I was just going to say no… But now you mention it, Phil’s version of You Can’t Hurry Love could add bathos to the Luke, Leia romance.
I add my wishes to Warb’s. Like Warb my dad passed a little earlier than most, I’m rapidly approaching the age my dad was when he got ill so I wish everyone on here and their loved ones the lengthiest and healthiest of lives.
Everything. A hole in one leads to smugness, smugness leads to impulse purchases, impulse purchases lead to action figures… I sense much action figures in you 😉
It happened. It’s the least offensive ROTJ end it quick move. Retroactively it even makes more sense than Luke being Vader’s son, Leia being Vader’s daughter explains her reckless attempt to save Han while being a Rebel leader with sensitive intel during a crucial period of the war. It explains all the choking. Compared to Yoda’s death scene and Luke’s plan to save Han it’s nothing really. It’s a shame we don’t seem to be getting anything interesting come of it particularly now Carrie has died. Leia would have made a wonderful villain.
As the man in the background with the long neck he is clearly there. Like the love guru with the long tail and the guy with the horns or Mr Dinosaurus. As the EU character with the potentially mildly offensive name, I’m going to stick my neck out here and say I couldn’t really give a monkeys. He doesn’t speak, he barely moves his canon status is up there with 4-LOM but he doesn’t look as interesting.
I’ve seen the first episode. I loved the first part and hated the second half. By the way this might be the first Star Trek lead I absolutely hate, she belongs to jail, why is she a hero?
She was right.
She correctly assessed the situation and did everything she could to prevent the conflict.
If Kirk did this it would be typical Kirk stuff and we would all be patting him on the back for disrespecting the chain of command as usual.But Kirk is the captain, and TOS is incredibly cheesy, so over-the-top is expected. Plus, we have had enough time with Kirk and his crew to assess their personality. Meanwhile, this is the pilot episode of Discovery. We know very little about this crew; why they act the way they do; why they distrust and bicker with each other, et al.
The captain may have made a bad decision, but she’s the captain. It’s her call. It doesn’t matter if the first officer was right and ignoring her would get everyone killed. That’s not how a command structure works.
This is not TOS. In TOS, the characters are endearing. Plus, to have a mutiny now is like having “The Menagerie” two-parter be the actual TOS pilot, including the parts where Spock mutinied (not just “The Cage” bits). If that were the pilot, why do we know anything about Spock? Why would we care? Does Spock do this all the time? Is it normal on a starship for people to mutiny? Or it could be like if The Best of Both Worlds was the TNG pilot. Cmdr. Shelby went over Riker’s head, straight to the captain when Riker disagreed with her, and Riker called her on it. Is Riker always like this? Is Shelby? Is this normal?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOnC0dgHNDA&t=1m28s <-- I mean seriously, imagine this episode is the TNG pilot. It would give a whole different vibe to the characters.
It’s too early in the Discovery characters’ development onscreen to have this drama because we don’t have a baseline for what is supposed to be normal for this crew in interacting with each other.
You asked why she was the protagonist. Kirk was a captain but he frequently disobeyed the chain of command and was the ‘hero’ of the piece. I think all of the main protagonists have adopted this mode.
No, no, no… He’s got four lightsabers, silly.
(if that’s not what’s happening there, I have no idea what is)SPOILERS
He’s firing a blaster in rapid succession.
The Droid fired first.
I’ve seen the first episode. I loved the first part and hated the second half. By the way this might be the first Star Trek lead I absolutely hate, she belongs to jail, why is she a hero?
She was right.
She correctly assessed the situation and did everything she could to prevent the conflict. Her Captain didn’t listen to her and put her in the brig.
She correctly gauged that killing the Klingon leader would create a martyr that would unite the Empire against the Federation and the Captain screwed up again. If Kirk did this it would be typical Kirk stuff and we would all be patting him on the back for disrespecting the chain of command as usual.
Mark’s Down On Your Syntax said:
You’re forgetting J. Michael Straczynski had pitched B5 to Paramount before DS9 was conceived.
Sounds reasonable, point withdrawn.
HUGE WINKY FACE.
Furthermore elements from the pilot script for B5 became major plot points for the whole duration of DS9. Like a character using a shape shifting device called a Changeling net to get revenge for a war started when a character called Dukhat was killed. The pilot even had Leeta in it DS9 didn’t even bother to hide it’s origins. When B5 got a defence grid upgrade and a state of the art ship in season 3 guess what happened on DS9? I just saw the first two episodes of Discovery. It’s the best Star Trek since 1979.
Looks more like the Man Who Failed to Bath
I’d rather beef up the ground battle so that on top of the normal staff of the base which should be considerable an entire legion of the Emperor’s best troops is actually there.
So of like the reverse of when the elves come to Helm’s deep.
The Rebels have seemingly subdued the base personnel and have planted their explosives (though I would plant them under the dish instead of in the reactor) and then in marches over a thousand troops. With walkers and big guns and then the Ewoks and the Rebels win not because the troops are rubbish but because the Ewoks and the Rebels are better.
There are so many good ideas from those earlier brainstorms which Angel was part of and looking at his website for the first time in years he still has some fresh new ideas. It’s just a crying shame that he ended up being so silly. With Ady deciding not to do certain things he could be on here offering alternatives. Greatly regrettable.
Still here?
^I gathered that my subconscious had raided my trivia store for that film.
Chewie’s introduction in the cell is one of the few changes I’d really like to see in even a ‘soft’ fanedit like this. It’s basically a plot hole that Chewie isn’t captured, since 3PO says ‘Lando Calrissian and poor Chewbacca never returned from this awful place’.
To make it work…
To make it “work” all Ady has to do is remove the audio “and poor Chewbacca” so Threepio says ‘Lando Calrissian never returned from this awful place’ and wala! … no more plot hole.
Nice simple change. Fixes lots.
I had this very strange dream about simulated realty. Many of my best dreams have Marlon Brando in them for some reason. At the beginning of the dream he is bored with being overweight and wants to be handsome and slim and make movies more regularly. He works on a film with Val Kilmer and admires him so pays money to occupy his body. Cut to a married lesbian couple who obsess about buying the best rated consumer items from the internet. Their mutual obsession is only made practical by their purchase of space. They argue that they spend too much time in their jobs and can’t enjoy their many lawnmowers anymore. The next characters were childhood sweethearts. But a malfunction in their simulation has caused the man to age. The woman tries her best to look after him while trying to alert the operating system to the fault. She finds her care role too stressful. She finds a simulation company inside her simulation and inserts her husband in it hoping that some time in a young body will repair the damage. She leaves him in there. After many centuries the simulation has degraded the world has become pixelated and his wife is now sort of like a Minecraft character. He cannot die. Outside there is a war which causes the simulation to breakdown. We find out it’s not really a war but a series of test simulations but the various civilian assets are rescued and moved to a new computer system. The husband and his wife are reunited but they don’t remember each other. They are passionately drawn to each other but hold back because of residual dedication to their earlier selves. Marlon Kilmer is very overweight again and is watching A Streetcar Named Desire. He watches with astonishment as his old young body walks out of the screen and leaves the cinema. The Lesbian couple are overjoyed. The new computer system has granted them infinite space. They may never need to work again. They look forward to getting all the boxes out of the way to the door of the bedroom and finding a place for everything in their collection. They move one box and find a lawnmower catalogue and excitedly contemplate their next purchase.
The Obi-Wan scene is needless, all he does is tell Luke that Leia is his sister. Cut that. Cut it cut it cut it - do it. Now.
Cut this scene and leave the one where Yoda says “there is another Skywalker.” Trim the scene where Luke and Leia talk on Endor to reflect this
NOW
During the end battle Vader says “you have a twin sister” do a flash of Leia via the Force. Yads did this in one of his edits but if my memory is correct I don’t think he scrubbed all the earlier stuff. Now it was Darth Vader who told Luke that he was his father and now it is Darth Vader telling Luke that he has sister, who is now fair play as a target. The scene makes the Skywalker family tree a revelation to Luke, Vader and the Emperor. Luke losing his cool makes even more sense when you cut it this way. I’ve done an edit of RotJ using the Yads edit as a base (the Boba Fett less one) and it works very, very well.I disagree. I think Ben needs to answer for out and out lying to Luke. If one half of that interlude needs to go it’s Yoda’s death scene. It’s awful and says less.
Particularly positioned where it is in the movie. He hangs around for the whole gap between Luke leaving for Cloud City and coming back from Jabba just to get a bit ill, tired and then die within a space of a few moments and without finishing his final sentence. The whole sequence is comically awful. George is practically screaming at the audience (I DONT WANT TO DO ANY MORE STAR WARS MOVIES). Like Boba Fett its a thing that we don’t even need to see. Luke could be on Tatooine and sense Yoda’s passing if he is a fully trained Jedi Knight. Ben however has to finish telling Luke the story of his father. I would prefer him to do that where he started on Tatooine where there is some actual resonance rather than resting his ghost butt on a tree stump on Dagobah but it’s not my show.How would it work if Ben revealed his story to Luke on Endor after the Battle had been won? Of course, some dialogue will need to be edited out such as Luke discovering that Leia is his sister. Which would also include having to possibly bring Luke and Leia’s conversation later in the film as well like before or during the celebrations, but it would be difficult with Luke leaving to face Vader in the scene originally. It would be quite an undertaking and could it really disrupt the flow of the ending that much?!
Exposition when necessary should be a springboard. The only way you could have ghost Ben do this on Endor would be as a prelude to a prequel edit. You won, this is where you have come to, now I will tell to a tale of where you came from.
What year is this?
Here’s fun.
Yoda and Kenobi died in prequels.
They were projections of Anakin’s memories in the original films given substance by the good man still trapped in Vader.
This is why they begin to fade away. As Luke becomes stronger Anakin’s tangible living son becomes a better incarnation of the light side in his character.
Like Bono?
The Obi-Wan scene is needless, all he does is tell Luke that Leia is his sister. Cut that. Cut it cut it cut it - do it. Now.
Cut this scene and leave the one where Yoda says “there is another Skywalker.” Trim the scene where Luke and Leia talk on Endor to reflect this
NOW
During the end battle Vader says “you have a twin sister” do a flash of Leia via the Force. Yads did this in one of his edits but if my memory is correct I don’t think he scrubbed all the earlier stuff. Now it was Darth Vader who told Luke that he was his father and now it is Darth Vader telling Luke that he has sister, who is now fair play as a target. The scene makes the Skywalker family tree a revelation to Luke, Vader and the Emperor. Luke losing his cool makes even more sense when you cut it this way. I’ve done an edit of RotJ using the Yads edit as a base (the Boba Fett less one) and it works very, very well.
I disagree. I think Ben needs to answer for out and out lying to Luke. If one half of that interlude needs to go it’s Yoda’s death scene. It’s awful and says less.
Particularly positioned where it is in the movie. He hangs around for the whole gap between Luke leaving for Cloud City and coming back from Jabba just to get a bit ill, tired and then die within a space of a few moments and without finishing his final sentence. The whole sequence is comically awful. George is practically screaming at the audience (I DONT WANT TO DO ANY MORE STAR WARS MOVIES). Like Boba Fett its a thing that we don’t even need to see. Luke could be on Tatooine and sense Yoda’s passing if he is a fully trained Jedi Knight. Ben however has to finish telling Luke the story of his father. I would prefer him to do that where he started on Tatooine where there is some actual resonance rather than resting his ghost butt on a tree stump on Dagobah but it’s not my show.
I’m not sure it’s impossible, hopefully (hopefully)just really complicated and time consuming.
Building a model of the Kenobi hut interior to a scale large enough to manipulate the light to match the Dagobah set footage from the existing version. Getting a body double for Mark so the construction of the saber can be redone without the issues that deleted scenes have. Making new transparent images of Sir Alec with the trees of Dagobah removed.
It’s possibly all doable but who’s gonna fly it kid… 😉
ROTJ needs major changes to approach working. Putting Mark and Ian’s performances onto a shelf for safety the rest is Prequel level bad.
Next to PT:R a heavily reworked ROTJ is what sparked my interest in the whole Revisited project.
If Ady did essentially what he did with ESB:R but with a few editorial changes it would still be interesting and worth watching but there is an opportunity with ROTJ and the PT that just isn’t there with a practically perfect movie like ESB or ANH. A chance to give people a glimpse into something special. Maybe even make a few wrongs a little less unright.
It’s not my show but I do hope that final product(s) shake/s up the film/s as we know it/them from now on in ways that will breath new life into the kind of droopy, hissy side of of the Star Wars inflatable universe.
Yoda hanging on for Luke to return from saving Han and dying in mid greeting (job unfinished) was really silly.
Like Fett’s death is another box ticked that didn’t even need ticking, ticked in the most dramatically clunky way possible.
^THAT
