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DrDre

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16-Mar-2015
Last activity
22-Feb-2019
Posts
3,239

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Post
#1270656
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

pleasehello said:

Creox said:

I also think veering off too much and you have a SW indie film that a lot fewer people will want to see.

But would probably be infinitely more interesting. I’m probably in the minority here, but I would love to see a Star Wars story done on a smaller scale. You don’t need $200 million to make a good Star Wars movie.

I also don’t agree veering off would turn Star Wars into an indie film. That would imply that only by continually rehashing Empire vs rebels, Jedi vs Sith, and fallen apprentices Star Wars can remain relevant to a large audience. I believe other epic stories can be told, that expand the universe, and the lore without being so self-referential.

Post
#1270602
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

Creox said:

DrDre said:

I view the ST thusfar as a somewhat failed experiment, not unlike the PT. In my view the OT is a self-contained story with a clear beginning, middle and end, with clear character arcs. That story has gotten lost somewhat with the addition of the PT, and ST. Both the PT and ST are superfluous imo, and cannot stand on their own. They both add something to the overall narrative, and lore, but at a hefty price. To me the overall narrative of the six part “tragedy of Anakin Skywalker” is significantly weaker than the three part “adventures of Luke Skywalker”, and the thusfar eight part “Skywalker saga” is weaker still. However, in the case of the PT, aside from the poor execution of many elements, the faults were built in from the get go, where the story’s outcome was a foregone conclusion, and it’s self-referential nature part of it’s DNA. It was therefore self-evident that story choices in the PT, might clash with the previously established self-contained story of the OT. It might have been better to have the PT be set in a much earlier time, or an earlier conflict to provide more of a disconnect between the PT and OT timelines, thus ensuring the OT’s narrative is not significantly impacted by the addition of episodes 1 to 3.

With the ST however the creators were free to forge their own path, to create new settings, new aesthetics, and a new conflict to drive the story forward. In my view this did not happen. The ST and Disney’s additions to the franchise in general have been self-referential to a fault, whether it’s by copying the OT’s settings, aesthetic, and general plot, or whether it is by using the OT’s story threads, and set pieces to misdirect, and subvert expectations, the ST at its core thusfar has failed to provide us with a new setting, and new story. It’s the current generation’s updated and modernized OT, where history seems destined to repeat itself ad nauseum:

The big question for me will be, whether episode IX can break through this cycle? If not, I fear for the future of the franchise, where in a worst case scenario Disney Star Wars will forever be a cover band playing Lucas’ greatest hits, changing the order of the verses with some newly updated (and in some cases inappropriate) arrangements, rather than to take Lucas’ style of music, and create some genuinely new songs.

And yet…people who do not like the film say it isn’t like the OT in many ways. That it broke the promise of the SW universe, the feel of the original films.

Well, I would argue if the OT can be represented by three different people, then the ST entries thusfar reminds me a little too much of this:

In other words several OT elements, settings, aesthetics, and story threads have been stitched together with some new elements to form a “new” whole. While Frankenstein shares a lot of similarities with the people that were used to create him, sadly the stitches are showing all too well. Analogously, while the ST shares a lot of similarities with the OT, inviting a continuous sense of déjà vu, the mish mash of OT elements does not provide an overall experience, that honours the legacy of the OT, or even Lucas’ six part saga to a great many people, and to them the stitches are showing all too well.

An example of the visible stitches in the ST is Rey’s sudden mastery of the Force, which appears inconsistent with what has been established before, and is only explained through the words of Snoke in TLJ:

“Darkness rises, and light to meet it. … I warned my young apprentice that as he grew stronger, his equal in the light would rise.”

The story element seems to have been mostly driven by plot convenience, rather some well thought out concept, that flows naturally from the story or the saga in general. Rey needed to be in that throne room on par with Kylo, despite the fact that Luke refused to train her, and so we get a couple of throw away lines to quickly fill a potential plot hole.

However, I have a number of issues with this approach. For one the movie makes it clear, that Snoke only becomes aware of Luke’s desire to die and letting the Jedi die with him by probing Rey’s mind, and so why does Snoke assume that Kylo’s equal in the light would rise while Jedi Master Luke Skywalker is still around? It appears that when Luke disconnected himself from the Force, the Force took matters into it’s own hands, and bestowed Rey with these powers to counter the growing imbalance. However, this rather important new concept is mostly ignored by the film. Luke himself doesn’t acknowledge it, and neither does Yoda for that matter. You would think that it would give Luke pause, that the Force displays its will by awakening in Rey, a wholly new concept in the Star Wars universe. Luke might interpret Rey’s presence as a confirmation, that the galaxy does not need the Jedi, and believe himself to be a possible corrupting influence on Rey, leaving her to figure things out for herself, or alternatively he might consider Rey’s presence a clear sign, that he was wrong to let the Jedi end, as it is the will of the Force for the Jedi to continue. However, he does neither of these things. He barely acknowledges her role in the bigger picture, even if he has sidelined himself, and treats her merely as an inconvenience, who should give up just like he has done. She finally gets tired of Luke’s routine, and leaves, prompting Luke to (again?) attempt to burn the Jedi Temple. Then Yoda appears, gives Luke platitudes, and Luke reverses his position, and accepts he’s not the last Jedi. The whole “we are what they grow beyond” is very prosaic, but rather meaningless (imo) in light of the fact, that the Jedi Masters ignore the elephant in the room, the apparent “Will of the Force”, and its implications to the bigger picture.

It is my opinion, that many of the new elements introduced by TFA and especially TLJ to stitch the different OT settings, elements and story threads together are not properly developed or placed in the context of the larger saga, and thus rather than enrich the Star Wars universe, stick out like a sore thumb. So, in my view episode IX has the difficult task to integrate and further develop these half cooked new concepts, such that it all makes sense once the nine part saga is completed. If it succeeds, and I hope it does, I might see TFA, and TLJ in a different, more positive light.

Post
#1270454
Topic
Episode IX - Discussion * <strong><em>SPOILER THREAD</em></strong> *
Time

I view the ST thusfar as a somewhat failed experiment, not unlike the PT. In my view the OT is a self-contained story with a clear beginning, middle and end, with clear character arcs. That story has gotten lost somewhat with the addition of the PT, and ST. Both the PT and ST are superfluous imo, and cannot stand on their own. They both add something to the overall narrative, and lore, but at a hefty price. To me the overall narrative of the six part “tragedy of Anakin Skywalker” is significantly weaker than the three part “adventures of Luke Skywalker”, and the thusfar eight part “Skywalker saga” is weaker still. However, in the case of the PT, aside from the poor execution of many elements, the faults were built in from the get go, where the story’s outcome was a foregone conclusion, and it’s self-referential nature part of it’s DNA. It was therefore self-evident that story choices in the PT, might clash with the previously established self-contained story of the OT. It might have been better to have the PT be set in a much earlier time, or an earlier conflict to provide more of a disconnect between the PT and OT timelines, thus ensuring the OT’s narrative is not significantly impacted by the addition of episodes 1 to 3.

With the ST however the creators were free to forge their own path, to create new settings, new aesthetics, and a new conflict to drive the story forward. In my view this did not happen. The ST and Disney’s additions to the franchise in general have been self-referential to a fault, whether it’s by copying the OT’s settings, aesthetic, and general plot, or whether it is by using the OT’s story threads, and set pieces to misdirect, and subvert expectations, the ST at its core thusfar has failed to provide us with a new setting, and new story. It’s the current generation’s updated and modernized OT, where history seems destined to repeat itself ad nauseum:

The big question for me will be, whether episode IX can break through this cycle? If not, I fear for the future of the franchise, where in a worst case scenario Disney Star Wars will forever be a cover band playing Lucas’ greatest hits, changing the order of the verses with some newly updated (and in some cases inappropriate) arrangements, rather than to take Lucas’ style of music, and create some genuinely new songs.

Post
#1269516
Topic
1997 Star Wars Special Edition 35mm Project
Time

KillThad said:

DrDre said:

poita said:

We still need another two 8TB Hard drives, the scan itself is finished, we just need hard drives to transfer the files onto so I can start work on the restoration.

I donated another 250 USD just now, so we should be nearly there… 😃

If we’re going off Amazon prices, we should only need another 250 and poita should be set. I could probably throw a couple bucks in if you guys want.

I added another 250 USD, so we should have the hard drives covered, such that poita can do his magic. 😉

Post
#1269076
Topic
Star Wars 4K77 - Regraded - No DNR
Time

poppasketti said:

DrDre said:

This is some really nice work, and in record time! Congrats! I think your shot by shot can also be used as a great basis for further tuning to cater to each and everyone’s personal preferences. Here’s my little effort, starting from the last shot of the film. I personally feel the color grading could use a little warmth to bring it more in line with the technicolor references.

sanjuro_61:

DrDre:

Hey DrDre, I was just wondering, are the technicolor references really that warm? Just looking at the video scopes, the red is very pushed. Not saying that’s wrong, I defer to your knowledge, just curious! The sanjuro_61 frame is a bit cool according to the scopes, so just as a quick test, I balanced the highlights, and the result is somewhere in the middle.

Yes, the technicolor prints are very warmly graded, although there’s a little too much magenta/red in the highlights. I will provide an update later today, to correct this.

Post
#1268961
Topic
Star Wars 4K77 - Regraded - No DNR
Time

This is some really nice work, and in record time! Congrats! I think your shot by shot can also be used as a great basis for further tuning to cater to each and everyone’s personal preferences. Here’s my little effort, starting from the last shot of the film. I personally feel the color grading could use a little warmth to bring it more in line with the technicolor references.

sanjuro_61:

DrDre:

I applied this adjustment to the two sets of sample frames I found:

It might need a little tuning here and there, to get to a final version (I see a few frames with some excess magenta), if there’s an interest, but you get the general idea.

Here’s the LUT:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1hDo_XIiozzDanx5B1WAn-GuG31UwHlYW/view?usp=sharing

Post
#1267512
Topic
4k77 - shot by shot color grading
Time

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

KranixZero said:

I was already excited for 4k77 but this looks amazing!! Will you be doing the same regrade for the DNR version when it comes out?

Thanks! I might, although it might actually be easier to apply DNR to the color graded version.

How will the cc be distributed as luts or as the video files

The plan is as video files.

How will these files be distributed and can I get an aprox date of completion

It will be done when it’s done. I’m pretty busy, so I can’t really give a reliable estimate.

Oh I’m sorry. I was just looking at all the progress shots and was so excited by the work you are doing. Everything looked exactly how I remember it back from 1977. I didn’t mean to offend you. Your doing so much fantastic work I wouldn’t want to give you the wrong impression. I just got ahead of myself. Sorry again but absolutely love your work!

No problem, I was a bit rude myself, so sorry about that. I hope to get it finished soon, but these things always take longer than you would like. Glad you enjoy the work! 😃

Post
#1267439
Topic
4k77 - shot by shot color grading
Time

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

KranixZero said:

I was already excited for 4k77 but this looks amazing!! Will you be doing the same regrade for the DNR version when it comes out?

Thanks! I might, although it might actually be easier to apply DNR to the color graded version.

How will the cc be distributed as luts or as the video files

The plan is as video files.

How will these files be distributed and can I get an aprox date of completion

It will be done when it’s done. I’m pretty busy, so I can’t really give a reliable estimate.

Post
#1267398
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

Jedi Master Skywalker said:

The Post mentions

“Original Negative”

This could mean the OUT or it could be the SE’s…

Personally I believe it is the Theatrical Cut…

I want the hear your thoughts on this matter

I think it means both. This done to create a digital master from which future releases can be sourced. It makes sense to scan and restore every element used for the film.

Post
#1267382
Topic
4k77 - shot by shot color grading
Time

Brodnation said:

DrDre said:

KranixZero said:

I was already excited for 4k77 but this looks amazing!! Will you be doing the same regrade for the DNR version when it comes out?

Thanks! I might, although it might actually be easier to apply DNR to the color graded version.

How will the cc be distributed as luts or as the video files

The plan is as video files.

Post
#1267233
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

Not sure if this is old news, but I came across this thread on thecantina.starwarsnewsnet.com, and stems from late last year and early this year:

https://thecantina.starwarsnewsnet.com/index.php?threads/star-wars-4k.54414/

Somebody involved with Reliance MediaWorks explains exactly what has happened to the 4K restoration of the OT. It was in fact finished for all three OT movies, and not rejected by LFM as has been suggested in the past. Additionally the colors on display in the reel we discussed in the past were only for internal purposes, and did not represent a final color grading. Here’s the jist of it:

"Reviving an old thread; I’m not 100% sure of George Lucas’ personal involvement with the actual reviewing of re-mastered content, but ILM worked closely with us to restore the original Star Wars Trilogy in 4K.

For those curious, there was a budget, but compared to the DVD remasters we did a decade ago, more money was pumped into creating pristine masters of the original film scans. The remastered footage was completed around 2012, but unfortunately nothing has come of that since.

I can most certainly guarantee you that nobody else is re-mastering the original SW films at this point. I say this with confidence because there is absolutely no one in the industry with technology as good as ours. Mind you that at this point, our software technology ceased development 6 years ago. If that tells you anything about the slow advancements in technology industry wide. This is the main reason Lucas came to us to begin with. We didn’t do the color correction, we only color grade for our own internal purposes. Our outfit is the only place James Cameron, David Fincher and George Lucas, to name a few – would send their films to. Unfortunately, a side effect of good work is price and the industry is flooded with cheap automated systems restoring films. The price the consumer pays is generic 4K upreses.

In my opinion I can only assume that they are waiting for advances in color technology to really make the remasters “pop”.

Any questions are welcome, I’ll try and answer what I can."

“All we provided was a mastered scan of the original with full image enhancement. No audio, no color correction, no VFX work, only a pristine restored digital version of the original. It is highly possible that someone is working on the digital delivery that we provided, I never denied that, but for me to believe that someone else out there has re-mastering capabilities beyond what we’ve delivered is not credible. If someone else is doing a remaster from scan, I can only say that it is being done through an automated system to save Disney money.”

“I can only say so much, but I was a lead image technician for several titles that were restored and have yet to see the light of day, such as True Lies 4K (4K transfer restored around 2013). Star Wars was a collaboration between several senior image technicians at the facility named above. I posted on this thread because I did a search on Star Wars 4K and came across this speculation thread. I thought it would be nice if someone with some insight could shed some light on the matter.”

Post
#1266753
Topic
4k77 - shot by shot color grading
Time

Ronster said:

If you are about to attempt Binary Sunset shot… I will tip you off look at Puggo Grande 😉 That is for Luke Leaving the Hut.

For the Dual Sun shot well… I would trust the Gout over any other on that one but do what you like.

One more tip off… I’m being good to you 😃

This shot has a red sky for the technicolor prints (inconsistent with the surrounding shots), and has a more consistent blue sky for the 1997 SE prints.