JakeRyan17

omnimuffin said:

Ed Slushie said:
It might be brief, but this would hopefully make it feel like Finn’s arc had real significance beyond reacting to Poe and Rey.

…Doesn’t Finn’s recruitment of and connection to Company 77 straight up save the galaxy? Without them, they wouldn’t have been able to disable the Steadfast, and the fleet would have been able to make it clear of the planet’s atmosphere.

It’s very underdeveloped. Jannah is the only member we see him interact with, and the way the film is cut (and with other members of that strike force being Resistance members like Rose) it’s unclear and vague. This was an attempt to build upon that.

Ed Slushie said:

JakeRyan17 said:

Ed Slushie said:

I just had an idea for something we could do to make Finn’s arc more important:

• Cut out the interaction between Finn & Jannah from the beginning of the battle of Exegol (the one where she says “how do you know?” and he says “a feeling.”)
• At the end of the battle, cut out the footage of Finn sensing Rey’s death and later saying “red five is in the air, Rey’s alive”
• Use Battlefront 2’s Galactic Assault cinematics to show clips of First Order transports fleeing the battle.
• Create a shot of the Millennium Falcon’s targeting system locking onto one of the transports.
• Add the shot of Finn sensing Rey’s death here, interspersed with flashbacks of key moments from his escape from the FO.
• This is the tricky part: Over the clip of him saying “Red five is in the air,” have a soundalike say “Let them fly, they’re not a threat” followed by something along the lines of “they’re afraid” (in place of “Rey’s alive,” which gives us more freedom because that part is said when Finn isn’t on screen).
• In response to this, add Jannah’s line “How do you know” and Finn’s “a feeling.” Background might need to be changed because they were in a different cockpit when they said this, but I don’t think most people would notice.
• Add one more shot of the transports flying away.

It might be brief, but this would hopefully make it feel like Finn’s arc had real significance beyond reacting to Poe and Rey.

This sounds interesting actually, are there cinematically of FO transports leaving Exegol?

Unfortunately, Exegol isn’t a map in the game. However, there are shots from Jakku, Crait, and Ajan Kloss that could be color-corrected to look like Exegol.

Would there be a large enough density of other ships to believably be part of this same battle? I’ll admit that I don’t have good enough experience with VFX to comp a troop carrier into the film’s footage (though I’d love for someone to replace Rey’s X-Wing with a Troop carrier) or do such drastic color correction and keep it looking believable. I would be able to isolate the audio enough to make those changes though.

If someone supplied me with shots of the troop carrier, I could quickly comp together your suggested edit.

Ed Slushie said:

I just had an idea for something we could do to make Finn’s arc more important:

• Cut out the interaction between Finn & Jannah from the beginning of the battle of Exegol (the one where she says “how do you know?” and he says “a feeling.”)
• At the end of the battle, cut out the footage of Finn sensing Rey’s death and later saying “red five is in the air, Rey’s alive”
• Use Battlefront 2’s Galactic Assault cinematics to show clips of First Order transports fleeing the battle.
• Create a shot of the Millennium Falcon’s targeting system locking onto one of the transports.
• Add the shot of Finn sensing Rey’s death here, interspersed with flashbacks of key moments from his escape from the FO.
• This is the tricky part: Over the clip of him saying “Red five is in the air,” have a soundalike say “Let them fly, they’re not a threat” followed by something along the lines of “they’re afraid” (in place of “Rey’s alive,” which gives us more freedom because that part is said when Finn isn’t on screen).
• In response to this, add Jannah’s line “How do you know” and Finn’s “a feeling.” Background might need to be changed because they were in a different cockpit when they said this, but I don’t think most people would notice.
• Add one more shot of the transports flying away.

It might be brief, but this would hopefully make it feel like Finn’s arc had real significance beyond reacting to Poe and Rey.

This sounds interesting actually, are there cinematically of FO transports leaving Exegol?

Anakin Starkiller said:

In fact, the comprehensibility of the entire ST rests on Leia being a Skywalker.

How so? Kylo doesn’t need to be a Skywalker to be a Vader fanboy, and he still comes from two important lineages, if you’re worried about it stealing from Rey Nobody.

She’s the other hope, if Luke should fall to the darkness. And she was that hope, when Luke abandoned the galaxy she was there forming a Resistance against the will of the Republic and preparing to fight the First Order. Luke also had the strength to face Vader and the Emperor because he knew she could keep the fight going if he failed; to quote Luke in The Last Jedi, he knew that if he died he wouldn’t be the last of the Jedi.

It does rest on her as much as him being a Skywalker.

thebluefrog said:

paja said:

Turn Ben’s Saber (in the TLJ flashback scene) to Green to really show and dig in that “New generation of Jedi” Idea.

I always thought saber colors had a theme:
White : Jedi Knight
Green : Jedi Master

This fit Luke’s path in ROTJ.
It fit Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan in Phantom.
AOTC…kind of followed that pattern. Yoda had green, Anakin and Obi-Wan had white.
But then Obi-Wan always had white even as a master while on the council…so it basically fizzled out as an idea with all the various extra Jedis just being whatever and it was clear Lucas didn’t follow the master-knight theme.

Obi-Wan has blue all the way until his death, so that was never the strict measure.

Blue is more about taking physical action with the force.

Green is about being more reflective and mystic in the fight against the dark side.

Yellow is about being more scholarly and stoic with the force.

Purple is usually associated with the concept of “grey” Jedi, those that seek that dangerous middle ground at the edge of the dark side.

Red is corrupted and bleeding from the dark side (old EU defined them as being artificial).

White (like Ahsoka’s sabers in Rebels) have been purified after going to the dark side.

Anakin Starkiller said:

Speaking of Saber’s I don’t like the idea of Leia having Jedi training (largely as a consequence of hating the idea of her being a Skywalker), so I suggest replacing her lightsaber in TRoS with Qui-Gon’s. That said, it would have no real significance there beyond bookends, so I’m hesitant. Maybe Luke’s green saber? Idk…

Why are you against the idea of her being a Skywalker? Did you adjust Revenge of the Sith and Return of the Jedi as well? And I believe there are mentions in The Force Awakens and The Last Jedi too…

I disagree, as do many others. Many more people also found Abrams’ film Star Trek Into Darkness to follow that same pattern of ripping off Star Trek: The Wrath of Kahn.

We’re getting off topic, I do feel like the new characters in The Force Awakens are rip offs, you don’t. I feel like the Plot copies A New Hope beat-for-beat. You don’t, and I’m glad you can enjoy that film without rolling your eyes. Criticising others for ideas they find more interesting than derivative and lazy choices isn’t really necessary. If someone preferred not to undo the ending of Return of the Jedi, even if that revealed a character that seemed only to be comic relief as a villainous mastermind, that is their opinion.

No, you’re confusing the rhyming with the rip off. Phantom Menace rhymed, it may not have been great, but it was different. It introduced new ideas, had creativity… it wasn’t just a new empire and new rebels in a dynamic that didn’t even make sense. There was no stand-in for the empire, and no stand in for the rebels. There was no list of analogies going beat for beat, between plot, characters, and even locations.

There’s a difference.

A rebel spy hides information in a droid. That droid is then found by an orphan in the desert, who joins up with a rouge and an old man. While attempting to deliver that secret information, a girl is captured by the space Nazis, she has to be rescued and the world-destroying base has to be destroyed.

Changing minor details, mixing and matching things around… that’s not enough to make it an original plot. That is why I compared it to a high schooler changing enough details to get past the plagiarism-detection software, but not enough to be its own thing.

And re-treading old plot beats doesn’t advance the story, it just re-treads the same ground. If it’s gonna be a remake, at least have the guts to just have it be a remake. Pretending it’s a sequel while acting like an underachieving high schooler plagiarising but with different pronouns and proper nouns doesn’t advance anything.

Then again, as an eight year old I thought Phantom Ménage copied A New Hope too much, so The Force Awakens coming out when I was an adult was even worse.

I dunno… more masked lackeys don’t really do it for me. And creativity is at least trying. Creativity is always better than safe banality. Force Awakens is my least favourite in the franchise because it just aimed so low. Abrams said he wanted to remind people of the original film, but I don’t need reminding. I have the theatrical cut on DVD, special edition on blu ray, and now we have Disney+. I can remind myself whenever I want. I want new films, at the bare minimum, to be new.

My problem isn’t that the Emperor isn’t new, it’s that it’s reductive. The film literally tried to make him the only evil that’s ever been. He’s ALL of the Sith. He’s the major villain of all three trilogies.

I would’ve been down for an evil Luke as the villain for the sequel trilogy, he wouldn’t be a new character, but he would be a new villain. Similarly, Jar Jar would’ve been a new and creative choice.

StarkillerAG said:

If you just hate Palpatine’s return because it was in the EU, then fine. But Darth Jar Jar is an objectively worse idea, purely because Jar Jar has never been established as a villainous force. And I’m not too concerned about “diminishing Anakin’s sacrifice”, since the whole Chosen One thing was a dumb idea in the first place.

It’s not because of the old EU that I dislike the idea, I’m saying I disliked it then as well. It’s not about him being the chosen one, it’s about that film‘s ending being undone and not being able to come up with another villain… like, I don’t like when these stories seek to make that universe smaller, and one overarching villain across the entire franchise is pretty reductive.

StarkillerAG said:

JakeRyan17 said:

StarkillerAG said:

If you’re making a parody edit, yes. But for a serious edit, it’s a terrible idea.

It’s the same “it was me all along” plot idea as Palpatine’s return, no less silly in my opinion.

Except Palpatine is already a well-established villain character, who has been teased to know something about cheating death. Jar Jar is just a stupid clown who does nothing over the entire prequel trilogy. Not to defend TROS, but Palpatine’s return is way less silly than Darth Jar Jar.

I disagree, but that’s mainly because Palpatine’s return always seemed like one of the bad ideas of the old EU to me. Snoke was a new threat, which didn’t go against Vader’s redemption/sacrifice to me.

Palpatine was a lazy choice, Jar Jar would have at least been a creative choice that didn’t undo 37 years of storytelling.

NeverarGreat said:

StarkillerAG said:

I know that as editors, canon doesn’t matter, and we can do whatever we want. But “whatever we want” ideally shouldn’t include Jar Jar being an evil Sith mastermind. That idea is dumb, it always has been dumb, and I don’t understand why some people unironically vouch for it.

Is anyone unironically vouching for it though?

If it could be done with good effects and audio, I’d be all for it.

StarkillerAG said:

If you’re making a parody edit, yes. But for a serious edit, it’s a terrible idea.

It’s the same “it was me all along” plot idea as Palpatine’s return, no less silly in my opinion.

StarkillerAG said:

I know that as editors, canon doesn’t matter, and we can do whatever we want. But “whatever we want” ideally shouldn’t include Jar Jar being an evil Sith mastermind. That idea is dumb, it always has been dumb, and I don’t understand why some people unironically vouch for it.

Dumb or not, it might be fun. At the end of the day, isn’t that the point? To have fun and enjoy it?

thebluefrog said:

StarkillerAG said:

It’s extremely likely that neither JJ, KK, or Rian read Aftermath, or indeed most EU books. Maybe they read a wiki summary at best.

The directors and Disney in general don’t really care about the canon as much as the fandom does. Pablo probably has a headache with every new script that comes out as he has to explain the latest contraction.

I know that, especially since TROS clearly contradicted the new canon at several points. But it’s still evidence that the whole “emergency powers” thing was intended to be Sidious manipulating Jar Jar, not the other way around.

My point was really more that “contracting canon” was never a priority for the sequel trilogy, so, really, why consider canon as holy and untouchable?

If we’re gonna edit, may as well go all-in and change things as we want. Why pretend to adhere to canon when the actual company does not?

Take Snoke. Each movie contradicted the holy canon.
TFA: Snoke was an unknown, powerful new Emperor-type leader, but somehow was always there during the original trilogy. Also he doesn’t seem to know or care about Rey.
EU books: The writers had to rationalize this somehow by making vague references to Palpatine sensing Snoke somewhere out there to explain why he didn’t have an impact over the war.
TLJ: Snoke is nobody important and also wants Rey dead now.
ROS: Snoke was actually Palpatine and wants Rey alive.

Before anyone gets worked up–I’m not debating whether these were good or bad retcons or whether anyone liked or disliked the changes.

I’m saying that as editors, we have freedom to do whatever we want.

In fairness to TLJ, Rey did have an impact on events of TFA… it makes sense that he’d want her dead. Also, his death doesn’t mean he didn’t matter. He still turned Kylo to the dark side and built the First Order, and his death allowed Kylo to become the new big bad. That’s not ignoring everything else as much as you’re suggesting.

Ed Slushie said:

I know it’s been a while since this thread discussed the possibility of using BF2 cinematics, but I just found this one that includes some really good shots:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlCH4uBBOzE

As good as it looks on the ship, I think it would still stick out in the film… also, what planet is that?

StarkillerAG said:

Can we please not do Darth Jar Jar? It would be one of the worst possible choices to make in a serious edit.

Honestly, think about it. Most of the “evidence” is just unfunny comic relief moments that the fans wildly misinterpreted. It isn’t even paid off in the prequels anyway, making it completely pointless. I have no idea why some people take this “theory” seriously.

I mean, he was responsible for the fall of the Republic to Darth Sidious…

thebluefrog said:

Anakin Starkiller said:

If I had the talent, I’d go full on Darth Jar Jar instead of Sidious. Let’s just embrace the ludicrousness.

You know that sort of attitude is how I enjoyed the film in theaters, but somehow, Darth Jar Jar just rubs me the wrong way.

It’s a tough sell, for sure, since Lucas obviously didn’t intend that at all. He flat out said Jar Jar was his version of Disney’s Goofy (as in, the dog character).

That being said, imagine it being pulled off. Instead of his wacky quasi-Jamaican overacting, imagine if he’s older, calmer, and talks with a smooth Baron Samedi style. No Palpatine cackling supervillain, a casual charismatic true behind-the-scenes villain who hid behind the jester’s antics.

Imagine Jar Jar actually being Darth Plagueus.

Cinefy said:

Han Solo flashback concept idea I had, this could be executed alot better just a thought I had.
think it could work for maybe just 1 shot during the scene.

https://youtu.be/FjgarF44CNc

I like the idea conceptually, and I had considered it myself… but Ford’s facial expressions seem too different for me personally. He looks angry and unsure in TFA footage, while loving and forgiving in TROS footage. Some of that might be the drastically different colour temperatures and lighting between the two scenes.

I really like the idea of this!

My recommendation would to start it with him already on the job looking for the Child. You can set up that he’s searching for a 50 year old bounty in the crawl, have him land, meet Kuiil, then have your opening act action be the battle alongside IG-11. I’d cut down his hunting down the Jawas, maybe even find a way that he just returns to the stripped ship and then has to go deal with the mudhorn. I’d then try to transition as quickly as you can from the major elements of chapter 3 to the stuff from chapter 4, and maybe have him recruit Cara Dune before leaving (cutting out all of their other travels). Then you’re set back up for the third act.

That’s really good so far!!

Anakin Starkiller said:

I’m also not a huge fan of the over-saturated look of Abrams’ films…

Well then you’re sure to hate the look of 90% of my work.

Haha, your work looks good. It’s just been harder to judge how far I take it when I adjust my edit. I may saturate it more, but it just depends How the full thing feels. Now that I have a first pass on all three films, I need to sit down and watch them to see how I feel about them. My edits are much more conservative than Hal’s, as much as I’m enjoying his changes.