Mrebo

moviefreakedmind said:

Mrebo said:

The decision to prosecute all who enter illegally is a hard choice. I know it’s easy to think of Trump as a combover twirling villain who enjoys inflicting hardship but illegal immigration has been rampant and unless we are going to do nothing about it, hardships will continue.

This isn’t true. Illegal immigration isn’t a problem now and it hasn’t been in recent memory, if ever.

You think illegal immigration doesn’t exist or you’re not aware of why it’s problematic?

dahmage said:

Mrebo said:

dahmage said:

Mrebo said:

dahmage said:

Mrebo said:

Warbler said:

Mrebo said:

It seems shortsighted to dwell so much on whether families are kept together

Tell that to the toddler crying for its mommy.

My Spanish probably isn’t up to the job but it’s no easier to explain to a toddler why she was carried through the desert or why she can’t stay.

um… when did you last explain anything to a toddler?

nothing, nothing compares to the anguish a toddler feels when their mom is not with them. and i am just talking about a 1 hour trip to the grocery store. if a toddler had to leave home, sure that is sad, but if they are with their mom/dad? not anguish.

Whenever a person commits an offense resulting in separation from children that is very hard for the children. Typically the parents should have to answer for that.

did you know that the majority of these separations being complained about, are from those attempting to seek asylum? yeah, lets punish them for fleeing a shitty situation. get educated. to say what jay says, do some research it isn’t my job to do it for you.

Asylum isn’t a magic word that let’s people stay. Generally the people are coming here because their own countries are lousy. Doesn’t mean they have a right to enter.

Jay Harold Christ mrebo… of course it isn’t magic.

but locking up parents, and shipping off toddlers, when the parents came to SEEK ASSYLUM is fucking nuts, and this is why people are making noise about this (Not because they hate Trump, Jay). this is why people are starting to say that the USA might be committing human rights violations.

I’ve yet to hear what the solution is.

dahmage said:

Mrebo said:

dahmage said:

Mrebo said:

Warbler said:

Mrebo said:

It seems shortsighted to dwell so much on whether families are kept together

Tell that to the toddler crying for its mommy.

My Spanish probably isn’t up to the job but it’s no easier to explain to a toddler why she was carried through the desert or why she can’t stay.

um… when did you last explain anything to a toddler?

nothing, nothing compares to the anguish a toddler feels when their mom is not with them. and i am just talking about a 1 hour trip to the grocery store. if a toddler had to leave home, sure that is sad, but if they are with their mom/dad? not anguish.

Whenever a person commits an offense resulting in separation from children that is very hard for the children. Typically the parents should have to answer for that.

did you know that the majority of these separations being complained about, are from those attempting to seek asylum? yeah, lets punish them for fleeing a shitty situation. get educated. to say what jay says, do some research it isn’t my job to do it for you.

Asylum isn’t a magic word that let’s people stay. Generally the people are coming here because their own countries are lousy. Doesn’t mean they have a right to enter.

TV’s Frink said:

dahmage said:

Mrebo said:

Warbler said:

Mrebo said:

It seems shortsighted to dwell so much on whether families are kept together

Tell that to the toddler crying for its mommy.

My Spanish probably isn’t up to the job but it’s no easier to explain to a toddler why she was carried through the desert or why she can’t stay.

um… when did you last explain anything to a toddler?

When was the last time you used the internet? :p

8.3/10

dahmage said:

Mrebo said:

Warbler said:

Mrebo said:

It seems shortsighted to dwell so much on whether families are kept together

Tell that to the toddler crying for its mommy.

My Spanish probably isn’t up to the job but it’s no easier to explain to a toddler why she was carried through the desert or why she can’t stay.

um… when did you last explain anything to a toddler?

nothing, nothing compares to the anguish a toddler feels when their mom is not with them. and i am just talking about a 1 hour trip to the grocery store. if a toddler had to leave home, sure that is sad, but if they are with their mom/dad? not anguish.

Whenever a person commits an offense resulting in separation from children that is very hard for the children. Typically the parents should have to answer for that.

The question is whether it is practical and legal to keep families together when parents are prosecuted. Generally, as I wager you know, the answer is “no.”

To address separation for violation of immigration laws, it appears that it does require a change in law and spending a lot more money. As Jay said a couple pages back, maybe Repubs should accept that as a cost of cutting down illegal immigration.

Warbler said:

Mrebo said:

It seems shortsighted to dwell so much on whether families are kept together

Tell that to the toddler crying for its mommy.

My Spanish probably isn’t up to the job but it’s no easier to explain to a toddler why she was carried through the desert or why she can’t stay.

I think we should focus on addressing the overall problem because as it exists now millions of people are going to keep being hurt in ways large and small, even when you’re not seeing headlines.

Warbler said:

Mrebo said:

Trump is trying to solve the illegal immigration issue.

By building a wall costing zillions and bsing about how he’s going to get Mexico to pay for it?

Apparently that is part of his chosen approach.

TV’s Frink said:

Lol at the idea that Trump is trying to solve anything.

As snark, fine. But what do you think he’s trying to do?

Possessed said:

The church has definitely not always been catholic.

I was Catholic once.

It used to not have an organization hierchy, which the Bible actually warns against having. Does NOT say priests should be celibate, encourages the opposite. Says call no man father, and I don’t even need to go any further on that one. Baptism for people of sound mind who understand the weight of the decision they are making (ie not babies).

I was a baby of sound mind at the time and called no man father, but certainly didn’t understand any of it.

I don’t even want to continue listing all the things catholics do different than the Bible as I’m sure you have a way to word yourself out of them, but claiming the church has always been catholic when the catholic church very clearly is very different than the early churches spoke of in the Bible is just silly.

The hierarchy and undue faith in men was a big part of what made my mother (and accordingly, me) leave. Ritual, faith in men, and hierarchy are virtual non-starters for me. But I appreciate the devotion of those who are Catholic.

dahmage said:

Mrebo said:

Trump will eventually leave office. Trump is trying to solve the illegal immigration issue. Is there a better way? What is it?

hah, really? The better way is what were were doing for the past several years before Sessions announced that they were going to separate families as a ‘deterrent’ (which past experience shows probably isn’t effective). Basically, use discretion and try not to separate families.

Look, laws exist and need to be followed, but there is ALWAYS discretion involved in how we enforce laws. and choosing to be a maximum power asshole about prosecution to the fullest extent of the law (And then throwing up your hands and saying ‘my hands are tied!’) isn’t the way to do anything.

But the law does prevent keeping families together for a long period of time where adults are prosecuted. There is usually some discretion, and now Trump (the hateful tyrant) is exercising it to keep families together for some amount of time.

I think Sessions comments were dumb and as noted the law limits keeping families together no matter what he thinks of the deterrent effect.

It seems shortsighted to dwell so much on whether families are kept together than on what will we do to address illegal immigration.

In other news, the Supreme Court today held that states can tax out-of-state online retailers.

dahmage, you say that Obama wasn’t in love with enforcing immigration law but Trump is.

I think immigration law is good and necessary. It’s far from perfect but if we are going to enforce it in any meaningful way it is going to impose hardships on those seeking to enter. Even those who manage to stay live as second-class ‘citizens.’

The decision to prosecute all who enter illegally is a hard choice. I know it’s easy to think of Trump as a combover twirling villain who enjoys inflicting hardship but illegal immigration has been rampant and unless we are going to do nothing about it, hardships will continue.

Trump will eventually leave office. Trump is trying to solve the illegal immigration issue. Is there a better way? What is it?

Warbler said:

Mrebo said:

In book I’ve been reading, this guy’s work translating the bible (really he oversaw the work) is discussed. Pretty interesting the interpretations we accept as legitimate.

Unfortunately I would have to subscribe to read the entire article. The problem with Thought for Thought translation is are you translating the text means or what you think the text means.

One example is the biblical parable about the foolishness of building a house on sand vs stone. For an Indonesian culture that has houses built on stilts it was translated as to build a house on metal stilts vs building out of a certain type of weak wood. The idea was to convey the meaning without requiring a lesson on house building foreign to their culture.

Your question is very interesting because isn’t a translation always just what the translator thinks a text means? Languages don’t align so neatly that you can just translate word for word and expect the same meaning to come through.

TM2YC said:

Jay said:

https://twitter.com/ImmCivilRights/status/1008902662828511232

It was bad policy when Obama and the Democrats supported it and it’s bad policy now, but it’s a travesty now because the media tells you it is and there are elections in a few months… nobody cared when it was Obama, and now suddenly it’s a national crisis. I guess hypocrisy has a short shelf life.

Agreed on the first part but the reason for it being highlighted now is not a double-standard, it is because Obama didn’t say Mexicans were all rapists and claim that Mexico was going to build the US a wall to keep themselves out. If Trump didn’t want the media to examine his border policy more closely than they did Obama’s policies, then he shouldn’t have had so many tantrums about it while screaming “Please pay attention to me!” all the time.

Poor reasons - even if true - for the media and the public to pay attention or not pay attention. Obama was awesome on papering over and distracting from his bad conduct and policies.

Yeah, as Dom says, lots we don’t know. And more a matter of finding happiness, love, whathaveyou, more than a “date.”

In book I’ve been reading, this guy’s work translating the bible (really he oversaw the work) is discussed. Pretty interesting the interpretations we accept as legitimate.

moviefreakedmind said:

DominicCobb said:

Handman said:

DominicCobb said:

Move somewhere else. Take better pictures of yourself.

This isn’t an option unless I uproot everything I’ve done this past year.

Fair enough. But it is an option.

It’s a really horrible option.

Why’s that?

Handman said:

DominicCobb said:

Move somewhere else. Take better pictures of yourself.

This isn’t an option unless I uproot everything I’ve done this past year.

Also, there’s nothing worse for online dating than a selfie. The damn word is just so stupid.

Thanks for the encouragement, everyone. I just wish finding friends were easy.

Selfie is a dumb word. People have been taking pictures of themselves since cameras were invented. Best you can do is come across as passionate about what you care about and clear about what you want.

TV’s Frink said:

Hahahahaha great job guy. Now you can claim victory for fixing your fuck up. And your dumbshit supporters will eat it up.

At best, it’s a stop gap measure. The law that exists does not permit keeping children in detention for more than 20 days, and adjudication of parents’ charges typically takes longer. The law needs to be changed or there is nothing that will keep parents and children together - absent not charging people who have kids. Many would prefer more lax enforcement of the laws but that’s another matter.

moviefreakedmind said:

Mrebo said:

moviefreakedmind said:

Republicans vs. human rights:

https://www.npr.org/2018/06/19/621435225/u-s-announces-its-withdrawal-from-u-n-s-human-rights-council?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=20180619

If that Council were useful and truly focused on Human Rights, I’d care.

The article explains why you should care.

It also comes at a poor time, given our own human rights violations.

Eh, it explains why crumbs are better than nothing. At least now the US won’t stand in the way of the Council scolding us, isn’t that great?

moviefreakedmind said:

Republicans vs. human rights:

https://www.npr.org/2018/06/19/621435225/u-s-announces-its-withdrawal-from-u-n-s-human-rights-council?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=20180619

If that Council were useful and truly focused on Human Rights, I’d care.

Schumer opposes changing the law so as to keep families together because he says Trump could just choose to keep families together. I have no idea how Cruz’s bill would work but that’s a bad argument.

TV’s Frink said:

Mrebo said:

The article says the law requires separation where criminal prosecution pursued and that such separations did thereby occur under Obama.

Obviously that’s not all the article says, but it does say that.

I’m not sure anyone in this thread claimed it never happened under Obama.

suspiciouscoffee

The article says the law requires separation where criminal prosecution pursued and that such separations did thereby occur under Obama.

Obviously that’s not all the article says, but it does say that.

You’re right it’s about political fuel. What are we supposed to do with the many unaccompanied minors who cross the border? What do we do about the massive illegal immigration in general? Complaining when the disfavored party is in power and the media spoonfeeds us daily outrages isn’t meaningful.

In other news, the Supreme Court avoided ruling on the merits in 2 gerrymandering cases, and in the process threw cold water on the “efficiency gap” theory.

The Court is allowing the case to proceed but the plaintiffs have to show they as individuals have been harmed by gerrymandering.