NeverarGreat

TFA in many ways was brilliant, but people tend to forget that brilliance because it has become part of the broader saga story and in that way its flaws become much more apparent. As a standalone experience it works gangbusters, but once people really stepped back and saw it as a continuation of a six-part series it feels a lot like a soft reboot. Similarly the ending works really well as a hook for the next installment but once that came out and failed to live up to many people’s expectations it too cast a pall over TFA.

Looking forward to TROS, a lot hangs in the balance in terms of how TFA will be viewed.

RogueLeader said:

Man it is crazy how much the dialogue has changed between 2012 and now.

Right? I remember the hype for the new movies was pretty overwhelming back then, and it felt subversive to say stuff in praise of Lucas:

https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/656632

There’s a little vindication going on, yeah.

TavorX said:

All I can think of:

Han Solo: No time to discuss this as a committee!

Princess Leia: I am not a committee!

“And that’s how I came up with the idea to make the main theme of Episode 1 committee deliberation.”

The small amount of screentime and size in shot would probably be a benefit though, since there is a potentially large library of Peter Cushing’s acting with which to train the AI for a brief shot with little to no emoting. enlarging the ROTS shot to place the deepfake and then shrinking it back down to normal would probably give more definition to the illusion.

JawsTDS said:

Finally, some 4K screencaps of THE PHANTOM MENACE, without the HDR grade. Looks super DNR’d, just like the Blu-ray.

Ya got any picture contrast to go with it?

The Star Forge is they key to all this, if we can get it working.

It feels like you could trim three or four of those shots and solve the continuity problems by removing Han’s feetfirst fall, then having his headfirst flop be stopped by Chewie without cutting to him grabbing Han’s boots at all.

But that doesn’t necessarily imply a mystical component of the saber itself, merely that constructing one takes a lot of fine focus.

timdiggerm said:

ZkinandBonez said:

It’s a cool idea, but wouldn’t a more mystical reason make more sense in SW? E.g. the idea of bonding with a living crystal if you’re a Jedi, or “bleeding” it if you’re a Sith.

I don’t get why so many people don’t like the new lightsaber crystal lore. It’s such a Star Wars-y concept. They’ve even named them Kyber crystals.

because the inclination against the mystic side of Star Wars is strong among sci-fi nerds

Rather, that the movies never indicate this level of ‘bonding with a living crystal’; Yoda relegates it to the status of Luke’s blaster in being just another distraction from his Jedi training in his test at the tree, and the Emperor casually dismisses it as a ‘Jedi’s weapon’, implying that the Sith wouldn’t use lightsabers at all. Vader presumably only has one because he was formerly a Jedi. The crystal is clearly not bonded too closely to Force users since Han can use Luke’s lightsaber just fine.

Point being, the lightsaber in the OT is merely an elegant weapon from a more civilized age. Giving it a ton of weird mystical baggage actually makes the weapon less elegant in the story, not more.

A lightsaber’s color could be based on how often it is used, with the crystal wearing down and displaying ever redder colors over time:

(I imagine that the purple part of the spectrum would be a bright, almost white pink with the blade gradually shifting blue)

This would make sense of why building a lightsaber is a rite of passage for every Jedi Knight instead of simply inheriting ones from previous generations, while also allowing for a test of skill if they wished to merely replace the crystal in an older saber. The reason Sith blades are red could be for many reasons, such as a reliance on violence and also a disinterest in the serene delicate work required to replace the crystals.

It’s an occasional guilty pleasure of mine.

I present to you: This…thing.

I wonder if the muted colors and reddish cast of ANH was a choice predicated on the fading of the original negatives, since they have severely red-faded in 30-35 years. I expect that though one could pull a lot of saturation from the yellows and greens, there simply might not be enough there to do it properly.

SomethingStarWarsRelated said:

Rey looking at R2. I think if you flip the shot of Rey the eyelines won’t work, right?

The eyelines actually work decently well, but I’ve found that the lighting is at issue. Most of the light seems to be coming from the large open space to the right when facing R2, and if I flip the shots of Rey the light is instead coming from her left. I think it will have to remain as it is.

RogueLeader said:

Random thought: would the Kylo Searches the Falcon scene raise a potential plot hole (maybe this is the wrong word) where Kylo could’ve just hidden a tracking device on the Falcon and then be able to follow Rey to Ach-To, and then her and the rest of the Resistance when they escape Crait?

Maybe he didn’t have enough time to consider it in the scene, since he only stayed on it momentarily before moving on to the next thing. If those Snowtroopers stayed there guarding it and Chewbacca came back and killed them, maybe he made sure to check the ship for trackers after they got back to D’Qar (maybe them returning is how “the Resistance is exposed” in this version of events). I know I’m overthinking it but I figured it was worth thinking through.

Funny you should bring that up. I’ve actually considered that angle, and having some brief cutaway to the interior of the Falcon after it lands showing a new tracking device. But of course it would have to somehow be deactivated before Rey leaves for Luke’s island but not be detected since that would raise the issue of why the Resistance doesn’t seem to be in a hurry to leave. It would have to be something like the tracker shorting out after the Falcon lands on the base, but that is really convenient. I think it’s best to consider that Kylo assumed that Han and the gang wouldn’t be escaping and/or the Falcon was too badly damaged in the crash to fly.

One of my favorites for sure 😃

ChainsawAsh said:

Your_friendly_Imperial said:

Luke should have fought against Kylo Ren in person and his confrontation with the walkers should end like Dark Empire(size matters not…). He never, never should have abandoned the jedi order, that’s not Luke.

I often wonder if, had the PT come first and the OT came out decades later and the scripts were all more or less the same, people would say this exact thing about Obi-Wan and Yoda in the OT.

“They never would have given up and gone into hiding! That’s not Obi-Wan/Yoda!”

Hell, I was saying that the first time I saw ROTS. It makes no sense for Obi-wan and Yoda to just give up when Obi-wan (explicitly stated as being the weaker of the two) defeated Anakin at the height of his power in a one-on-one battle. Just fight him again, or team up with Yoda and finish it, then team up and defeat the Emperor.

Luke in TLJ is handled a lot better since he was never raised in the Jedi ways and defeated the Emperor by going against the advice of his masters. It makes a lot of sense then that he would refuse to rebuild their flawed order. No, the biggest problem with Luke in the ST is not that he abandoned the Jedi, it’s that he abandoned his friends. No amount of offscreen flashback trauma should change the absolute core of his character, period.

RogueLeader said:

Well, at the very least you could keep the majority of those subtitles and just change “Ren” with “Hux”. You would still get the idea across that he was a janitor that was promoted to field duty recently. And Hux slapping Finn in TLJ night then seem more personal. It also makes more sense that Hux would have the authority to promote him more so than Kylo. This could at least be your option for now until you think of something else that might fit better.

For sure.

I think this new music works well too! Might want to get some more input besides me. I liked how the little thump of the strings lines up with the shooting star!

Is it similar to another Star Wars movie scene or another movie entirely?

It just made me realize that there are some similarities in this transition/scene, even though the feeling is a bit different and far more effective than some Frankensteined fan project (Spoilers for a decades old kids movie):

https://youtu.be/yhaoJxQpRg0?t=61

SomethingStarWarsRelated said:

Ok you probably don’t want to hear this but I just realized that Rey and R2 are both on screen right. One should really be on the left while the other should be on the right. I don’t suppose you have a way to extend the background to right in Rey’s shot do you? 😜

Do you mean in the fade from Rey sleeping to R2, or when Rey is looking at R2? In either case I could probably flip the shots horizontally without it looking too weird.

Good thoughts. I agree that it’s still too confusing, and I had forgotten this little exchange:

‘How capable are your soldiers, General?’
‘I won’t have you question my methods.’
‘They’re obviously skilled at committing high treason.’

Since Kylo is placing the blame for this fully at Hux’s feet, the implication is that Kylo had no hand in selecting the soldiers for this mission. Of course he could be accusing in bad faith because of their rivalry, but it seems weird regardless.

Now I’m on the fence about this whole direction. More thought is needed, clearly.

So as for a general update, I’ve finished a few more changes throughout the film. I wasn’t totally happy with the cue for Rey noticing R2 since it felt too upbeat, so it is gone in favor of a cue from TLJ:

https://vimeo.com/373056573

Password: fanedit

The crescendo timed for Rey looking at R2 hopefully communicates a more important connection. The beginning of the Jedi Steps has also been lengthened so the rhythm works better.

Incidentally, the new cue over these visuals and the beeping sound effect feels eerily similar to another movie scene. I’ll let you guess which one, but I swear it was unintentional.

I find his definition of art disturbing.

RogueLeader said:

The fact Yoda has the cat’s eyes is a nice touch. What would be some good captions for that photo?

“That’s unfair! I built that pod when I was nine! I had to make sure it still worked.”

“Hilarious it was. Like a Hutt riding a tricycle, you looked.”

BedeHistory731 said:

Making the Prequels with the attitude of “everybody knows the originals.” They should have assumed nobody knew anything going into it, teaching them along the way. That way, continuity with the OT would be respected.

I would agree with this as being one of the worst things in Star Wars so far. It would have been so much more interesting to follow a new cast of characters which only occasionally interacted with known heroes in order to tell a story with the potential to be surprising.

^Excellent!

Another:

Although I don’t like the sketchy nature of the rendering. It’s coarse and rough.

DrDre said:

NeverarGreat said:

Okay, I’m going to jump back into this thread for a minute because this prophecy angle could actually be really interesting.

If Palpatine survives ROTJ as it has been established, then Anakin never fulfilled the prophecy at all. This actually makes the prequels more interesting to me, since the old Jedi Order was right to be mistrusful of believing the prophecy and right to deny him training (at least at first).

Furthermore, if the prophecy is unfulfilled after ROTJ then TFA’s first lines of dialogue make a lot more sense ‘I have seen too much to ignore the despair in the galaxy. Without the Jedi, there can be no balance in the Force.’ If the Force was ‘in balance’ at the end of ROTJ due to Anakin’s sacrifice, it would have had to fall out of balance at some point, but we are never given any definitive point at which that happened. Much better in my opinion to simply have the Force out of balance for all of this time, since the re-establishment of ‘balance’ would end the story full stop.

Finally, if Anakin didn’t destroy the Sith then there’s a good argument that he’s not the subject of the prophecy, freeing it up to apply to someone else. And this is where Episode 9 could really shine, by dethroning Anakin as the chosen one and elevating someone else (presumably Rey but maybe Kylo or Luke).

That doesn’t sound very respectful to Lucas’ story though, unless he intended such a direction for the ST.

I’d argue that actually trying to recontextualize elements of the PT would be more respectful than outright ignoring them, which is what the ST has essentially done.

Okay, I’m going to jump back into this thread for a minute because this prophecy angle could actually be really interesting.

If Palpatine survives ROTJ as it has been established, then Anakin never fulfilled the prophecy at all. This actually makes the prequels more interesting to me, since the old Jedi Order was right to be mistrusful of believing the prophecy and right to deny him training (at least at first).

Furthermore, if the prophecy is unfulfilled after ROTJ then TFA’s first lines of dialogue make a lot more sense ‘I have seen too much to ignore the despair in the galaxy. Without the Jedi, there can be no balance in the Force.’ If the Force was ‘in balance’ at the end of ROTJ due to Anakin’s sacrifice, it would have had to fall out of balance at some point, but we are never given any definitive point at which that happened. Much better in my opinion to simply have the Force out of balance for all of this time, since the re-establishment of ‘balance’ would end the story full stop.

Finally, if Anakin didn’t destroy the Sith then there’s a good argument that he’s not the subject of the prophecy, freeing it up to apply to someone else. And this is where Episode 9 could really shine, by dethroning Anakin as the chosen one and elevating someone else (presumably Rey but maybe Kylo or Luke).

Octorox said:

Don’t want to get anyone’s hopes up just yet but I’ve started tinkering with this again. Trying to find a narratively satisfying place to put the 3rd seeds of the rebellion scene and I think I may have finally cracked it. Borrowed a shot from Siliconmaster482’s edit which I believe was pulled from Attack of the Clones and flipped/color corrected.

Here is the clip: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ar3OOaZZGQ9oaf5ZGoqojil3Dj2Ugwy4

EDIT: Watching through it a few times, I may ultimately decide to wipe to the next scene after “Senator Amidala is hiding something, I can see it in her eyes”. Thoughts on that vs. how the clip currently plays?

Nice work!

I think the change is worth trying, but I think most of the issue is actually with the Anakin/Padme scene following the office scene. Anakin immediately acts suspicious because Obi-wan has been there, and while that wasn’t too problematic in the original coming right after his departure for Utapau, now it feels odd since he has presumably been gone a full day at least. I also think that scene in general is too schizophrenic with Anakin going from mistrust of Obi-wan to weariness back to mistrust and then doubtful of his own abilities. Removing the exchange ‘I feel lost’ ‘Lost, what do you mean?’ might allow a more natural flow.