NeverarGreat

darth_ender said:

De-hashed Edition, as it removes at least one of the major rehashed ANH elements.

D-#ed for short.

#D-#

TV’s Frink said:

Sometimes info removes edit listings when the links go dead.

It would seem nobody Kerrs anymore.

If everyone applied that rule, there would be no good fanedits.

Oh wait…
Crap.

Hal 9000 said:

it’s a LOTR project, not recreating something from the past but completing the project, though both of us have evolved our views substantially in the past decade.

Not sure I understand that bit, but okay 😃

I am also looking forward to seeing V2: Super Special Starkiller Edition completed before TLJ. I’ve quite run out of things to change, at least until V3: Ultra Complete Mega Fantastic Poe and Finn Shipping Edition.
😉

It seems strange to have such a sense of ownership when you’re remixing and altering other people’s work to begin with.

Hal 9000 said:

I agree; sounds good. I apologize for my terse interactions in this thread lately. I’ve been working on something LOTR-related in conjunction with Kerr that I’m pretty excited about, with TFA:R V2 being in the “waiting on” phase.

I hope it’s a project like this one.
😉

.Mac. said:

NeverarGreat said:

The view of many people on this forum is that there’s something wrong with the Jabba’s palace sequence. It’s more open to debate as to what, exactly, is the culprit, but there are plenty of candidates which have been suggested in the past:

-There are too many poorly designed muppets
-The plan makes little to no sense, or if it does it relies too much on luck (or the Force)
-The palace sequence drags on too long
-There’s a musical number that serves no narrative function
-Characters (such as Boba Fett) are poorly defined or (in the case of Han Solo) overly quippy.
-The palace seems at times like a heavily defended fortress and other times like the Mos Eisley cantina in terms of security
-The action and effects, especially on the sail barge, are stodgy.

The last time I marathoned the entire trilogy, it was abundantly clear that there was something wrong with ROTJ compared to the previous installments. From the first act to the last, I was continually disappointed in how little of the film really resonated. I have faith that Adywan can solve much of the stodgy action and effects on the sail barge, but believe that the problems with the palace sequence go beyond superficial fixes and require editorial changes.

The reason I chose the Wookiee scene to cut is that the scene is really emblematic of the problems in this section of the film. To sum up the scene, Leia is apparently able to bring a high explosive and an uncuffed, violent Wookiee twice her size into Jabba’s audience chamber, no questions asked. It really takes the threat out of Jabba’s security if anyone dressed like a bounty hunter can get in and threaten his life with no repercussions. Even How It Should Have Ended made fun of the thermal detonator.

This, all of this. I see we’re definitely on the same page, NeverarGreat, in terms of what things can be handled better about the Jabba sequence (assuming you agree with that list you just typed), but it seems it’s just how it can be improved is where we differ. I’m still not at all convinced that having Leia be involved with bringing in Chewie is a good idea/plan. I totally do understand your reasoning with your suggestion, it’s just I’d much prefer to steer away from having her giving up Chewie. Her motivation in doing this (based on just your dialogue as it is) would not be deduced to those who aren’t here reading about it, and so it would confuse most audience members because, really, how could there be no other possible way for her to get in without sacrificing Chewie? You never surrender one of your friends in hopes of getting another, otherwise you’re back at square one (or as it turns out, in a worse scenario)! That’s what I hated about this sequence originally.

Plus, you mentioned that the dance sequence serves no narrative purpose, which I totally agree and hope that gets removed too (unless Ady wanted to do a condensed, hybrid of the SE and OUT shots featuring just the dancers with new music [tribal drums/Japanese Taiko-esque] and moved to the intro of Jabba - that I’m completely cool with), and so if that were totally removed, where else would your short scene fit?

So, ideally, I’m of the opinion that the sequences would work best as: Torcher chamber (I know many don’t like this but it’s actually needed to establish the jobs that the droids will be given), then after that a wipe to an establishing, scenic, night shot of the palace outside (without a distracting frog slurping up some thing), then it continues with the shots of Leia sneaking around inside the palace (we don’t have to know it’s her before she takes off the mask either; although, prior to this, a shot of her in disguise that establishes that she is already inside, just like Lando is, would be a good idea).

It sounds like you want to go further than my edit by removing all mention of Chewie save for 3PO establishing his imprisonment. I am totally with you that Leia bringing Chewie in isn’t the best decision. But there’s no stated reason for Chewie to be there, and we just have to imagine that he was captured at some point. I suppose that would be fine.

Here’s a wacky idea that just might work: Have Boushh release a sedative through the palace at nightfall. She could indicate this in her dialogue to 3PO: “The gas will clear at nightfall. Be ready.” Just replace the previous dialogue in the mockup with this.

This explains the extremely alien language and gas mask part of her disguise, and why she thinks sneaking through a hall of dozens of sleeping scoundrels will work. To make it even cooler, there could be a visible cloud of gas in the hall which is clearing as she makes her way to the Carbonite slab. Of course the plan fails at some point when 3PO blabs. I’d prefer metal doors instead of curtains to block the gas but oh well, curtains would probably suffice against a widely dispersed sedative traveling through air currents.

TV’s Frink said:

doubleofive said:

Tyrphanax said:

Just because it’ll make 005 mad: more Boba Fett. Lots more.

Make him the hero.

Muy muy I hate you

FTFNO

Nuke this from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.

Yeah, but then you’d have to do the same thing with the shot in ANH.

Gotta have consistency, y’know 😉

The view of many people on this forum is that there’s something wrong with the Jabba’s palace sequence. It’s more open to debate as to what, exactly, is the culprit, but there are plenty of candidates which have been suggested in the past:

-There are too many poorly designed muppets
-The plan makes little to no sense, or if it does it relies too much on luck (or the Force)
-The palace sequence drags on too long
-There’s a musical number that serves no narrative function
-Characters (such as Boba Fett) are poorly defined or (in the case of Han Solo) overly quippy.
-The palace seems at times like a heavily defended fortress and other times like the Mos Eisley cantina in terms of security
-The action and effects, especially on the sail barge, are stodgy.

The last time I marathoned the entire trilogy, it was abundantly clear that there was something wrong with ROTJ compared to the previous installments. From the first act to the last, I was continually disappointed in how little of the film really resonated. I have faith that Adywan can solve much of the stodgy action and effects on the sail barge, but believe that the problems with the palace sequence go beyond superficial fixes and require editorial changes.

The reason I chose the Wookiee scene to cut is that the scene is really emblematic of the problems in this section of the film. To sum up the scene, Leia is apparently able to bring a high explosive and an uncuffed, violent Wookiee twice her size into Jabba’s audience chamber, no questions asked. It really takes the threat out of Jabba’s security if anyone dressed like a bounty hunter can get in and threaten his life with no repercussions. Even How It Should Have Ended made fun of the thermal detonator.

The edit strengthens Leia’s cover story because she has apparently gained the trust of a famous bounty hunter. This explains Fett’s presence, since it doesn’t make much sense that he’d just hang around the palace for weeks or months after delivering Han Solo. Doesn’t he have anything better to do? In this version, he did: help Boushh capture Chewbacca.

JEDIT: Here’s a rough mockup: https://vimeo.com/235057281
Password: boushh

I also noticed when editing this that Boushh only has about 3 different words, not really enough for this brief exchange much less an entire scene.

Is there any fading on this, or was the grading intended to show the flashbacks through Rose colored glasses? 😉

I like it either way.

Serious suggestion, can we call this edit something other than A Gentle Restructure when V2 is released? Perhaps something like The Force Awakens: The Starkiller Edit.

http://originaltrilogy.com/topic/TFA-A-Gentle-Restructure/id/50117/page/43

Suggesting ideas is fine, far as I know. But I figure that after a fair amount of discussion, ideas should go to the more general thread since Ady has probably made up his mind one way or another and it’s less posts to sift through later on.

It should really go in the thread I linked above.

I’m sure they would have gone with that if it wasn’t a script requirement that the top of the ship be completely flat. As to the reason it’s flat…who knows.

Every issue with the rescue plan could be explained away (as indeed you do), it’s just that it takes quite a bit of thinking to even parse it out. This change fixes the contradictory information from 3PO, shortens the Jabba sequence by 2.5 minutes, and strengthens Leia’s cover story while involving Boba Fett in the plot.

.Mac. said:

NeverarGreat said:

.Mac. said:

NeverarGreat said:

.Mac. said:

Do we need to see Leia gain admittance though? Just like with Lando, we didn’t see how he got in; he just is already in, which could work the same for Leia also.

Right, with this idea Leia is already in the palace and has probably been there for a while.

If she has already been in for a while, then that tells me she was already accepted, and so then it still makes zero sense for her to surrender Chewie for no apparent benefit. I understand what you were going for with the idea, but we don’t need to see her get the “You go girl” nod from Fett. My point is she could’ve already been accepted in by Fett and everyone else, just as Lando was.

Also with the removal of this whole scene, we then won’t have to worry about seeing Lando pulling down his disguise and essentially telling the audience, “Hey it’s me guys!”

It doesn’t make sense that she would have been accepted like Lando. Lando was a known scoundrel. It’s reasonable to believe that he would have the cred to be accepted into Jabba’s service as someone who recently lost their gig as a city administrator and has fallen on hard times. Leia, on the other hand, is instantly recognizable as a former senator and member of the Rebellion. There’s no way she’d be accepted sight unseen without a really good disguise and plausible Bounty Hunter credentials. Enlisting Boba Fett to help ‘capture’ Chewie solves this problem. Chewie is her price of admission, even if it’s inconvenient later on.

I like your idea but also think it’s making this more complicated than it needs to be 😃 because there’s no way you’d be able to explain that notion to the audience; they are still just seeing her giving up Chewie. Let’s just expect that the palace doesn’t actually know it’s Lando in disguise, and just the same they don’t know that is is Leia as Boushh. How she got in, it may have been different than Lando’s method, sure, but we don’t have to see how. Besides, how would they confirm if it was Lando or not? Did he have to take off his helmet and say, “Yeah it’s me.”? If so, then wouldn’t Leia also have to take off her mask and explain, “No, I’m not actually Princess Leia. I get that a lot, though.”?

I still think you’re misunderstanding what I have in mind. The audience doesn’t see her giving up Chewie. There’s a more detailed explanation here.

Here’s how I think this change would work:

After the dancer gets eaten by the Rancor, the band begins to play and the first shot of Boushh is when she’s face-to-face with C-3PO. She dismisses Bib Fortuna and says to the robot something like ‘It was us, who captured the wookiee’. This uses audio from the negotiation scene (which has been completely cut), and carries over to the next shot of Boba Fett nodding. Chewie is cut from the scene entirely, of course, and the final shot is of Lando, which cuts before he pulls the face mask down. Cue frog outside the palace.

Posting this here from Adywan’s ROTJ thread so it doesn’t continue to clutter it up:

NeverarGreat said:

Chewie’s introduction in the cell is one of the few changes I’d really like to see in even a ‘soft’ fanedit like this. It’s basically a plot hole that Chewie isn’t captured, since 3PO says ‘Lando Calrissian and poor Chewbacca never returned from this awful place’.

To make it work, Boushh’s bargain with Jabba should be cut, leaving only the brief word between Boushh and 3PO after the negotiation. Boushh would need to be dubbed to say more alien words, and subtitled so she says ‘We captured Chewbacca’ or ‘We captured the Wookiee’. Her glance at Boba Fett, who nods in return, explain the presence of Boba Fett and make sense of the scheme: She needed the trust of a renowned bounty hunter to gain admittance to the palace, not just Chewie and a disguise. Finally, we see Lando in a guard uniform, and can piece together the plan - Luke sends the droids as a peace offering, and if that fails there are two people inside the palace who can rescue Han, Chewie, and the droids. When this fails as well, it falls to Luke to rescue them all.

.Mac. said:

NeverarGreat said:

.Mac. said:

Do we need to see Leia gain admittance though? Just like with Lando, we didn’t see how he got in; he just is already in, which could work the same for Leia also.

Right, with this idea Leia is already in the palace and has probably been there for a while.

If she has already been in for a while, then that tells me she was already accepted, and so then it still makes zero sense for her to surrender Chewie for no apparent benefit. I understand what you were going for with the idea, but we don’t need to see her get the “You go girl” nod from Fett. My point is she could’ve already been accepted in by Fett and everyone else, just as Lando was.

Also with the removal of this whole scene, we then won’t have to worry about seeing Lando pulling down his disguise and essentially telling the audience, “Hey it’s me guys!”

It doesn’t make sense that she would have been accepted like Lando. Lando was a known scoundrel. It’s reasonable to believe that he would have the cred to be accepted into Jabba’s service as someone who recently lost their gig as a city administrator and has fallen on hard times. Leia, on the other hand, is instantly recognizable as a former senator and member of the Rebellion. There’s no way she’d be accepted sight unseen without a really good disguise and plausible Bounty Hunter credentials. Enlisting Boba Fett to help ‘capture’ Chewie solves this problem. Chewie is her price of admission, even if it’s inconvenient later on.

Anyway, let’s take further discussion here so as not to clutter the thread.

.Mac. said:

Do we need to see Leia gain admittance though? Just like with Lando, we didn’t see how he got in; he just is already in, which could work the same for Leia also.

Right, with this idea Leia is already in the palace and has probably been there for a while.

Chewie’s introduction in the cell is one of the few changes I’d really like to see in even a ‘soft’ fanedit like this. It’s basically a plot hole that Chewie isn’t captured, since 3PO says ‘Lando Calrissian and poor Chewbacca never returned from this awful place’.

To make it work, Boushh’s bargain with Jabba should be cut, leaving only the brief word between Boushh and 3PO after the negotiation. Boushh would need to be dubbed to say more alien words, and subtitled so she says ‘We captured Chewbacca’ or ‘We captured the Wookiee’. Her glance at Boba Fett, who nods in return, explain the presence of Boba Fett and make sense of the scheme: She needed the trust of a renowned bounty hunter to gain admittance to the palace, not just Chewie and a disguise. Finally, we see Lando in a guard uniform, and can piece together the plan - Luke sends the droids as a peace offering, and if that fails there are two people inside the palace who can rescue Han, Chewie, and the droids. When this fails as well, it falls to Luke to rescue them all.

I haven’t watched much of Clone Wars so I can’t comment on that, but this edit would remove the darkest moments from RotS (child murder, immolation). Of course RO isn’t a part of this idea, but though it may have more explicit violence than ESB it still doesn’t capture the sense of nightmarish fear that the Dagobah cave scene was able to create, at least for me.

New Trailer on October 9th

Or maybe not. Better disconnect from the internet now just to be safe, all ye who recoil at further footage.