Bingowings

 Double post!

Sorry.

ben_danger said:

you should really check out the rotj fan o matic. there is a really good edit of the rebel briefing scene. luke is assumed to already have joined the fleet, so i guess his xwing would just follow the falcon.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f19SnqUkAlA&feature=channel

 

love the idea of the saber reconstruction on dagobah. would be great!

I appreciate it's rough and ready but it certainly puts the brief into briefing.

Oh Gods ! That set (what a piece of junk!), Admiral Ackbar channeling Robin Day and General Madine phoning his performance in.... hells bells I hate that scene even the OT cast can't save it.

It's years since I listened to the radio version are there any better vocal elements in that that can be used?

ben_danger said:

ChainsawAsh said:

I'd rewritten the crawl based on some of the ideas presented in the "Fan-O-Matic" thread.  Note that this crawl assumes the movie plays out in this order:

1. Vader arrives on DSII
2. Leia delivers Chewie to Jabba
3. Luke is on Dagobah, Yoda dies, Obi-Wan tells Luke of Leia (which works well because the next scene is...)
4. Leia frees Han, is captured
5. Luke arrives on Tatooine.
6. Droids attempt to deliver message, but are taken captive

 

please please please do this!

There's no need to massively re-write (other than adjusting the bit about Luke to have return to Dagobah to complete his training instead) the crawl to do that but a really interesting edit idea.

It may be easier to reshoot the sabre construction/hologram scene on Dagobah than on Tatooine too (making his new sabre could be the final part of his training).

Getting around the black glove would be a bugger though.

It would add a bit more menace to Boussh and really start Jedi off on a the same downer ESB ended on.

Yoda dead, Vader his dad, new Death Star , Chewie captured, droids captured, Han and Leia (his sister... which he snogged) captured, Rancor, Sarlacc...it never rains but it pours...

You'd have to remove Luke's return to the fleet though (not that I'm fussed that whole scene needs working on).

If you are going down that route you could start with Luke have a little dogfight on his way to Dagobah (Star Wars films start better with a battle) have him shoot down a few TIE's in his X-Wing one last time then land.

Then Vader, The Dagobah stuff, the mighty Boushh, Droids, Han/Leia and then the return of the not quite Jedi.

Add another peril into an already really bad day.

It's just a mock up so I can add as many dots as you like Chainsaw (I missed a full stop after DEATH STAR anyhoo).

ChainsawAsh said:

Octorox said:

TMBTM said:

If its the enemy I guess I can understand it, like a mystical powers arm race.

Maybe, we can find a plot AROUND cloning without ANY stormtroopers clones at all.

You know, the bad guy finds a way to clone people and he begin to clone some high members of the Republic to take control, step by step. The Jedi begin to suspect something. Everyone's getting paranoid. And that is the Clone War, a kind of cold war...

 

You guys need to remember that Star Wars is NOT SCI-FI. It's a fantasy/western/adventure story set in space. Cloning should NOT play a large part in the plot or your heading into sci-fi territory. Using cloning to amass an army steers clear of sci-fi because it doesn't really affect the plot that their clones. However, replacing important characters with clones seems like a no no to me because it's a very sci-fi concept. Futuristic space tech is just an element of setting in Star Wars, not of plot.

I really don't understand this mentality at all.  Star Wars is CLEARLY sci-fi.  Not necessarily "Star Trek" sci-fi where every minute detail has to be explained in a scientific way - THAT'S the difference.

Carbon freezing?  That's not sci-fi?  That's not an element of plot?  Hyperspace?  Huge space stations that can destroy planets?

I agree that Star Wars is a fantasy/adventure story in space, but to say that it's not sci-fi is kind of narrow-minded.  I'd describe it as a sci-fi fantasy, where certain things are explained away by the "fantasy" aspect and others the "sci-fi" aspect, as opposed to other sci-fi stories were everything is explained by it being "sci-fi" (Blade Runner, Alien, Dune, Star Trek ... )

Science Fiction is an unfortunate genre label.

What the term really refers to is Speculative Fiction, writers and readers are given a set of items which have yet to have been proven to exist and from that selection of ideas a story is created set in a world with those plausible but as currently realised items.

Bladerunner, 2001, Dune fit that criteria.

Star Trek sits in the middle (sound in space doesn't work but space warping might).

Star Wars doesn't fit at all, it uses space as the far and distant land of ancient myth so it's Space Fantasy.

That doesn't make it less a story telling realm and the story still has to obey the rules of that fantasy landscape but the audience doesn't expect or need for it to make scientific sense.

It's Sinbad with laser swords.

ChainsawAsh said:

I'm not sure that angle works best.  It makes it look like a strange alien ship, like one of the Rebels', instead of the Executor.

Oh I agree but finding a shot of the wedgeee angle has not yielded any catches for me yet.

Here's my first stab at beefing up the crawl :

Octorox said:

TMBTM said:

If its the enemy I guess I can understand it, like a mystical powers arm race.

Maybe, we can find a plot AROUND cloning without ANY stormtroopers clones at all.

You know, the bad guy finds a way to clone people and he begin to clone some high members of the Republic to take control, step by step. The Jedi begin to suspect something. Everyone's getting paranoid. And that is the Clone War, a kind of cold war...

 

You guys need to remember that Star Wars is NOT SCI-FI. It's a fantasy/western/adventure story set in space. Cloning should NOT play a large part in the plot or your heading into sci-fi territory. Using cloning to amass an army steers clear of sci-fi because it doesn't really affect the plot that their clones. However, replacing important characters with clones seems like a no no to me because it's a very sci-fi concept. Futuristic space tech is just an element of setting in Star Wars, not of plot.

Replacing characters with evil copies is the stuff of legend, it's Changelings, Doppelgangers and the like, the clone thing just gives it a space aged edge so I wouldn't object to it within a space fantasy context as long as it's a metaphor for something of a mythical flavour.

Octorox said:

ben_danger said:

i know ill get egged for this, but ill love to see stormtroopers with clone trooper markings...

 

if only there was someone with exceptional photoshop skills around here......;)

 

like this:

 

http://bsmbow.blogspot.com/2007/04/star-wars-dvd-april-fool.html

I liked the fact that Vader's wonky chest plate is still wonky, It's just the thing Lucas would do, tart up here and there but forget to fix things.

They must have spent a fortune animating TPM's Jabba for the DVD and then they coloured him incorrectly and left in all the mistakes that Adywan spent time isolating and putting right.

Come to think of it, did Ady fix the chest plate?

BarBar Jinkx said:

Where is Ady anywayz it seems like forever since he's been on here!

Besides working his teeth off on fixing Star Wars films he has a real life too, I'm sure he will get around to commenting in good time.

"Don't say that master, you're the closest thing I have to a...3D modelling expert type thing...mmm."

It was taken at an exhibition but I did just google it.

So I can't claim to be responsible for taking it (i'm a terrible Magpie).

Obviously I still had to put a light to the engines.

I'm starting to think we could (between the people posting here) produce virtual storyboards for alternate ROTJs with all the extra trimmings.

It would be a great resource for anyone doing an overhaul of Episode VI.

Very nice work there, very nice indeed!

I cobbled together this view of the Executor dropping Vader off with a hint of contruction around the Death Star.

I did think last night that it would be fun to remove the Torture Droid and replace it with a couple of smaller ones to mirror Darth Maul's probes.

That way the mind probes are Sith issue instead of standard Imperial equipment (something that Vader personally uses with the Force to reach into the minds of his victims).

The needle looks too here and now and it must be a bugger for the poor thing to stick it's patient.

vaderios said:

The perpespective seems a bit odd. From far it works.

Why you don't use a 3d model? :)

-Angel

 

I haven't ever tried 3d modeling, for one thing I haven't the software on this Mac thing and for another I'm not even fully competant at working in 2d.

I'm terrible at cutting around edges (even with real paper), too many late nights doing tiny patterns with white ink on black ink drawings in a candle lit room does terrors to ancient eyes.

vaderios said:

The Endor is 3d model?

The forest moon is the original matte, the gas planet is a painting of Uranus, the Death Star is my own attempt to simulate the back of the thing (rather slapped together as can be seen in close up).

Rather than spending nearly two decades building a Death Star (that it would later take three or four years to rebuild bigger) here are the Sith over-seeing the construction of the new Imperial Star Destroyers :

vaderios said:

Very Cool! Still if the planet is the gas giant it should be bigger that its moon :)

I like the extreme perspective of the shot!

-Angel

I feel a Father Ted style explanation of perspective coming on.

I wanted it to look different from Yavin so I put the moon quite far away from it's parent.

Endor as the moon of a blue ringed gas giant (like Neptune) with the back of the Death Star crude mock-up type thing :

Octorox said:

ChainsawAsh said:

Blackhawk, we are DEFINITELY on the same page.  That just sounds amazing - God, if only the real prequels had been like this ...

And that outline makes me warm up quite a bit more to the whole "Sith" thing.

I'd comment more, but I'm still a bit overwhelmed by that outline, and I need to get some real-life stuff taken care of at the moment.  But wow, fantastic job there.

TheBoot, you have some good ideas, but it feels simultaneously too similar to ideas already presented to the point where it's really not much new, and too similar to the prequels as they exist today.  I know that seems contradictory, but that's the feeling I got when I read them.  Also, it's far too clear that Anakin is Vader at the end.  But there are some good ideas in there, as well.

 

I still really hate the OT of preserving the OT secrets in the prequels. I thought the whole point of the prequels were to show everything the characters talked about in the OT. Anakin's fall, the Empire's rise, The destruction of the Jedi, The Clone Wars, Palpatine's rise to power, Luke and Leia's birth and separation ect. I don't like the idea of never seeing Anakin's gradual fall to the dark side. Sorry guys, I'm just not seeing it. The prequels failing was all in writing, acting, direction in characterization, not in story or concepts.

In that case why not call them Episodes VII through to IX and tell that story as a flashback and tell an even earlier story for I to III.

That way you can tell your story of the origin of Anakin as Luke discovering his roots after Endor and not worry about surprises and people watching in chronological order remain spoiler free.

Then you get your trilogy of trilogies.

To be very daring you could make Episodes I to III after Endor and set up the reason why Luke needs to investigate his past.

So the three trilogies run in reverse.

It seemed a bit odd in the original landing bay that droids were on parade too.

You'd think that they would tuck them away for the arrival of the bossman.

Ziz said:

Why'd you change the shuttle element?  I think the original one looks better.

I imagine it's because of perspective, the scene seems to have been shifted slightly further over to the side to take in the gantry which would mean the original element wouldn't match up with the new vanishing point.

Perhaps a different form of tarting up the "Mind Probe" by focusing on the beam thing at the bottom instead of the needle.

OzoneSherrif said:

Nah that thing in the corner is the teleporter

Sure it isn't the ash tray?

Octorox said:

I'd like to see a scene after the rebels victory but before the throne room awards that shows Vader returning to coruscant and handing Obi-Wan's saber to the Emperor saying "Order 66 is complete my master" or something along those lines. Or even saying "I have failed" in regards to the Death Star and then the emperor shocks Vader. wishful thinking I know. Glimpses of Coruscant throughout the OT would be nice because it's pretty much the focal point in the Pt and yet is never seen in the OT.

Like a serious version of the now immortal Robot Chicken skit?

That adds a lot more grandeur to old prune face's entrance, I would still like to see him have a fancier shuttle than Vader's.

The other real problem is the docking bay that Vader lands in is clearly meant to be a different smaller one and the mattes help with that but the set elements look exactly the same.

Editors like Adywan have worked wonders but are there any other ideas that could be worked on by other editors to add even more to what has already been accomplished.

Here’s a couple of crude mockups to get the ball rolling.

1st, That Jabba Scene…surplus to requirement at the moment but by adding different subtitles and re-colouring it to match his look in ROTJ it could add more than just say again what the Greedo scene did so well (especially if someone could work out what to do with his tail without Han stepping on it).

Holographic communications appear in every Star Wars film but in ANH all we get is Leia’s message.

It would make sense that Tarkin would want to get news about Dantooine ASAP so why not have the message delivered over the holonet?

That big ball on the conference table must serve some function (not unless it’s for Imperial Fondue parties).