Mocata

People not being brave enough to tell George things aren’t quite right sums up the whole PT.

John_ said:

Star Wars 9 Adds Dominic Monaghan To Its Cast

Awesome! I’ve always been a fan of Monaghan; he was great in LOTR and Lost.

Forest coloured ponchos? What a rehash!

But neither Fake-Tarkin or Jar-Jar were the first rough attempts at a ground breaking idea that paved the way etc. They’re both just expensive failures by people that should know better.

DominicCobb said:
The theory that Qui-Gon is the only Jedi Anakin ever saw as a “truly good man” is a nice theory, but ultimately just that - a theory. There’s evidence to support it, but at the end of the day nothing like that is ever clearly (or even subtly) communicated in the films.

The entire character of Qui-Gon is utterly wasted since nothing results from his death. If Obi-Wan was reckless in TPM and it caused him to become more stoic, then that would be a character thing. If he was a figure that Anakin looked up to and Obi-Wan always failed to match him as a teacher then that would be a character thing. But for any of that to work you have to actually write characters.

If the goal was to create a grand political drama full of behind the scenes manoeuvring and sinister goings on… then they failed. If the goal was to create another three Star Wars films about action, adventure and heroism… then they also failed. One of the biggest problems is all of this should have been re-drafted and re-fined over and over to get it just right, but instead it’s a botched kitchen sink effort with too much all at once. What is it George says in the DVD extras “oh they’re building sets, I better start writing the script”. Haha yeah no kidding.

GlastoEls said:

Can suspect disbelief for the five seconds we see Leia’s face, honestly. All good.

If they spend millions of dollars on it and you still have to suspend your disbelief then something its wrong. Everyone needs that little voice that says “maybe we shouldn’t”. Honestly I’m shocked that it was even done this way when the fighter pilots were just cut from existing footage, that would have been much better.

snooker said:

Funny you mention Leia’s movement cause she was a real actress under the CG face. (Unless you meant facial movement.)

That’s the problem with both of the characters in RO to be honest. Putting someone else’s face over the bone structure of another actor.

To fix it would be easy, just delete those scenes. No cringe and better continuity.

pittrek said:

I said it before, say it again - Yoda with a lightsabre is like Gandhi with a machine gun

Worst. Because they had one simple job to do and they blew it.

Personally I think it looks like a videogame from 10 years ago when cel shading was a big fad. But I don’t care for this type of show in general. As for the viewer reaction, it looks like a kids show. People don’t like the suggestion that SW is for general viewing, they want to feel like big adults. While watching a Disney channel show.

Weird, and pointless. A true SE alteration.

dahmage said:

djsmokingjam said:

DrDre said:

Here are two links from the same critic. The first discusses weaknesses in RJ’s story, and argues that TLJ’s biggest weakness is, that the story doesn’t go anywhere. There are no consequences.

Short summary:

"In The Last Jedi, a lot happens. But not a lot happens for long. Leia’s sudden and unexpected death only proceeds her jarring return to life.

Kylo Ren’s betrayal of Snoke, which leads to a team-up with Rey and himself against Snoke’s guards, implies his redemption… But it isn’t long lasting as his actions hardly reflect his intentions. After the fight, he has to explain himself to Rey, and how they still aren’t on the same side.

This is a classic break from “show, don’t tell.” Kylo has to tell us his motives for the scene to make sense. He essentially retcons the entire sequence, because it might as well not have happened. The scene ends up telling us nothing new. Kylo Ren is a bad guy. But we were already aware of that. Actions should speak for a character, but in the most powerful scene of the film, they don’t.

Lastly, when Luke finally faces Kylo, there’s a moment where we’re meant to believe this is the end for the Jedi Master. It seems as if Luke has accepted his fate as Kylo runs toward him with his blade drawn. Luke literally tells him something similar to what Ben Kenobi tells Darth Vader: “If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine.”

Luke seems fearless. But then, we realize Luke has nothing to fear after all. He’s not even actually there. This scene is meant for us to anticipate Luke’s death, only for it to be revealed he’s fine… Only for it to be revealed a moment later that he dies anyway."

Both these points seem incredibly pedantic and overinflated to me.

In the first instance, “show don’t tell” does not mean either that dialogue is redundant in cinema, or that actions and dialogue always have to be in perfect concert, especially regarding villains (who are often by nature duplicitous or unstable). The entire point of the throne room sequence is to set up an expectation (Kylo will side with Rey) that is then upended; in much the same way as the action at the end of ESB sets up an expectation (Vader wants to kill Luke) that is then contradicted by dialogue (“I am your father”) rather than action.

On the second point, he’s just being incredibly literal. The entire subtext of the dialogue is not that whether Luke will literally be struck down - Luke has already made it clear throughout the film that he does not fear death - but that in opposing him, Kylo ensures Luke’s reputation will echo throughout the galaxy and that thousands will be inspired by his example, which we see happen in the final scene.

To say there are no consequences to the events in the film is absurdly reductive, and frankly typical of the wilfully and uncharitably misreading “criticism” I’ve seen so much of about this film.

Just want you to know there are many who agree with you, but we have tired of posting in this thread. Excellent points.

Agreed.

8 months later people are still arguing over this.

But 8 months later it’s still in the Blu-ray chart.

Kinda looks like the Jedi pool thing from TLJ in the centre there.

Deadpool has the kind of jokes in it that they fired James Gunn for making, so in a way this was always incoming. They did use to have Touchstone releases as mentioned above, but I wonder if that era has passed? I’m unsure what they’re involved in these days.

You can’t sell limited editions and time releases on a streaming platform.

Dennis Lawson wanted more than a few lines so he’s not gonna be back.

Collipso said:
one must be really in tune and have a master’s control of the force to be able to perform it. that is why Luke mind tricking Bib Fortuna at Jabba’s Palace means he’s grown from novice to master.

But there’s no evidence for this at all. We can infer that Luke reached this level by using the same powers as Obi-wan perhaps. But again it turns into a nonsensical discussion about power levels, limit breaks and experience points.

in the OT it’s left apparent that one’s progression in sword fighting goes along with one’s progression of the mastery of the force. i guess that makes sense, given that the more you master the force the faster your reflexes are going to be, so yeah.

and Luke was in his physical peak during the OT and we watched Yoda push him to his physical limit while in Dagobah; so that, alongside the use of the force, makes me not see any sort of problem in him doing martial arts jumps and stuff.

But Yoda never shows him any sort of blocks and parries etc. and the running and jumping tricks he uses are more physical than the kind of sudden rush of speed he uses to escape the carbon freeze. There are lots of gaps and it’s all just fine. I just don’t see the kind of perfect training regimen that people seem to demand Rey experience to get any skills at all. It’s all just grasping straws.

screams in the void said:

lovelikewinter said:

screams in the void said:

I keep hearing the same RUMOR about Hayden . Where is it officially stated that he is coming back ?

I keep hearing JJ is going to tie the three trilogies together. That scares me. Im still irritated about the Darth Sidious reference in Last Jedi.

curious as to where you keep hearing this .

It’s this interview https://geektyrant.com/news/jj-abrams-reportedly-said-that-star-wars-episode-ix-will-unite-all-three-trilogies

lovelikewinter said:

Tobar said:

Having Hayden Christensen appear in IX is my single biggest fear for the film.

If that were to happen I’d have to write off the entire ST and I’d rather not do that. =/

If JJ legitimizes the Special Editions, I don’t know what I will do. I’m sick of the idiot PT and Clone Wars fans.

I hadn’t ever considered this as a thing that could happen. Thanks for that.

Jay said:

After Rey’s childhood, there’s nothing zen about her. I can’t buy the notion that a week’s worth of stress focused her mind and turned the coal into a diamond. Show me a monk who achieves enlightenment in a week.

I don’t disagree. But I also don’t see what you mean, the finale of ROTJ is nothing like what happened so far in the ST outside Luke’s story.

Whether you define the scope of what it means to be a Jedi as flipping around and floating rocks or a spiritual, zen-like state of mind, neither should be possible to the extent Rey is capable within a few days.

I guess I just don’t mind it that much. It’s more believable that she figured all these things out after contact with Kylo that it is Anakin can flight a Naboo starfighter.

Collipso said:

Possessed said:

And where did he pick up all those moves he used in Return of the Jedi that he didn’t learn from Yoda in esb? I believe he… Dare I even say it… Figured them out himself?

such as? i can only think of the mind trick that was in the movie to basically tell the audience that Luke had grown from novice in SW to master in RotJ. other than that…

New powers in ROTJ were force choke and force mind trick… which he learned by copying others. In the established screen canon he doesn’t even learn to sword fight. He never learns speed / jump powers either. Or the telekinesis. OR the power to sense Vaders feelings. What exactly is the problem suddenly? This thread is just all over the place. Rey is learns too quickly. Luke was out of character. The Phantom Menace was a good film. Jeez.