ChainsawAsh

none said:

1080p BDMV, 1080p mkv, AVCHD

These versions are NOT the Revisited version, they're Ady's HD color-corrected version of the 2004 SE (minus the Greedo scene, which is now back to Han shooting first).  They do look fantastic, though. :-D

Oh yeah, I forgot about that.  Ah, Seth Rogen ...

My guess is you wouldn't like the PS1 Metal Gear Solid any better, Chaltab - it's much, much more difficult than The Twin Snakes, especially at the very beginning of the game.  At least you get a tranquilizer gun early on in TTS (which doesn't exist at all in the original).

They did have the same ugly pink tint to them that the TPM DVD does.  Which is funny because at the time of their release, I remember a documentary or something about them where they made a huge deal out of the need to color correct the films to remove the pink tint the negatives had acquired over the years ... guess they didn't do a very good job.

They still look a shit-ton better than the 2004 colors, though.

No, I won't be using the Pwnage Edition as (if I recall) it's compressed to a DVD-5, while DJ's GOUT (which I'm in the process of getting from him) is a DVD-9.

Here's the list of all my sources:

Adywan
- Star Wars Revisited NTSC DVD-9
- Star Wars Revisited: Purist Edition NTSC DVD-5 (for duel audio)
- Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope AVCHD BD-9

Dark_Jedi
- Anamorphic/cleaned-up GOUT

Belbucus (I think)
- Restored mono mix

Official
- 2004 DVD (color corrected by me - for the Greedo scene so I can add my own subtitles - don't worry, Han will still shoot first)
- 2006 DVD (as a guide - any leftover shots will be replaced by DJ's GOUT)

Well one thing I (recently) decided I'm going to attempt is to make sure that this syncs 100% exactly with the GOUT, so that others can drop in their own audio tracks if they don't like the mono mix.  I think I'm going to have the option to choose between the mono and theatrical stereo mixes in the final product (though the mono will be the default one).

The only problem with this idea is the (very) few added sound effects (Dewbacks in Mos Eisley, Ady's star destroyer going to hyperspace) that wouldn't be present if someone substituted the mixes.

And about the missing frame somewhere, I have a feeling that I know what went wrong, and if I'm right it'll be insanely easy to fix ... but right now I'm going to eat dinner and try not to think about Star Wars for the rest of the day.

Those are some great ideas - I like it a lot!

Just ran into a rather frustrating problem.  Just yesterday, I took all the Star Wars sound mixes I had (1977 mono, 1977 stereo, and 1993 stereo) that were already synchronized to the GOUT (minus the 1985 mix, which I have, but it's unsynchronized) and added the exact amount of delay at the beginning needed to properly sync them up.

I then took the GOUT video track I had in Avid underneath my Revisited/AVCHD track and made sure it lined up perfectly with the beginning, and adjusted the Revisited/AVCHD track accordingly.  I then erased the mono mix audio that I'd attempted to manually sync up (with more or less OK results - the YouTube clip makes it look worse than it was, but it still wasn't 100% exact) and replaced it with the new file that I'd added the delay to (which now syncs up 100% perfectly!) ... but the problem is, somewhere along the line the Revisited/AVCHD track becomes one frame out of sync with everything else.  Now I have to go through every shot until I find the first one that's off so I can fix it.  Ugh.

I think I'll take a break from this for the rest of the day today and come back to it tomorrow to fix this.

I think it would work better to cut from "We must move quickly" to Palpatine's office directly.  There's already too many takeoff/landing sequenes in the PT that just aren't necessary, and this is one of them.

The problem here is that if Anakin does go with them, why does it take so damn long for him to get up there?  That was my only real problem with your edit (well, that and the fact that Palpatine A) still flips around like a monkey and B) uses a lightsaber at all; but I think B is, sadly, unavoidable in any ROTS edit).

He most definitely does - I can't stand the fuzzy arm, and didn't think the DVD-5's "flipper" was quite convincing enough.  Besides, why would Ben cut the arm off of someone who doesn't even have a gun, while leaving the guy who does have a gun armed (no pun intended, really)?

I've also kept Ady's new Death Star shots, but not in their entirety - they're cut the way the original shots were.  It actually wasn't as difficult to do as I'd anticipated, and it works very well.  I don't think I really need to post a clip of those shots, though - I'll save that for the final release.

Another exciting thing - after having trouble with the section where Ady cut out Jabba (there are 40 frames missing there, and I don't yet know how I'm going to get around that), I decided to tackle the end of the Ben/Vader duel, where Ady added more slow-motion than there was originally.

By painstakingly taking every frame from Revisited that is also in the GOUT and matching it up perfectly, I've been able to keep Ady's sabers and new Ben's-death shot without having to change the mono mix audio one bit!  After doing the same with the shot where Ben's saber falls on his robes, though, I realized it would have been much easier to use the AVCHD for that shot.  But I didn't, and it looks exactly the same as the original, so I think I'll be keeping it that way.

I'm coming up on the SE-added Falcon takeoff, which I think I'll remove simply to more easily match the original edit, but I'm not 100% sure about it yet, and won't be until I get there.

But the line in the journal is "Rorschach's journal, October 12th, 1985.  Dog carcass in alley this morning ... " - it's bugged me since I saw the film in theaters.  "Tonight, a comedian died in New York" is in the journal much later and isn't preceded by a date.  It just feels to me like the filmmakers think the audience is stupid and won't understand what's going on otherwise.

Not to mention, in the graphic novel, the last line is "I leave it entirely in your hands" as Seymour reaches for the journal - there's no repetition of "Rorschach's journal, October .... " at all.

--EDIT--

Oh, I thought of one more addition - the ending quote of the graphic novel will be inserted before the end credits:

------------------------------------------

Quis custodiet
ipsos custodes.

Who watches the watchmen?

—Juvenal, Satires, VI, 347
Quoted as the epigraph of the Tower
Commission Report, 1987

------------------------------------------

Note that "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes" will, as in the GN, be larger text than the rest, which will all be the same size.

I may also look into using Sanities by John Cale (quoted at the end of the GN just before the above quote) during the end credits.  I don't know the song, though, so I don't know how well it would fit, but I like the quote Moore used from it: "It would be a stronger world, a stronger loving world, to die in."

(Hopefully) Finished Mos Eisley sequence ("Mos Eisley Spaceport ... " through "I don't like the look of this ... ") is now up on YouTube - the link is available in the first post.

Check the YouTube info box for details on the clip itself.

And DJ, you have a PM.

Jono11 said:

 [[I totally disagree on these choices. Sound of Silence, Ride of the Valkyries, I'm Your Boogie Man, Hallelujah, and All Along the Watchtower worked perfectly. Can you explain why you want them out of the flick? I understand some people really dislike the Desolation Row cover for some reason, although personally I thought it was fantastic, and the only remotely interesting thing MCR has ever done.]]

Sounds of Silence *may* stay, but I'm not sure ... it just feels a bit too un-subtle for the scene, but it's one of the less offensive ones.  In the GN, The Comedians by Elvis Costello is quoted during this scene, so I'll look into maybe using this instead.

Ride of the Valkyries made me laugh my ass off in the movie theater ... and that's not what you're supposed to be doing at that point in the film.

I'm Your Boogie Man may also stay, we'll see about that one.

Hallelujah - are you kidding me?  That's fucking gone.  Period.  Ugh.

All Along the Watchtower was another beating-you-over-the-head-with-how-clever-Zack-Snyder-is moment.  But as the song is quoted in the graphic novel during this scene, I might try to replace it with Bob Dylan's original version, but Hendrix's is just too in-your-face for the scene.

And I loathe the MCR Desolation Row.  It's gone.  There's nothing anyone can say to me to make me keep that, so I'd like to respectfully ask everyone to not try to change my mind about this - it won't happen.  Consider this change already made.

Jono11 said:

[[You're leaving some fo the fight in for flashbacks, right? There are supposed to be quick flashbacks to the fight sequence.]]

ChainsawAsh said:

pan up from the smiley-face pin to the cops talking about Blake's murder, which will be intercut with relevant portions of the removed intro

Yes, the flashbacks will be there, as stated.

Jono11 said:

- Over-the-top aspects of Laurie/Dan vs. knot-tops toned down [[That gets talked about a lot, but I remember it being pretty violent in the comics.]]

Yeah, but nowhere in the GN does Dan make someone's bone pop through his arm.  It'll still be brutal, it's just that when you throw in things like that, it's no longer brutal, it becomes a parody of itself.  I'm trying to avoid that in my edit.

dark_jedi said:

I have not seen this yet so I can't comment yet,but I do want to see it bad,looks very interesting,so which version should 1 buy,the Director's Cut Blu-ray or the Theatrical Cut DVD?,the Theatrical version won't be on the Blu-ray according to everything I read,hell I might just get both.

If you don't mind sitting through a 3-hour movie, I'd recommend the director's cut (though the theatrical cut is pretty long in itself) - there are things removed from the theatrical version that made no sense to me whatsoever, as they're pretty crucial to the story.

I just typed a huge update post, then somehow managed to, while typing, select it all and delete it, then continue typing to prevent the possibility of undoing my mistake.  Fuck me.  I'm not retyping that tonight, it's 1:10 AM here, I'll post an update tomorrow.

Possessed, that's a good idea - I'll try it out in After Effects and see what results I can come up with.

Short version of the really long and detailed update is I'm now almost an hour into the film, with a few shots throughout that hour that aren't done yet (I need DJ's GOUT before I can do those).  I'll post a YouTube clip of the Mos Eisley sequence so you guys can see how I've cut the SE/Revisited footage to match the original cut/mono mix - I'm pretty excited and happy about how it turned out.

This edit is in the planning stages - as much of the changes I want to make require a great deal of work, this won’t be started until I’ve finished my Star Wars: The Trilogy edits (at least ANH and maybe ESB, depending on when Ady releases ESB:R).  I also need to wait until the Super Extended Cut is released this winter that includes Tales of the Black Freighter incorporated into the film, along with the “bridge” scenes of the kid reading TotBF and the newsvendor talking to him.

But I’m starting this thread now to bounce ideas off of you guys, both for specific edits and for figuring out the more complex stuff that I don’t yet know how to do.

So, here’s my current plan (based on the Director’s Cut):

• Rebuild most of the audio from the ground up to remove most (if not all) of the songs (possibly to be replaced with more songs quoted in the graphic novel).
• Specifically, 99 Luftballoons, The Sounds of Silence, Ride of the Valkyries, I’m Your Boogie Man (maybe), Hallelujah (definitely), All Along the Watchtower (possibly to be replaced with Dylan’s original), and Desolation Row (likely to be replaced with Dylan’s original) will be either removed or replaced.
• Credits sequence will be removed, as will much of the Comedian fight intro - the film will open with a simple black-on-yellow (or vice versa) WATCHMEN title, followed by the pan up from the smiley-face pin to the cops talking about Blake’s murder, which will be intercut with relevant portions of the removed intro - Rorschach’s narration might start here as in the GN as well
• Cops seeing/shooting at Rorschach (added to DC) will be removed
• Hollis/Dan seeing Rorschach news story on TV (added to DC) will be removed (this also fixes an error made by the newscaster, who says that the Keene Act was passed “six years ago,” which would either mean the Keene act was passed in '79 when it was actually '77, or that the current year was '83 instead of the established '85)
• Dan asking Rorschach about the cops/news story (I believe this was added to the DC) will be removed
• Gunga Diner patron’s line “I’m glad I ordered the four-legged chicken” will be cut.  I mean, really?  What the fuck?
• Laurie/multiple-Manhattans sex scene shortened
• Over-the-top aspects of Laurie/Dan vs. knot-tops toned down
• Over-the-top aspects of Veidt’s assassination attempt toned down (perhaps - I don’t have a huge problem with the scene as is)
• “Fingerprint scan” in Dan’s goggles removed
• Sex scene shortened considerably, plus new music
• Prison fight sequence shortened considerably
• I’d love to get rid of the “Rameses II” book sitting right next to Veidt’s computer and let Dan figure it out the way he did in the graphic novel, but I don’t think it’d be possible
• I’d also love to insert an explanation for Bubastis and Rorschach’s mask, but I also don’t think either one of those would be possible
• No superhuman feats during the Veidt/Dan/Rorschach fight (though the bullet thing will, of course, stay) - this will be tricky
• Rorschach will die alone as in the graphic novel (I’ve decided that if I can’t make this work, I won’t bother with the rest of the edit)
• No Dan beating the shit out of Veidt after Rorschach’s death (since he won’t witness it this won’t make sense)
• Cut “Tonight, a comedian died in New York” narration at the very end - it will just be “Rorschach’s journal, October 12th, 1985,” then credits
• All Director’s Cut additions that are not mentioned in this list will stay
• Tales of the Black Freighter will be woven throughout the film (assuming it doesn’t hurt the pacing of the film too badly)

Here’s one thing I already know I’ll have trouble with:

It’ll be relatively easy to edit Dan out of Rorschach’s death with the exception of two shots.  First, when Rorschach starts to take his mask off, Dan is in the background, and Dr. Manhattan’s glow is in front of Dan.  I don’t know if I’ll be able to erase Dan without fucking up the blue glow.  Second, when Manhattan explodes Rorschach, Dan is behind him as he explodes.  It will be difficult to erase Dan while keeping all the chunks of Rorschach intact.

Much of the music that I’ll be removing will be replaced with Philip Glass - since this precedent is already set by the use of Koyaanisqatsi music during Dr. Manhattan’s origin story, I feel it’s appropriate.

Any and all suggestions and advice are welcome - that’s what I started this thread for, after all.  So what do you guys think?

LordVader said:

Oh for fuck sake why cant we just leave some movies alone...... To me, sequels will always be more acceptable than just "rebooting" a franchise, it completely devalues movies these days, there could always be that idea lingering that "we can just remake it" and it's turning hollywood into a giant clusterfuck, excuse me, a bigger clusterfuck than it has to be.

While I agree with you on general principle, there have been cases of remakes actually being (arguably, of course) superior to the original.

The few remakes I feel actually do improve upon the source material:

- The Thing (1982)
- Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1978) - I should note here that I do enjoy the original quite a bit, I just think the Sutherland-starring version is far superior
- Ocean's 11 (2001) - not so much "superior to" as "just as good as"
- Cape Fear (1991)
- Ben-Hur (1959)
- 3:10 to Yuma (2007)

That's all I can think of at the moment.  Then there are the remakes that change enough that they're still good, but not really comparable to the original (such as Seven Samurai vs The Magnificent Seven, or Yojimbo vs Fistful of Dollars).

My point is, while most remakes are unnecessary and utter shit, sometimes they work.

I'd think the laserdisc would be the best option.  I can deal with a few shots being lower-quality than the others (I'll have to for my "Trilogy" edit series, anyway).

Ah, that was probably my bad - when I come to the site, I open all the threads with new posts in separate tabs.  I did this very early in the morning, then got distracted and ended up falling back to sleep.  When I responded, my tab had the old post up.

Sorry about that.

C3PX said:

If you like Metal Gear Solid a lot, Twin Snakes is worth picking up on the cheap.

The Twin Snakes would have been great if not for the following problems:

- The ability to shoot in first person makes the game insanely easy compared to the original MGS
- Some of the re-recorded voice acting isn't quite up to snuff (though I have no problem with the change of Mei Ling and Naomi's accents)
- The ridiculous cutscenes (jumping off of a missile? WTF?)
- The fact that, despite all the changes, everything felt just a little too much the same (in fact, the majority of the game itself just feels like they took the original PS1 maps and put better textures on them), though this is a double-edged sword because you can't make it too different either

But I still enjoyed it quite a bit - I just highly prefer the original.

Bingowings said:

Dune needs to be remade (possibly as two films in a series covering the whole Frank Herbert series over many films) the current plans for another film version don't fill me with much confidence.

100% agreed.  I, for one, think Dune could be made into a single 3 and a half hour film, but I don't think any studio would be willing to take the risk on that.

I have a devious scheme to save enough money over the course of my life and build up enough contacts in my (future) career as a film editor to finance an epic, roadshow-style (shot on 70mm - I would choose IMAX but I prefer the 2.20:1 AR over 1.44:1 - with an overture, intermission, exit music, and at the aforementioned 3.5 hours in length) version of Dune from a script that I've begun working on and will continue to until I'm 100% satisfied with it.

It also will actually be shot in the desert, unlike the Sci-Fi miniseries.  It got the story (mostly) right, but the cheap costumes, sets, Fremen eye makeup and the incredibly obvious matte-painting desert ruined it for me.

I wouldn't have a hell of a lot of interest in anything beyond Dune Messiah though - it was OK, but I didn't like Children of Dune that much and don't have any interest in reading the three novels beyond that.

Unfortunately, I'm pretty sure that's just a pipe dream that will never happen.  And even if it did, I doubt I'd ever find a way of distributing it properly.  Plus there's the whole rights issue.

[Farnsworth]A man can dream, though ... a man can dream ... [/Farnsworth]

Skyjedi edited his post after I quoted him.  Whether he really was joking or not is something I can't know for sure, but his original post sure didn't seem like a joke.

Come on, now, asking a question because you don't know the answer doesn't make you a troll.  Ease up a bit.

vaderios said:

The whole world hates it

Well, I don't, so that's clearly a bit of an exaggeration ;-)

And I haven't run into any of the problems you mention - I particularly like the tabs feature in Photoshop myself.  And they rearrange the buttons every once in a while, that's just something you have to get used to - I learned on Photoshop 5.5 LE, and then jumped from that to CS2 ... that was a bit of a shock.  I hated CS2 for a long time.

What don't you like about CS4?  I happen to like it quite a bit.

Well, pretty much any of those programs, but their newer versions:

Adobe Premiere CS4 (includes Adobe Encore CS4 for DVD authoring)
Adobe Premiere Elements 7.0
Avid Media Composer 3.5 (Avid Xpress was discontinued last year, but if you're going the not-so-legal torrent route, Avid Xpress Pro HD can work with HD content)
Sony Vegas Pro 9.0 (as of 9.0, you can actually work in 4K if you so choose! - Vegas also has some fantastic 5.1 surround mixing software included)

Those are the only ones I know that work on Windows, but I have no idea if they work on XP with SP2 - I haven't used Windows in quite a long time.  But pretty much any modern professional editing software will allow you to work with HD content.

Here's Wikipedia's list:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_video_editing_software#High_definition_import