Bingowings

All brilliant ideas there, having Qui-Gon disappear would be difficult to work into a saga where Jedi vanishing is unheard of.

It might be seen as proof that he was onto something about Anakin but it would be difficult to reconcile with Vader's apparent WTF when Ben's body does it in ANH.

Unless in that context it becomes more of a "Oops! So he can do it too" sort of thing but Vader seems to take a lot of pride in it being Kenobi's final end and is still convinced of it in ESB (but that too could contexually change into Vader keeping more secrets from his master in the hope it will help him get the old bugger out of the way).

vaderios said:

Yeah the sourse was crap. Youtube what did you expect :P

 

-Angel

What you want is to get your hands on one of these : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/index.html?curid=2748491

I had it years ago but gave it away when I split up with my Ex and in a moment of madness became a mac user.

ben_danger said:

^i meant that film!:p

Crickey Ben we seem to be synchronised today :-)

The Time Guardian has got a DVD release too (more Carrie in metal boobs action) I'm not sure if it would be useful but you might be able to get something out of it (even if it's just Carrie with metal boobs).

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Guardian-Premium-Anamorphic-Widescreen-Release/dp/B0012GVKEQ

There would be a bit of irony of sampling from Slipstream for a ROTJ edit because it would mean Gary Kurtz gets directly into the final part of the OT at last (even if it wasn't from his finest work).

JasonN said:

I'll look into killing off Lando, yeah - at the moment, though, I'm editing the Luke/Yoda/Vader/Emperor scenes (maybe as a way to starve off working on those damn Ewoks....) and doing research if the "montage" ending is technically feasible.

Right now, I'm rewatching some of Harrison Ford's later movies see if there are any scenes that could work to portray an older Han Solo (Indy 4, perhaps). Now finding actors to use as older Luke and Leia, that's going to be more difficult (the actors need to somewhat resemble older versions of the characters and the film scenes have to be close to the ones I want to portray in the ending)

Mark in Slipstream would make for a good battle hardened Jedi (the face fuzz gives him a bit of an Obi-Wan look and makes him look even older than he was at the time), shame that movie is such bobbins because he was really good in it and I love the late Bob Peck, if anything could be rescued out of that film I would be pleased beyond words.

I'm not sure if it got a DVD release however.

 In a similar vein Carrie did an even more rubbish film, The Time Guardian which might have a few salvageable frames.

What you have done there is very good (especially working around that nasty frame crack) there is some exciting software out there for sampling textures from still images and applying them to damaged and even monochrome moving images.

I can't remember where the link is (I will look again).

There were quite a few full colour production photographs taken of the deleted scenes and maybe these can be used to improve the quality (assuming that Lucasfilm hasn't hidden a mother lode of full quality out takes which they are sitting on for the 8D 2084 hologlobe release).

In my effort to keep the ideas on the SAVE LANDO!!! thread from dying when the bru ha ha ebbs down (if it ever will) I'm posting this here too :

Bingowings said:

What if the impact that knocked out the communications disk also knocked out the quad laser, that way it's not a suicide mission (well no more than usual) or down to extra shielding on the reactor, but down to not having enough firepower once the Falcon gets there.

The ship could get really badly shaved and covered in dings (meaning the cockpit is sealed in to stop fire from spreading).

That would just leave the guys in the cockpit to volunteer to ram the reactor.

It would add to the tension because the Falcon might not even make it to the reactor before blowing.

Something like this (only better) :

I agree it's a fine line between tell and show and tell but these are pieces of cinema and not audio drama so while some restraint can make for better story telling, sometimes you can't beat just putting it up there (the putting up there bit is more difficult).

Another sequence I suggested sometime back was to have the Falcon and Luke's X-Wing attacked as it tried to leave Tatooine (Vader wants both captured to get Luke before for the Emperor can and knows he will try to save Han at some point), once again something similar was put into the radio drama version, Star Wars is usually at it best when it has little out the frying pan into the fire moments like this and it would deliver a bit more of a punch to the end of the first act and remind us that the Empire is a much more dangerous threat than Jabba :

TMBTM said:

doubleofive said:

Bingowings said:

But as I said you don't need that approach to get around Luke getting out in time, you just have him leave earlier.

Does no one like my idea of not showing him leave at all?  Have Leia's revelation that she feels that Luke is alive be both a reveal of her untrained Force ability and a revelation to the audience that Luke made it off.  So we'd see Luke mourning his father and next time burning the remains, not: mourning his father, flying a shuttle out of an exploding hanger bay at the last second, burning the remains.

Or if you really wanted, instead of the Falcon flying in front of the DS explosion, have it be Luke's shuttle.

I either need to figure out how to do some editing with the programs I have, or ask someone else to mock it up for me...

I think it's a good idea to not see Luke leaving the Death Star. It's a good exemple of "less is more".

It might seem a bit bizarre having Luke on a battered station with a dying Vader one minute and on the moon with Vader's corpse later but then it might put greater strength to Leia's knowing he survived, I guess it would be something that you could only be sure of once someone has given it a go.

Davnes007 said:

Bingowings said:

EyeShotFirst said:

I actually have a decent idea (if it hasnt been stated yet) the shot could open outside bens house and have lukes xwing sitting outside it. or have the ship flying over tattoined and landing by bens house. Of course if you read the first 5 pages of Shadows of the empire the whole gang is at ben's house. Hmmm of course we could say fuggit and let luke be alone. Of course that will be a bitch to pull of. We would have to use existing scenes. could we even add obi wan to the shot telling him about how vader is his father. of coursse we need to see yoda die.

Ideas like yours have been discussed before (scroll back to page 20) here was my take:

 

I just put together an edit of what you might have in mind. The video spans the first hour of the movie (but I cut alot out of the footage just for the sake of time, etc). You might even get a few chuckles out of it. Ayway, just have fun watching ROTJ like you've never seen it before.

Please note: This is probably one of the weirdest looking edits ever made, but I think it sort of gets the point across, so please put aside any "it looks rushed" thoughts :P

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erIchJPPlyw

More great work there, I take it you have seen SomethingStarWarsRelated's take starting here : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJOLKUR-420&feature=channel_page

My take on the scene in Ben's hut take's place before the droids set out for Jabba's palace (he records his message for Jabba there and if it can be done constructs his sabre and places both in R2) which is why Threepio is outside the hut in my mockup.

But SSWR's take has Chewie being delivered before all of that and removes Threepio from that scene.

When I did my photoshop mockups I did a large image of the hut (not the Hutt) interior minus all the characters bar R2 (I kept him in to scale the other characters into the frame). My thinking being that the background would be out of focus most of the time in relation to the characters.

Perhaps someone with the HD version of ANH could do a higher rez version?

There have been efforts to try and clean up the footage but there is only so much that can be done with the source material in the state it's in.

EyeShotFirst said:

Thats not an impossible thing. If their is any way of having boba put up a good fight then that is even better. Empire Strikes Back though he didnt need to fight, You could tell by his theme music and his quietness that he was no man to mess with. Of course accourding to EU novels and comics. Boba is not a bad guy. He just does his job and that job is making money. He is in kahoots with vader though. But hey Han was an imperial officer in the EU. And luke wanted to go to the Imperial Academy along with Biggs (why did they not talk about this more. He even contradicted wanting to go to the academy when he said he had no love for the empire) maybe going to the academy was the only way of getting out of tattooine. That would make sense. It would be like joining the military if your stuck in say cookeville tennessee like I am LOL though I dont plan on joining the military. But think about it you would probably lead a successful life joining the imperial academy. Joining the rebellion well the only benefits from it is your chances of dying increase. In the empire all you have to do is avoid pissing off vader.

You really, really need to go back a bit (you sound like the sort of guy who would get a kick out reading the ideas that have been posted before, here and on the Fan-O-Matic/Starkiller thread).

Going back here might help : http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/ESB-and-ROTJ-Wishlist/topic/8826/page/17/

Here is the combined efforts of vaderios and myself applied to the problem, it would be great to see what you come up with.

Bingowings said:

vaderios said:

As Bingowings said: Some storyboard of the possibly Mr Boba's insert to Rebellion's fate.

First Shot: A ship is approaching fast a fleet (rebels) that is gathering/ or some ships whatever. It enters into a hangar.

Second Shot. We see it landing. Dark hangar. The door is open and some light fills the place. We see someone ( boba) walks down of the ship and meet some ppl.

Third shot. Behind of boba) to walk.

Fourth Shot: We see some rebels ( in the pic are random) They talk

Fifth shot: Mr B gives the plans to the rebels. A payment agreement.

Final Shot: Out of the hangar camera.We see B's ship take off and Fly to the camera.

-Angel

Here's my go, now the nod that Fett gives Boussh and the line, "I hope it's worth the price we paid for it" have different meanings.

The Rebels hire Fett to find the location and Fett get's it straight out of the Sith Lord's mouth (two paychecks for one job just like in ESB).

 

As you know I'm really for the two Death Star scenerio as it was in the original script treatment and it makes Jedi less like ANH.

I can't see how having two of the things  is any more daft than having one of them and if Ady doesn't do it I'm sure someone else will.

But as I said you don't need that approach to get around Luke getting out in time, you just have him leave earlier.

EyeShotFirst, it makes perfect sense if you read the relavent section of the ESB/ROTJ thread.

Palpatine lets the Rebels know about the Death Star being built around the forest moon so he can trap the fleet and destroy them with a second Death Star they don't know about (where Luke and Vader fight).

The fun starts on this page (http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/ESB-and-ROTJ-Wishlist/post/345406/#post345406)

You will find yourself going over old ground if you don't back track a bit and the whole thread is a good read, full of great ideas.

EyeShotFirst said:

Could yoda's death be shorter. It seemed like he was milking it. I mean he dies then he goes Luke luke their........is...another...........skywa...ker... I cant help but think god whould ya hurry up and die.

We are singing off the same hymn sheet here I said something similar a number of pages back.

Sluggo said:

I don't like the idea of a lightsaber being built with the Force.  It sounds too PT/EU to me.  I'd bet it would make Obi-wan very grumpy.

Oh, for those of you that haven't seen Jambe Davdar's Returning to Jedi, he has a clip of the original prop lightsaber that Luke filmed but wasn't included in the final cut.

 

It was the way he does it in the Radio version of ROTJ (he tries to do it by hand but none of the pieces come together then he uses the Force and they fit perfectly), so it's not exactly out there, also it would explain why Vader finds it remarkable, otherwise it makes being a Jedi sound like having the power to put up flat packed furniture that doesn't wobble, using all the screws.

Luke is a Jedi knight not an Ikea knight ;-)

It would be great if someone could make a Luke ROTJ sabre that can come to pieces so it could be stop motioned coming apart and reversed so it looked like it was being constructed using the Force.

I wonder if any of the sabre makers out there could construct such a thing.

AuggieBenDoggie said:

 

"Adywan" said:

I always had an idea almost straight after seeing ROTJ in 1983 that Lando should have died. i had even planned it and wrote it down and i still have the outline i wrote. it took away the rehash of ANH feeling i had away from it. One thing i couldn't understand is why the hell would the emperor not protect the main core from torpedoes after what happened to the original DS? That just didn't make sense and still doesn't. My original outline was what if they reached the core and the torpedoes had no impact at all on the shielding. what do they do? the only ship large enough to do any sort of damage was the falcon. i had planned to have lando ram the core as he screams "yeeehaa" and it is wedges X-wing that you see just escaping the death star just before it explodes. But bloody independence day went and did it. i still love that idea but can i still do it now that film came out? i don't know. i may have to find an alternative ending somehow. now after the SE came out and the PT there was an extra part i wanted to see after the DS explodes which ties in all the celebrations around the galaxy. that, i am keeping secret for now.

 

 

Why the emperor didn't protect the main core from torpedos? He had the shield generator, and the imperial fleet was to keep the rebels trapped while the death star picked off the battle ships one by one. Something that wasn't done in ANH.  In the end, the emperor was over confident, just as Luke told him. He didn't expect/accept the strike team on Endor to be able to destroy the shield generator.

Having Lando commit suicide by chashing into the core screaming yeeehaa is pretty funny.  It would also create a few problems with Lukes escape, as he wouldn't be able to escape. He wouldn't be able to see his fathers face before he dies. He would also die almost as instantly as Lando would if the death star exploded as fast as the first one did. The rebel fleet might not get the chance to get far enough away either. I think the all ready established ending works best, and has worked for me ever since I first watched it.

The problem of Luke's escape would be solved by the two Death Star scenerio (see the ESB/ROTJ wishlist thread for details), in short Luke is on another Death Star which is destroyed by the Executor.

Without it the problem could be solved by altering the timing, the station could be shaken by bombardment from Rebel capital ships once the shield is down and he could be escape just as the station is about to explode (like Wedge).

ChainsawAsh said:

Movie starts with Vader arriving, then Luke on Dagobah, then a Jabba scene, then Luke arrives on Tatooine and that's where the above scene would come.

I know what you mean Ash I meant as far as Luke is concerned.

Yoda dies after Luke finishes his train near the beginning of the film (some people have or are working on variations based on the same idea but all of them build on that daring leap of reordering).

Sluggo said:

That would be a pain in the butt to pull off.

 

And totally cool.

 

Since it removes Ben and Luke from Dagobah, would Luke still travel to Dagobah to complete his training with Yoda?

In most of fan-o-matic inspired scenerios the film starts with Luke on Dagobah as he's been there finishing his training since ESB.

What if the impact that knocked out the communications disk also knocked out the quad laser, that way it's not a suicide mission (well no more than usual) or down to extra shielding on the reactor, but down to not having enough firepower once the Falcon gets there.

The ship could get really badly shaved and covered in dings (meaning the cockpit is sealed in to stop fire from spreading).

That would just leave the guys in the cockpit to volunteer to ram the reactor.

It would add to the tension because the Falcon might not even make it to the reactor before blowing.

Something like this (only better) :

EyeShotFirst said:

I actually have a decent idea (if it hasnt been stated yet) the shot could open outside bens house and have lukes xwing sitting outside it. or have the ship flying over tattoined and landing by bens house. Of course if you read the first 5 pages of Shadows of the empire the whole gang is at ben's house. Hmmm of course we could say fuggit and let luke be alone. Of course that will be a bitch to pull of. We would have to use existing scenes. could we even add obi wan to the shot telling him about how vader is his father. of coursse we need to see yoda die.

Ideas like yours have been discussed before (scroll back to page 20) here was my take:

AxiaEuxine said:

Okay so this is my coolest Axia Edition post yet, in my opinion. What if Vader opened up Luke's Saber to check out just how he had made his saber?

Not recomended while the saber is on but Vader is a bad-ass.

That looks so good and would work even better if we could get the Ben's hut bit done. Could it the lightsabre construction scene be done with stop motion, so he constructs the whole thing via telekinesis underlining just how much skill is needed to make one?

Welcome to the New Republic of Calrissiania :-)

I used that photo but getting it to look like a statue wasn't easy so I pinched from several statues to produce this Bling it might look better at Cloud City:

doubleofive said:

And a staute of Billy Dee Williams in any form is solid awesome.

Well I don't know if it's art...

What about a Biggs is Lando and survives the attack on the Death Star and goes off to take over Cloud City branch?

Taking from the SAVE LANDO!!!! thread (as this isn't an exclusively Adywan thread I've copied these contributions over so they may be worked on here as contributors see fit.

On killing Han instead (or as well):

Bingowings said:

I don't know how it could be done but an alternate take could be to kill Han in the Endor battle (so he never see's the Falcon again) and have Lando live and marry Leia (many, many years later).

That would make Harrison Ford happy, keep the cries of "You killed the only black character" at bay and what's more move him from the B list to the A list characters.

Killing Lando is more doable though....

DarkFather said:

Lando sacrificing himself, I believe, would be superfluous. As Bingowings already mentioned, his redemption was putting himself on the line for months in order to save Han from Jabba. He was hanging around as a mole waiting to sabotage in one of the murkiest locations in the galaxy.

Only Han dying in the carbonite, which he obviously survived, would warrant Lando sacrificing himself at the Battle of Endor. I doubt Lando has much guilt left in his mind now that Han is rescued in no small part thanks to him.

That's why I vote that if we are going to have any of the heroes die in the final clash between Rebellion and Empire, it is better to have it be Han. To have rescued the rogue-turned-hero only to have him die soon afterward would add an extra sense of tragedy to the death.

In essence, they would have undertook a long, dangerous rescue mission just to have a few more precious days with their dear friend.

It's poetic.

 InfoDroid said:

Han could be killed when the charges blow at the bunker.  He could be swept up in the explosion that seems to level several city blocks.

doubleofive said:

Not bad, but if HAN died we'd REALLY need some reaction shots.

DarkFather said:

He has a funny feeling like he's never going to see her again.

And... if we take away the ropes holding Han's feet to the sand cruiser over the Sarlaac Pit... it could also act as a hint to Han being attuned to the Force.

Hmm. I still say Han dies, though. I'll try to pick a moment in the film when this can be done later. Expect greatness.

 

As for reaction shots, it could be something subtle. As when Luke is looking on at the ghosts, alter his expression slightly to reflect an underlying sadness. When Leia comes up behind him to beckon him over to the celebration, the alterations would need to be a lot more substantial... though at the same time not too hard to pull off: take away the broad smile, and replace it with a weaker smile to Luke that only lasts for a brief moment, while making it clear that she has tears running down her face.

Also, we could put a pire next to Anakin's for Han. It doesn't necessarily have to be a tradition exclusively for Jedi, but a tradition in honor of the greatest of heroes.

InfoDroid said:

He could fall into the Sarlaac with Boba.  ;)

On killing off charchters other than Lando or Han :

BarBar Jinkx said:

I say kill em' all off, & let the emperor win!  >;-)

focuspuller said:

 What are you going to do next, kill Wedge?

BarBar Jinkx said:

Don't give him any ideas I love wedge!

EyeShotFirst said:

If you are gonna kill someone. go by the infinities approach and kill luke. I wouldnt mind seeing leia die. of course How in the fuck is it even possible to kill someone off of their importance. It will be a bitch and I garuntee that it will be even more of a bitch to blow up the 2nd death star without lando.

ben_danger said:

or maybe Luke dies, and Vader survives. at endor he gives Leia Luke's sabre before he self immolates on a pyre with his son.

Dangerous Incorporated said:

Kill Jar Jar. Dont kill Lando!!

The last one would be difficult to do in Jedi but not impossible.

And finally for changes not relating to character deaths :

TheoOdo said:

I always sort of guessed it would be something smaller that would still disregard the EU. Like, say, Leia not being Luke's sister?

I dunno', that's always seemed like the obvious choice to me.