Jar Jar Bricks

Adywan, or anybody making an edit of ROTJ, is free to use these:

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1zlE34aGJd-yL0S_f52YbJwPko4fPAUQb?usp=sharing

If for whatever reason these two particular takes of the line aren’t up to snuff I’ll add more.

dgraham, I have some alternative lines where it sounds like he’s starting to cry a bit beneath the mask toward the end. So I guess it’s up to you guys. Do you want him to storm off angry (which we kinda see that he does) or more so in shame/embarrassment? Do we want to start to see through the cracks in his mask this early in the movie or do we want him to remain firm in his convictions?

Anyways, RL just came through with the Vader lines, and it sounds perfect. I haven’t extended out the beginning so there’s more buildup yet, but I promise I’ll get to that! I just wanted to use the project file I had saved previously:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/10vIG5jzb-LXmkNBMIWUNt39CYbAYCniZ/view?usp=sharing

That’s interesting. I’d previously been using a lighter delivery, but my brother told me he preferred this line because he thinks he should sound more angry. I can take another look at it.

I don’t think he ever made one for Episode 2. I’d love it if he did though, would be awesome to have the Obi-Wan show flashback integrated with it all.

To make this idea more clear, here’s what I’m thinking.

“What are you doing here?”

“I saw myself on the dark throne. I’m never leaving this place, I’m doing what you did.”

“I was wrong. I feared I’d only push Ben toward that fate. What are you most afraid of?”

EDIT: This would then explain why we have a scene earlier of Luke talking to Kylo. He’s confronting his fear, which is the “destiny of a Jedi”. See how everything comes full circle? 😉 And it still works in the context of TLJ alone, as he wanted the Jedi to end so that the dark wouldn’t be as oppressive or retributive. Same concept, just in a slightly different context. So not a retcon, especially compared to what was there originally.

Here’s a random thing that I’m thinking about. I know EddieDean, in one of the previous threads, said that it shouldn’t be too clear what everyone’s respective destiny is orchestrated by Palpatine / by the will of the Force. But I genuinely think that is one of the greatest strengths here.

The reason Luke immediately gives up on Kylo, but was willing to give Vader a chance, is because he literally saw that Ben was destined to rule the galaxy as a tyrannical ruler and never be redeemed. This is why he cannot believe Rey’s own vision of her redeeming Kylo in TLJ. Which we of course know Luke was correct about in that film, at least. Furthermore, we know Rey is destined for the same dark fate due to her vision in this film.

We don’t want to deny either of these as fact, as that would mean by the end of TROS that Luke wasn’t wise enough to acknowledge the limits of foresight, acting upon a foolish notion that they are inevitable, and it would also mean visions of the future are false if you just try hard enough. None of this is particularly satisfying, since as we learned from Anakin’s story and Luke drawing his lightsaber, everything points to the idea that the more you try to resist fate the quicker it comes about. This would give Luke a reason for going to Ahch-To, because he believed that being involved in the fight would only draw that dark fate closer.

That’s why I think it’s critical to emphasize that the dyad is so powerful that it allows them to change fate itself. This means Luke was arguably justified in all his actions, and it doesn’t diminish the value of foresight in the Star Wars universe going forward. We can just make an exclusion in this case, and the fact that their bond was something created by the Force itself makes it seem like this was the wrench it intentionally threw into Palpy’s machinations so the good guys can win.

Everything also lines up with this idea. So, for example, despite Leia’s best efforts, Kylo can’t be redeemed and is going to die leaving Rey alone to inherit the throne… until Rey is somehow able to heal his fatal wound. Rey is about to slice down Palpatine in the ritual… until Ben reaches out to her through the dyad. Heck, even going back to TLJ, Snoke says that he cannot be beaten and that he sees everything that will transpire… until he gets fooled by the distraction set forth by Kylo using Rey as bait.

losthead said:

Ooh, I like that one a lot. My only suggestion would be spacing it out just a bit, it feels somewhat cut up atm. Especially building up before the Vader reveal, it should have more room to breathe imo

Ordinarily I’d agree. But this is TROS we’re trying to fit into, where everything feels like it’s been cut down to the shortest possible run time. I’m aiming for around the same run time as when Rey enters Palpatine’s Wayfinder shrine - which is exactly 1 minute between the door closing on her and her falling back outside of it. Currently, just the vision part of Kylo’s scene is at 1 minutes 11 seconds, which I think matches the circumstances. We don’t want a side story like this to drag the entire plotline to a complete stop.

EDIT: Right, I should also mention that I’m trying to cut around parts where they have voice acting baked in. So the parts that are missing at the beginning are gone mostly for that reason. Although I could see about extending his wandering through the snow a bit at the very start to allow a little build up.

Good to hear! I’ve already started assembling the Vader AI clone. Let’s cross our fingers that it turns out well. I see no reason why it shouldn’t but you never know with technology. For example, I just tried to create the following exchange between Zorri and Poe on Kijimi:

“How long has it been like this?”

“Ever since Skywalker. But everyone’s only out for themselves. I’ve saved up enough to get out…”

This would be a perfect way to convey an uprising on Kijimi without being too in your face about it or making it too clear what’s going to happen by the end of the movie. Because if they are all resisting as one because of Skywalker on Kijimi, then Poe has no right to complain the very next second about nobody coming on Crait and thinking the same thing is bound to happen again. But if Skywalker has only made selfish opportunists (at least from Zorri’s perspective) resist the First Order, then Poe has every reason to be apprehensive.

Anyway, while the voice clone sounds identical to the actress, it can’t quite pick up that weird voice modulation effect she has. Does anybody know how exactly that could be replicated? The only alternative would be to dub all of her lines in this scene when her visor is closed, but that seems kinda disrespectful to the actress. I’d love to include this for this edit and possibly even Ascendant v5, but until we replicate it that’s probably not happening. Not a big deal either way, but would be cool:

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1tiDKw2bx3SstVF2k7Sr_Q4eaccAoXCwd?usp=sharing

Here is what I’m thinking for the duel dialogue now:

“You were never real!”

“Your fear is.”

They fight.

“Your mind dwells on your failure here. You are unworthy.”

And here is a test with all of the audio incorporated except for Vader’s lines, any music we want to add, and none of the audio from TROS:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ZCa7rcVks5-rshPiXI8J53GM5TI77kJM/view?usp=sharing

I’m now satisfied with the lines for the Kylo and Luke scene. It just needs the sounds originally from the scene, minus the original music.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1QqcnX1e1Hb2lhCuCPh4Cho3bejxjY6XM/view?usp=sharing

I am not a screenwriter haha. This is why I shared it the essence of what I wanted to convey before generating anything. I like all that.

TheDimitrios said:

This kinda lines up nicely with the timing of the Cloning Palp Storyline from BB. Right after Anakin becomes uninteresting as a host via barbecue, Palps starts the Clone project.

Yes, this is my intention. Palpatine says to Yoda that Anakin will become more powerful than either of them, but then when he gets burned to a crisp he loses a lot of his potential. His cloning projects would explain why he isn’t bothering with creating more life again, because it’s the far safer option of the two. Then Luke shows up and his plans change again. He dies anyways, and makes Snoke who falls apart and inhabits a clone which is also falling apart. At this point he realizes cloning isn’t viable, creating Rey (if that’s your interpretation) and starting to groom Ben into Kylo.

As for the japor snippet, I really wish it was simply in Kylo’s quarters in reality. I’m not sure if it belongs in that vision since Palpatine’s hands are in that in some ways. In an ideal world, he is simply keeping that artifact in his quarters with the rest of them and brings it with him to Endor to give to Rey. Then we could have a shot of him clutching it before/after Han shows up. And we could place it between the twin’s lightsabers that Rey buries on Tatooine. In other words, I don’t think this is particularly feasible without people willing to contribute VFX.

Thanks! It would also be the hangar scene, if you don’t mind. I’m sure this will all take quite a while to do.

I like it for a couple of reasons. For one thing, the way Snoke was cast aside so easily in TLJ warrants an explanation for his origins that is equally mundane - such as being a puppet (with the red curtains in his throne room to match). For another, we know Anakin’s ghost is fully detached from Vader. Therefore, there is nobody who could be speaking to Kylo through that mask besides Palpatine. Now, sure, you could make the argument that he never actually saw or heard anything, treating it more like an inanimate idol. But then we have to explain why he is seeing something now for the first time, which we simply don’t have the time for.

I think the reason Kylo goes to the mask is simply because Palpatine is a notorious liar. He wants to make sure he’s telling the truth about his beloved grandfather. Perhaps even let out his rage at Palpatine through it. Which is, of course, what he does by killing “Vader”. It doesn’t need to be more complicated than that.

But Rey’s does talk, at least with one line, in this movie. What if we just remove Vader’s second line? I think it’s important to clarify that this doesn’t necessarily have to be “just Palpatine” he’s fighting, since we’d have learned that Palpatine has been Vader this whole time.

I’ve talked to the guys who made it briefly and it sounds like they’re going to look for a version without music, but they have to hope the file still exists somewhere.

So far, here is the dialogue I’m thinking of:

“You’re just Palpatine.”

“I am your own fear.”

They fight briefly, and Kylo loses badly.

“It is no wonder your mind dwells on this forest… You are unworthy!”

Then he pulls the old Snoke maneuver on “Vader”. I personally like the idea that Kylo uses tactics outlawed by the Sith and Jedi in the scene - shutting off his lightsaber while interlocked, and launching a saber at him. It shows he doesn’t care about tradition, just whatever gives him the edge in terms of power.

I don’t have a Vader voice clone yet, but it should be fairly easy to do. Once I have it, I’ll also generate “Your mother once thought as you do” for Ady’s Episode 6 thread. If he wants it, that is.

Jar Jar Bricks said:

In the meantime, my personal goal at present is to create a draft of the Kylo Ren and Luke conversation. I’m eyeing the track “Torn Apart” from TFA, mostly because it fits the mood of the scene with the Falcon being transported to the Star Destroyer and since they allude to Han’s death (and possibly even Chewie’s).

I’ve finished a rough test of this, and I think it works fairly well. I’d love to hear some thoughts about it, but keep in mind that the sounds of the TIEs aren’t there yet and neither are Kylo’s footsteps at the end. When the screen goes blank, that’s where the transition back to BB-8 stumbling upon D-O would be.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1qQyQltxI54mePv91WIZ4XGJYQi4pJiMP/view?usp=sharing

EDIT: I’ve updated the Kylo Ren lines for more inflection to match the feedback of my brother. Second edit, I’ve changed them again.

Thank you for your endorsements, everyone!

Hal, the first order of business would be to create a version of the Ascendant dyad-duel scene and hangar scene with all of his lines removed except for the following:

• Rey. Wherever you are, you are hard to find.
• I pushed you in the desert because I needed to see it. I needed you to see it. (Remove this line, still). Rey…
• So that’s where you are…

This will almost assuredly be a resource for other editors like Nev. Although, if it’s easier to blend in new lines than it is to create an almost entirely blank scene for some reason, just let me know. No rush on this, either.

In the meantime, my personal goal at present is to create a draft of the Kylo Ren and Luke conversation. I’m eyeing the track “Torn Apart” from TFA, mostly because it fits the mood of the scene with the Falcon being transported to the Star Destroyer and since they allude to Han’s death (and possibly even Chewie’s).

Furthermore, I’m also going to get in contact with Seize the Frame, the creators of the Vader vs. Kylo Ren fan film. I mostly want to see if they have a 5.1 surround version of the project they’d be willing to contribute, or at the very least a version of it without the voices or music, only the foley.

Thank you! I don’t doubt that this project will take most of the year to develop at the very least. But I wanted to get a jumpstart on things so that we have a (somewhat) firm foundation to build upon.

This is an ongoing fanedit of The Rise of Skywalker based on Hal 9000’s TROS Ascendant. Furthermore, it is intended to be paired with NeverarGreat’s The Force Awakens: Starlight. Most changes will be accomplished using AI voice work, although I can guarantee all of them will be as seamless as possible. If you don’t believe me, then listen to some of the samples linked below.

The main goals of this project are to bring clarity to Rey’s backstory and Palpatine’s motivations, which are some of the messiest parts of this film (even after the changes made by Ascendant), as well as enhance Kylo Ren’s arc to be more congruent with where The Last Jedi left him and his established fear of living up to Vader’s legacy. This is especially important in a film that has the central theme of “confronting fear”. He is arguably the most meaningful character in this trilogy, and this edit will effectively convey his independence and own goals despite Palpatine’s return.

Below are some of the changes you should expect in this edit:

• “Vader” calls out to his grandson on Mustafar (matching Adam acting like he heard something startling), leading Kylo to his Wayfinder
• Instead of Palpatine simply instructing Kylo Ren to kill Rey when he goes to Vader’s mask, Palpatine will take the form of his grandfather and they will duel on the site of Kylo’s greatest insecurity - Starkiller Base. This scene will make it clear that Kylo is not interested in the Sith at all and wants to make something new. The implication by the end of the scene is that Kylo has shut Palpatine’s voice(s) out of his head, perhaps even by the re-construction of his mask. Various tests of this can be found in this thread.
• Replace Kylo Ren’s line: “Palpatine wants you dead” with “Palpatine wants me to fight you.” Off-screen from the first scene of the film, Palpatine has told Kylo that he wants either him OR Rey to take the throne (but not both), depending on who is the strongest.
• Luke will reach out to Kylo Ren, trying to convince him to come back to the light. This replaces another instance of Palpatine simply telling Kylo to kill Rey. This is meant to fulfill his line from TLJ: “See ya around, kid.” It also is meant to chip away at the idea that Palpatine is the only voice trying to speak into his head. And finally, it makes their appearance together at the end of the film less awkward since they didn’t leave on the best of terms in TLJ.
• Instead of explicitly going after Rey, Palpatine will simply be going after his son in the backstory, unaware that Rey exists. This makes Ochi less of an idiot for not finding a child left alone on Jakku, or for not noticing the screaming child in his rear view mirror. We no longer have to rationalize his ship leaving Jakku as his parents having stolen his ship at a prior date to make sense of things, he can actually be on board it now. Palpatine only discovers Rey’s existence at an undefined point, perhaps in The Force Awakens, but it doesn’t really matter.
• The second flashback of Rey’s parents has been recontextualized to suggest that Palpatine was checking to see if Rey’s father could now use the Force, but had him killed when he discovered he’s a “powerless failure”. This matches other canon content about Rey’s father, and is accomplished without spoiling Rey’s heritage in the moment.
• Kylo will make it clear at the end of their dyad fight that Palpatine wants one of them to take the dark throne, instead of talking about Palpatine wanting to kill a child. This makes Rey’s terrified reaction more justified (“No…!”), since she’s had a vision of herself upon it.
• Reinstate Kylo’s line to “we’re a dyad in the Force”. I personally prefer that this was something always shared between them, given their interrogation scene in TFA.
• (Possibly) add an additional sentence at the end of Kylo’s reveal: “We’ll kill him. Together. And make a new order.”
• Modify a conversation between Finn and Poe to suggest that Ochi only discovered Rey’s existence from a vision given by his dagger after killing her parents and was intent on informing the Emperor about her on Exegol - only to end up dying with the secret. This explains why Ochi would be returning to Exegol according to D-0 instead of finishing the mission he was sent on in the original film (killing Rey) by going back to Jakku. In this new chain of events, he needs to find out what Palpatine wants to do about this development before he can even look into his Jakku lead for the child.
• Replace Luke’s line of “It was fear that kept me here” with something along the lines of “Failure was my greatest fear” to prevent Luke in TLJ from being a complete coward. This is not what Rian Johnson intended, he wanted Luke to genuinely feel that his intervention would lead to failure.
• Reinstate Palpatine’s line: “For my grandchild to come home! I never wanted you dead. I wanted you here, with me.”
• Luke reaches out to Ben a final time as he clutches a dead Rey, encouraging him in the moment. This matches perfectly with some unexplained acting Adam Driver does where it appears he hears somebody and starts looking around in the distance.

EDIT: Double-post

Darth Raditz said:

Going with the idea that the dagger was created by Palpatine, have Rey use that against him. Rey faces her fear, focuses in on the dagger’s origin, and uses that to get to Exegol (and leave coordinates for the Resistance to follow. That’s how you get around the lack of Wayfinders.

Nah, sorry, I can’t buy that. If Rey could use the dagger itself to find Exegol, they never would have gone to Endor in the first place. Remember, the dagger was made to guide the user to a Wayfinder. This is stated several times in the movie. Plus, there’s no indication she has it with her on Ahch-To. I think it got dropped somewhere on the Death Star wreckage? Not sure.

EDIT: Yeah, just checked the movie. The dagger was in her bag, which mysteriously disappears once Kylo appears in front of her. I’m assuming that in canon it was set on the ground in the destroyed throne room.

I couldn’t help myself, so I decided to come back LMAO.

There’s some good discussion here. I do like the idea that Kylo wants to nope the hell out. But I’m unsure how this would work within the context of what we have. Kylo smashes the Wayfinder that Rey finds to pieces and says, “The only way you’re getting to Exegol is with me.” This would ordinally work by simply removing that line, but then you have the problem of the other Wayfinder being on board his own ship, which implies he was planning on going there with Rey in his ship. He would have destroyed the other Wayfinder as well if he no longer wanted any part in this. Plus, it makes their fight scene quite pointless, as previously pointed out.

What I like about the idea on the other thread is that it gives purpose to why Kylo made the choices that he did in his life, and why he’s still so interested in the dark side. Kylo will tell Rey that they’re destined for power because Palpatine used the Force to make their bloodlines, and in turn manipulate their fates. Luke saw that Ben was destined for a dark power in TLJ (the Sith throne), and that’s why he drew his lightsaber on him. Kylo kills Han because he knows his purpose in life is to choose power over family. One of them, Ben or Rey, has to take the throne. It’s unavoidable, a fixed point in time. But what Palpatine could not foresee is that the Force created a dyad between Rey and Ben, a connection that “transcends fate” when they’re together. When Kylo figures this out, it becomes a sunk cost fallacy. He’s already devoted so much of himself to the dark side. He hates that he had to kill his father. He feels too ashamed to see his mother again, as he states to Rey on the Death Star. So instead of using their bond to break free from his destiny for power and darkness, he is obsessed with creating a new dark order with Rey. Yes, this is just a different flavor of Sith, but I think that’s the point! He wants those sacrifices he made at the altar of the dark side to mean something. This is why he’s so obsessed with not allowing Rey to confront Palpatine alone, because he knows that means she will take the throne and all will be lost. This is also what makes their duel on the Death Star wreckage another “Duel of the Fates”, because neither is giving an inch for the other and this means one of them is going to die, fulfilling fate, and ensuring Palpatine’s victory. Palps would have won, too, if it weren’t for Leia’s intervention and Rey’s forgiveness which is a result of that. It’s only because Ben arrives on Exegol that their dyad stops one of them from being possessed by Palpatine and taking the throne.

That’s cool to hear.

I’d ideally like to let simmer what I shared in these threads for a week or so before I go back at it. So I may go dark for a bit. That way other people can point out out anything I might have missed (in other words what might not work fully).

At this point a v5 would have to pick up whatever pieces of Nev’s edit or my edit it chooses to. I guess I should continue voicing these ideas over there, the only reason I brought it up here is because it’s tangentially related to the idea of the DOTF conversation between Luke and Kylo, which several people have voiced an interest in for Ascendant itself.