RogueLeader

For those curious, I gave my two cents on the deleted scene/dice idea over on the Redux thread.

https://originaltrilogy.com/topic/Star-Wars-The-Rise-Of-Skywalker-Redux-Ideas-thread/id/71460/page/152#1414568

From a convo over at Hal’s thread regarding adding the “Kylo Searching the Falcon” deleted scene from TFA into TROS.

NeverarGreat said:

I don’t think it would be practical, but I’m all for someone removing the timecodes and attempting to include the Falcon deleted scene in this movie…for totally selfless reasons of course 😉

Using the Falcon scene for this movie just seems really impractical. I don’t see how you could edit that scene in a way that isn’t blatantly apparent that it’s a fan edit. Kylo just looks totally different than his appearance in the rest of TROS, not to mention the snow-covered windows and other changes you would need to make. You could say that he wears a hood or whatever, but we never seem him wear a hood at any other part of the film, so it would just come off as confusing to the audience, imo.

Plus, as Hal sort of mentioned, Luke was the last person we saw with the dice (on the Falcon), and we don’t know if he put them back or kept them.

BUT, if you were to try to implement the dice into TROS, this is how I think would be the simplest, and most natural way, to do it.

First, I would take the final shot from Solo, the insert shot of the dice hanging while the Falcon is in hyperspace, and insert it somewhere early in the film to establish that the dice are in the Falcon. Maybe during the lightspeed skipping sequence, or just somewhere during that first scene with Finn and Poe.

Second, after we see the Falcon hauled onto the Star Destroyer (or when Palpatine communes with Kylo in the hallway), I would literally only use the insert shot of Luke’s gloved hand taking the dice, but recolor it to make it black (like Kylo’s glove). I just don’t think any of the shots from the deleted scenes would really fit, or would be really necessary. Leave some room for ambiguity.

Finally, when Kylo is moping on the Death Star ruins, you could reutilize Kylo holding the dice to show he does indeed have them, and is thinking of his father (if you can get it to work). Then that would lead straight into the “memory” of Han.

So, literally three shots, max. I think this makes the implementation of this idea unobtrusive and not stick out as an obvious fan edit change.

Shit, that would be actually funny.

And maybe he wants to finish what George started by destroying all remaining copies of GOUT, which would be the “sacred Jedi texts” on Ahch-To.

Movies Remastered said:

RogueLeader said:

poppasketti said:

Shaddy Zaphod said:

I think “fanboys who can’t let go” is the opposite of this. The fact that this is all in-service of a community effort to turn something they didn’t like into something they do (or, well, tolerate) purely for the sake of their own personal enjoyment is inspiring.

Agreed. I think RL and I were just having a little fun. If we didn’t agree with you, none of us would be here! Although it is becoming clearer that many of us our losing our minds. Maybe one day when I can stop wiping down bags of potato chips with lysol, things will be in better perspective.

No, I was serious…

Haha, not really, but after all of these years sometimes I do ask myself what the point is in all of this effort. But it is just like any other hobby, really. We do it because we enjoy it. And it is nice to hear the positive perspectives!

Anyway, I think I’ll get started on the puppets this weekend. Whenever I get to filming, I think I’ll film the puppets separately, which will make it easier for editors to place and time them however they please.

That would be awesome, dude. Are you gonna film them on greenscreen? Honestly can’t wait to see what you make 😄

Yes, so editors should be able to key them out rather simply!

poppasketti said:

Shaddy Zaphod said:

I think “fanboys who can’t let go” is the opposite of this. The fact that this is all in-service of a community effort to turn something they didn’t like into something they do (or, well, tolerate) purely for the sake of their own personal enjoyment is inspiring.

Agreed. I think RL and I were just having a little fun. If we didn’t agree with you, none of us would be here! Although it is becoming clearer that many of us our losing our minds. Maybe one day when I can stop wiping down bags of potato chips with lysol, things will be in better perspective.

No, I was serious…

Haha, not really, but after all of these years sometimes I do ask myself what the point is in all of this effort. But it is just like any other hobby, really. We do it because we enjoy it. And it is nice to hear the positive perspectives!

Anyway, I think I’ll get started on the puppets this weekend. Whenever I get to filming, I think I’ll film the puppets separately, which will make it easier for editors to place and time them however they please.

My proposed title:

The Rise of Fan-Editors: Underground Artists, or Fanboys Who Can’t Let Go?

TestingOutTheTest said:

@RogueLeader Because I’m clearing up misconceptions regarding TRoS and its so-called “effects” on TFA & TLJ and you guys seem to act as if you can’t infer things from TRoS and the prequels?

Wasn’t directed at you, man.

Reading this thread is exhausting. Why are we doing this to ourselves?

I think Palpatine preferred just taking a new host, whether it be Rey and Kylo. He asked Kylo to kill her, and he figured whoever survived the encounter would be the most worthy host.

I guess the Dyad thing doesn’t necessarily equate to the rising and falling of the dark side and the light that we see personified by the Jedi Order, then Vader/Palpatine, then Luke, then Kylo, then Rey. Somehow, Kylo realized they were a Dyad offscreen at some point independent of Snoke, and Palpatine didn’t realize their connection was a “Dyad”-level connection until they were together.

It’s just dumb because the Dyad is never really explained outside of what Palpatine says at the very end of the film. We don’t even learn how Kylo knows they’re a dyad. I would almost suggest cutting the term to just not add to the confusion, but I feel like that specialness is necessary to explain how Palpatine can just drink Rey and Kylo’s Dyad Milkshake and get that Sith sugar rush.

Jarbear, I didn’t really take it as one bad guy rises, another good guy rises. I just took it as an interpretation of the way peace and conflict wane and wax naturally overtime. Darkness rises, and light to meet it.

I don’t think I notice it.

You could replace R2 with BB-8 perhaps! I do feel like not having 3PO fire it is a bit of a missed opportunity.

Too bad it isn’t R2, though. Maybe you could’ve made an aggressive negotiations joke. I like the idea of 3PO trying to follow his baseline programming, and perhaps try and negotiate for Chewbacca’s release or something.

I see what you’re saying, but I think it could complicate things and detract from the impact of what Luke did in TLJ specifically. Plus, we don’t have a lot of time to
play with either.

Brewzter said:

RogueLeader said:

It could be along the lines of the theory that Palpatine/Plagueis inadvertently created Anakin/the Chosen One. They thought they could use him, but in the end it was their undoing.

The story group has come out and disproved this many times:

https://imgur.com/a/nwqxEzX

I think the whole Chosen One thing is dumb anyway, but the Plagueis novel (I know it isn’t canon) didn’t imply Plagueis or Palpatine made Anakin, but that Plagueis’ experiments with the dark side made the Force create Anakin as a reaction. So it never implied they actually made Anakin, but them toying with the dark side led the Force to counterbalance their growing power, thus creating the Chosen One. That was the comparison I was trying to make, not that Palpatine literally made Anakin.

EDIT: Also, in earlier drafts of ROTS, Palpatine did claim to have created Anakin in a sense. Clearly George considered the idea. I mean, we never get an explanation for Anakin’s virgin birth, and then later Palpatine said his master had the power to create life. This was clearly meant to be connected at one point before George changed his mind. While I’m glad George didn’t include it, I don’t really blame anyone for drawing that conclusion. I mean, who didn’t consider it when Palpatine said the “create life” line?

It’s all really silly regardless.

It could be along the lines of the theory that Palpatine/Plagueis inadvertently created Anakin/the Chosen One. They thought they could use him, but in the end it was their undoing.

Maybe Snoke did bridge their minds, which inadvertently solidified their bond and made them become a Dyad in the Force. So Snoke/Palpatine’s own machinations led to their undoing once again. I mean, we basically get that theme already since Palpatine indirectly made Rey by having a child of his own.

Regarding the Palpatine Clone stuff, for the sake of clarity, I think the clones are fine the way they are.

But, the whole thing is sort of confusing when you think about it. If we’re going with “Shriveled Palpatine is his true form”, I would assume he became shriveled and had to mask his true appearance because the dark side (or the Sith spirit that possesses him) corrupted his physical form. So, if those are simply clones of Sheev Palpatine, then it wouldn’t make sense that the clones are shriveled, because it was the actual possession, or just the long-term corruption of the dark side, that gave him his monstrous appearance. Perhaps you could say it is a side effect of the “dark science” or “Sith magic” they’re using to make the clones.

On the other hand, for most of TROS, Palpatine appears to be just a decayed version of his Sheev Palpatine form, and he doesn’t look like monstrous Sidious until after he sucks up the Dyad like a milkshake. Maybe you could argue he was masking his true form to make himself look more weak and decrepit, appearing as an easier target for his soon-to-be new host.

It’s all a mess, honestly. And I think we should save ourselves the work and leave it as-is.

Agreed!

theprequelsrule said:

SparkySywer said:

I’ve never played KOTOR 2. Only KOTOR 1.

You should! Don’t forget to install the restored content mod! https://deadlystream.com/files/file/578-tsl-restored-content-mod/

Thanks for sharing! I think I’m gonna get a new PC soon, so it might be finally time to give this a go.

I know TLJ isn’t perfect, but I think the way it handled Luke felt very mythological to me.

I like to imagine an alternate reality where instead of George making a Star Wars trilogy, he adapted the legend of King Arthur into a trilogy. The trilogy ends with a happy ending, like ROTJ did. I guess Arthur becomes King, brings piece to Britain, and marries Guinevere. Something like that. A very typical fantasy, Happily Ever After, kind of story.

Now, obviously people would know what to expect if they know the text, but imagine most audiences didn’t, and they concluded the Arthur story decades later in another series of movies. Guinevere has a affair with Lancelot, Arthur hears a prophecy about a child born that would be the undoing of everything he loves, so he orders all babies born that day to be killed (What??? That’s so out-of-character for Arthur.), and eventually his own nephew Mordred, who survived the massacre, grows up to betray him, bring his kingdom to ruin, and Arthur fights him to the death. And the story ends with Camelot and the Round Table in ruins. I could imagine people saying, “Wow, I can’t believe they made Arthur sequels only to ruin their happy ending!”

I mean, Star Wars doesn’t have to be King Arthur, and doesn’t have to follow the same story beats, but the family tragedy that permeates the sequel trilogy definitely makes it feels more mythic to me. Even the stories of old didn’t make Arthur sinless, and I’m personally glad the Sequel Trilogy didn’t make Luke sinless either. I guess I relate to that, having made a lot of mistakes myself, but I understand others don’t.

It’s not the same spot. The sunrise being to the right of the homestead in both shots is confusing you, but the Lars homestead looks similar from different angles, so I can understand why it would be sort of misleading.

If you look at the shot where Rey says, “I’m Rey”, the camera is basically pointing in the same direction as the iconic binary sunset shot in A New Hope. And the suns are rising somewhere in the direction Rey is facing. It’s just that the camera all of the sun setting/rising shots are placed in a way where the homestead is placed left of frame. That doesn’t mean the suns are rising/setting in the same spot.

TestingOutTheTest said:

sherlockpotter said:

Huh, I just re-watched the scene and you’re right, the sun is just peeking over the horizon at that moment. So, at what time of day does the scene actually take place? I guess it’s right before sunset?

Granted, the two suns are only visible in one shot in TLJ; every other time, it seems like a uniform light source. I honestly thought it was just a clever metaphor until I looked it up just now. If more effort wants to go into coloring that scene, I guess it should just be about what feels most natural, rather than trying to chart two different stars across the sky.

Two, actually. The establishing shot of the sunrise before we cut to Rey awakening, and Luke’s final moment.

Went back to check this, and there is definitely just one sun in that shot.

Could you open link sharing?

Shit, this is a great idea. Hire one of those Vader impersonators.

Yes! I think the placement there works a lot better.

Should the Luke puppet be made of string and wires, like that Proof of Concept image, or made of the same material as the fire and walker? Right now I’m just planning to replicate that look, but I’m still deciding on Luke’s design.

So then maybe what Faraday described might be the best bet? Where Luke makes fire or a red bolt fly back and hit the walker, making it fall below stage. That seems like a simple, easy to convey action. And you wouldn’t have to extend the shot at all I don’t think.