palpatine is through me”, he just destroys the Wayfinder.

I guess part of my motivation to pursue this idea is that some people felt Kylo’s turn to the light felt rather sudden. Even ROTJ makes Vader appear rather sad and regretful when speaking to Luke, “It is too late for me, son”, which sets up his turn later in the film. Having Kylo not wanting Rey to follow the same fate as he did might help make his character more sympathetic and three-dimensional, as well as make their final kiss more natural, since Kylo/Ben was trying to protect her the whole film.

Bonus thought: I found an Adam Driver line from This is Where I Leave You where he says to Tina Fey’s character, “You’re the voice in my head.” I feel like this would be an interesting thing for him to say to Rey, since it would play well against Palpatine telling him he has been every voice he’s ever heard inside his head. Him saying something like this would be like him rejecting the destiny the Emperor’s has tried make him for one that involves Rey, which would parallel Rey’s own journey to forge her own destiny. I guess what I’m trying to say is that all this would help make Kylo/Ben more actively pursuing his own motivations instead of anyone else’s.

A great idea for a fan edit, DigMod!

I definitely think it was a weird decision that after TLJ broke the saber in two, that JJ decided to just repair it offscreen rather than allow Rey to build a new saber from it. I thought for sure she would build a double-bladed lightsaber using the two crystals.

Regarding what idir was saying about Snoke, I could picture something added in the shot where the saber flies toward Rey and she grabs it, and Snoke’s torso falling over. Maybe when his upper body tumbles over, a whiff of that blue smoke/flame could waft up and then disappear. I think the throne is out of focus during that moment, so it would still be subtle. I guess the idea is that a part of Palpatine’s essence was inside Snoke, controlling him.

poppasketti said:

I LOVE this idea! A simple “Finn” whisper by Rey is so simple and elegant. The only thing I wonder is does this set up the expectations for better payoff than we got in TROS? Hopefully the deleted scenes will help!

I already have some ideas on how we could provide some payoff to that subplot if we need to do it ourselves, but hopefully we get another deleted scene related to that. Dom mentioned awhile back that he imagined there being a cut scene where Poe is like, “You love Rey, don’t you?” and Finn responding, “No, I have the Force.” and then Poe looking a little relieve, paralleling the jealous Han ROTJ subplot. It probably doesn’t exist but that would’ve been a great little scene.

Cool find, I love the Sith whispers!

Well I think you’ve done a solid job so far making it feel like it could’ve been a part of the movie. I agree a lot with jarbear’s last post regarding it. In order to not reuse those shots of Ben looking up, just cut his and Rey’s last interaction, that way you can just use it for his reaction to the radio. I also think making it briefer, and just having it say, “Find me…”, or perhaps, “The time has come… find me…” might have a more subtle touch. And like jarbear said, having the dialogue somewhat distorted could lend to some mystery regarding who exactly is sending the mystery. Your hypothetical first time viewer might be pretty sure it is Palpatine, but still enough room is open for speculation.

Which goes to show Rey Nobody would’ve been a lot less coincidental!

Really his motivations change once.

He is manipulating both Rey and Ben to see who will come out on top. I don’t think he cares if Rey is his biological grandchild. Whoever kills who, whether it be Ben or Rey, will make for a stronger vessel. Once Ben turns to the light, he focuses on Rey and tells her what she wants to hear, “I never wanted you dead.” That’s what he’s always done, lie and manipulate.

But once Ben and Rey are together, he realizes how strong they are together and decides to revitalize himself. I think he would have preferred a newer, healthier body, but healing his own body will suffice.

But that’s just my take.

Speaking of foreshadowing story elements for TROS in TLJ, have you considered trying to foreshadow Finn being Force-senstive at all? I think it would be difficult to remove the implication from TROS, but I don’t really know where in TLJ you could put hints to that. Maybe before he wakes up, he could hear Force whispers like Rey, or hear an echo of Rey saying “Finn”, which is why he wakes up saying “Rey!” It would also parallel the “Luke.” “Leia!” interaction later on in the film between the siblings.

poppasketti said:

Here’s another pass of the radio scene, with updated work on the radio fx, addressing the kind of things Axios pointed out. It’s still yellowish, and if that stands out we can try white!
https://vimeo.com/382209243
PW: fanedit

And here’s a first pass of the cave Sith whispers with a first pass effort for a subtle hood moment as the two shadows merge into one.
https://vimeo.com/382695905
PW: fanedit

Hal was also kind enough to share his work on the Palpatine laugh during the Luke/Kylo flashback, so we now have teases at 1:08 (sith cave whispers), 1:12 (Luke/Kylo flashback), and 2:10 (radio scene). I’m thinking DZ-330 might be right about having something earlier in the film around the time she is first drawn to the dark side cave. I’m thinking since this pairs with her later cave scene, another sith whisper might be appropriate.

Thank you all for your helpful feedback!

These are well done! I still think it is funny that Palpatine is contacting him by radio, of all things, but the fx and music choices feel really seamless!

I love the Sith chants in the cave. What was your source for them? If this had been in the theatrical film it probably would’ve made me think Palpatine created her, like an anti-Chosen One. I like it. I think I noticed the hood during the two figures merging but it is definitely subtle. I don’t think one would notice the difference.

That is an interesting though. I suppose you could think of Episode I as a prologue and Episode IX as an epilogue to the whole story.

I would be interested in hearing what you were sort of hoping to see in IX, Dre.

Wanted to share some thoughts on adding to the role of the Knights of Ren in the trilogy.

What if you could somehow alter the rainy scene from Rey’s forceback to imply it is the Jedi massacre? Maybe change the guy with the bowl hat’s staff into a lightsaber. And insert the burning temple in the background. Although Kylo had not yet made his red lightsaber or had his Kylo look by that point, it could just explained by vision symbolism. (Or you could cover Kylo with a new character, hooded with face unseen holding Ben’s blue lightsaber. Implying it is Ben that same night.)

This gets into a whole other topic regarding the massacre and the different ways it could have went. I know the Rise of Kylo Ren comic has backstory on the temple massacre and the Knights of Ren, but I’m ignoring that because destroying the temple with a random Force storm feels like such a wasted opportunity.
There’s two ways I like to imagine how it went:

1. The Knights are Sith cultists who were planning to help Ben Solo destroy the temple the night Luke looked into Ben’s mind. He basically saw what they were planning to do. Maybe Ben was on the fence about going through with it, but waking up to Luke holding up his lightsaber forced him to make a choice.
2. The Knights are the other students Luke mentioned that left with Ben. Maybe there were already Team Luke and Team Ben camps forming among the Jedi students, and when it looked like Ben had killed Luke, the Jedi began fighting each other and Team Ben came out alive.

While I like both, especially option 2, I think you would have to create new footage to try to get option 2 across, especially since you would have to explain why the Knights no longer use lightsabers. This leads me to think Luke saying that Ben left “with a handful of his students” should be cut from TLJ. Maybe you could give the Knights dialogue to help get either option across in TROS when they show up.

If you implied the Knights just helped Ben attack the Temple that night, maybe you could create a shot where the Knights are looking at the temple from a distance, and it could be placed in a flashback somewhere. You could possibly insert it after that establishing shot of the temple in Luke’s first TLJ flashback, but before it cuts inside the hut. You could take the shot from TROS of the Knights peaking around the rocks looking at Chewbacca, but change the background and regrade it to match that location. You could possibly add a light rain effect to that establishing shot to help connect it with the Force vision, or simply distant thunder of an approaching storm.

This would add a few benefits. One, the Knights of Ren would now appear in all three films (even if it is brief) and gives us an idea of their relevance to the story. Two, if Luke realized there was a predmeditated attack on the temple that night, and Ben was in on that plan, it would make Luke’s anger more understandable. It isn’t just a hypothetical dark future, but a danger right on his doorstep. While Ben perhaps had not made up his mind yet, it appears to Luke that he was in the midst of betraying him.
Three, having another group kill the Jedi, or help Ben kill the Jedi, might help make Ben more sympathetic, that maybe he was pressured into those actions by the Knights of Ren and Snoke, and did not kill the other Jedi alone, or at all.

Apparently in the comics a Force storm destroys the temple and kills most of the Jedi, but I think that is dumb. If Snoke could destroy Luke’s temple and students with a Force storm, why did he need a planet killing device to destroy Luke on Ach-To?

During Luke’s first flashback, he says, “When I came to, the temple was burning. He had vanished with a handful of my students, and slaughtered the rest.”

Maybe the line could be changed to, “He had vanished, and slaughtered the/my students.” I don’t think Luke ever says anything about the Knights of Ren directly.

Maybe you could still imply the Knights of Ren are the other students (maybe one or all of them already secretly work for Snoke), and give them dialogue into TROS to imply that, but some people might find it weird that they’re fallen Jedi, but Kylo is the only one who uses a lightsaber. Maybe Kylo was the only one out of that group who had completed their training and built their own lightsaber, or maybe Luke’s Jedi didn’t all use lightsabers.

If you went with that angle, maybe you could have Luke say, “He had vanished with a handful of my students, and [they] slaughtered the rest.” Again, this just helps make Ben not solely responsible for the death of all the Jedi, as well as provide backstory for the Knights of Ren. The Forceback scene could be interpreted as an event of their past, but with their presents appearances. Basically, the night their new identities were born.

Then again, if they are Luke’s formers students that sided with Ben that night, why doesn’t Ben try to turn them back after he switches sides? Maybe dialogue could be added that shows their minds won’t be changed. Or, they can reveal that they were working for Snoke the whole time.

I’m still not sure. There are a lot of ways you could do it. I’d be interested to hear what you guys might do with them.

That’s a good idea! Do we know if he ever says something similar to that?

I can agree with that. Since the crystal was broken in half, it would’ve been interesting if the lightsaber at least had a unique effect, like Kylo’s saber, or even a different color but the same hilt. I think someone said the Visual Dictionary mentions that Rey “healed” the crystal, and I can understand how having Ben using the lightsaber after he is redeemed hold some thematic weight, but I think it the blade having a noticeable difference would’ve been more interesting for the audience visually.

If the source is hypothetically legit and has some position within Lucasfilm or Bad Robot, it is possible that these are things they’ve heard from coworkers. Like, “Susan was in a meeting with JJ and she told Keith who then told me.” Studio gossip isn’t unheard of me, but it definitely muddies the water of what is and isn’t true.

No worries, I didn’t think you were attacking his credibility. I came back here to post that after I realized who made the post on reddit.

The whole Disney trying to undermine WB through JJ and Star Wars does sound pretty bonkers. At first I just felt like writing this off as another 4chan-like “leak”, but it coming from egoshoppe makes me pause a little. Honestly my primary thought is “what the hell is going on”. This is all very weird.

I didn’t notice who posted that thread originally, but I actually spoken to u/egoshoppe a few times on reddit. He actually has an account on here (egosheep, I believe). While I’ve disagreed with him on things before, as long as I’ve kept up with his comments and posts he has always tried to back up what he says with actual sources, like interviews or articles.

I can’t speak to the validity of his source, but I don’t think egoshoppe would have posted this if he didn’t think there was some truth to it. It is possible he has become a troll, but that would be pretty surprising to me honestly. And it is also possible his source is just feeding him what he wants to hear. It’s hard to say. But my interactions with egoshoppe have always been positive regardless whether or not we were disagreeing about something, because he seems he just wants to understand what happened behind the scenes of the Sequel Trilogy.

I still am going to not take this as the truth until more proof is provided, but if it isn’t true, either Ego has changed a lot or his source is just a troll. Hopefully this will be validated or debunked eventually.

Yeah, I think the hooded spectators were just regular people who worshipped the Sith.

I’m not saying none of that is true, it could be, but you know social media and clickbait articles are going to run with this as the truth without it ever being verified.