Bingowings

I think you mean the ones doubleofive posted which explains my confusion.

The picture is more crisp in the 2004 DVD because it had an extensive restoration done on it and was digitally remastered specifically for the DVD format but the colour has some of (but not quite as bad) the tinting that made weird all the SE DVD sets and then there is Vader's pink sabre (the most pink in ROTJ) and all the sound problems.

If the OUT had been restored to the same degree and remastered and presented well (instead of being essentially a LD transfer) I imagine it wouldn't have got the GOUT moniker.

Even then it should have been in the 2004 box set and the SE discs should have been treated with more care and given a proper sound mix but then if we had that I imagine that some of the creative people on here wouldn't have hung around for so long and newer people like myself wouldn't have joined on.

So George when he does something wrong still does some good, from a certain point of view.

Sluggo I think colour stripe should return, it would be the easiest way to make the shuttles look different from each other (though I think what with Palpatine replacing the blue guard with the red, the stripe should be red to reflect this colour scheme).

I've never heard of this factoid before and I suppose I was hypnotised into not noticing the matte missmatch so thanks for pointing it out.

Now I have an whole new Doh! moment to notice when watch Jedi ;-)

oh_riginal said:

Bingowings said:

The problem is that to see it that big they would have to be between galaxies or the other galaxy would have to be colliding with theirs (which would make it visable in almost every shot in the saga) or very, very big (which would have the same effect).

We can only see Andromeda in detail in those nice photographs through looking through a very powerful telescope.

Everywhere in our galaxy the view would be pretty much the same (though both our galaxy and it are moving together very quickly).

I don't get it... supposedly our sun is located in one of the spiral arms of the Milky Way, right? Yet when we look around us (to the sky naturally) we do not see the arm we are in, or the rest of the galaxy... well, technically we do I suppose, but we don't SEE it, if you know what I mean.

So if we are not able to see the galaxy around us, how would it be at all possible to see ANOTHER galaxy? Telescopes see differently than the naked eye, right? Am I wrong about that? I don't know.

So... I'm just gonna go with the idea that the image shown in the background as the Falcon flies by is a forming star, nothing more. Though an updated version could be cool either way.

 

Andromeda is 2.5million light years away so it will look roughly like this:

wherever you are in our galaxy (unless you have a telescope). The reason why you might not see the galaxy we are in may be light polution, most humans through our history have been able to see it (it's why the galaxy we are in is called The Milky Way it looks like a splash of milk across the sky if the sky is dark enough) here it is from Death Valley:

Here are two mock ups I did in the ESB/ROTJ Wishlist thread showing an accretion disk instead (not up to vaderios' standards) :

As for the object in ESB being the Rishi Maze it seems a bit odd to me that the Rebels, after suffering such a defeat, would hide in what must by then be one the most notoriously famous areas of space.

It's like a bunch of anti-American spies hanging out at Mount Rushmore, mmm...didn't Hitchcock do that one already ;-)

Asteroid-Man said:

First 2:30 of the movie: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=2MNTUWZW

Just wanted to know what you guys think of the opening.

I assume I have to register because I can't see the code I have to enter.

teharri said:Is it just me or does the color on the 2004 dvd's actually look better than the original in this instance.  I am referring to the images from Bingowings above.

 Which images are do you mean teharri?

"May I suggest a new strategy...Artoo let the humans win" :

Now you know why GOUT ain't OOUT (or at least one of many reasons).

The problem is that to see it that big they would have to be between galaxies or the other galaxy would have to be colliding with theirs (which would make it visable in almost every shot in the saga) or very, very big (which would have the same effect).

We can only see Andromeda in detail in those nice photographs through looking through a very powerful telescope.

Everywhere in our galaxy the view would be pretty much the same (though both our galaxy and it are moving together very quickly).

He's heading from that small moon.

Something like this too:

Docta Nick said:

The thing (whatever it is) at the end of esb always kinda botrhered me 2. maybe u should just change it to a regular star..idk just an idea

That is what I was sort of suggesting.

Only rather than just a star, make it a very young star with an accretion disk of proto planetary matter around it.

That way we can keep the basic spiral shape of the original shot, keep the characters in their galaxy and even get a nice pretty glow from the star into the bargain.

Everybody wins.

Something like this :

Monroville I would like to direct you to this related conversation over on the ESB/ROTJ Wishlist thread (starts near the bottom).

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/ESB-and-ROTJ-Wishlist/topic/8826/page/51/

I would have posted it here if those images came here first.

EyeShotFirst said:

Damn so that means I cant write my graphic novel. Boba Fett vs. Predator. LOL

You can write it but you'd need a Star Trek cliche to get them together ;-)

Sluggo said:

Bingowings said:

It has been speculated that the Falcon isn't flying towards isn't a galaxy (as all of the story takes place inside the Star Wars galaxy and travel between galaxies would require technology beyond even that shown in the saga, not something that concerns me much as I don't feel Star Wars is science fiction).

It may be an accretion disks around a young star (something that doesn't really match the current image or your lovely new one both of which look like spiral galaxies).

It might be nice to experiment with images of what accretion disks might look like (some look very pretty and there are a lot out there if you do a search) :

 

 It has never really bothered me that perhaps the rebel fleet was hiding outside of the galaxy at the end of ESB.   I think the final shots could use a little punching up, but nothing too drastic.

It depends on how science fictiony you feel Star Wars to be.

If it's pure fantasy that's fine but sort of doesn't make much narrative sense because if the Rebels can hop in and out of their galaxy why bother building bases?

The spaces outside their galaxy would be huge, imagine that looking for the Rebels in their galaxy was like looking for one person in a major city, looking for them at that distance from their galaxy would be like looking for one person in a city the size of our entire solar system.

The Imperials wouldn't stand a chance of finding them.

In terms of Science Fiction, Proxima Centauri (the nearest star to our own) is 4.2 light years away, a long distance but with the technology shown in Star Wars a short hop, Andromeda (the nearest spiral galaxy) is 2.5 million light years away to see it the way we see the object out of that window we would need to be half way there.

Even with Star Wars style technology it would take aeons to get to that point and aeons to get back.

I don't think Star Wars is science fiction but even as a fantasy it has to make sense within it's fantasy realm and an accretion disk would look similar (in many ways nicer because of the glow coming from the young star) and make sense both as in a fantasic and in a science fictiony manner (making both sets of fans happy).

Post no longer necessary

It has been speculated that the Falcon isn't flying towards isn't a galaxy (as all of the story takes place inside the Star Wars galaxy and travel between galaxies would require technology beyond even that shown in the saga, not something that concerns me much as I don't feel Star Wars is science fiction).

It may be an accretion disks around a young star (something that doesn't really match the current image or your lovely new one both of which look like spiral galaxies).

It might be nice to experiment with images of what accretion disks might look like (some look very pretty and there are a lot out there if you do a search) :

The in credits celebrations look really good Davnes, the idea itself I'm not keen on for the reasons I described earlier but you have done a good job proving the concept and some editors may want to go that way after seeing what you have done.

It's nice to see the overhead super laser in motion.

Between us we could do a mock-up matte with a protection screen of some sort or some kind of stucture around the gunners that fits's into the aspect ratio of the film.

Thanks for taking the time to put one of my ideas to the test.

That's what I love about logging on here, team work and community spirit.

Sevb32 said:

They already did it! Just didn't release it yet.

They may well have already done it but I for one am not sure if I will be buying a blue ray player for a long while and going by the DVD set I'm not sure I will buy the same film again for the umpty thrumptieth time, possibly at a stupid inflated price and with the Ugnaughts replaced by cats wearing dog outfits waving turquoise laser toothpicks around in the latest round of George's attempt to capture his original vision and with everything tinted mauve this time.

The TPM puppet is an element (a really awful element) but while fiddling about doing something else I saw it starting to look a bit like Yoda so I posted a few pictures to see if it was just an accident or if anything could be done to save this very expensive mistake.

Clearly nothing can but it was worth a try especially seeing as we have no idea when this CGI Yoda will turn up and there are a lot of people who want to do edits of these films now (think of how many edits we may have missed if we waited on Lucas, would we be actually editing at if we waited on him long enough he might make the perfect Star Wars anyway, unlikely but possible).

We have no guarentee that the new CGI Yoda will work any more than the new Jabba in the DVD version of ANH did (same model as in TPM but colour and lighting way off and no solution to the tail stepping problem).

Just saying George is going to fix it if we buy yet another version of a film he should have got right the first time is no reason to be complacent.

I've been having a thought about the Trade Federation and the boring tax situation, Magnoliafan turned them into slave traders, but if a skilled artist manipulated those carved faces at the Gungan sacred place there could be another reason for them wanting the planet.

Something like this (only better):

Now it's more of a case of wanting it back rather than just wanting it.

They could have colonised the planet a long time back when the Gungans were still a primitive race (something the Trade Federation still think they are) only to be driven off by the Naboo. The Gungans religion could have started off as a Cargo Cult worshiping the Neimodians as Gods, later as they became a sophisticated race they still believed in the Gods but didn't recognise the Trade Federation as being them:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult

It would explain such practises as life debts if their Gods were really business obsessed bureaucrats and there are many regions on our planet which nations argue they have a legitmate claim to even though they haven't held that area for centuries.

Davnes007 said:

I was just casually watching ROTJ, and when I saw the various celebrations, I thought it would be neat if the Yub-Nub was restored...and then the celebrations could be shown during the ending credits - either behind the credits, or beside them.

Wouldn't that be super-cool? :P

And, as always, a video to show how it would look (behind the credits).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfkT1gnWXcw 

The link seems to be dead Davnes.

One of the unique aspects of the Star Wars films is it's lack of opening credits (something Lucas actually fought and sacrificed for) and their consistent end credit format.

So for me personally I wouldn't like that to be changed.

I'm not a fan of action intrusive credits anyway (unless they are done in a really clever way) but it might work.

rcb said:

Bingowings said:

rcb said:

EyeShotFirst said:

The Idea of just ending ROTS with anikan burning in the flames is just too good. We dont really need flashbacks but it would help tie in the PT to the OT. But still how do we remedy the whole vader was a pupil of mine and was suduced by the darkside thing. If we did dreams with anikan. We could just add shots of vader swinging his saber about through the home of padme. and add screams. But leave the anikan padme scream out of return of the jedi. Their is enough tension in that scene alone and plus we by that time know what is going through his mind and we know what happened to him by the simple line. Noooo I am your father. that already clears it all up. But still that scene in A New Hope were Obi Wan said vader was a pupil of mine until he was suduced by the darkside. We could though look at it from the shakespeare aspect of irony in which you know what the character doesnt know. for instance Luke does not know that vader is his father and obi is hiding that from him but YOU know it. Hell if romeo and juliet can pull that off and be one of the masterpieces of all time then why not. So you know who vader is obi wan knows who vader is but luke does not know who vader REALLY IS until he reveals with the line "I am your father" you see and luke really doesnt know it. Even obi wan admits in ROTJ that he lied to protect Luke and Leia from the Emperor and Vader. It works and still makes sense. But ROTS ending with anikan in the flames really pumps things up with a what is gonna happen next and A New Hope you find out hes mean and in a black suit.

i think flashbacks would be cool. when i watch that scene, i just think back on how sweet a kid he used to be and how that little boy could become something so evil. and i got teary eyed when the ewok died. i don't wanna see anymore of that. :(

It's not even certain that Corpsey actually dies and we should feel upset when people get killed in battles.

The problem with ROTJ is that it tries so hard to be a happy jolly upbeat ending with all the loose ends tied off that it feels fake.

No victory is ever complete, not all the good guys win, not all the bad guys lose.

Star Wars is a fantasy but even myths have a bitter sweetness to their endings, Arthur must be taken to Avalon, Robin Hood must die, Lando and the Falcon should go bang.

 

hey. corpsey and those other ewoks are cute and its sad. its like a big teddy bear for a pet. how would u feel if that was ur dog, uh?

 

That's the problem, instead of feeling that a cute teddy bear got hurt (and possibly died) you should feel that a person (all be he or she short and hairy) was tragically killed fighting for freedom. Not an animal or a toy.

This is where colour alteration can be a radical change.

I suggested some pages back (and I'm sure other people must have thought of this too) that the robes should be recoloured to tie in more with what Luke wears in ROTJ (black under tunic and boots with a dark brown hooded cloak).

The designs could be very different but the colour scheme stay the same.

Obi-Wan in the OT is dressed to fit in with what the moisture farmers on Tatooine wear so there is no reason why all the Jedi, in their prime, have to dress like that when they aren't undercover on Tatooine, unless we are meant to believe that Obi-Wan chose Tatooine to place Luke and hide so he can wear the same set of clothes for the next two decades.

DarthBo said:

Redubbing will look fake.

it always does.

Dubbing Ewan to sound more like Alec is a bit too radical a change for me ;-)

Very little dialogue recorded on set or on location actually ends up in the majority movies so most of it is technically redubbed (including the Star Wars movies as they currently exist).

It might be interesting to see (or rather hear) someone attempt it, but I can imagine it going very wrong if done badly.

SilverWook said:

I can't find it on Youtube, but I did find what appears to be some fascinating behind the scenes footage from the shoot!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7B_69vakbrc

Interesting that bits of the Death Star docking bay control room set were still around when this was shot. (Circa 1979?)

Chunks were repainted and put into the Executor set in ESB (possibly including the bit that is replaced by the televison behind a plastic dome thing here) so it makes sense that other bits would still be tucked away in Elstree as late as then (they might have hoped to recycle them too).

rcb said:

EyeShotFirst said:

The Idea of just ending ROTS with anikan burning in the flames is just too good. We dont really need flashbacks but it would help tie in the PT to the OT. But still how do we remedy the whole vader was a pupil of mine and was suduced by the darkside thing. If we did dreams with anikan. We could just add shots of vader swinging his saber about through the home of padme. and add screams. But leave the anikan padme scream out of return of the jedi. Their is enough tension in that scene alone and plus we by that time know what is going through his mind and we know what happened to him by the simple line. Noooo I am your father. that already clears it all up. But still that scene in A New Hope were Obi Wan said vader was a pupil of mine until he was suduced by the darkside. We could though look at it from the shakespeare aspect of irony in which you know what the character doesnt know. for instance Luke does not know that vader is his father and obi is hiding that from him but YOU know it. Hell if romeo and juliet can pull that off and be one of the masterpieces of all time then why not. So you know who vader is obi wan knows who vader is but luke does not know who vader REALLY IS until he reveals with the line "I am your father" you see and luke really doesnt know it. Even obi wan admits in ROTJ that he lied to protect Luke and Leia from the Emperor and Vader. It works and still makes sense. But ROTS ending with anikan in the flames really pumps things up with a what is gonna happen next and A New Hope you find out hes mean and in a black suit.

i think flashbacks would be cool. when i watch that scene, i just think back on how sweet a kid he used to be and how that little boy could become something so evil. and i got teary eyed when the ewok died. i don't wanna see anymore of that. :(

It's not even certain that Corpsey actually dies and we should feel upset when people get killed in battles.

The problem with ROTJ is that it tries so hard to be a happy jolly upbeat ending with all the loose ends tied off that it feels fake.

No victory is ever complete, not all the good guys win, not all the bad guys lose.

Star Wars is a fantasy but even myths have a bitter sweetness to their endings, Arthur must be taken to Avalon, Robin Hood must die, Lando and the Falcon should go bang.

Darth Lars said:

Monroville said:

If anyone has seen the www.pinkfive.com spots, could it be conceivable to get the guy who does their Obi-Wan impersonations to dub over Ewan's lines?  Ewan is one of the better actors in the PTs, but that's not saying much.  It wouldn't just be a matter of having someone who sounds even more like Alec Guinness but also someone who could impart a little more seriousness...

Whoever you get to impersonate Alec Guinness, I think that he should try to impersonate the voice of Alec Guinness in an earlier work, when he was younger. I think that the tone of voice that Obi-Wan uses as Luke's mentor would be inappropriate for most of the prequels, as he is not in that role and in other circumstances.

If you watch films like "The Man In The White Suit" Alec Guinness' voice didn't change that much as he got older and in that film he is playing a young, slightly naive but altruistically driven man, learning a trade that most people don't understand (rather like learning to be a Jedi).

I don't think the Empire tortures people in party dresses.

They even made Han take his jacket off.