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Are there people who don’t like that he opened up Cloud City and showed crowds and stuff?
Or is that change generally liked?
Hayden’s ghost.
Please don’t bring that into other threads.
Anakin’s ghost. I just typed that thinking about the other conversation.
I guess he wasn’t too worried about how badly Owen and Beru age in only 20 years. Otherwise he would have cast actors that were a bit older for AOTC.
Have you ever seen that picture of the lady who sat at a desk with one cheek to the window for many years?
Her sun exposed cheek looks extremely prematurely aged.
Oh, I’m sorry, I didn’t realize “a majority of fans” was an absolute statement. I didn’t realize that meant “literally every single person who ever saw the movie.” Sorry. Guess I need to go back to elementary school and re-learn how to speak English.
You’re the one who seems insistent that it was this huge gaping problem until Wise Old George decided to fix this massive flaw in the narrative.
Put it this way,
George Lucas>Mike Stoklasa+JJ Abrams
You act like you’re the only person who existed during that time, therefore only your perceptions have merit.
I’m phrasing it how I am because you keep dealing in baseless absolutes.
Wasn’t a problem for anyone from 1983-2004.
Source?
The vast majority of fans that weren’t confused in that 21 year period…? I never met anyone who didn’t recognize Shaw as Anakin before 2004. You’re really twisting things if you think it was ever an actual issue for anyone.
You’d be surprised. When VHS is the only major way to watch the movies.
Even if that was a feasible idea, if Luke stole Rey’s thunder and came all the way to Starkiller base to face down Kylo Ren, what would the entire plot of TLJ be about?
Luke showing us what he’s learned in his travels and Kylo chatting with Hayden’s ghost.
He hasn’t been in the movie at that point? It would confuse the audience, I think, and would seem incredibly out of place.
Meh, the movie is already jumbled, and it would jolt people awake.
Ideally you would have my idea followed by Mark Hamill’s idea of the lightsaber shaking with the force and then flying not into Rey’s hand- but Luke’s.
When Han dies, after it cuts to Leia, it should cut to Luke.
You could use a couple shots for this.
I personally think a Watsonian argument for a young Force ghost Anakin is irrelevant. If JJ wants the Sebastian Shaw version of Force ghost Anakin, they’ll make a hamdwavy explanation for it like they did to explain how our heroes could see Starkiller destroy Hosnian Prime from across the galaxy. I think a director’s concern for canon is low-priority. The story group can just say, “Well, Force ghosts can take whatever shape they want, and Anakin decides to be his older, redeemed self at this particular moment, so it doesn’t contradict the SE ending of ROTJ.”
I can see JJ making this decision. But it does come with a few cons when you look at it outside of his own personal preference.
First of all, they might need to use CGI to recreate a version of Shaw-Anakin, like they did for Tarkin in Rogue One. To me, the biggest issue would be that anyone who grew up watching any post-2004 versions of ROTJ are used to seeing Hayden-Anakin as a Force ghost, and probably wouldn’t even recognize who he was at first.On the other hand, having Hayden come back as Force ghost Anakin has some benefits. He will be immediately recognizable as Anakin to even the casual Star Wars fan. They could just film Hayden as he is now, since he has not aged dramatically in the past decade+ since filming Revenge. While some fans might rolls their eyes at the addition of Hayden, a lot of younger fans who grew up with the prequels and Clone Wars will likely appreciate the addition, especially since online sentiment towards the prequels seems to have turned around slightly in the past few years.
To me, audience familiarity is strongest argument for Hayden to play Force ghost Anakin.
I definitely can see arguments for or against that choice. I do think if you try to look at it objectively, having Hayden return as Anakin seem to be the most likely option, if Force ghost Anakin even appears at all (I would surprised if he did anything more than pop up briefly). Even if JJ might initially want old Anakin, I could see how he might be persuaded otherwise for those reasons. Sorry if I’m just reiterating what has already been said.
I want Hayden, but honestly I think JJ won’t show Anakin in any form because of the issues you describe.
If the man has a mental breakdown at the sight of Podracer flags and makes his CG guys redo those shots because “my movie isn’t about podracing”, then he would never in a bajillion years put Hayden’s Anakin in his movie.
And it can’t really not be Hayden from Disney’s perspective, for the reasons you mention.
This series seems awesome so far. I don’t know if you guys read Charles Soule’s Vader comic, but this seems like a continuation of that.
And hopefully the ending is less anticlimactic than the final issue of Vader was.
I love “Vader mopes over Padme” stories, and I LOVE “Sith try to mess with the barrier between life and death” stories.
This stuff has roots in at least 1980, because there’s this image in Rinzler’s ESB book that has Vader thinking about a beautiful woman as he sits in his egg chamber thing.
I never had a problem with it. You see Vader unmasked and then a third guy shows up to the dinner party so naturally you can assume who it is. But honestly we might just wanna back off of this guy there’s no reasoning with him
It’s not that it can’t be puzzled out. It’s that having to stop and think takes you out of the movie. Not to mention Hayden looks more like Mark than he does.
It would please both OOT and SE fans
Would it though?
Well, maybe not you, but it would please almost everyone else.
I disagree and Hayden force ghost in ROTJ SE is one of the things that pissed me off the most.
Shaw kinda doesn’t have the necessary impact the first time since you have to figure out who this rando is.
It’s that hard to recognize his face as the one Luke saw when he took Vader’s helmet off?
On VHS I didn’t recognize the guy.
Wasn’t a problem for anyone from 1983-2004.
Source?
It would please both OOT and SE fans
Would it though?
Well, maybe not you, but it would please almost everyone else.
I disagree and Hayden force ghost in ROTJ SE is one of the things that pissed me off the most.
Shaw kinda doesn’t have the necessary impact the first time since you have to figure out who this rando is.
Has nothing to do with canon whatsoever.
Well there’s no argument which is canon.
I thought we were talking about influence.
Another SE style thing would be the ship combat scenes. The ST uses no practical scale ship models. (That I’m aware of.)
That’s just the forward march of special effects technology. Heck, the SE’s and bits of TPM used scale models for some material (e.g., the sandcrawler, several TPM ships, etc.).
Yep, exactly. I don’t see how using more contemporary filmmaking techniques means the SE is any more canon than the OOT.
See above.
Another SE style thing would be the ship combat scenes. The ST uses no practical scale ship models. (That I’m aware of.)
That’s just the forward march of special effects technology. Heck, the SE’s and bits of TPM used scale models for some material (e.g., the sandcrawler, several TPM ships, etc.).
Maybe, but for all the lip service JJ paid to “practical effects”, it’s Favreau with The Mandalorian that is busting out the miniature ship models.
Another SE style thing would be the ship combat scenes. The ST uses no practical scale ship models. (That I’m aware of.)
I was under the impression we saw a different entrance to the Yavin hangar in R1. There are four sides after all.
I feel like they would show the same side just for nostalgia’s sake.
if Leia’s planet blew up, I’d expect more than “we have no time for sorrows commander”.
I take it your aren’t in the military nor do you know many who are.
That’s just how things are. She’s got bigger fish to fry at the moment. No time to cry about your home when you’re trying to literally save the rest of the galaxy.
But even her tone is too unnaffected.
Lucas was criticized for his direction at the time, remember.
Is there a way, on Android, to play video files without the blacks being washed out? Like MPC on PC does?
I trust you didn’t watch the 2004 version of THX?
Other than the highway car shots, pretty much all the changes are improvements IMO.
Looks at name of forum, then your post, then at name of forum again and goes cross-eyed.
The Star Wars SEs have more questionable stuff in them than THX 2004 does IMO.
The effects are less dodgy, most of it doesn’t change the tone, and like the best SE changes, it makes the world feel less low budget. The THX working scenes feel a lot better with people out of focus in the background all toiling away too.It does so change the tone. The vast underground cityscapes take away from the claustropohic feel of the original. Lucas got the look he wanted by shooting real locations in Northern California. Things like the video screen above the complaint box are pointless, and the hands on the Robert Duvall stand in on the monitor aren’t even in the same position. And don’t get me started on those mangy CGI baboons that replaced some of the shell dwellers. The bigger crime is there’s no way for the average viewer to know they’re watching an altered version. There are no SE credits. There isn’t even a crappy non-anamorphic DVD of the original for people to choose to watch.
Many members of this site have dedicated years to preserving the original THX, so you’re barking up a very large non-cgi tree on this.I get preserving these things, but that doesn’t mean the altered version sucks.
Not inherently, but THX’s DC has more wrong with it than ESB’s Special Edition if you ask me. I hate that it’s most people’s first/only exposure to the film.
I’ll concede that it’s overall less offensive than ANH and ROTJ’s SE’s, though.
At least the SE’s don’t have anyone rolling their eyes up into their heads like a fugitive from Toon Town. 😉
I was surprised to learn that the eyes were altered.
I trust you didn’t watch the 2004 version of THX?
Other than the highway car shots, pretty much all the changes are improvements IMO.
Looks at name of forum, then your post, then at name of forum again and goes cross-eyed.
The Star Wars SEs have more questionable stuff in them than THX 2004 does IMO.
The effects are less dodgy, most of it doesn’t change the tone, and like the best SE changes, it makes the world feel less low budget. The THX working scenes feel a lot better with people out of focus in the background all toiling away too.It does so change the tone. The vast underground cityscapes take away from the claustropohic feel of the original. Lucas got the look he wanted by shooting real locations in Northern California. Things like the video screen above the complaint box are pointless, and the hands on the Robert Duvall stand in on the monitor aren’t even in the same position. And don’t get me started on those mangy CGI baboons that replaced some of the shell dwellers. The bigger crime is there’s no way for the average viewer to know they’re watching an altered version. There are no SE credits. There isn’t even a crappy non-anamorphic DVD of the original for people to choose to watch.
Many members of this site have dedicated years to preserving the original THX, so you’re barking up a very large non-cgi tree on this.
Eh, you say claustrophobia, I say “obvious lack of resources”. The only tone hurting change is the Hot Wheels scene IMO.
The 2004 version doesn’t change the freakyness of the society at all for me.
Also my third favorite shot is a digitally altered one- the lizard with wings.
I get preserving these things, but that doesn’t mean the altered version sucks.
Heck, I signed up mostly because of those film prints of TPM and AotC.
There might be wiggle room on that as Yoda looks a tad younger in TLJ, or at least happier.
Luke probably didn’t know what young Anakin even looked like at the time, but Kylo worships his grandfather so either form could appear to him and make more sense than the SE change.
But seeing as Kylo is based on Hayden’s Anakin in many ways, having some kind of CG-Sebatsian-Shaw-voiced-by-Matt-Lanter monstrosity would be lame IMO.
Anakin could make a point about the life he could have lived had he not fallen, going from healthy Sebastian to Sebastian right after the helmet came off would emphasize that. Kylo may have ignored certain aspects of Anakin’s life soley focusing on the Vader aspect.
Or, in keeping with appeasing everybody, young Anakin is Hayden, and CG Shaw is unmasked old Anakin. Who voices Shaw though?