NeverarGreat

DominicCobb said:

The one awkward thing there that stands out for me is the re-editing of the Kor Sella scene. Any particular reason for that?

The original editing of the scene had Kor Sella smiling in reaction to Leia’s line ‘Not all the senators think I’m insane’. While that may be a humorous exaggeration, it doesn’t seem like a joke. After her reaction, Leia then says ‘…or maybe they do. I don’t care.’. This seems like the punchline to me, which is why I put her reaction here. It also gives the scene some room to breathe, otherwise it would cut too fast back to Finn and Poe. Of course, this change meant that I had to find some other reaction shot of Kor Sella to place between Leia’s lines, so I took the only moment where she wasn’t talking and slowed it down as much as I dared.

Sir Ridley said:

That’s good (the briefing scene)! I see some small issues. It needs BB-8 foley, “any word from the republic” sounds a little odd around the “the” (perhaps someone could record a new line?) and the shot of Leia saying “no” could perhaps be better (maybe slightly animate the mouth to an O shape) but otherwise it seems like a good way to do it.

Thanks. I remember that Snap’s line was a combination of two other lines, making it very tricky so not sure there’s much else to be wrung from it. As for any remaining audio issues in these scenes, I’m hoping Hal works some magic on them before it’s all said and done 😉

Leia’s deleted scene on Vimeo:

https://vimeo.com/233568361
Password: TFA

This one has color correction but no foley for the Resistance base shot, just like the full quality version.

TV’s Frink said:

NeverarGreat said:

TV’s Frink said:

What was the problem with the ending of TFA, exactly?

The fact that it doesn’t.

To explain: Certainly TFA has an ending, more of an ending than some movies at any rate. The problem is that it doesn’t have a Star Wars ending. In every Star Wars movie up to this one, we are able to significantly jump forward in time to the next installment, since the final scenes of each Star Wars movie before TFA have been some kind of statement or resolution (just put the words ‘deal with it’ after each of these summaries):
TPM: We saved the day. Anakin will be a Jedi.
AOTC: The Clone Wars have started. Anakin and Padme are married.
ROTS: The Empire won, our heroes are in hiding, and Anakin is Vader.
ANH: The Death Star blew up, and we’re celebrating.
ESB: We’re going to find Han no matter what.
ROTJ: The Empire lost.

TFA doesn’t end with a resolution or statement. It ends with Rey looking to Luke and basically asking him to train her. We don’t know what he will do.

And just in case you think I’m reading this as a question whereas it’s understood to be a resolution of some type, let me show you the end of the novelization:

Whether motivated by her stare or by something unknown, the figure finally turned toward her and pulled back his hood.
Luke Skywalker.
His hair and beard were white, and his countenance was haunted. He did not speak, nor did she.
Remembering, Rey reached into her pack and removed his lightsaber. Taking several steps forward, she held it out to him. An offer. A plea. The galaxy’s only hope.
She wondered what would happen next.

So it’s very clearly a cliffhanger and a question, rather than a conclusion and a statement.
Rian has even had to re-film this scene in TLJ just to answer this question. At the very least this is a complete departure from every other film in this series, and for no discernible reason other than that JJ simply had no idea where to take the story.

Sounds like that’s a “you” (and other people, to be fair to you) problem rather than a movie trilogy problem, but ok.

Also ESB isn’t that much different, and ANH was conceived as a stand-alone, and prequels lol.

The Fellowship of the Ring had an ending despite being the first movie of a trilogy. Frodo and Sam resolve to go to Mordor alone, then they start that journey as it fades to black. Nobody went back to re-film their final scene. We imagine what troubles await since we know what our characters are determined to do.

ESB had an ending despite being the second film in a trilogy. Luke and his friends resolve to find Han Solo, and then they start that search as it goes to credits. Nobody needed to re-film that scene to add more information. The journey of Luke propels him into the future, and us with him.

If TFA ended when Rey left on the Falcon to find Luke, that would be a proper ending. We would be able to imagine her long journey to Luke’s planet, and look forward to whether or not Luke would deign to train her. As it is, we’re left in the middle of a scene which the director of the next episode felt it necessary to re-film in order to complete. I don’t know what’s so difficult about understanding it. It’s certainly dramatic, but there is no more information in her handing the lightsaber to Luke than when she determined to seek him out aboard the Falcon. It’s another instance of Weaponized Intertextuality that we the audience desperately wanted to happen beyond the natural resolution of Rey’s character arc, so JJ made it happen. That’s probably why people are so defensive about this. That’s how I’ll interpret it anyway 😉

Just to make clear: TFA is a good movie, and it has an ending. The ending is just in a different place for me. Proceed with the topic at hand.

I saw IT in a drive-in.

I don’t watch many horror movies, so I’m sure other people would have issues with the spastic scares, but I thought it was quite good, and played more like a well-made drama than a horror movie.

Here 'tis on Vimeo:

https://vimeo.com/233559263
Password: TFA

@Mala: The line was originally “Without the Republic fleet, we’re doomed”, but it was replaced with “This is a catastrophe” because the Resistance base is still supposed to be hidden at this point in the edit, and thus not a target for the weapon. One could make the argument (and I think I did) that 3PO’s statement could mean “Without the Republic fleet, we (the Resistance attack ships) are doomed”, but that might be confusing.

This version makes clear that the Resistance knows that the First Order is targeting the Republic, and also suggests that under other circumstances, the Resistance would have the backing of the entire Republic fleet. Since there’s so little mention of the Republic in the original film, I worry about taking out any more. ‘It’s the Republic! The First Order, they’ve done it’, and ‘Finn’s familiar with the weapon system that destroyed the Hosnian System, he worked on the base’ were always going to be gone, so these lines are an endangered species of sorts.

😃

I did another version of the Resistance Briefing scene, further tweaking Leia’s mouth movements (as usual) and giving 3PO this line: “Oh my! Without the Republic fleet, they’re doomed!”

What do you think?

https://mega.nz/#!3EFEVTLL!nVZb6XmsPlFFqiUWpKrw4KQC5ZmfaYKdkr5VP4WVeMc
Music: https://mega.nz/#!WUEC0S6J!sL-aB5Qcg7NUSykVcIH-jIA-w6v4HpSHxNNOPPRcRRk
Dialogue:https://mega.nz/#!LAlnHDjB!1OqtC3xToVyqzM6uNhdcI4tTyDByODTn0xiTrHLuWBE

TV’s Frink said:

What was the problem with the ending of TFA, exactly?

The fact that it doesn’t.

To explain: Certainly TFA has an ending, more of an ending than some movies at any rate. The problem is that it doesn’t have a Star Wars ending. In every Star Wars movie up to this one, we are able to significantly jump forward in time to the next installment, since the final scenes of each Star Wars movie before TFA have been some kind of statement or resolution (just put the words ‘deal with it’ after each of these summaries):
TPM: We saved the day. Anakin will be a Jedi.
AOTC: The Clone Wars have started. Anakin and Padme are married.
ROTS: The Empire won, our heroes are in hiding, and Anakin is Vader.
ANH: The Death Star blew up, and we’re celebrating.
ESB: We’re going to find Han no matter what.
ROTJ: The Empire lost.

TFA doesn’t end with a resolution or statement. It ends with Rey looking to Luke and basically asking him to train her. We don’t know what he will do.

And just in case you think I’m reading this as a question whereas it’s understood to be a resolution of some type, let me show you the end of the novelization:

Whether motivated by her stare or by something unknown, the figure finally turned toward her and pulled back his hood.
Luke Skywalker.
His hair and beard were white, and his countenance was haunted. He did not speak, nor did she.
Remembering, Rey reached into her pack and removed his lightsaber. Taking several steps forward, she held it out to him. An offer. A plea. The galaxy’s only hope.
She wondered what would happen next.

So it’s very clearly a cliffhanger and a question, rather than a conclusion and a statement.
Rian has even had to re-film this scene in TLJ just to answer this question. At the very least this is a complete departure from every other film in this series, and for no discernible reason other than that JJ simply had no idea where to take the story.

Don’t know if this has been posted before:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=861&v=nVZGUV77aRg
The guy’s got a point, y’all.

ray_afraid said:

Tobar said:

NeverarGreat said:

JJ Abrams is entirely unsuited to third acts, at least in a writing capacity.

So sadly this. 😦

What’s the track record here? Do most of his projects fall apart at the end?
I’m really not very familiar with JJ’s works. I’ve seen the Trek reboot and TFA. Thought both were “meh” but not bad.
And he had something to do with Cloverfield, which I liked quite a bit.

He was the Producer of Cloverfield.

In terms of writing, he was involved with Super 8, Lost, TFA, Armageddon, and Mission: Impossible 3, among a few others that I haven’t seen. I also haven’t seen Lost but it’s infamous for flubbing the ending, so I’ll count it. Of these projects, Super 8, Lost, and TFA have fumbled their endings. Armageddon and MI3 were serviceable in this regard, but one of these was a verifiable mess throughout. So really my hope for Episode 9 rests entirely on the strength of Mission Impossible 3, and that gives me copious amounts of pause.

joefavs said:

Anyway, I’m fine with this. There are more potentially interesting choices out there, but I already know I like J.J.'s flavor of Star Wars. As long as he’s learned a lesson from the reaction to Starkiller Base and/or the story group reigns him in enough to prevent anything else like that, I’m on board.

I think the bigger issue is JJ’s perhaps unconscious use of weaponized intertextuality:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeAKX_0wZWY

TV’s Frink said:

Eh. I’ll wait and see, like everything else regarding movies not yet viewed by myself.

You’ll withhold your opinion for two whole years?

Eh, I’ll wait and see.

timdiggerm said:

http://www.starwars.com/news/j-j-abrams-to-write-and-direct-star-wars-episode-ix?cmp=smc|1069686719

Noooooo

NeverarGreat said:

JJ Abrams is entirely unsuited to third acts, at least in a writing capacity.

SilverWook said:

So, why couldn’t they pack Anakin’s arm in some ice and reattach it in AOTC? It’s lying right there on the floor, not like they have to go looking for it. Okay, it might be a little bit shorter after, but seriously!

Maybe all the Midichlorians in it died, so he wouldn’t be able to levitate pears with it anyway.

Patting ourselves on the back are we?

suspiciouscoffee said:

I think they already confirmed that Shia will not be involved.

Not in 5 anyway, but perhaps he’ll return in later installments.

If we’re in the mood to look upon Crystal Skull with a more forgiving eye…

I hope that they find a way to use the character of Mutt going forward in a way that doesn’t make his inclusion in Crystal Skull an absolute waste. I know Shia has undergone a strange career reinvention of sorts, so maybe he’ll be open to do a more modern take on the ‘adventurer archaeologist’ who has to deal with the constant derision of people ‘debunking’ the tales of his adventures among aliens and ancient nuclear-powered Hindu civilizations.

SilverWook said:

NeverarGreat said:

TV’s Frink said:

I agree, E.T. is massively overrated.

Complete rehash of Close Encounters by studio hack Spielberg Disney-fied and dumbed down with bad child actors and ugly puppets 0/10.

Not sure if serious.

I remember an L.A. film critic panned E.T., dismissed it as a kid’s film and got a sackload of hate mail.

It would be fun if they remade it based on the original scary concept.
https://www.bustle.com/articles/26113-steven-spielbergs-original-et-concept-was-truly-frightening-photos

Just attempting to emulate some of our more flavorful posters.

I remember seeing that concept art years ago. Who knows whether it would have been better than what we’d gotten, but ET terrified me as a child, so mission accomplished on the horror front. I challenge anyone to gaze upon this alien thing and not get a sense of creeping horror:

There’s also no denying that E.T. is genuinely a masterpiece.

SilverWook said:

At least preserve some mystery for people who haven’t seen the movie before.

It’s not the first repackage to have spoiled the reveal of a small alien.

TV’s Frink said:

I agree, E.T. is massively overrated.

Complete rehash of Close Encounters Disney-fied and dumbed down with bad child actors and ugly puppets 0/10.

Oh wait, that might have been this.

DominicCobb said:

There’s a Finn line you missed that I’d probably call the most accurate one for the majority of people here (and in general).

And you’re not enlightening us why?

I think greater humanization of Vader is warranted at that point in the story, regardless of what Obi-wan believed.

ray_afraid said:

FVDnz said:

Artan42 said:

Something I’ve seen mocked up by AggeIw (https://aggeiw.deviantart.com/art/Give-me-a-Hand-216238791)

It also begs to reason why Vader would even scream over his mechanical arm getting severed. Maybe there were nerves connected during Vader’s suit construction or something?

3PO feels pain when he’s banged around, burned, ect. And the droids in the stupid torture scene are all screaming in pain. If they feel is somehow, I’m sure Vader does too.

It’s a confused issue for sure. Luke’s prosthetic hand has synthetic nerve endings, but this is presented in contrast to Vader’s robotic suit, which is ‘more machine than man’. If he does indeed have feeling in his robotic limbs, it would humanize him.

TV’s Frink said:

Not sure I can do much about that. Chopping up dialogue to make new dialogue is always dicey.

Ha.

There is one upshot of having 3 offspring of Han and Leia - Each one can channel a unique mix of the parents’ personalities. One may be the cocksure hothead, one would be the diplomat, and one could be very different to the others in some way. Since everyone would have imagined their own version of Han and Leia’s kids, this would give them what they imagined, and something more.

I don’t remember much about the EU. I read a bunch of the books as a kid, up until I got bored in the Yuuzhan Vong war. The big problem with most of them is that they failed to translate the deep themes of the movies into novel form. Star Wars, at least in the OT, wasn’t a comic book with villains of the week with splashy superpowers. Nor was it military science fiction, despite the name. The biggest missing element in the books was that they forgot (or were never aware) that Star Wars was an epic myth about growing up in rural America. Here we have a Midwestern farm-boy forever on the frontier, forever wanting to be elsewhere. It’s about him fulfilling the old American dream of becoming a self-made man, even if the dream threatens to become a nightmare. It is about navigating the desolate wasteland that is American folklore, a strange mix of alien cultures and Eastern Mysticism wrapped in a Western religious epistemology. Finally, it is about embracing the new folklore of pulpy romance and swashbuckling adventure in the movies, and making of it something more than its schlocky origins.

If you manage to make a story that taps into these themes, or similar themes of the 21st century, it won’t much matter if the story is sufficiently integrated with the EU.

SilverWook said:

NeverarGreat said:

The problem is that film used as a verb is quite efficient, compared to capture with a digital movie camera or even shoot in digital 4K.

And no one has coined a similar term that conveys the technology involved. We could steal a phrase from A Clockwork Orange and say we’re viddying it? 😉

I suppose video is sometimes used as as verb, but it still sounds weird.