I think the person they were speaking to on the comm says, “Rogue One?! There is no Rogue One!”
And at the end of the movie, Admiral Raddus says, “May the Force be with you, Rogue One.” Or something like that.
-When that pilot defector mentions the call sign “Rogue One”, roll out the Star Wars credits briefly.
Building off of this, you could roll out the credits or title card for shorter increments each time someone says “Rogue One”.
I think there are two potential ways to fix this apparent continuity issue regarding the Tantive IV receiving a physical copy of the plans or having it “beamed” onboard as Vader words it in ANH.
Honestly, a simple solution would be to remove the final two shots of Vader watching the Tantive IV undocking from the Rebel flagship. Not showing Vader see the Tantive IV might help alleviate the glaring obviousness of it clearly being a rebel ship and not a diplomatic one. Even though the Rogue One novelization says Vader notices the plans being handed off from rebel to rebel, I prefer to believe he was too focused on slaughtering them all to spot this trade off, which explains why he isn’t sure if the plans were beamed to the Tantive IV or the Rebel flagship or both. I can buy that, but seeing Vader sit there as Leia and Captain Antilles lie straight to his face about being a diplomatic ship when he literally just saw the ship flee the battlefield pushes it.
A more difficult solution would be to cut it in such a way that the person downloading the plans appears to be at the end of the hall, but instead, transmitting the plans to the Tantive IV. So Vader is charging down the hall to stop the plans from being transmitted. Maybe someone could generate a shot of the Tantive IV in the distance of the battle, or back and forth comm chatter between the two ships. The only issue would be explaining why soldiers wearing Alderaanian garb were on a Mon Calamari cruiser, and the coincidence that they just so happen to be transmitting to an Alderaanian ship.
This might be a hard change to make, and I’m okay with believing Antilles and Leia were playing with technicalities since no transmissions were actually beamed onto the ship, like Vader insisted. I think just not showing Vader actually see the Tantive IV would help this issue. But I’d be interested in seeing it if someone thought they could do it.
I’ve been running around lot this summer and my input on the edit the past few months has been sporadic at best, but I just wanted to chime in and give a big thanks to everyone who shared their ideas and contributed to this edit on both creative and technical levels. Especially a big thanks to Hal for all of your hard work to make this happen and becoming the unspoken leader of this project. I know there may have been times where you almost pulled your hair out from frustration, but I think this is a really great example of not only fan editing but how the fan editing community can come together to collaborate on something we all have a passion for.
I also respect you for being so humble and, for example, having Sherman change the credits on the box cover from just your name to crediting it as a collaboration despite doing the bulk of the work. You could have not said anything and left it as is but you didn’t. That is cool of you.
Also, Sherman, that box cover is perfect. Great job.
Something just like the Starkiller Edit/Restructure might make the focus of the edit a little clearer.
I do think the Lone Star Edition is fine though, even though it makes me think of Spaceballs a little (not necessarily a bad thing!).
I was going to suggest “The Starkiller Shift” but it sounds more like a maneuver or dance move rather than an edit name.
I actually was messing around with inserting that! It helps get more perspective on Kylo’s conflict. I trimmed it down a lot in order to not repeat the same shots too much, and I didn’t like his delivery on some of the lines. I’m worried it can’t be inserted without it being obvious, you know?
I at least considered the idea of making them having a longer conversation, especially if one were to remove the Han Solo reveal. It could go something like this:
Snoke: There has been an awakening. Have you felt it?
Kylo: (“Yes.”, or, “I feel it too.”) The dark side.
Snoke: -and the Light.
Kylo: Supreme Leader, I’m immune to the light.
Snoke: Even you, master of the Knights of Ren, have never faced such a test.
Kylo: By the grace of your training I will not be seduced
Snoke: We shall see. We shall see…
I got the dark side line from Lor San Tekka conversation. I feel it too could come from the Rey interrogation. Snoke, the Light line from the first teaser. I got the “I’m immune to the light” as a wav file the Kylo Ren action figure.
All of this isn’t really necessary, but this scene could provide something different from this scene, and not make it so short.
That test looks great Jack! I think that is definitely usable. I think they could be smaller/closer to the Star Destroyer, but I think it is good the way it is too. Any closer would be too close, but I like it now too!
Also Hal, about the “they’ve done it” line. I think it works that way, it’ll definitely do. I think we could still look for alternatives though just in case someone finds something better.
That is great! I had figured you had already done it. It was a very easy cut to do. We also need a good name for this “Hosnian destruction post-Han death” edit. Haha.
That looks really good. Telecine is very talented. Maybe a combination of the two, a happy medium, would be what we are looking for. Sort of like telecine’s, maybe they’re a little farther away, and then have the Star Destroyer in the distance like Jack’s?
Totally agree. I was thinking that “The Starkiller” track for that scene could be replaced with some part of the First Order suite, but like you said, something that is low-key. I’ll have to go back through the soundtrack, but you guys already might have better ideas than I have!
I guess it could go both ways. Well if you try it differently and it doesn’t work then I think your current version still works really well. It looks very believable already to me.
Thanks for the compliment Jack!
Yours is terrific as well. I wasn’t expecting anyone to do the fx so quickly! You probably should wait until you hear from Hal, but do you mind if I give my opinion?
I know that the TIEs and transports are flying overheard when Rey sees them, but I imagine that they flew low and are heading toward Maz’s castle, since Rey has ran a distance away from it herself. So by having then fly the same way over Maz’s head, it doesn’t seem like they’re flying toward the castle.
My suggestion would be to have them instead flying downwards from out of the Star Destroyer (which also looks perfect btw). In this scenario they would be much smaller, like a swarm of specs flying out of the Star Destroyer toward them. Also, them being farther away would explain why the patrons aren’t running for their lives just yet.
But yeah, I’d wait for Hal’s and few other opinions but that would be my suggestion. Either way though it looks great to me! A lot better than what I could do!
I think he meant during the resolution, when they return from the battle. Maybe I’m wrong but if that’s the case I see why you saw it that way, Hal.
Here is a short clip that cuts Poe’s dialogue about Hosnian Prime when Finn meets Leia.
https://vimeo.com/167980480
I also played around with the idea that R2 doesn’t have the map at all, and instead they get the larger piece from Captain Phasma at the same time they get her to lower the shields. You could also have Kylo tell Poe they have the rest of the map when he is interrogating him at the beginning of the movie. Although it would require more work to change that fact. But I think just adding a little hint of him waking up in the first scene could help make his awakening and possession of the map feel less out of nowhere, but I don’t even know if it is worth the effort. Extra expositional lines from 3PO could’ve been useful.
Maybe Luke will be Mr. Exposition and explain all this whole situation in Episode VIII, but for now R2 waking up at the perfect time without much explanation seems more like poor writing that has to be clarified later. I also thought that Luke magically woke up R2 because Rey showed up, or that R2 sensed Rey’s presence. But if Rey doesn’t turn out to be this special person then it will all just seem convenient for the plot. Without the trilogy over it is hard to say how much big edits could contradict the sequels, but for me, the one big change that is less likely to affect future movies but also have the biggest difference has to be moving Hosnian Prime’s destruction to the climax. Maybe after seeing 8 (and maybe 9), we’ll have a better understanding of what is and isn’t worth changing when it comes to this type of edit.
I don’t know if it could replace the original for me, I would like to see a version of the film that leaves the father/son reveal until the bridge scene just to see how different it would be. It’ll be interesting to see what different versions pop up.
I really enjoy your crawls topdawg! I like how you explain your intentions of emphasizing the whole political situation, and your understanding of it based off the dialogue is very observant. The only part I’m not sure of is if what Hux said about the New Republic supporting the Resistance is truth or propoganda, because it also seems that New Republic didn’t see the First Order as a threat and saw Leia as a paranoid warmonger. We definitely could’ve used a little more context in the movie, definitely agree with that.
Also really like your ROTJ crawl. It flows really well to me. This may be the wrong thread for this but would it start on Tatooine/Nal Varr sense the crawl ends on that note? Also, I think changing it to a Hutt world is an interesting idea. Would like to see how it could be executed.
Hal, sorry if you mentioned this already, but did you have any feelings on the R2 subplot with the map? I know a lot of people felt that it seemed more like weak storytelling. The whole logic of the map is confusing to me and I know the answer JJ gave for his late wake up feels like lazy writing to some. I know this has been discussed before but I’d appreciate anyone’s additional thoughts on it.
“Fearless RESISTANCE” sounds good Jack!
And thanks, Lord Haseo! I appreciate the compliment.
Totally agree with you Hal. It almost felt shoehorned in. This new weapon barely has introduction and then blows up planets that we have no real attachment to. I understand that the story’s focus wasn’t on Starkiller like the Death Star was in a New Hope, but barely having any introduction to it gives the audience no time to really accept it. So to me, on my first viewing, it felt more like a Death Star 3.0 nostalgia grab. The crawl would’ve been fine if the story was more focused on searching for Luke rather than having this Starkiller subplot.
Although I would’ve preferred them not going the doomsday weapon route a third time, I can understand the logic of it happening again. But, like many have mentioned, how the First Order managed to have the resources to build it is another question. That’s why I liked the idea of it being an ancient machine that they rediscovered, maybe with the help of Snoke. It could even have been a Star Forge-like device that they converted into a weapon, explaining why the base has Imperial architecture. It could also explain how the First Order managed to build up their military forces without anyone noticing. While someone could call it an “ancient weapon” in the crawl, I think it would raise more questions than answers and it is probably more important to emphasize the secrecy of the project, explaining why the New Republic is not freaking out about it.
Luke Skywalker has vanished. In his absence the sinister FIRST ORDER has risen from the ashes of the Empire and have vowed to take control of the galaxy.
Failing to convince the New Republic of this looming threat, General Leia Organa has formed a brave RESISTANCE to stand against the First Order and the powerful Starkiller weapon.
Desperate for help, General Organa has sent her bravest pilot to Jakku to learn the location of the last Jedi, while dark forces gather far above…
This is really good! I like how you said “this looming threat” instead. If I could give any suggestions, I can only pick out two things: I would suggest switching one of the times you use brave/bravest with a different word just for variation, since you use to describe both the Resistance and Poe. Maybe “best pilot”? And maybe you could say “their powerful Starkiller weapon” too. Nitpicky I know. I had actually considered calling it an “ancient weapon” just because I’m confused how the First Order could afford building that thing, but I felt that it was more important to know that it was unknown to the Republic.
OT Fan, yours is good too! I wanted to mention that even though the structural rules I laid out are conventions, they certainly shouldn’t be considered boundaries. Yours gives a lot of detail that mine otherwise couldn’t give. It sounds nice as well!
Could be as simple as starting the third paragraph with meanwhile.
Very nice crawls by the way. I appreciate the thought put into keeping it consistent in tone and style. Have you considered making new PT crawls?
That is true! Transitional words can make a big difference.
And I actually do have rough versions written for PT edits that I’ve been working on. Mine are actually based a lot off of Hal’s crawls, which I think are great. Cloak of Deception actually fits in the format pretty well I think. They’re really a mix between his and the original crawls, minus referencing the specific timespans between films like Hal’s do. The opening sentences are more general.
Thanks for the feedback guys.
And you’re spot on, Kexikus. I actually was thinking that when I went back and read mine. One could write at the beginning of the third paragraph, “Little does Luke know that” or “Yet he remains unaware that” to help transition into the next point, and then cut out “Hunted by the Imperial Starfleet” and just have “After suffering terrible losses” at the beginning to help maintain the word count. The original crawl actually has the whole “Little does Luke know” line so they must’ve been aware of how it felt unconnected.
Luckily it seems like an appropriate crawl for The Force Awakens won’t be as hard to figure out.
Fantastic post and I like your proposed crawl.
If you don’t mind me asking, what’s your crawl for ROTJ?And what’s your edit for ROTJ on that note?
Sure. It isn’t perfect but I wanted to get as close to the feeling as I could to the others while also following the format. I also took inspiration from an early draft of the crawl as well other suggestions people have made on here. And yeah, I can try to give a brief synopsis of the edit.
The Alliance is doomed. Hunted by the Imperial Starfleet and suffering terrible losses, the rebels have made a desperate plan to strike back against the tyrannical Empire.
Struggling to persevere, Luke Skywalker has continued his Jedi training in preparation to rescue Han Solo from the clutches of the vile gangster Jabba the Hutt.
Darth Vader, under the commands of his cruel Emperor, hurries the construction of a new dreaded Death Star that will bring about their ultimate victory once and for all…
So the word count goes as:
27
26
29
Total: 82
It’s starts as normal, but then goes to the deleted scene of Vader calling to Luke, then you see Luke building his lightsaber in the cave (minus it activating), and I rotoscoped it to appear as if he were on Dagobah. From there he flies off to Tatooine. Then he goes back to Dagobah after rescuing Han like he does in the movie. That’s why it says what it says in the second paragraph.
I know a lot of people put the Dagobah sequence before Jabba’s palace, but I want to preserve the mystery of Luke as much as I can. I just think it plays out well in the original. That’s also why I save the green saber reveal until the Sarlaac sequence. I also see Han’s rescue as Luke’s last trial before facing Vader. He was patient this time unlike in Empire.
Originally I had Leia’s rescue mission be separate from Luke’s because I thought the original plot made no sense. In that version you don’t see Vader call to Luke until Leia is captured, then Luke hears both Vader and Leia calling to him. But after I did it I realized it really just cut too much out of the movie, and I realized that the plan may have been to get as many people on the inside as possible and then be sent to the Sarlaac. That way they would be let out of their cells and have an escape vehicle (the skiffs). There also may have been less guards escorting them than there were in the palace. With that in mind I inserted a line from Jabba after Han is freed about how escaping his palace is impossible and no one has ever done it to help hint toward their plan. Interestingly enough Jabba is saying something before Han talks but there are no subtitles for it. Nice place to put it. I still have the other version though as well.
Boba still falls in the Sarlaac but he doesn’t scream and he puts up more of a fight. I think his “death” is pretty iconic now and I think there is a bit of irony that what takes Boba out is something that has a one-in-a-million chance of actually happening. Boba is always one step ahead of everyone but how could he foresee “blind” luck? I’d still be open to change this but I haven’t really seen an edit of this that is totally convincing.
Afterwards Luke goes back to Dagobah. I altered the dialogue so instead of asking “Is Vader my father?” which he probably would’ve already asked Yoda if he’d gone back to train, he asks him, “Why didn’t you tell me?” And I inserted the “Obi-Wan would’ve told you long ago had I let him” and pitched it a little to sound more accurate.
I do the usual with the Ewoks, except I do change one little thing to help make them look less innocent that I have yet to see in another edit.
Probably the change I’m most proud of is restructuring the Battle of Endor. In my version I have both the space and land battle going down-hill up until Vader kills the Emperor, then after that things start turning around. I won’t go into detail but I think it helps the emotions of the each sequence flow more naturally into the next. Things get bad, then good, then worse, then great. In this version, I tried to make it where if Luke failed, then the rebellion would fail.
It ends like many edits, with Luke watching the funeral pyre and panning up to the stars. No force ghosts.
It isn’t perfect. I still think the beginning is pretty dull, and a part of me would like to imply that the second Death Star is actually the first Death Star rebuilt, but I think I’d have to edit the entire trilogy to do that. But I think some of these changes really helps me take this movie more seriously and be a worthy successor to ANH and ESB. Sorry to everyone else. I know this a TFA edit thread, not a ROTJ one.
Everyone on here has posted some pretty good opening crawls on here. Definitely a shout out to Kexikus. Really like yours. While I did generally like the opening crawl for TFA, it didn’t exactly fit the format of the rest. While not all of the opening crawls have to fit the same format, the opening crawls are like poetry. And poetry follows certain kinds of structures. The opening crawls for A New Hope and The Empires Strikes back are arguably the most well-written out of the saga (and my favorite two, so I suppose I’m biased), but they actually follow the same format as well. Return of the Jedi really dropped the ball but I’ve changed it in my personal edit of the movie.
Anyway, I just figured I’d give my two cents on my opening crawl philosophy so that it might help the process for others and then give my own suggestion. I know plenty of people have talked about what the content should be, those things have become clear, so instead I’ll talk more about the structure/format.
The opening crawls, according the ANH and ESB, have a few unofficial, structural rules.
Four total sentences.
The first paragraph has two sentences. The second sentence and each one after contain independent clauses.
The second paragraph starts with an -ing word within an independent clause.
i.e., “During the battle,” “Evading the dreaded Impreial Starfleet,”. I think this helps the crawl have a present-tense, action-packed feel to the story.
The opening crawl has, on average, 82 words. 81 for ANH and 83 for ESB. Each paragraph is, on average, 27 words. The smallest paragraph has been 22 words and the largest 32 words. This might seem like an overblown analysis but I do think some crawls can get too wordy. Out of all of the crawls of the saga, none of them pass 83 words.
I think following these rules can help the structure of an opening crawl look and feel more in line with the others.
While I like TFA opening crawl, it actually breaks all of these rules despite getting the tone correct. It goes to 88 total words, which doesn’t really bother me. The fact that the second paragraph is two sentences is what bothers me so much. It isn’t bad but none of the other crawls do that.
So, here is my proposal based off these rules. I want to mention that mine is actually based off NeverarGreat’s great (ha) crawl, especially the last two paragraphs. So a lot of credit goes to him. While most of the first sentences set up the political situation, I think the “Luke Skywalker has vanished.” has become iconic so I’m leaving that untouched.
Luke Skywalker has vanished. Without the Jedi, the mysterious FIRST ORDER has risen from the ashes of the Empire and will not rest until Skywalker has been destroyed.
Failing to convince the New Republic of the looming threat, General Leia Organa hastens to form a RESISTANCE as the First Order prepares their secret weapon, the STARKILLER.
Desperate for her brother’s help, Leia has sent her bravest pilot to Jakku to learn the location of the last Jedi while dark forces gather far above…
First paragraph: 28
Second: 28
Third: 27
Total: 83
Also, while not necessary, the second paragraph contains the word “secret” which both the crawls of ANH and ESB also do. Nice little touch.
So yeah, sorry for the long post. I know I seem really anal about the structure and am probably overthinking it, but I think structure/format is something often overlooked. So maybe people will like this version or use the concept to make their own. I hope this is helpful!
Cool ideas. It’s interesting to start TPM on Tatooine. Hopefully there’d be a way to compensate for runtime. And there might be some existing edits to your preferred concept for ROTS!
Sorry for changing topics, but I was curious if this idea had been suggested before.
I’ve been trying to think of ways to repair plot inconsistencies between the trilogies, and one of the major ones that seems overlooked in my opinion is the whole relationship between Anakin and Owen/Beru. They seem close in the OT but they barely could even be considered acquaintances in the PT.
So would it be possible to turn Kitster’s character into a young Owen? It could help them seem more like old friends rather than strangers. 3PO could call him “Mastern Owen” in TPM and both Anakin and Qui-Gon say the word “win” a few times in the movies if I recall correctly, so you might be able to make that work. You could even make one of the girl kids into Beru if that could even be possible. Then when Anakin comes back to find his mom in AOTC, he find’s out she married Owen’s dad. You may need to redub Owen in AOTC though to make it more like a reunion rather than an introduction.
I think one big issue though is that Kitster seems to be a POC while Owen is white. So it might throw people off unless they can overlook it.
Yeah, probably so. Also, does it make sense for SKB to explode into a star since in this proposed version it would have already discharged its stellar energy?
I’d actually thought about this as well. I think within the context of the theatrical version it doesn’t make sense but within this version it could. If the energy of an entire star was compressed inside a planet smaller than it, why wouldn’t it explode back into its massive size instead of turning into a planet-sized star? But if Starkiller base already released most of the sun’s energy firing, it’s possible what we see is some residual energy that was still inside. So you could keep it the same size/color or you could make it a white dwarf star, which are smaller in size but have equal mass to a star similar to our sun.
Or after Finn says that his friend was taken prisoner, you could just cut to Leia saying, “And I’ll do everything I can to help, but first you need to tell us all you know.” Yeah you lose a few lines but it’s worth it in order to bypass that jarring cut. And the lines lost are not really necessary, the scene still works either way. But I would only try this if the first one me and Smithers thought about still feels noticeably jarring.
I noticed this too. I tried to alter it myself by just having him just say, “Finn’s familiar with the weapon” but you can really tell that it has been cut because of how fast he says it. I wonder if one could cut it in a way to make him say “Finn’s familiar with the base” and cut back to Leia as he is saying “the base”.
(When they take off on their Banthas.)
Hi Ho! Jumbo! Away! (Feel free to suggest a better name for the Bantha.)
I think the name of the elephant that portrayed the bantha was named Mardji. Could use that.
“It’s the First Order!” sounds great, Hal. Like you said, I think the “they’ve done it” line is excusable in order to achieve what we’re trying to accomplish. Unless someone could get a line of Finn saying “found us” or something like that we’ll probably have to stick with it. The only other thing I think someone could do is have them blow something else up. One could add someone air traffic of patrons coming and going to Maz’s place in the few wide shots we have, like when the Falcon flies toward it and then when Rey is looking out over the lake, then maybe when the First Order arrives, they might blow up a random ship or two that are trying to leave, ensuring their targets won’t escape on another ship. Of course this would require more vfx, but just an idea.