Just to be sure, there was a gag with a small drunken CGI creature putting coins in BB8, right? I haven’t seen it mentioned anywhere, and I want to make sure it wasn’t some sort of fever dream I had.
Yes, the pay off being when BB8 later weaponizes the coins.
I actually thought the Force projection thing was alright. That was I think the only time this movie ventured somewhat successfully out of its own comfort zone. Sure, it’s not the most outrageous thing you could think of, but at least it’s something we haven’t seen in a Star Wars movie before.
Except every single person in the galaxy for the past 8 films, including extremely powerful Jedi and Sith characters, all had to use the holographic projection communication system. But what did the know anyway when we have force FaceTime.
Did you miss the part where it kills Luke?
As for Rey learning the force beyond this film, I think it’s clear, as Leia says, that she has everything she needs between the books, ghost Luke, and Leia herself. Not to mention the whole thing about some lessons she needs to learn by herself.
Could somebody explain to me why I’m supposed to give a sh*t about Captain Phasma?
Seriously, a lot of people seem to find this character and her ‘story’ interesting. What’s the deal?
You’re not, at least not in the movies, anyway. She is interesting in other material. But her parts in the film are minimal (and only important in regards to Finn’s character) but there’s nothing wrong with that. She was only hyped up because she looks cool as a toy.
I feel like the ST collectively (so far) feels jarring. TLJ is extremely well written and put together, and successfully executed its apparent goal of subverting what came before (including, no, especially) TFA. However, it does feel like a smartass taking a turn at telling the story (y’know, when people tell a story one sentence at a time).
I feel disappointed that I didn’t get the legendary Luke, and the movie actively wants me to feel that way, so I can’t fault it for that. I was someone who, when they announced they’d be doing 7, 8, and 9, ventured into the post-ROTJ EU to take in the broad strokes of the continuing adventures of the legendary Luke Skywalker. (This trailed off when they announced the EU was no longer canon at all, not that I was expecting them to be beholden to it. I figured they’d probably ignore the EU and contradict whatever they happen to contradict, leaving the EU to deal with it.) Luke is a different character here and the film deliberately thwarts everything that I went into this moving looking forward to. And… it did so in a series of 9 movies with only one left.
If your small town has an apple pie baking contest, and someone submits the best peach cobbler in the world… what do you do? I don’t know, this movie more than any previous one is hard to swallow, by design, which is good and bad which is good. I’ll have to chime in later after a week or more once I can sit with this.
Luke’s plot line is literally about how he was hyped up to be the Luke of legend and TFA and yet isn’t. Both Rey and Luke acknowledge this, but then Rey says they need a legend, to ignite that spark of hope.
So at the end, when Luke shows up on Crait, he’s not the Luke that failed that we saw on Ahch-to, he is the Luke of legend (with the sword of legend), and his standing up to the whole of the First Order and Kylo Ren and emerging without a scratch is what inspires hope of rebellion the galaxy over, as we see in the final scene.
Here’s a pretty good article about the film: https://www.avclub.com/part-kurosawa-part-wile-e-coyote-the-last-jedi-boldl-1821291545
RE: Ackbar vs. Holdo, the author of this piece has a good point in a response to a comment:
Lotta folks seem to think that her role should have gone to good ol’ Admiral Ackbar, but I get Johnson’s intention: Everybody likes Ackbar, and the audience needs to be fooled into Poe’s point-of-view.
Probably why she didn’t get a proper ‘hero’ introduction as well. It’s a trade-off, but one I liked given where and how it’s taken: this is all Poe’s point of view - to the very end, and that’s why his turn into a proper leader works in the finale.
The more I think about it, the more I appreciate how well-written this film is.
Poe got a bunch of people killed because he was reckless and disobeyed orders. But it’s cool because ‘Ah, that’s just how Poe is, the little scamp’.
No, it’s cool because he’s imperfect and ultimately learns from his mistakes.
Poe also understands BB8.
I think the biggest issue (not that it really bothers me but worth mentioning) is that Rey understands BB8 immediately. Luke needed an x-wing translator at first (and always? or did he not need it in ROTJ? I can’t remember) and Poe worked with BB8 a long time (presumably).
Of course Rey worked in an outpost/spaceport thingy so you can assume she’s been exposed to all sorts of different languages, which I guess is why it doesn’t really bother me anyway.
Not ROTJ, but TLJ.
I also didn’t find the score to be particularly exciting.
What??
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIIvAoHIsPQ&t=3m45s
(link to TLJ score; minor spoiler? in track title.)I remember exactly when this happened in the film and it got me fired up.
This is very exciting, yes, though probably a poor example specifically as it is a reprise of the “Tie Fighter Attack” from the original film (also heard in ROTJ), there are plenty of other great examples of exciting music in the film. In fact, while I rate the TFA soundtrack higher, I think TLJ is a lot more exciting.
This is too close for comfort to spoilers.
I’m just talking about the music.
Is there a repeated Poe shot? The one that he looks over to the hole in the oscillator. Is that the same one used for when he’s looking at the Starkiller’s laser?
I think so.
Originally I had used the shot of the female pilot reacting to an explosion (which I think fits better), but I suppose it was too obvious a repeat if the original scene was going to be played verbatim. I think some editing could be done to put her reaction back in the Starkiller firing and simply remove that reaction from the original scene.
I think if you add some Starkiller laser glow it shouldn’t be a problem.
I did that when I worked on the slow motion effect for that part, so the shot isn’t identical in color, at least.
Cool, I’d imagine it’s probably not too noticeable. Haven’t seen the finished edit yet.
Here’s a pretty good article about the film: https://www.avclub.com/part-kurosawa-part-wile-e-coyote-the-last-jedi-boldl-1821291545
RE: Ackbar vs. Holdo, the author of this piece has a good point in a response to a comment:
Lotta folks seem to think that her role should have gone to good ol’ Admiral Ackbar, but I get Johnson’s intention: Everybody likes Ackbar, and the audience needs to be fooled into Poe’s point-of-view.
This completely. The other thing about Ackbar is… I’m sorry guys, he’s kind of a joke. When he showed up in TLJ everyone laughed. I think a lot of peeople wouldn’t buy the drama of him in an expanded role.
JEDIT: I need to be better about keeping all my responses in one post, rather than 4 back to back.
Wasn’t the original hologram footage shot on videotape though? I know it was shot off a tv screen to get the original effect.
I thought it was shot on film initially, then transferred.
Second viewing. Love this film.
Samesies.
almost everything on the casino planet
If nothing else, the “riding the CGI animals” stuff was prequel-level awful.
Don’t be that guy, Frink.
The intro crawl theme didn’t sound like a new recording.
I watched the TFA/ TLJ double bill and have the TLJ soudntrack CD. It is NOT the same theme used
On the soundtrack they are the exact same. Not sure about in the movie, though. Very disappointing if so.
Okay I’ve now seen it twice so I feel like I can do this with some degree of certainty (though it’s still subject to change, of course)
I shouldn’t rank so soon after TLJ (you have to sit with a score even longer than a film to fully understand and appreciate it), but here goes…
This is pretty tough actually because TLJ is a actually pretty much wall to wall great but loses big points in my mind for lack of new material. It feels more like TFA Part II (and in that sense, it does absolutely succeed). But if we look at each film and the new signature theme they introduced, I don’t know if TLJ even qualifies because it doesn’t have one, but if we use the next closest thing - Rose’s theme - it’s at the bottom of the list.
I also didn’t find the score to be particularly exciting.
What??
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIIvAoHIsPQ&t=3m45s
(link to TLJ score; minor spoiler? in track title.)I remember exactly when this happened in the film and it got me fired up.
This is very exciting, yes, though probably a poor example specifically as it is a reprise of the “Tie Fighter Attack” from the original film (also heard in ROTJ), there are plenty of other great examples of exciting music in the film. In fact, while I rate the TFA soundtrack higher, I think TLJ is a lot more exciting.
Making the categories expandable and collapsable also kind of ruins using the “find” feature. You have to expand every category for it to be searchable by the browser. I’m not sure if that trade-off is worth it.
You fucked up by not reserving the second post in this thread and using that as a non-expandable duplicate for finding.
Is there a repeated Poe shot? The one that he looks over to the hole in the oscillator. Is that the same one used for when he’s looking at the Starkiller’s laser?
I think so.
Originally I had used the shot of the female pilot reacting to an explosion (which I think fits better), but I suppose it was too obvious a repeat if the original scene was going to be played verbatim. I think some editing could be done to put her reaction back in the Starkiller firing and simply remove that reaction from the original scene.
I think if you add some Starkiller laser glow it shouldn’t be a problem.
His arm was already golden again at the very end of TFA.
That whole shot bothered me from day one. I think the studio screwed up on that one. Should have still been Red. Also that was not Anthony in the suite.
I would be very interested in a TFA and TLJ edit that did nothing but make his arm red throughout.
With my biggest issue being the fragmentary storyline, I’d like to see an edit where the First Order is still hunting for the Resistance base at the start of the film. This would require using a modified version of TFA Restructured, where they never learn of the Ilenium system in the first place.
With this change, I could frontload The Last Jedi with Luke and Rey material, picking up right where we left off in the previous film. There would be more time to breathe (and reach out!) in this part, now that there’s less of a ticking clock Resistance plot to draw us away from Rey’s journey. It could be implied that she spends a great deal of time on the island trying to get information from Luke and learning things on the way.
Near the end of her time on the island, we’d introduce the Resistance as the they try to evacuate their base. The slow, illogical cat and mouse fuel plot can then be reduced. Rose and Finn still travel to Casino planet, but only because Rose knows from experience that their hacker can be found there.
It’s an interesting idea, and would be neat as a curiosity, but I can’t imagine how this would make the film better in any way. If anything, I feel like it’d feel a lot worse.
Yeah, Ackbar should have gone down fighting. Can’t imagine Ackbar being a dick to Poe though.
Or vice versa.
I am feeling like these arguments from the people vehemently defending hating TLJ, they’re rationalizing. They want to hate it, and so are finding reasons to justify their position.
Yes, it seems some people have thrown reason out the window, and are being willfully obtuse about it.
This is unfair. I wanted to like it (I loved TFA) and I am openly jealous of those people who loved it, wishing I could be in their number. But I’m not.
The same argument could be levelled at some of the people who loved it despite its many glaring flaws. They ‘wanted to like it’ and so will say anything to convince others (and themselves).
Or maybe the above is bullshit and people just like different things… how about that?
My comment wasn’t in regards to everyone complaining about the film, just some.
I am feeling like these arguments from the people vehemently defending hating TLJ, they’re rationalizing. They want to hate it, and so are finding reasons to justify their position.
Yes, it seems some people have thrown reason out the window, and are being willfully obtuse about it.
They’ve also completely rebooted the Empire vs rebels scenario, with the Resistance now even being called rebels. Snoke was the only character with some history beyond the FO, and might have provided motivations that separates the FO from the Empire, but that’s all gone by the wayside. There are now only new faces part of an organisation without much of a history or an identity. It’s this sense of history and hidden layers that made Star Wars appealing to me, but now all the history and layers have been peeled away.
Thing is, it’s not Snoke’s First Order anymore, it’s Kylo’s. And yeah, the history’s been stripped away, but, again, that’s the point. It’s not about Vader or the Empire anymore. This is his and I’m excited to see where else he takes it.
It’s not about Vader or the Emperor. It’s about a sense of history, and motivations. With the OT there was the history of the old Republic, Vader, the Jedi. With the PT there was the history of the Sith, the rule if two. The FO has no history or identity. It’s just a bunch of faceless goons emulating the Empire, led by Kylo and Hux, neither of whom have any motivations aside from wanting to be evil.
There was no more motivation behind the Empire than that. There was a sense of history, sure - they were once the Old Republic. Well the First Order rose from the ashes of the Empire. I don’t know if you can really count the Sith in the PT because that was never even vaguely explained (which, to me, is fine). Kylo’s motivations in TFA and TLJ are obvious and make perfect sense for the character. I do hope he thinks bigger in IX though.
Yeah, but it’s more than that. The Empire consisted of many worlds, including the later named central system of Coruscant, home of the mysterious Emperor. The Alliance consisted of many worlds, with senators secretly conspiring to help them. It was a vast galaxy of peoples and allegiences. As I said there were many hidden layers in both space and time.
The FO is just a bunch of space ships, and a number of faceless enemies led by two youngsters. They don’t even have a home world, which as far as we know was SKB.
Yeah, Coruscant isn’t a part of the OT. If you want a more in depth and nuanced look at the makeup of the FO, it’s out there. Same goes for the Resistance.
There are no hidden layers, no sense of space and time. Snoke and Rey’s mysterious background provided those hidden layers, stuff to speculate about. TLJ snuffed that out. That’s quite depressing to me.
I just plain don’t get that reaction.